My Variety Pack Of Josswest Cues Together Again For The First Time

cuesblues

cue accumulator
Silver Member
There's no comparison with Joss shaft tapers then, and now. Then, if you're talking late 60s and 70s, shafts were quite large by today's standards, 13 1/4, 13 1/2, and even larger were the norm. Also, pro taper meant just that, the thickness stayed the same for at least the first ten inches or so, then gradually widened. Today, the standard, including Joss would generally be thinner at the start, and gradually increasing, rather than a constant diameter for that section of the shaft.

A whole host of reasons for the difference. First, slower napped cloth was the standard, mostly Brunsco wool, as well as Mali cloth. You had to slug the cue ball a lot harder than today. Second, pool was mostly played by men, with larger hands. Also, the cue butts were much thicker than today, so the shafts naturally were thicker as well. Today, with faster cloth, the shaft thickness has gone down to more like 12 3/4 and 12 1/2, with gradually increasing diameter all the way, not the constant thickness they used to be for a large part of the shaft. Most of today's cues, including shaft tapers, do not resemble the ones of that era.

All the best,
WW

It would be interesting to take a dozen cues to try out on vintage equipment like the tables/cloth you mentioned, and use the same type balls from that era.
 

Chopdoc

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
It would be interesting to take a dozen cues to try out on vintage equipment like the tables/cloth you mentioned, and use the same type balls from that era.

This is sort of my hobby now. I really enjoy having cues from different eras to compare. I'll often take several to the hall for that purpose.
 

Chopdoc

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
There's no comparison with Joss shaft tapers then, and now. Then, if you're talking late 60s and 70s, shafts were quite large by today's standards, 13 1/4, 13 1/2, and even larger were the norm. Also, pro taper meant just that, the thickness stayed the same for at least the first ten inches or so, then gradually widened. Today, the standard, including Joss would generally be thinner at the start, and gradually increasing, rather than a constant diameter for that section of the shaft.

A whole host of reasons for the difference. First, slower napped cloth was the standard, mostly Brunsco wool, as well as Mali cloth. You had to slug the cue ball a lot harder than today. Second, pool was mostly played by men, with larger hands. Also, the cue butts were much thicker than today, so the shafts naturally were thicker as well. Today, with faster cloth, the shaft thickness has gone down to more like 12 3/4 and 12 1/2, with gradually increasing diameter all the way, not the constant thickness they used to be for a large part of the shaft. Most of today's cues, including shaft tapers, do not resemble the ones of that era.

All the best,
WW

AFAIK the standard Joss shaft is still 13.25 with a constant diameter for at least the first third of the shaft.
 

Chopdoc

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
That's why your attachment to Lucasi is so puzzling

:smile:

Seriously though, it would be interesting to hear about the tapers Joss & Josswest used back then, and how they compare to each other as well as Joss now, and other pro-tapered shafts.
It's hard for me to just look at them and tell the difference, I have to play with the cue to tell.
I tried to do some shaft taper comparing last night but I need to spend more time with it.


If I ever get time I'll take measurements of various shafts I have. I have interest in the Joss lineage and how they all evolved. Joss, JW, and Scruggs in particular. I have various examples.

Comparing those with others is interesting as well of course. My 1981 Huebler has a very interesting taper. Very different. I have a 29 inch for it plus two original 31 inch shafts, very rare. And I have two Scruggs shafts that fit that cue as well. Very cool for comparing.

The really old stuff like Katz, Brunswick, Rieper, Luscher, Victor, and Briggs are cool to compare and contrast with newer stuff as well.

But my best player for 30 plus years is still my Joss with Josswest shafts. Of course I am biased in that matter. It's like what makes one woman better than another in the sack. Not a simple matter.

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WildWing

Super Gun Mod
Silver Member
AFAIK the standard Joss shaft is still 13.25 with a constant diameter for at least the first third of the shaft.

Don't bet on that. According to their website, 13 1/4 is the largest they offer, not a standard. And my guess is not many get them that large these days.

Back in the early 70s, we routinely got shafts from Joss that were more like 13 1/2. About 40 to 45 years ago.

