Small turnaround at US open? where are all pool pros?
- Thread starter mel_smOg
- Start date
They all screamed "Show me the money!!" and Tom Cruise hung up on them, so they stayed home.
It has to be Bonus Balls fault. 
It has to be Bonus Balls fault.
Not this time but have you seen next years points event schedule?
Five events that were there this year wont be there in 2014. What happened with BB in 2013 was a factor in four of them. Thats fact not opinion.
The damage BB management and some players did is very real. Everyone will see the effects in 2014.
Which events are going away?
Very true, hopefully something will be done for 2014, so bonus ball and major tournament do not collide, i dont see much good coming from this when it happens.
What is going to happen to Dcc if there is only a few great players that can attend, DCC is going to closed its doors for good if this does happen, plus other tournaments like tunica.
Then we will have Bonus Ball the only game left in town, thats not going to cut it!
I dont know what is really going to happen, i just wish that if bonus ball does catch on, i hope it can fit in with all the big tournnaments that we have left!
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Don't worry, bonus ball will NEVER make it. The game is to complicated to get the average joe interested. I'd love to drive thru McDonald's and see Rodney Morris or some of the others flipping burgers
I counted the Souther Classic as one and now that I think of it it may not have been a points event I do not remember but it was a major tournament.
US Open 10 Ball and 8 Ball were points events. They will not be back.
Ultimate 10 Ball was a points event will not be returning.
Thats four large added money open events gone.
Those four events all had BB scheduling and the noise and hassle that went along with it as a factor in deciding not to go again in 2014. BB will say they have no impact but I know that is not the case. Some won't believe me and thats fine I don't really care.
Last I heard Turning Stone will be down to one event this year due to some remodeling at the casino. Maybe that changes who knows.
Bringing the total points events to the Bigfoot at DCC and one Turning Stone event. If the US Open 9 Ball is around that may make it three.
Tunica US Open 10 ball, 8 Ball AND Ultimate 10 Ball .. GONE... this is beyond sad it is devastating ... are any being replaced with invitational type events?...
Well, we all have opinions. What you call fact I don't think there is a way to prove as fact. I disagree that BB was the cause. Its just a convenient scapegoat. Pool has been on a downward spiral for years. 6 months of BB uncertainty is not at fault for this decades long spiral, nor the final nail. Maybe Mark is mad at BB and canceled his events. However, Mark should not have been the only game in town left where if he walks away, there are no more events.
That is my opinion, that I'm entitled to
I like when players ***** about the pro payouts at the BCA/csi events like Rodney did.
For one no one came there to watch them anyhow, they came there because they play league all year and want to compete themselves.
The "pros" should have been happy he offered them the events as they are definitely not money makers.
Then they don't support the southern classic, because of BB. Well guess who owns a piece of that.
Now BB, wants to hold playoffs in January, I'm sure it will conflict with the u.s. bar table event or derby.
Lol, they always seem to fk up what little they do have and holler they deserve more.
Guess we will see more of em getting a job like they should anyhow.
For one no one came there to watch them anyhow, they came there because they play league all year and want to compete themselves.
The "pros" should have been happy he offered them the events as they are definitely not money makers.
Then they don't support the southern classic, because of BB. Well guess who owns a piece of that.
Now BB, wants to hold playoffs in January, I'm sure it will conflict with the u.s. bar table event or derby.
Lol, they always seem to fk up what little they do have and holler they deserve more.
Guess we will see more of em getting a job like they should anyhow.
Pro events
Everybody is entitled to opinions. Even me.
What JCIN said is pretty accurate. And you are wrong. It is a FACT that I have changed my whole outlook on professional pool and pool players. BB was a major part of that decision. The attitude of the 'pro' players is a major part of that decision.
It s not a convenient scapegoat. I am just not going to put up with the arrogance and attitudes of so many of the 'pro' players. I will be doing some kind of invitational events - with an international field (maybe 16 players or so).
I will not subject me or my staff to spend close to $90,000 (for the 3 events) and listen to the *****ing BEFORE the event because we charge registration and late fees. And then listen to Rodney Morris, who won $15,000, declare he doesn't like me and similar nonsense. It's all rather simple, if I do invitational events, I can deal with the players I feel are respectful of the game.
I can only say that the players have no one but themselves to blame. There are about a dozen US players that will NOT be playing in any more of my events. As others have said, they are not a draw, they are very high maintenance and just not worth it.
So there you have it- and that's the truth! And I'm not giving up on pool, just giving up on some of the US pro players. And it is ONLY these players. The foreigners always behave themselves.
Mark Griffin, CEO
CSI
Everybody is entitled to opinions. Even me.
What JCIN said is pretty accurate. And you are wrong. It is a FACT that I have changed my whole outlook on professional pool and pool players. BB was a major part of that decision. The attitude of the 'pro' players is a major part of that decision.
It s not a convenient scapegoat. I am just not going to put up with the arrogance and attitudes of so many of the 'pro' players. I will be doing some kind of invitational events - with an international field (maybe 16 players or so).
