Action cue ferrule material

The overseas cues use a soft material like pvc plastic and the Loctite will melt it somewhat ... Next time keep pressure on the tip for a longer period and let it set up a while before cutting down to match ferrel ... I sometimes moisten with spit the excess glue that gets squeezed out around the base of the tip , it cools the melted plastic and sets up the Loctite ... go light on your cut so not to pop off the tip ... Good luck ...

Palmetto cue said:

I recently installed a Triangle on a cutomers Action cue. I'm fairly sure it was constructed overseas, and sold through Cue Stix international. I installed a Triangle tip the same as always, and it popped of when I started to trim it. I tried another with a fresh tube of Loctite gel, and I popped it off with my fingers. I had this happen once a few years ago with a Scorpion cue. So I did the same thing I did back when. I changed the ferrule, and then all was fine. The tip I cut off originally didn't have any signs of poor adhesion. So my question is, what is this ferrule material made of, and more importantly, what method, or glue are they using?
I've installed many tips on Players, and Action cues without ant problems before. I'm so glad this happened at my lathe before it reached a customers hands.
I consider myself very lucky to have as a resource, the knowhow, and experience of the many fine Cuemakers, and Repairmen this site offers. Thanks in advance for any help you may offer in this matter. Mikey :smile:

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I have encountered the same problem many times, it appears that whatever, type of plastic they are using is similar to the material used to make caps for super glue containers. I solved the problem by using a fast drying two part Epoxy, but any 5 min will do, for me it isn't really that much trouble.

Take Care

I've had this happen a few times and put a fibre pad between ferrule and tip and Loctite glue bonded fine and tip stayed on!

Zim

The easiest way to cure this is to use the Dennis Searing install method. When you have everything ready to glue....wipe a thin coat of CA gel on the ferrule face & tip back. Let dry then lightly scuff the tip back taking care not to sand off the glue layer. I also like to take the corner of a razor and cut some light grooves in the ferrule face. Then just glue the tip on as normal. I started using this technique when I was having problems with Moori's staying glued onto the old original Predator shafts. I've since used this method on 100's of the ferrules which are hard to glue & I've never had one single tip pop off since. Actually I use this method on all of my tip installs. Many tips such as Moori's tend to soak the glue in so much that it creates adhesion problems. The thin CA layer acts as a primed surface & then allows for a vastly superior bond. Thank you for sharing your wisdom Dennis & making life easier!:thumbup:

I had that problem as well and it stems from the soft pvc compressing when a ball is hit and if its isnt glued on PERFFECT then its going to go flying. I have "moistened" the end before gluing so the ferrule doesnt melt, then again the best fix is to do a ferrule change first. Epoxy will work too, 5 min, but those ferrules are a pain sometimes. I let the tip set up longer before I trim it down. Good Luck

Varney Cues said:

The easiest way to cure this is to use the Dennis Searing install method. When you have everything ready to glue....wipe a thin coat of CA gel on the ferrule face & tip back. Let dry then lightly scuff the tip back taking care not to sand off the glue layer. I also like to take the corner of a razor and cut some light grooves in the ferrule face. Then just glue the tip on as normal. I started using this technique when I was having problems with Moori's staying glued onto the old original Predator shafts. I've since used this method on 100's of the ferrules which are hard to glue & I've never had one single tip pop off since. Actually I use this method on all of my tip installs. Many tips such as Moori's tend to soak the glue in so much that it creates adhesion problems. The thin CA layer acts as a primed surface & then allows for a vastly superior bond. Thank you for sharing your wisdom Dennis & making life easier!:thumbup:

