Ernie Martinez List Ideas

12squared

12squared

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Hi Again,

Before Ernie's next batch of cues (don't know when), I thought it would be a good idea to get your thoughts on the format and see how the rules can be improved to accommodate everyone's wants & needs.

Currently, Ernie makes what he feels like making & those next up on the list buy them based on your list placement, first up gets 1st choice of all the cues, next up 2nd choice of remaining cues and on & on. You've all committed to buy at least one of his plain-jane cues at a minimum. Because of this if only a plain-jane remains & it's your turn, you must buy it or lose your place in line - even if you wanted a pointed cue. Only if you wanted a plain-jane were you able to not lose your place in line (you would then move to the top of the next batch to only get a plain-jane once available) because the plain-jane is the minimum & we didn't feel it was right to make someone who only wanted to spend $575 be forced to go higher.

This process was put in place to maintain the integrity of the list so it could be self maintained and Ernie sells all of the cues made - after all, this started to help Ernie get back on his feet, so again, thank you all for being so great.

What has happened in a few cases is that those wanting a fancier cue were forced to buy a plain-jane and get back on the list. How can we resolve this issue?

One suggestion is to create 2 separate lists: one for those wanting a plain-jane; and one for those wanting points. One problem with this is that Ernie may make a fancier cue that someone originally wanting a plain-jane just can't live without. In other words, if they are in the right position and want to change their minds, they would not be able to if there were two lists. Everyone would have to stay in his or her list choice for this to work. Also, for this to work (in my opinion) those looking for the fancier cues cannot pass & keep their place, they would have to swap their spot with someone from the next batch. Remember, these cues must be sold, which is the reason for the list. So you see, it's not as simple as it sounds & I need your help.

I would love to hear from those on the list to hear what you believe to be a good solution for this issue. We can always leave it alone, but I know there's always room for improvement and you are a creative bunch.

Thanks for your understanding,

Dave
 
kudos

Dave,

First let me say that from what I've seen, and we talked about this in Louisville some, you've done a great job with this venture helping them to sell Ernie's cues. The "list thing" has undoubtedly been hectic for you. I like the idea of a separating the lists out......maybe broken down into 2 or maybe even 3....plain cues, pointed cues, and fancy cues (hopefully he'll be able to begin doing some inlay work in the near future).

You'll probably have an array of people/different buyers, some just wanting a plain jane and others just wanting a hoppe or 6 hi/low style, or even a fancier one. If Ernie were to make a batch of cues, say plain ones, and no one else on that first list wanted a particular plain cue, then there could be the possibility of the next person in line on the 2nd or 3rd list having the option to take it, but not lose their spot on the list they originally signed up for.
I know Ernie's just cutting his teeth getting back into the swing of things, but on those plain ones, it may have helped some with somewhat more variance in woods, rings, joint/butt material, etc. A lot of times where there are 4-5 very similar things on the market at the same time, it can tend to kill the allure (so to speak).

That being said, with a little more variance in each batch, I don't think you'd run into the situation where everybody would turn a particular cue down, especially at these prices.

Just a couple of ideas going through my head. Sure others here will have some even better ideas, too.

You all take care and please give our regards to Ernie,
Sean
 
cueaddicts said:
Dave,

First let me say that from what I've seen, and we talked about this in Louisville some, you've done a great job with this venture helping them to sell Ernie's cues. The "list thing" has undoubtedly been hectic for you. I like the idea of a separating the lists out......maybe broken down into 2 or maybe even 3....plain cues, pointed cues, and fancy cues (hopefully he'll be able to begin doing some inlay work in the near future).

You'll probably have an array of people/different buyers, some just wanting a plain jane and others just wanting a hoppe or 6 hi/low style, or even a fancier one. If Ernie were to make a batch of cues, say plain ones, and no one else on that first list wanted a particular plain cue, then there could be the possibility of the next person in line on the 2nd or 3rd list having the option to take it, but not lose their spot on the list they originally signed up for.
I know Ernie's just cutting his teeth getting back into the swing of things, but on those plain ones, it may have helped some with somewhat more variance in woods, rings, joint/butt material, etc. A lot of times where there are 4-5 very similar things on the market at the same time, it can tend to kill the allure (so to speak).

That being said, with a little more variance in each batch, I don't think you'd run into the situation where everybody would turn a particular cue down, especially at these prices.

Just a couple of ideas going through my head. Sure others here will have some even better ideas, too.

You all take care and please give our regards to Ernie,
Sean
Click to expand...

Well said Sean. I love the plain player cues, but would like to see some exotic woods and different ring stock. Would also like to be able to get extra shafts and smaller diameter direct from you guys without having to send the cue back to have the shaft taken down a bit. It goes without saying that the work you are putting into this is a herculean task and I for one admire your hard work and dedication to help Ernie with his comeback.
 
Dave,

Would it be possible for those that are left on the list to have some input on what we actually want? Afterall, we are helping him get started again and it would be a kind gesture to give us some consideration during the design stage.

What do you think?
 
What is the current list for the next batch.I would like to see where I fall before I can make a comment on this.
 