I will not subject me or my staff to spend close to $90,000 (for the 3 events) and listen to the *****ing BEFORE the event because we charge registration and late fees. And then listen to Rodney Morris, who won $15,000, declare he doesn't like me and similar nonsense. It's all rather simple, if I do invitational events, I can deal with the players I feel are respectful of the game.
I can only say that the players have no one but themselves to blame. There are about a dozen US players that will NOT be playing in any more of my events. As others have said, they are not a draw, they are very high maintenance and just not worth it.
So there you have it- and that's the truth! And I'm not giving up on pool, just giving up on some of the US pro players. And it is ONLY these players. The foreigners always behave themselves.
Mark Griffin, CEO
CSI
Well, we all have opinions. What you call fact I don't think there is a way to prove as fact. I disagree that BB was the cause. Its just a convenient scapegoat. Pool has been on a downward spiral for years. 6 months of BB uncertainty is not at fault for this decades long spiral, nor the final nail. Maybe Mark is mad at BB and canceled his events. However, Mark should not have been the only game in town left where if he walks away, there are no more events.
That is my opinion, that I'm entitled to
No business ever grows by producing net losses every time
I really like the US OPEN and think it's still the very best tournament these days. With that being said, let's do the math with 168 players (as an example, I'm not sure what the exact count is). Then let's figure out how good the BUSINESS MODEL is working.
168 {players} times entree fee of $500 equals $84,000
168 {players} times $1000 (average expense for hotel, travel, etc for tournament) $168,000
That's a total of $252,000 - now back out the entree fees of $84,000 add the "added money" of $50,000 to get the total net loss to the players....which is $84,000.
Divide the total number in the field (168) by the net loss of $84,000 and we find that the average loss per player is $500.
Try to imagine a regular business venture where the staff of 168 averages losing $500. apiece and it will start to make sense why the tournaments can never grow......NO BUSINESS EVER GROWS BY PRODUCING NET LOSSES EVERY TIME.....this is just "common sense" in business, but seems to me the "business model" of professional pool at the moment. 'The Game is the Teacher'
I really like the US OPEN and think it's still the very best tournament these days. With that being said, let's do the math with 168 players (as an example, I'm not sure what the exact count is). Then let's figure out how good the BUSINESS MODEL is working.
168 {players} times entree fee of $500 equals $84,000
168 {players} times $1000 (average expense for hotel, travel, etc for tournament) $168,000
That's a total of $252,000 - now back out the entree fees of $84,000 add the "added money" of $50,000 to get the total net loss to the players....which is $84,000.
Divide the total number in the field (168) by the net loss of $84,000 and we find that the average loss per player is $500.
Try to imagine a regular business venture where the staff of 168 averages losing $500. apiece and it will start to make sense why the tournaments can never grow......NO BUSINESS EVER GROWS BY PRODUCING NET LOSSES EVERY TIME.....this is just "common sense" in business, but seems to me the "business model" of professional pool at the moment. 'The Game is the Teacher'
+1
Finally glad to see someone take a stand. I'm proud of you for taking the stand Mark.
A fellow in Houston offered to have me run a 50k added pro event, I told him know way do they deserve that and I'd have to Barr a lot of pros. He said ok, I tried.
dom_poppa
Banned
It's funny that pro pool players demand so much.
This sport is like golf. There are only a few guys that are draws and even they have a problem drawing in this sport.
Just because you are a pro, it doesn't mean you can act like a diva.
"You may be a professional player but you don't play well enough to get people to watch."
This sport is like golf. There are only a few guys that are draws and even they have a problem drawing in this sport.
Just because you are a pro, it doesn't mean you can act like a diva.
"You may be a professional player but you don't play well enough to get people to watch."
Can't get much plainer than that. Pretty sad that such a great supporter of this game has come to this conclusion but maybe it was inevitable.
It has to be Bonus Balls fault.
Yes, it is BB's fault.
I hope the BB minions are happy now.
I don't blame you one bit. It's about time pool promoters begin to look out for themselves as far as financial gain, especially since there is little to no appreciation for what it takes to create a professional pool event. It's a thankless job for sure. Professional pool, as most know, is a rich man's high, nothing more and nothing less.
Today, I see some younger pro players on top of the world, and then I am reminded of those pros who age and pass away, sometimes with no friends or loved ones surrounding them during their time of need.
Bonus Ball is just the final nail in the coffin. American professional pool has been circling the drain for several years now. There is no new blood getting into competition. There are no professional tours. The BCA, the supposed representative of professional pool in the U.S., seems to turn a blind eye to the current state of affairs.
Wishing you all the best, Mark. League pool is where it's at. Pool should be fun, and those who are recreational shooters do have fun. Professional pool is a dog-eat-dog world, and the American pool culture is a fickle bunch of fans, to boot.
I'm going to say something that I'm sure will get me slammed, but I would like nothing more than to see Shane Van Boening go to college while he's still young. He's a good kid and deserves a better future than one afforded by the pool industry. I feel the same way about Brandon Shuff.