Hmmmm! Someone go teach Florian "Venom" Koehler how to shoot with T.O.I.

His Boy Elroy

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I just finished watching a few of the guy's videos on YOU TUBE. I must have matured since the last time I watched those same videos. This time I concentrated on watching the shots and not the models. This, in turn, led me to a new appreciation of his ASTOUNDING skill!

I recall reading that he's nothing special shooting conventional CB into OB into pocket shots. If so, WHAT'S THE STORY FOR GOD'S SAKE! Alll I can figure is that he can't shoot a center ball shot very well. If that's the case, SOMEONE TEACH HIM T.O.I....PRONTO!

With that absolutely exquisite control of spin he possesses and applies to masse' shots, I see no reason why that same exquisite control would not transfer to his shots when shooting a millimeter or 2 off verticle center, which is what advanced T.O.I is all about. Once he masters that, the ability to shoot a perfectly straight center ball shot when a straight in shot presents itself, will automatically follow...Then WATCH OUT WORLD!.....imho!
 

HawaiianEye

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I just finished watching a few of the guy's videos on YOU TUBE. I must have matured since the last time I watched those same videos. This time I concentrated on watching the shots and not the models. This, in turn, led me to a new appreciation of his ASTOUNDING skill!

I recall reading that he's nothing special shooting conventional CB into OB into pocket shots. If so, WHAT'S THE STORY FOR GOD'S SAKE! Alll I can figure is that he can't shoot a center ball shot very well. If that's the case, SOMEONE TEACH HIM T.O.I....PRONTO!

With that absolutely exquisite control of spin he possesses and applies to masse' shots, I see no reason why that same exquisite control would not transfer to his shots when shooting a millimeter or 2 off verticle center, which is what advanced T.O.I is all about. Once he masters that, the ability to shoot a perfectly straight center ball shot when a straight in shot presents itself, will automatically follow...Then WATCH OUT WORLD!.....imho!

I've met and watched him and C.J.

Florian CAN'T HANDLE TOI. LMAO.
 

RunoutJJ

Professional Banger
Silver Member
Ok don't get your logic. Why the hell does he need to use a touch of inside in anything he does? :confused:
 

btown

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Until he realizes that the cubeball is actually a flat surface he will never understand the secrets in T.. O.. I..
 

His Boy Elroy

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I've met and watched him and C.J.

Florian CAN'T HANDLE TOI. LMAO.
Wow! That's difficult to understand. C.J. Wiley has mentioned though, that only about 30 % of his students pick it up. Hey.... if Florian just keeps doing what he's doing now and nothing else he's still standing on a high pedestal in the billiard world in my opinion. He's amazing!
 

HawaiianEye

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
When I first read your post, I assumed you saw C.J trying to teach Florian T.O.I, and you later learned Florian couldn't get a handle on it. Is that what you meant?

LOL.

No. It was a joke.

Most people who use spin a lot will usually argue with you all day about how TOI won't work. Florian uses so much spin it isn't even funny when he does a lot of his trick shots. Trying to get him to quit using spin may mess with his psyche after spinning for so long.

:)
 

Nick B

This is gonna hurt
Silver Member
Wow! That's difficult to understand. C.J. Wiley has mentioned though, that only about 30 % of his students pick it up. Hey.... if Florian just keeps doing what he's doing now and nothing else he's still standing on a high pedestal in the billiard world in my opinion. He's amazing!


Ahhhhhhh No. I'm almost certain he plays at a very average level. Most trick shot artists are not the strongest of players...they devote too much time in learning how to Jump over the shark cage (for those old enough to remember Happy Days). Otherwise you would see him playing and winning some events which would further enhance their reputation and probably their livelihood and marketing power.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PqrexMJ5ohk
 

His Boy Elroy

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
LOL.

No. It was a joke.

Most people who use spin a lot will usually argue with you all day about how TOI won't work. Florian uses so much spin it isn't even funny when he does a lot of his trick shots. Trying to get him to quit using spin may mess with his psyche after spinning for so long.

:)
"Most people who use spin a lot will usually argue with you all day about how T.O.I won't work"?.Huh? I'm not following. In his video Wiley teaches beginners to T.O.I to go either center to center or center to edge. It's necessary to sometimes go a full tip inside the vertical center doing either.

