Rip-off Report on Glen, The Real King Cobra

UGOTDA7 said:

People who are the best in their field tend to be eccentric......RKC is no exception. And is there anybody here who has paid any attention at all who doesn't know what they're getting into when they pursue his services? Really? I mean come on.....really?

It's obvious he's in high demand, travels all over the country, is committed to perfection, and is willing to do what it takes to achieve perfection for his customers....and he clearly marches to the beat of his own drum - which in the end means that he will be unpredictable. He is who he is and he makes no bones about it - you have to respect that.

But you know what - given his eccentricity and scheduling challenges.....the service he provides is worth it as has been proven time and time again. Hell, it's damn near an honor just to say you have a table he has worked on. How crazy is that when you think about it?

Having said all of that and fully understanding the situation - RKC I want to get on your list to have an older red label Diamond nine foot professional brought up to the most recent specs with new rails, rails extended to make four inch pockets, and covered with tournament blue Simonis 860. :thumbup:

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I'll see what I can do....LOL I'm still in SD right now, then headed to IA to rebuild 2 older Diamond 9ft's there, then back up to MN, WI, and the last table I have to deliver and set up is in IN.

Once I get back to the factory, I'm loading up again headed for WY, MT, WA. and Alaska for deliveries and service work.

After that, I'm a little open to doing some tables on the way back to the factory...LOL

Where are you located?

Glen

UGOTDA7 said:

People who are the best in their field tend to be eccentric...... :thumbup:

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Maybe just a little, but I'm not crazy yet

Baxter said:

Glen's services are the ones that everyone is after. If you don't want to have to put up with whatever it takes to obtain Glen's services, then pound salt and go find someone else who is willing to bend over backwards for you within your timeframe. Glen is regarded as the best table mechanic in the known world, so you're probably going to be the one bending over backwards within his timeframe to obtain his services. Just know that. That being said, the OP has legitimate reasons to be upset. Glen probably should have had a little bit better communication with the guy. I don't think Glen was trying to be deceptive when estimating his deadlines, but he may have underestimated how backed up he was and how long it would take to complete the project. It's always best to give yourself some wiggle room when agreeing to a deadline. You think it's going to take you 2 months to complete, you estimate it at 3 months. If you're done in the 2 months you thought, your customer will be happy to have their work completed "early".

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I have followed the careers of both Glen and Mark Gregory over the last few years. I would bet money, and have seen, that Glen doesn't want any part of a match between them measuring mechanic ability. Glen will come back with the fact that he taught Mark everything he knows, but its become pretty obvious lately that Glen is full of sh!t in that department. It's sad that Glen is allowed to bully every other table tech off of here, so he is considered "the guy" in his own little world.

realkingcobra said:

I'll see what I can do....LOL I'm still in SD right now, then headed to IA to rebuild 2 older Diamond 9ft's there, then back up to MN, WI, and the last table I have to deliver and set up is in IN.

Once I get back to the factory, I'm loading up again headed for WY, MT, WA. and Alaska for deliveries and service work.

After that, I'm a little open to doing some tables on the way back to the factory...LOL

Where are you located?

Glen

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Kansas City area.......whenever you're available just let me know and we'll see what we can work out. And if you like BBQ I'll even grab us some great KC BBQ while you're here.....it's among the best. :grin-square:

realkingcobra said:

yet you know NOTHING about what I do, as you think it's all about putting cloth on a pool table and calling it done!

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This where you're wrong. I was a billiard mechanic for 6 years. I know precisely about what you do. (no I'm not claiming to be as talented as you).

I'm not telling you how to run your business but pointing out that you clearly take some customers for granted.

Then instead of owning it and apologizing you publicly aired his personal business on a forum, sarcastically told him you'd get around to returning his property and his money, insulted other members and claimed that we can't begin to suggest anything to you unless we're capable of doing the same level of work you do.

Here I'll even quote you.

IF THEY CAN'T DO THE SAME LEVEL OF WORK THAT I DO, then how can they possibly think they're smart enough to proceed to telling me how to do MY job!!

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News flash, lots of people on this forum do the same level of work in their field that you do. They don't use it as an excuse to treat their customers poorly.