Dak21st said:
What is the current list for the next batch.I would like to see where I fall before I can make a comment on this.
Click to expand...
15) Viperkiller
16) 8-ball Rat, (donated by 1pRoscoe)
17) Regas (sixpack) 6/23 3:51pm
18) Fast N Loose 6/23 3:59pm
19) Fool4pool 6/25 12:48pm
20) pocono 6/25 9:08pm
21) Pauly (paulybatz) 6/26 9:55am
22) Pharoah68 6/26 10:00am
23) Panhdlce (swapped w/chris2669)
24) Dak21st 6/26 2:04pm
25) Nelson (Taiko) 6/27 3:27pm
26) flc78 6/29 12:09pm
27) pathman 6/29 1:02pm
28) Todd (Zeek) 6/29 1:15pm
29) BrooklynJay 6/29 2:26pm
30) Joe (cmxv) 7/17 5:30pm
31) Bamacues 7/18 9:31am
32) Ron Brown 7/18 6:00pm
33) Bruce Enyard 7/20 8:00pm
34) George 7/22 9:02am
35) Sid Barcelona
36) Mike (Jager Monster)
37) 8-ball Rat
38) Matt (Matty)
39) Ho (Jazz) - got back on the list after his purchase
40) Robert (robertno1pool)
41) Manuel
42) vee (vgodley1)
43) Mike (mikeh)
44) Deacon
45) Aaron (painpool)
46) Bill (cornerstone)
47) Chris (ChrisOnline)
48) Marty Parchuck
49) Mike (Zoojersey)
50) Jason (4theHorseman)
51) Swami4u
52) Hanqing (Torqiet) - back on the list after purchase
53) Isaac (bells)
54) buck15
Click to expand...

This is where the list is at, right now. Viperkiller is up first for the 3rd batch of cues.

Personally....and this is just me....I kinda like the way the list is (and NOT only because I get to pick 2nd, I swear!! :) :) )

There are some of us that most definitely want to get one of Ernie's cues....but will make their selection based upon what kind of finances they have available at the time the cues are ready to go.

I'd LIKE to get a points and veneers cue.....but if the cues come up at a time when I only have 600 bucks or so, I'll buy a Plain Jane.

That's not to say I don't think different lists are a good idea.....they are.....but only for those who already KNOW FOR SURE what type of cue they're gonna buy. I know I'm buying one....just not sure what type yet. That...and none of us really know what Ernie will kick out next....so trying to guess a design or price for that design makes it even more difficult.

Either way, really.....it all pans out, and we all get to put our hands on a Martinez. In that, we're all pretty fortunate, Dave.

Just my $.02
 
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Looks like I am last on the list if it is a ten cue batch.I will trade my spot and add some some cash to get near or at the top.PM if interested.
 
Im not sure at all....

Dave I think to leave the list the way it is, is easiest...the format however...if say there are no pointed cues when it gets to my name and I want one and none are available, the queue for cue choice should skip me, but I should remain in my position for the next batch of cues, and choice would just defer down the line in the normal proceeding order.
 
by the way I am just kidding with the above suggestion, but will repeat that should anyone wish to liquidate their Martinez, I will purchase it
 
is it still possible to get on this list or is it still closed?

Oh also, I would think that the list would allow those that don't want a cue from a certain batch to pass and still be on the list for the next batch.

ie. if the list were:

1) Person A
2) Person B
.
.
11) Person C
12) Person D

and a 10 cue batch came out, couldn't person A pass and everyone else get their cues and then the list would look like:

1) Person A
2) Person D

etc.

Kinda like what paulybatz said.

Maybe theres a problem in this I'm not thinking of.
 
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Nice looking cues and prices

The only thing I would personally like to see would be for some plain janes/player's cues to be made out of different woods so that all the simple cues did not look alike. Various rings and wrap colors on those could vary them even more. Woods like cocobolo, bacote, ebony, kingwood, tulipwood, etc just to vary the field a little. Other than that, I don't see to much to be changed.

I also like the ideas of Paulybatz and QRC in that a person be able to "skip" their place in line and wait on a different cue as long as someone else was willing to move up the list. If no one would be willing to move up, then the commitment would remain.
Joe
 
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That's what I am talking about!!

paulybatz said:
How about solid ebony and paduak handle.... :-)
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I am personally not a big fan of plain birdseye cues, but the various wood players like this one are sweet!!

BTW, Pauly, I second what 8-ball Rat said...SHOWOFF!!:eek: :D :rolleyes:
 
I understand the market for Ernie's cues, but don't like some of what I hear in this thread. It would seem that the guy with the money should have options. Why wouldn't Ernie state that the next "X" number will be plain or pointed, and get with the guys on the list. He may restrict the ringwork, etc. or the veneers to what he likes, but I think the buyers should get some say in the deal. Kinda like SW.

If he makes a cue you don't like and you are next in line, you shouldn't have to give up your place. You should stay where you are and the next guy down the line should be contacted with the same option.

Ernie is not the customer here, but demand is demand, and silly things happen when that is the case.
 
Thank you all for your input.