As the player becomes more advanced, he may start moving more towards the center of the cue ball with the tip. At T.O.I's most advanced stage the player is aiming at the side of the pocket and deflecting the OB into the center of the pocket using the 3 part pocket system. At this point the tip is only moved a millimeter or 2 inside of verticle center.

Before a player develops the skill to play using the 3 part pocket system and going only a millimeter or 2 off verticle center, he has to first learn to go center - center and center edge while sometimes going a full tip inside of verticle center. .....a full tip off vertical center is not an insubstantial distance. I really can't understand why players who use spin a lot would not see the merit in T.O.I. It just doesn't make sense. I also don't see why players who display great control of the cue ball while applying a great amount of spin to the ball, as Florian does in his masse' shots, could not learn also how control the cueball with similar skill, while applying only the smallest amount of spin.

So I'll say it again....somebody teach the guy some T.O.I shooting!
 

Player

I'm your huckleberry
Silver Member
I don't see TOI so much as a fix for potting balls but more as a way of controlling the cue ball.

But then I only use it a little and am no expert on it.
 

marek

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I'm almost certain he plays at a very average level.

I wouldnt call someone who can run 5 racks in a row in 9b and 80+ in 14-1 "a very average level" :D:D:D He is no pro at "normal" pool but I would definitely call him an accomplished pool player :wink: Also Florian said recently that he was starting to learn 3-cushion and with the speed he learns things I dont think we will wait too long before he becomes 1.0avg player in 3cushion.
 

KRJ

Support UKRAINE
Silver Member
I wouldnt call someone who can run 5 racks in a row in 9b and 80+ in 14-1 "a very average level" :D:D:D He is no pro at "normal" pool but I would definitely call him an accomplished pool player :wink: Also Florian said recently that he was starting to learn 3-cushion and with the speed he learns things I dont think we will wait too long before he becomes 1.0avg player in 3cushion.

Exactly :) We saw a video of him taking all of two shots. One of the times he was pinned pretty deep in a pocket. And the other looked like he was not even trying to make it. He can play, if we wants to play on my state team, he's IN ;)
 

Nick B

This is gonna hurt
Silver Member
I wouldnt call someone who can run 5 racks in a row in 9b and 80+ in 14-1 "a very average level" :D:D:D He is no pro at "normal" pool but I would definitely call him an accomplished pool player :wink: Also Florian said recently that he was starting to learn 3-cushion and with the speed he learns things I dont think we will wait too long before he becomes 1.0avg player in 3cushion.

Well I've run a few 5's and over 100 at 14.1 and would consider myself an average player who wouldn't fare to well in a real Pro Event. Seeing as he has hundreds of youtrube videos can you show me any proof of that kind of speed?

I would assert that if he was a player of aforementioned abilities he would do himself well to win or place high in some pro events to further bolster his reputation. That would be indisputable and marketable and he seems to be a marketing machine. Therefore with no disrespect I think his actual playing skills are below what you state.

As a side note I have played a couple of well known Trick Shot Artists and they could do some cute stuff but in the end had average ball potting abilities and unfortunately when you are really playing you don't get to hand place the balls and two tries at everything. :shrug:
 

Nick B

This is gonna hurt
Silver Member
Exactly :) We saw a video of him taking all of two shots. One of the times he was pinned pretty deep in a pocket. And the other looked like he was not even trying to make it. He can play, if we wants to play on my state team, he's IN ;)

OK well he has hundreds of videos up on youtube. Show me I'm wrong. Regular game or practice session will do.
 

KRJ

Support UKRAINE
Silver Member
OK well he has hundreds of videos up on youtube. Show me I'm wrong. Regular game or practice session will do.

Sorry, Nick, but you think running a 100 balls and 5-packs is an average player. 99% of the folks on AZB can't do that, so it's far from average.

So, you're as good as Florian in a game of pool, but that makes both of your WAY better than average. He's Never claimed to be a professional pool player, but he's still better than most amateurs.
 

cleary

Honestly, I'm a liar.
Silver Member
Venom is very good as what he does. That is, try over and over to do something very difficult on equipment that favors what he's trying to do. I'd imagine he would. Last very long in a tournament full of B players because that's just not something he does (that I'm aware of). Pocketing balls and getting shape over and over is a different kind of skill.

I'm sure if he attempted to become a regular pool player, he'd have a great stroke and become rather good quickly. And you wouldn't wanna get into a safety battle with him.
 
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