Highroller54 said:

After weeks of phone conversations with Glenn (The Real King Cobra) he and I came to an agreement for him to rebuild and calibrate my Gandy Rails. Back in the first week of February 2013, Glenn was in my area and was able to pick the rails up at my home along with the payment for the work. We made a deal that he would have them completed and returned by mid March 2013. Well now it’s late May 2013 and after many phone conversations, and Glen telling me he would have the rails done and returned to me time and time again, I have given up all hope to ever seeing Glenn, my money or my rails again.

I have been extremely patient during the procrastinating Glenn has done. Glenn has left me with a Table that’s useless. Now I have been forced to take action, I normally wouldn’t even think of doing this kind of thing, (Venting on a forum), but Glenn has took my money, took my rails and has done nothing short of screw me, and has never returned either of them. People need to know what he is capable of doing!

I just don’t understand how a person everyone speaks so highly of, can do this. But I guess you live and learn. I have since tried to sell the table for parts, trying to recover some of my money, but so far no takers. I guess an old Big G Gandy isn’t worth much but it was my table, and now it’s been stolen from me and the remainder I have left isn’t worth anything.
Glen has totally ripped me off and screwed me and I just felt like venting, sorry to waste your time..
:angry:

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realkingcobra said:

There is no getting caught up, the line of customers go down the road miles and miles, so guess what? I get people that are pissed at me because I can't get to them next...when they're 1500 miles away, or 50 miles away but I'm not headed in that direction at the time. So, I'd love to see someone come up with an all BRAIN schedule for me to follow along with. There isn't a person smart enough on AZ that could schedule my workload for me, because you couldn't guarantee that I'd be in TX or CA or NY or FL or LA, MS, WV, VA or anywhere else in this country...at a specific time frame to work on someone's pool table. The only guarantee I can make, is that when I'm done working someone's pool table, they'll love the way it plays, as I don't take any short cuts to getting the job done right...the first time

Glen

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realkingcobra said:

For that matter, I'm not even at the Diamond factory all that much, so when I do get there, that's when all the in house projects start. Plus I do other things at the factory, like design and build their billiard tables, fix older Diamond rails so they can be sold off on used tables, but play like a new Diamond. If it were up to Diamond, I'd be there all the time, but even Diamond can't afford to pay me on a regular basis, as I don't work for Diamond, so that means I'm NOT an employee of Diamond. If I wanted to be someone's employee, I wouldn't be doing what I'm doing now, as I won't work for someone else, and haven't in the last 30 years.

Glen

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If it's gonna take two months, tell the guy it's gonna take two months.

If it could take up to a year, then tell the customer that IT COULD TAKE UP TO A YEAR

What the fudge is so hard about that ??

If you tell me it could take up to a year (or whatever, I'm just throwing an amount of time out there), then at least I know what I'm lookin' at, and I don't feel like I'm getting the shaft.

Every good business owner knows it. Even the guy that fixed my car doors knew it. Told me it would take four says to redo the bottoms of my rusted doors (NY roads and all). Had it done in three.
"Wow, Jimmy, you guys work quick !!"
"It usually take 2-3 days. I told ya four in case I got jammed up somewhere. If I told ya three and it took, you'd be pissed at me. So I look good when I get it done in three."

Under promise and over deliver... That's Business 101...

Be straight with the customer, or don't take the job.

Mickey <--- Oh, and dropping the personal stuff about the OP was BS

If you don't care what everyone thinks then why do you continue to waste time here defending yourself.

On a lighter note see this - especially at about 2:10....kind of reminds me of RKC. :winknudge:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a6wpYS15Gag

Highroller54 said:

angry::angry::angry::angry::angry::angry::angry::angry::angry:

After weeks of phone conversations with Glenn (The Real King Cobra) he and I came to an agreement for him to rebuild and calibrate my Gandy Rails. Back in the first week of February 2013, Glenn was in my area and was able to pick the rails up at my home along with the payment for the work. We made a deal that he would have them completed and returned by mid March 2013. Well now it’s late May 2013 and after many phone conversations, and Glen telling me he would have the rails done and returned to me time and time again, I have given up all hope to ever seeing Glenn, my money or my rails again.

I have been extremely patient during the procrastinating Glenn has done. Glenn has left me with a Table that’s useless. Now I have been forced to take action, I normally wouldn’t even think of doing this kind of thing, (Venting on a forum), but Glenn has took my money, took my rails and has done nothing short of screw me, and has never returned either of them. People need to know what he is capable of doing!

