Caudron vs. Sayginer (3-cushion video)

Aaron_S

Aaron_S

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I'm sure most carom enthusiasts have seen this video already (probably about 100 times, like I have :o), but I thought I'd share it again, along with a question. In this match, which I believe is from 1997 (actually, it appears to be from '96), Caudron sets a new world record by achieving an average score of 5.0 (45 pts in 9 innings) for the match.

I'm curious to know what the record was before this stunning performance, and if Caudron's record has yet been broken. I personally have never seen anything like it, and would be interested in obtaining any videos showing performances approaching or exceeding it. Anyway, enjoy the video if you haven't already seen it.

mms://vod.tbc.co.kr/vod5/billiard/bill961208.asf

Also, notice the horrible lighting situation the players were having to endure in this tournament. There appears to have been some powerful light source off to one side that caused major shadows to be cast over the table when the players were shooting. Very distracting I would think.

OH, and there are a ton of other matches on this website if you just poke around a bit. There are a bunch of other 3-cushion matches, including some with Ceulemans and some with Sang Lee (may he rest in peace), and some straight rail matches as well. There are also some ladies 9-ball matches from the 90's in there somewhere. Happy viewing.

Aaron
 
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Thanks for sharing. I don't personally play 3 cushion, but I enjoy watching. I'm still trying to learn to pocket the ball in the hole, lol. According to the two announcers, previous record was set on 92 at the Netherlands World Open, 45 points in 13 turns. I don't know if this record has been broken, but they predicted won't be touched in 100 years.

S.
 
Aaron_S said:
I'm sure most carom enthusiasts have seen this video already (probably about 100 times, like I have :o), but I thought I'd share it again, along with a question. In this match, which I believe is from 1997 (actually, it appears to be from '96), Caudron sets a new world record by achieving an average score of 5.0 (45 pts in 9 innings) for the match.

I'm curious to know what the record was before this stunning performance, and if Caudron's record has yet been broken. I personally have never seen anything like it, and would be interested in obtaining any videos showing performances approaching or exceeding it. Anyway, enjoy the video if you haven't already seen it.

mms://vod.tbc.co.kr/vod5/billiard/bill961208.asf

Also, notice the horrible lighting situation the players were having to endure in this tournament. There appears to have been some powerful light source off to one side that caused major shadows to be cast over the table when the players were shooting. Very distracting I would think.

OH, and there are a ton of other matches on this website if you just poke around a bit. There are a bunch of other 3-cushion matches, including some with Ceulemans and some with Sang Lee (may he rest in peace), and some straight rail matches as well. There are also some ladies 9-ball matches from the 90's in there somewhere. Happy viewing.

Aaron
Click to expand...

Both player have perfectly manicured cue tips! :grin-square:
 
sunnyday said:
Thanks for sharing. I don't personally play 3 cushion, but I enjoy watching. I'm still trying to learn to pocket the ball in the hole, lol. According to the two announcers, previous record was set on 92 at the Netherlands World Open, 45 points in 13 turns. I don't know if this record has been broken, but they predicted won't be touched in 100 years.

S.
Click to expand...

You know, I have played it some, but I think I still enjoy watching it more than playing it. I realize that doesn't say much for my level of proficiency at the game. :)

I appreciate the information about the previous record. By my math, that comes out to about 3.46 average, so this was in fact a record shattering performance from Caudron. Truly amazing.

Thanks again,
Aaron
 
Great link. That was awesome. You have the feeling he was in such a groove he could have just kept rolling 10 and 15 points everytime up. Sayginer looked like he couldn't get out of the room fast enough.

:thumbup:
 
Thank you for the link Aaron. Now those guys can play. I played a lot of 3 cushion in the 1960's to early 1970' as I had one table in my poolroom. I ran a lot of sixes, but can't remember running more than that playing anyone. My game plan is to close the patio in where I have the 7 foot Valley now and put a billiard table in there too. Johnnyt
 
Aaron_S said:
Caudron sets a new world record by achieving an average score of 5.0 (45 pts in 9 innings) for the match.

I'm curious to know what the record was before this stunning performance, and if Caudron's record has yet been broken.
Click to expand...

Dick Jaspers broke it this past June at the European Championships against Blomdahl. Jaspers scored 45 points in 8 innings (15 in 2, 15 in 1, 15 in 5). He ran 13 and out in the 1st set, ran 15 from the break in the 2nd, and started with a 6 in the 3rd. That means he scored 34 consecutive points without missing, although they were spread between sets.