Here's a recap so far: I will suggest different woods could be used in the plain-jane cues, but this may increase the pricing for them slightly. At the same time you are asking for more variety in the batches of plain-janes even if BEM is used - different color collars, etc.

Also, you have requested that Ernie reduce the size of shafts to order or add a 2nd shaft: there has been a few who requested this at the time of getting their payment & shipping info into them & they have accommodated them. Taking the shaft down hasn't been a problem, but the 2nd shaft may delay things a bit. So please ask once your selection has been made.

Some have asked for separate lists, but the problem is still the same - if someone wanted to change their mind of cue type, they can't. It's been suggested that it remain the same but if there are no pointed cues left, they can be moved to the top of the next list for 1st choice. This may be a doable possibility if, and only if, there are no pointed cues left when it's their turn. It would not work if someone just wanted to see what the next batch would bring before making their selection - nothing would get done.

Would this solution be acceptable to everyone so if there were no pointed cues remaining (& there is a plain-jane left) that you wouldn't be forced to buy the plain-jane?

Taking requests for a cue (wood, style, etc.): This is the hardest of all. Because there is a list, even if you requested a particular cue to be built for you, there would be no guarantee that it will be there when it's your turn. All those in front of you would have the option to select that one since it's part of the batch. Unless you are #1 on the list, this would never work. Sorry. If Ernie was making made to order cues, he would need a deposit & if he goes walk-about, we're in the same mess as before. The reason for this format is that if something where to happen to Ernie (no sign of this by the way) then no one's out any money & whatever has been built is still an Ernie Martinez cue. I hope you understand.

Nothing is set in stone & I look forward to more suggestions, my addressing some of your suggestions are just to let you know we have given this a lot of thought & there are reasons for its format.

If I missed anything, I'll pick it up during this thread. All ideas will be considered - after all, this is YOUR list...I'm just administrating it.

Again, thanks all. Keep the ideas coming.

Dave
 
cuenut said:
I understand the market for Ernie's cues, but don't like some of what I hear in this thread. It would seem that the guy with the money should have options. Why wouldn't Ernie state that the next "X" number will be plain or pointed, and get with the guys on the list. He may restrict the ringwork, etc. or the veneers to what he likes, but I think the buyers should get some say in the deal. Kinda like SW.

If he makes a cue you don't like and you are next in line, you shouldn't have to give up your place. You should stay where you are and the next guy down the line should be contacted with the same option.

Ernie is not the customer here, but demand is demand, and silly things happen when that is the case.
Click to expand...

Thanks, cuenut. I saw this just as I posted my 1st response. I understand what you're saying, but this is completely different than SW or any other custom cue maker's way of doing business. If everyone could pass & keep their place in line, the list would become unmanageable & Ernie would not have the cash flow he needs & deserves.

To go back, this all began when I had mentioned I would be posting Ernie's completed cues on AZB for sale. A member asked to be 1st on the list. So I asked the AZ masses if they wanted a list, I would administer it for them, but those on the list must buy at least a plain-jane cue if available. All agreed, so here we are.

Instead of posting the completed cues then selling them, we are following a list to make sure that everyone, who wants one, gets an Ernie. We knew going in this is not ideal but it is full of integrity and it prevents those who had been burned in the past by prepaying from it happening again. Only finished cues are available. It also allows Ernie to do what he loves & not be bothered with the business aspect of the cue business. He loves it this way.

I guess we could go back to the original plan to post the cues as they're completed (with no list) and have people buy them if they want, but what about those that are anticipating their turn on the list?

I agree, the best thing for the buyer is to order what they want - but in this case, it would have not allowed Ernie to flourish and get back in the game. The idea of his business manager was to relieve Ernie of the stresses he had while on his own & let him do what he loves to do...make great cues. Also, Ernie could never say no, so the locals that had his ear would jump to the head of the line & sometimes get great deals on cues if Ernie needed money. With this system in place, none of that is happening. The roll out & get sold based on the list. If locals want one of his cues, they get on the list. Period.

Again, I'm open to all suggestions so the process can be improved, so thank you for your input.

Dave
 
I think that you should keep the list the same. It worked well so far with the exception of the Derby City Classic and one particular member. All-in-all I don't think you could have expected this to work any better.

So far, Ernie has produced simple cues, and I see him producing these for a long time, even if he gets back into making fancy things.

I suggest you do this. Leave the list the way it is. If someone wants a plain cue, no problem, there will always be plain ones. If someone wants a pointed cue and there are none left, move them back on the list, SO LONG AS you don't have any problems selling the plain ones. If someone wants something fancy, and wants input into the process/materials/designs, they should buy a plain or pointed one, and be put at the top of a special list for if and when Ernie starts making them (no guarantees he ever will, but if he does, he is commited to the list).

The special list buyers should buy the plain one they commited to even if they want a fancy one. The cost of a plain cue may be only a fraction of the price of a fancy one, so it should not present a big problem anyway.

I don't see Fancy expensive cues working out on a first come type list anyway. For over $2k, people are going to want full service.

As far as the plain cues go, input could turn into a nightmare. Besides, in getting a cue from a living legend maker, everyone should put a certain amount of faith in him, that they will get a great looking and playing cue.
 
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