I just don’t understand how a person everyone speaks so highly of, can do this. But I guess you live and learn. I have since tried to sell the table for parts, trying to recover some of my money, but so far no takers. I guess an old Big G Gandy isn’t worth much but it was my table, and now it’s been stolen from me and the remainder I have left isn’t worth anything.
Glen has totally ripped me off and screwed me and I just felt like venting, sorry to waste your time..
:angry:

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Not that I know this guy or how he works but there is one thing I learned the hard way. Never pay someone in full for services that are incomplete. I can maybe imagine a partial payment but never a full one. Just think about it they already have your money so there is no rush to complete your work. But with a partial payment they are eager to finish it. By no means am I trying to bash this guy I am just talking in general.

realkingcobra said:

You know what, it's a real ***** being the best there is, but someone has to be, so it might just as well be me. No business plan in the world actually gets the job done, it's still done by my hands, and not someone else's, so that means I have to be there to do it.

Problem is I can only work on one pool table at a time, but for all of you who think you have the right to tell me what I should do or not do, or how to do the work I do, I have one question for all of you?...How the hell come YOU'RE not out doing what I'm doing to make a living? All I read is that there's a whole bunch of you out there that don't know shit about what I'm doing for a living, yet you feel educated enough to tell me how I should run my life.

Here's a saying for all of you, in which I truly believe in...."The hardest jobs in the world are made easy by all THOSE that don't have to do them"
Glen

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The best there is?!?! Here's my quote from another thread on here about my experience with this d-bag:
Originally Posted by Idaho
It had more to do with the way he treated my wife. She fed him like a king and he never once said thank you. He left cigarette butts all over outside, Dr. Pepper cans and trash all over inside, then took a dump and bragged about how he stunk up that end of the house when there was a can of spray next to the head. I gave him a DeWalt drill that was like the ones he uses and he just looked at it and said "huh", no thank you. We are very neighborly and treated him the way we treat any visitor in our home. He is a classless tool that will never be welcome here. It's no wonder he is single and lives in a box truck. He has the maturity of a ten year old. Zach, on the other hand, was very respectful and a pleasure to deal with. Glen belittled him a time or two, but he just kept working and kept his mouth shut. I felt sorry for him because he got stuck with Glen way longer than he originally promised.

Posted by RKC
On a side note, it's a real good thing I didn't know you were so full of shit like this before I showed up at your house, or I'd have never been there, and I still can't for the life of me remember who you are...must be a reason


It is true that I thought I'd have him back later to do more work in my table, but that was only because I was new to AZ and didn't know any other mechanics. I'd let Zach, Mark, or Donny work on my table now that I know about them, but I wouldn't let Glen eat the peanuts out of my sh!t

Here's an example ...

Gsitz89 said:

Never pay someone in full for services that are incomplete./QUOTE]

I have ordered several Custom Cues (My Design) from Alex Brick
over the past 10-12 yrs. and NOT ONCE would he accept full payment
in advance. He inisists on no more than 1/3 - 1/2 down payment with
the balance on completion. I think it keeps him "hungry". A True
Gentleman and a GREAT Cue Maker. He gives a rough estimate of
time to completion and it rarely goes much past the projected date.

Of the 50+ Cues ordered from Tom Coker, he never once asked for
a "dime" up front. Payment on Completion was fine with him.

As an Exotic Car Owner/Restorer/Dealer I rarely took on projects I could
not complete within a reasonable timeframe.

"Quality" (Happy Customers) vs "Quantity".

I made a comfortable living and still had time for the finer things in life.

That said: Most Retailers (Cars, Food, Clothing, Goods & Services, etc.)
are selling basically the same goods and services from different venues.
The ONE thing that sets them apart is .... Customer Service

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P.M. me to find out how to keep peanuts out of your sh*t.

Wow, that was pretty descriptive Idaho...

A buddy of mine and I sort of joke about the threads on here involving RKC. All of his work appears to be good, but at what cost ? Quoting my buddy, "Sure I could hire him to work on my table, but from what I've read I would need to expect him to stay for a week or two in my guest room, feed the guy and let him sleep with my wife".

I only bring that up because I love the quote and it really does sound like some of the restorations run long due to complications and fixing screw-ups by previous mechanics, and perhaps a little bit of perfectionism.