All the best,
WW
 

Chopdoc

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Don't bet on that. According to their website, 13 1/4 is the largest they offer, not a standard. And my guess is not many get them that large these days.

Back in the early 70s, we routinely got shafts from Joss that were more like 13 1/2. About 40 to 45 years ago.

All the best,
WW

I understand. But as I understand it, unless you specify otherwise when you order a cue it will come with 13.25mm. That makes it their standard.

Of course, these days most will be ordered smaller.

As far as the taper, the late models I have sampled have a traditional "pro taper" with the diameter constant for at least the first third of the shaft.

Cues sold through distributors would likely be ordered with whatever shafts they think will sell well. But most distributors I see offer whatever you want. Joss shafts are interchangeable anyway, going back decades. So they easily offer various options to end users.

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cuesblues

cue accumulator
Silver Member
Plain jane pics



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033.jpg

037.jpg

043.jpg

039.jpg
 

Chopdoc

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
OK- Now your pics are giving me an emotional crisis. :eek::grin:

Maybe I can sell a kidney or something? Wait a minute...that sounds really bad for a doc to say that. :eek::eek:



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skins

Likes to draw
Silver Member
OK- Now your pics are giving me an emotional crisis. :eek::grin:

Maybe I can sell a kidney or something? Wait a minute...that sounds really bad for a doc to say that. :eek::eek:



.

Yeah but you could save a lot by doing the procedure yourself..:eek::wink:
 

WildWing

Super Gun Mod
Silver Member
Yeah but you could save a lot by doing the procedure yourself..:eek::wink:

Doc might need a nurse to help with that, but he could dismiss the anethesiologist.:eek:

Seriously, this is the nicest set of older JossWest cues around.

All the best,
H
 

Chopdoc

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Doc might need a nurse to help with that, but he could dismiss the anethesiologist.:eek:

Seriously, this is the nicest set of older JossWest cues around.

All the best,
H


Yes, it is an amazing collection for sure.



And my daughter could help. I just need somebody to hold the retractors, a monkey could do it. ;):D

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bstroud

Deceased
That's why your attachment to Lucasi is so puzzling

:smile:

Seriously though, it would be interesting to hear about the tapers Joss & Josswest used back then, and how they compare to each other as well as Joss now, and other pro-tapered shafts.
It's hard for me to just look at them and tell the difference, I have to play with the cue to tell.
I tried to do some shaft taper comparing last night but I need to spend more time with it.

The original shaft taper for the early Joss Cues was taken from a Balabuska shaft.

I measured the shaft every 3" and recorded the measurements on a hand drawing. I still have the drawing.

Bill S.
 

bstroud

Deceased
There's no comparison with Joss shaft tapers then, and now. Then, if you're talking late 60s and 70s, shafts were quite large by today's standards, 13 1/4, 13 1/2, and even larger were the norm. Also, pro taper meant just that, the thickness stayed the same for at least the first ten inches or so, then gradually widened. Today, the standard, including Joss would generally be thinner at the start, and gradually increasing, rather than a constant diameter for that section of the shaft.

A whole host of reasons for the difference. First, slower napped cloth was the standard, mostly Brunsco wool, as well as Mali cloth. You had to slug the cue ball a lot harder than today. Second, pool was mostly played by men, with larger hands. Also, the cue butts were much thicker than today, so the shafts naturally were thicker as well. Today, with faster cloth, the shaft thickness has gone down to more like 12 3/4 and 12 1/2, with gradually increasing diameter all the way, not the constant thickness they used to be for a large part of the shaft. Most of today's cues, including shaft tapers, do not resemble the ones of that era.

All the best,
WW

I agree with everything you said in your post.

Most of the last cues I made had 12 3/4 MM shafts and that is what I play with today.

Bill S.
 

Chopdoc

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I agree with everything you said in your post.

Most of the last cues I made had 12 3/4 MM shafts and that is what I play with today.

Bill S.

The two shafts I have by you for my old block letter Joss are in fact about 12 3/4. I got them with the cue about 1985. I have always thought they were their original diameter. You have helped confirm that notion.

I have since located a couple original block letter shafts but the two I got with it that you made are the player shafts for that cue (not so easy to find). Simply put they are better, at least for me.


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