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Sounds like we have traveled on parallel roads.My experiences have been very similar right down to only certain preds with the problem. I only had 2 of them with that issue over the last 10 years, but they were the same 2 shafts from the same owners, all the other preds that I tipped over the years, whether It was the same generation or not I had no such issues, even though the ferrule material looked very similar, the ones in question did look a bit more waxier though (if that makes any since). I have had the issues with newer imports that have those ferrule types mentioned here, not just 2 piece cues but some of the house cues also. My fixes- sometimes I use the searing method, especially mooris or similar pigskin tips, but the cross hatching is what seems to help the most. I just do very fine, lite, cross hatches with the tip of My razor. Too deep and It alters the facing too much and can cause leveling problems. Speaking of which with these type ferrules- You have to be extra aware of how flat Your facing job is to begin with. even the slightest wobble or high middle, and nothing will help keep the tip on, so even You have to have your facing tool tuned in/ shimmed to dead zero, or you have to slightly come into the middle of the facing with something close first, knock the middle down a hair, and face to just shy of that depth to avoid a high spot. I don't recommend everyone doing that, but I've done so many over the years I can can judge the depth of My facing to hit perfect every time. Any low spot left in the middle is less then 1/4 of what a glue relief hole would be. Providing that there is no push off occurring, that is one other near surefire way I know of to make sure the surface is good and flat. Also make sure the tool is very sharp, so as to create less heat.

Another thing I do is after sanding the back of the tip, I hold the tip in place before gluing and put some inward pressure on it, while holding that pressure on It, I try to move the tip side to side slightly, that kind of gives me something to gauge from, if the tip wants to slide to easily then I know something is not up to par, If the tip grips really well then I know I'm good to go. I will not glue a tip until I have It gripping the face well.

Greg

There are lots of those cues out there. Are you guys charing the customer if you are changing his ferrule when he only wanted a tip change?

I was always careful with the cheap cues, and primed the ferrule and tip with CA and let the tip clamp longer before cutting.

Also it seemed that most of the customers who had one of those cheap cues had the filthiest ferrules ever, and a very deep chalk groove ground into the ferrule.

Palmetto cue said:

Very good point. Yes, I let my customer know about the problem I was having, and my proposed solution. I also let him know that the ferrule change was free of charge. I threw in a shaft clean also, which I do anyway on ferrule replacements. Good question.
To go a little farther. With repairs, you never know what you might find. I've even gone so far as to take photos of odd, or subpar conditions that are discovered on customers cues. :grin:

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I've certainly never went that far as to replace a ferrule for free. If my normal glue will not work I let the customer know that the ferrule is a problem material and they have a choice of either replacing the ferrule or from now on they would have to leave the shaft for 24 hours each time that they need a tip so that I can use contact cement to put on the tip.

Dick

Among the cues I've seen (not worked on, I'm not a cm) that had this kind of ferrule, were some X Breaker knock offs a couple of folks had picked up cheap. (First bad indication.)
Tips popped off repeatedly until ferrule replaced.
On a break cue, this stuff was really the worst of it. Pure crap.

Keep some slip on tips in your box for when a customer with one of these cues comes for a tip replacement. Most likely they won't know the difference, lol.

action cue

Palmetto cue said:

I recently installed a Triangle on a cutomers Action cue. I'm fairly sure it was constructed overseas, and sold through Cue Stix international. I installed a Triangle tip the same as always, and it popped of when I started to trim it. I tried another with a fresh tube of Loctite gel, and I popped it off with my fingers. I had this happen once a few years ago with a Scorpion cue. So I did the same thing I did back when. I changed the ferrule, and then all was fine. The tip I cut off originally didn't have any signs of poor adhesion. So my question is, what is this ferrule material made of, and more importantly, what method, or glue are they using?
I've installed many tips on Players, and Action cues without ant problems before. I'm so glad this happened at my lathe before it reached a customers hands.
I consider myself very lucky to have as a resource, the knowhow, and experience of the many fine Cuemakers, and Repairmen this site offers. Thanks in advance for any help you may offer in this matter. Mikey :smile:

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not sure about ferrule , i have four action cues the inlay series , i changed
tip on one of them still on, and playing, may be hard to pin point ferrule
material they buy that kind of stuff in lots from who knows where. you are right china. look at the ring work and points.inlay series,
tell me did bob m. go to china? i call them a china made meucci.
can't say anything bad about them, the ones i have play very good i would rate them 8 1/2 out of ten