I have read a lot of the posts from the table mechanic section. Thanks to RKC for sharing a lot of your knowledge, but you may want to consider revising your business model and not take on a small job like this one again and just give some of the work to colleagues.

realkingcobra said:

Well, to put it bluntly...it's none of your business, is it? Try proof reading before you post key board warrior

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Bottom line.
Tony is without a table for months on end, well beyond the expected completion time.

Rather than contrition, apology and a renewal of good customer service, we get F. U. here are your broken rails back after 5 months of staring at a broken table and an exclusion list.

I don't know how to use spell check.

Got it.

Is the rail recalibrate $600 or $800? Why do you charge different rates for the same job?

Blue Hog ridr said:

Obviously no dog in this thread either way.

I have always enjoyed and sit amazed looking at the craftsmanship in Glen's pictures.

One trait that I have noticed with many people, specially craftsmen, and maybe one of Glen's problems is that he doesn't know when to say no.

Just tries to make everyone happy and it comes back and bites you in the butt on occasion.

Just one possibility.

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Does this somehow excuse rude condesention, a dismissive I'm doing you a favor attitude and an over blown ego?

I wouldn't have posted in this thread but for the tenor of his response to this guy.

I can empathise with not having a table. Having to look at the naked slate every day not knowing if or when I would ever get to play on it again. Then to get the treatment he got on top of the anxiety frustration and anger already caused at the generous gifted hands of Glen?

I don't care how good you are. Right is right. there is no amount of talent that would entice me to put up with the bullshit on display here.

So glad Tony posted this thread. I might have decided to have my rails done. I can feel Tony's anguish just thinking about it...

Baxter said:

Glen's services are the ones that everyone is after. If you don't want to have to put up with whatever it takes to obtain Glen's services, then pound salt and go find someone else who is willing to bend over backwards for you within your timeframe. Glen is regarded as the best table mechanic in the known world, so you're probably going to be the one bending over backwards within his timeframe to obtain his services. Just know that. That being said, the OP has legitimate reasons to be upset. Glen probably should have had a little bit better communication with the guy. I don't think Glen was trying to be deceptive when estimating his deadlines, but he may have underestimated how backed up he was and how long it would take to complete the project. It's always best to give yourself some wiggle room when agreeing to a deadline. You think it's going to take you 2 months to complete, you estimate it at 3 months. If you're done in the 2 months you thought, your customer will be happy to have their work completed "early".

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This isn't the case. that is why the thread was started. How would you feel looking at your unplayable table for 5 months? I wouldn't be able to even walk in the room after a while. Just the sight of it would set me off again and again.

That's what Glen fails to appreciate or attone for. It isn't about how much he charges or the quality of his work. It's about attitude.

realkingcobra said:

What's "INSULTING" is you thinking that my job is stressful, because it's not, so why are you assuming that it is?

What's "INSULTING" that just because you can run your business a certain way, that should mean I can run my business the same way you run yours.

What's "INSULTING" is that YOU sit back on YOUR pedestal and pass judgment on me, like you're so much better than I am, yet you know NOTHING about what I do, as you think it's all about putting cloth on a pool table and calling it done!

What's also "INSULTING" is the fact that I wouldn't make a good waiter in a restaurant either, but who's talking about being able to do other jobs. Millions of people work in this country, what's THAT got to do with the JOB I DO?

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It's insulting that you still think this is about the quality or the price of your work.

DelaWho??? said:

It's insulting that you still think this is about the quality or the price of your work.

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You ever heard the story of the peacock and pig?

"the peacock was so full of himself that there was not a spare inch left in his ears for anyone else's words"

How old is this guy ?

REV

For all of the keyboard heroes that are bashing Glenn about bring up the OP's IRS issue, the OP took it upon himself to air his own issues in a previous thread long before Glenn ever did.
I'm sure Glenn couldn't care less about anyones opinion's here. He conducts HIS business the way HE wants. If you don't like it, move on. The OP should have done his due dilligence before hiring Glenn to know what he was getting into instead of crying foul later.

gutshot said:

For all of the keyboard heroes that are bashing Glenn about bring up the OP's IRS issue, the OP took it upon himself to air his own issues in a previous thread long before Glenn ever did.
I'm sure Glenn could care less about anyones opinion's here. He conducts HIS business the way HE wants. If you don't like it, move on. The OP should have done his due dilligence before hiring Glenn to know what he was getting into instead of crying foul later.

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*Couldn't.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=om7O0MFkmpw