playing well without aiming systems

By personal belief is that there are no aiming systems at all in pool. My definition of a aiming system is the reason for this belief.

What these "aiming" systems really are is visualization systems. You have to visualize everything. There are no real world points to align up to see where you need to put the cb. I was a IFT on p3's, sub hunters, and that plane had aiming systems. Fighters have aiming systems.

Pool does not. I have never aimed a baseball when throwing one. I just throw to wherever. I visualize where the ball needs to be taking in all the current parameters that will affect the baseballs path and then execute based on past stored info.

I didn't hold the ball in front of one eye trying to line up a spot on the baseball with a spot on the glove and then throw the baseball trying to keep those alignments. Can't be done.

So I agee that he is not using a aiming system but a visualization system. Pool is all about seeing the shot. You want to know how those great shots happen....they saw the shot and then did it. The shot was in their minds eye. They saw it, they executed it, no thought. This is the goal. See, do, no more and no less.
 
duckie said:
You want to know how those great shots happen....they saw the shot and then did it. The shot was in their minds eye. They saw it, they executed it, no thought. This is the goal. See, do, no more and no less.
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I hear you.

While I have a great deal of respect for C.J.Wiley in terms of his playing ability, when it comes to systems I personally favour the Kesuke Miyagi TOWOWO system (Touch Of Wax On Wax Off).
 
obclassicut said:
I'll check it out. i just figured with throw, english, follow, and draw that diamond systems would be usless. if i always used center ball i guess the diamond system would be a logical way to improve.
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Most diamond systems I've seen don't use center ball. They also take into account spin and throw.
 
real bartram said:
I don't use any that I know of
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Liar lol :D

OP, I am the same way but I actually consider the lining up of the shot as "aiming" which is part of my pre routine. You can't just go down and cut a ball without aiming at a spot even just visually with your eyes that you are trying to hit. I don't intentionally use any of the aiming systems out there i.e. SAM, Ghost Ball, CTE, TOI, Perfect Aim etc...I also don't consciously think about these while I am shooting a shot (which is a good thing as your thinking should be done before you get down on the shot).

Can these aiming systems help out me? Possibly...but it would take a some consistent coaching/teaching and practice/effort on my end. I don't think I have the energy and funds to put in that much effort.

I believe that I am blessed with a natural ability to see the shots and even execute them to a certain degree. Some people have that, others do not...it doesn't mean they can't improve with trying an aiming system...just remember it isn't the cure all answer. Never forget that ol fundamentals thing that can be the root of a lot of mistakes in players. :embarrassed2:
 
I don't use aiming systems or kicking systems. I'm a high C low B player, playing for 15 to 20 yrs now.

I made a bet with a low A player that said there is no way to kick balls without a system. We randomly threw cb and 1 ob on the table and called out how many rails to kick. He would measure and count diamonds and I would just see the ball coming off the rails. I hit more kicks then he did. And he normally gives me the 6 in 9 ball.

To each his own. But systems are NOT needed for high level play. Plenty of pro players to back that up. Corey and Schmidt are the first two to come to mind:)
 
Diamond systems certainly aren't a gimmick. They come in very handy and you'd do yourself a service by learning them.
 
ChicagoJoe said:
Diamond systems certainly aren't a gimmick. They come in very handy and you'd do yourself a service by learning them.
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Diamond systems will do you no good if you have bad fundamentals to begin with. If you have solid fundys then yes I agree that it is definitely worth tinkering with.
 
Not saying diamond systems are a gimmick. Just saying they are not necessary to kick. Some people just "see" the path the ball takes off the rails in thier head. Same with banks.
 
iusedtoberich said:
Not saying diamond systems are a gimmick. Just saying they are not necessary to kick. Some people just "see" the path the ball takes off the rails in thier head. Same with banks.
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+1...I don't use the diamond system...I use the old angle in angle out feel...it probably isn't the best method, but that's ok. Maybe some day I will examine the diamond system further.
 
iusedtoberich said:
Not saying diamond systems are a gimmick. Just saying they are not necessary to kick. Some people just "see" the path the ball takes off the rails in thier head. Same with banks.
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That's true, but i like to fall back into a system when i'm not certain. Just like when nerves kick in during a high pressure situation, its good to use a whatever system you use to make balls besides just seeing the shot (pre-shot routine, ghost ball, etc). At least until you settle down.
 
My connection is either to the center or edge of the object ball and ALWAYS.........

I had not heard players talk about "aiming systems"{very much} before reading this forum. After years on the road, not once has anyone said "don't play that player, he knows an "aiming system" that's better than anyone else's" :eek: I have not "aimed" at an object ball once I'm down on a shot, it takes too long and I know better than to try and hit a "contact point," this is an illusion at best). We used to watch slower players like Dick Lane in Dallas and say "I wonder what he's aiming at?" (after they stroke it many times).....and I would say "I don't know, but I hope he hits it eventually" ;)

I use an "Alignment System" above the ball and connect the two balls together the same way every time. My connection is either to the center or edge of the object ball and ALWAYS from the center of the cue ball. Then when I get down I simply move my cue to the Inside to create the angle.

This is the most effective way I've found to "Create" every angle I'll need to play pool at the highest level. This also frees me up to have the Touch and Feel that is the most important quality to have playing any billiard game. 'The Game is the Teacher' www.cjwiley.com
 
To OP..

Just enjoy the game..

never spent more then your willing to lose on anything
pool related...unless your willing to put hours of effort in
to your self..

I've spent a few dollars on books an dvds..because the locals
seem to have a hard time sharring info..like its some big
secert..." right " my point is..I just wanted to know if I was
hitting the damn ball like others..

I hope your not stroking 12 times to miss the ball..just kidding.

all the best to you..enjoy the weekend.
 
obclassicut said:
I can play pool at a fairly high level most of the time ( 2nd place in a 8- ball league consisting of about 60 players, most of which are beginners) . I do not use any type of aiming system or diamond system consciously that i know of. Am i missing out or are there good players that only rely on there feed-forward process and do not need aiming systems? i hear of these aiming systems a lot, i hope they are just a gimmick. Know of any pros that do not use aiming systems? i know there are other threads on this but i like to ask the question in my own words
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Playing pool at "a fairly high level" is very subjective. I finished 2nd place in a BCA league here with 2oo plus players and first place in another with 80 players in another town. But my game is a joke when surrounded by real players. That's what's great about pool, there's always something to learn. Aiming is just one part of it.

JC
 
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