Btw, last year he had runs of 20 and 22 in the same tournament. In fact, Just a couple of weeks ago Jaspers ran 17 and 20 in a single 50-point game at a tournament in France. He ran the 17 from the break for an early lead, but his opponent DeBruijn fought back to get ahead 36-27 averaging over 3.0. Then Jaspers ran a *20* to regain the lead 47-36. Incredibly, DeBruijn ran an 8 to catch up 47-44 and eventually tied the match 50-50 thanks to the equal innings format. Billiards is a crazy game! :)

Robert
 
Aaron_S said:
I'm sure most carom enthusiasts have seen this video already (probably about 100 times, like I have :o), but I thought I'd share it again, along with a question. In this match, which I believe is from 1997 (actually, it appears to be from '96), Caudron sets a new world record by achieving an average score of 5.0 (45 pts in 9 innings) for the match.

I'm curious to know what the record was before this stunning performance, and if Caudron's record has yet been broken. ..
Click to expand...
(Jaspers' 5.625 average described by Robert above ...) Not exactly a run of 34, but pretty good none the less.

The record for average depends on the length of the match. In 60-point matches, which are hardly played any more, Blomdahl has the record of 15 innings for a 4.0 average. Accu-stats has a tape of this match. Ceulemans was his opponent with something like a 2.2 average.

You can see a lot of tournament results including the EC3C mentioned above on the www.kozoom.com web site. You have to look under Resultats -> Individuel and then pick the event or discipline you want to look for.
 
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Great video! I've played 3-C for over ten years and have never seen that one before.

Caudron not only played phenomenal, he made a number of low percentage shots that were really cool to watch.
 
One thing that never fails to amazes me is that.....

Frederic Caudron looks like if he is almost going to kiss off the first other object ball every single time. His style is as smooth as butter. But for us carom enthusiast, it is very well known why: Because Frederic's background is in Cushion Caroms, then before that: Balkline, and Straight Rail before that ever so consistantly. :)
 
SlickRick_PCS said:
Frederic Caudron looks like if he is almost going to kiss off the first other object ball every single time. His style is as smooth as butter. But for us carom enthusiast, it is very well known why: Because Frederic's background is in Cushion Caroms, then before that: Balkline, and Straight Rail before that ever so consistantly. :)
Click to expand...

Caudron hasn't given up the small games either. Last year in the Belgian National Championships he entered and won all six events -- 3-cushion, 1-cushion, straight caroms, and all three balkline events. His averages in the five "small" events were phenomenal: 47.05 in 47/1, 109.09 in 47/2, 111.11 in 71/2, 400 in straight caroms (i.e., he never missed -- he ran 400 and out in his first inning every game), and in 1-cushion, where 15 billiards per inning would win nearly every tournament ever held, he averaged 27.27.

Mark
 
SlickRick_PCS said:
Frederic Caudron looks like if he is almost going to kiss off the first other object ball every single time.
Click to expand...

Caudron was fortunate to miss several kisses by a hair in that match. I think most record-breaking games are such a combination of luck and skill.

Another Caudron-Sayginer match to keep an eye out for is from the 2008 Sang Lee Internationa Open this past July. I'm not sure when High Rock Productions intends to release the footage, but many believe it was the most exciting billiards they'd ever seen even if it wasn't a record. It was 21-22 after only 5 innings and 27-37 after 8! Sayginer had a 13, and Caudron ran 11 and 12. Sayginer made an incredible comeback to have the first shot at victory, but Caudron pulled it out by 1 point: 50-49 in 18 innings. The scoresheet can be seen here.

Robert
 
mbvl said:
Caudron hasn't given up the small games either. True Last year in the Belgian National Championships he entered and won all six events -- 3-cushion, 1-cushion, straight caroms, and all three balkline events. Penthalon, right? His averages in the five "small" events were phenomenal: 47.05 in 47/1, 109.09 in 47/2, 111.11 in 71/2, 400 in straight caroms (i.e., he never missed -- he ran 400 and out in his first inning every game), and in 1-cushion, where 15 billiards per inning would win nearly every tournament ever held, he averaged 27.27.

Mark
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....yet, this is why he never fails to amaze me :cool: . Can't forget Blomdahl, Jaspers, Sanchez, Sayginer, and (of course) R. Ceulemans. :thumbup:
 
Robert Raiford said:
Caudron was fortunate to miss several kisses by a hair in that match. I think most record-breaking games are such a combination of luck and skill.

Another Caudron-Sayginer match to keep an eye out for is from the 2008 Sang Lee Internationa Open this past July. I'm not sure when High Rock Productions intends to release the footage, but many believe it was the most exciting billiards they'd ever seen even if it wasn't a record. It was 21-22 after only 5 innings and 27-37 after 8! Sayginer had a 13, and Caudron ran 11 and 12. Sayginer made an incredible comeback to have the first shot at victory, but Caudron pulled it out by 1 point: 50-49 in 18 innings. The scoresheet can be seen here.

Robert
Click to expand...

I'll say this: I am likely going to buy a DVD of this tournament just for carom experience before I depart to California. If you say this is one of the best matches there, I'll highly consider buying it. But on one condition: Are you commentating on this particular match? :o
 
Aaron_S said:
I'm sure most carom enthusiasts have seen this video already (probably about 100 times, like I have :o), but I thought I'd share it again, along with a question. In this match, which I believe is from 1997 (actually, it appears to be from '96), Caudron sets a new world record by achieving an average score of 5.0 (45 pts in 9 innings) for the match.

I'm curious to know what the record was before this stunning performance, and if Caudron's record has yet been broken. I personally have never seen anything like it, and would be interested in obtaining any videos showing performances approaching or exceeding it. Anyway, enjoy the video if you haven't already seen it.

mms://vod.tbc.co.kr/vod5/billiard/bill961208.asf

Also, notice the horrible lighting situation the players were having to endure in this tournament. There appears to have been some powerful light source off to one side that caused major shadows to be cast over the table when the players were shooting. Very distracting I would think.

OH, and there are a ton of other matches on this website if you just poke around a bit. There are a bunch of other 3-cushion matches, including some with Ceulemans and some with Sang Lee (may he rest in peace), and some straight rail matches as well. There are also some ladies 9-ball matches from the 90's in there somewhere. Happy viewing.

Aaron
Click to expand...

Where do you find these other matches? I can only get this one
 
Cameron Smith said:
Where do you find these other matches? I can only get this one
Click to expand...

Let me do a little digging, Cameron. I'll try to post some links a bit later.

Aaron
 
Bob Jewett said:
...In 60-point matches, ...Blomdahl has the record of 15 innings for a 4.0 average. Accu-stats has a tape of this match. Ceulemans was his opponent with something like a 2.2 average...
Click to expand...

I believe I just got this match from a fellow AZBr. Blomdahl is an absolute monster, for sure. The style difference between him and Ceulemans is really noticeable. Raymond is all finesse, while Torbjorn is power defined. A great exhibition.

I have always dabbled in 3c, the room I learned to play in had a table, but I have really become interested over the last couple of years...in fact, I boutght a billiard table and I am going to replace my pool table with it. Great game. The yang to pool's yin.
 
Ok, here are some links to other areas of this website. Sorry, I have not even tried to do any translation of these pages, but there are many, many good matches. Each of these links is to a page containing several videos:

3 Cushion: http://tbc.co.kr/tbc_sports/billiard_03_1.htm
Straight Rail (I think): http://tbc.co.kr/tbc_sports/billiard_03_2.htm
9-Ball: http://tbc.co.kr/tbc_sports/billiard_03_3.htm
Misc. Billiard: http://tbc.co.kr/tbc_sports/billiard_03_4.htm

There may be other videos on this site as well. A good translation would be very handy.

Happy viewing,
Aaron
 
SlickRick_PCS said:
I'll say this: I am likely going to buy a DVD of this tournament just for carom experience before I depart to California. If you say this is one of the best matches there, I'll highly consider buying it. But on one condition: Are you commentating on this particular match? :o
Click to expand...

:) Thanks for the interest, Rick, but I'm not sure if I'll be doing that particular one. Let me explain...

When I do commentary for Jan Carl's CaromTV videos, there are only 2 cameras and it's all edited live during the match (except for a digital scoreboard that is added later). It's effective for selling DVDs and streaming video individually to billiard fans worldwide, but it's not broadcast quality for commercial TV.

In contrast, the stuff from Ira Lee's High Rock Productions is professionally taped by a big ESPN-certified crew using 4 cameras. All editing is done in post-production long after the actual taping, which is a big hassle and makes commentary difficult. It can't just be improvised, since you have to coordinate 4 camera angles, incorporate pretty graphics, smoothly interleave other video segments like interviews and profiles, break for ads, etc. Since their primary market at the moment is Korea, it's unlikely I'll be involved until they target an English-speaking country. :) Now that ESPN aired the artistic 3-cushion programs, I'm hoping it'll be easier to air some actual games in the future.

Hopefully you'll still get it when it becomes available, though, since it's one of the most amazing matches you'll ever see!

Robert
 
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