Sight Along Stick or Something Else?

Patrick Johnson · Mar 30, 2018

I like keeping my sightline over/along my stick. It allows me to live-monitor my stroke for straightness/accuracy and also to "measure" the cut by pointing the stick a precise distance from the OB contact point.

But once upon a time I liked to sight from contact point-to-contact point, especially for thin cuts, trusting my ability to stroke my stick accurately while sighting beside it rather than over it.

Do you make that choice (or choose another option) consciously?

pj
chgo

MattPoland · Mar 30, 2018

Oh gosh. I am always trying different things aiming. I also like CP-CP aiming for thin cuts. But most shots I do edge of shaft to contact point. I know it doesn’t work for all shots but it works for a lot on a bar box.

https://www.pooldawg.com/article/pooldawg-library/what-the-fck-are-you-looking-at-a-guide-to-aim

Patrick Johnson · Mar 30, 2018

MattPoland said:
...edge of shaft to contact point. I know it doesn’t work for all shots but it works for a lot on a bar box.

Don't feel like the Lone Ranger - no system works precisely for all shots (can I say that here?). Edge of stick aiming is only perfect for one small cut angle (based on the stick's width*), but it has other advantages: it puts your focus on the contact point(s) and where the stick is pointing. Your subconscious can work with that.

It's a little like what I do consciously - try to estimate how far from the contact point my stick's centerline should point in order to hit it.

pj
chgo

* A 1/2" (12.7mm) stick at center CB points through only one CB contact point, 1/4" from center. Because of the balls' curvatures, that CB contact point can only physically contact the OB 1/4" from its center - a cut angle of ~13 degrees (a little fatter than 3/4 overlap).

One Pocket John · Mar 30, 2018

Interesting post Pat.

From a standing position I line up the CB vertical center line with the contact point on the OB. Once this is done I determine what kind of spin I want to use. Lets say, high right, (cutting an OB to the left) I then come down on the shot with the left side of my cue on the OB contact point. Been doing this for a couple of decades.

Yeah, I'm old, 71 April 3rd.
After using this method for so many years I have learned to make adjustments where needed.

John

Patrick Johnson · Mar 30, 2018

One Pocket John said:
Interesting post Pat.

From a standing position I line up the CB vertical center line with the contact point on the OB. Once this is done I determine what kind of spin I want to use. Lets say, high right, (cutting an OB to the left) I then come down on the shot with the left side of my cue on the OB contact point.

Yep, sounds like edge of stick aiming.

Been doing this for a couple of decades. Yeah, I'm old, 71 April 3rd.
After using this method for so many years I have learned to make adjustments where needed.

John

You got me beat by 6 months or so, old timer - will I know the adjustments then?

pj
chgo

MattPoland · Mar 30, 2018

Patrick Johnson said:
Don't feel like the Lone Ranger - no system works precisely for all shots (can I say that here?). Edge of stick aiming is only perfect for one small cut angle (based on the stick's width*), but it has other advantages: it puts your focus on the contact point(s) and where the stick is pointing. Your subconscious can work with that.

It's a little like what I do consciously - try to estimate how far from the contact point my stick's centerline should point in order to hit it.

pj
chgo

* A 1/2" (12.7mm) stick at center CB points through only one CB contact point, 1/4" from center. Because of the balls' curvatures, that CB contact point can only physically contact the OB 1/4" from its center - a cut angle of ~13 degrees (a little fatter than 3/4 overlap).

I wasn’t doing this with my 13mm shaft and don’t like my results when I try. My 12.6mm shaft it worked great for. With my 12.4mm shaft it continues to work great. I really want to hit some balls with an 11.8mm shaft to see how it works then.

Shooting on a Valley bar box, edge of shaft to contact point seems to work pretty darn well from 5-45 degree cuts. I also find it works well no matter what spin you’re putting on the ball. I have started getting a little more time on a 9’ Diamond pro-cut (boy is that punishing) and find it’s less forgiving. But again the 7’ Valley is either more forgiving or my subconscious is helping me with getting the ball in (slight adjustments in head position?).

MattPoland · Mar 30, 2018

The last few days I’ve been playing setting my stick on the rail or felt along my best approximation of shaft edge to contact point alignment. Keeping it there with one hand I verify the alignment while back on the shot and slightly bent down. If I like what I see, I step into that shot line, still with my stick already in place. Then I add my bridge hand in and try to trust /keep that alignment.

It’s tricky. I feel like I will miss if I take my eye off the ball so I want to see the alignment while down. But I also can’t be making much of any adjustments while down or else I’ll inevitably over-correct. So I’d rather have a high parity between what I see standing and what I see down on the shot. So I’ve been playing with different ways to make sure more and more of the aiming process is done standing up and that my down on the shot visual metrics are only to be assured I am still in line as opposed to finding the line.

If any of that makes sense.

LAMas · Apr 1, 2018

Patrick Johnson said:
I like keeping my sightline over/along my stick. It allows me to live-monitor my stroke for straightness/accuracy and also to "measure" the cut by pointing the stick a precise distance from the OB contact point.

But once upon a time I liked to sight from contact point-to-contact point, especially for thin cuts, trusting my ability to stroke my stick accurately while sighting beside it rather than over it.

Do you make that choice (or choose another option) consciously?

pj
chgo

I like aiming the stick through the CPCB at the CPOB and try to shift the stick parallel to that line to the CCB. The parallel shift is the rub. Sighting over the stick and DD from the center OB to the CPOB to the outside is easier an just as reliable unless the CB and OB are too close together - then I use the former.

BobN · Apr 16, 2018

PJ, I may be misunderstanding your question, but I sight down the center of cue stick on all shots. Actually, the inside corner of my right eye is on the center of the cue stick because that’s my “visual center” or the head/eye position that I best see center cue ball.

Patrick Johnson · Apr 16, 2018

BobN said:
PJ, I may be misunderstanding your question, but I sight down the center of cue stick on all shots. Actually, the inside corner of my right eye is on the center of the cue stick because that’s my “visual center” or the head/eye position that I best see center cue ball.

Sounds to me like you understood my question. I wondered if anybody sights along another line, such as contact point-to-contact point or center-to-fraction, either all the time or just for specific kinds/angles of shots.

Thanks for the reply.

pj
chgo

BobN · Apr 16, 2018

Short answer is yes. Longer answer: One very popular pro player sights along edge of cue to contact point. Another I know personally sights overlap or contact point to contact point. Another yet, sights Center Cue Ball to an offset to the contact point. ...and yet another (great player) sights Center Cue Ball to one of 8 fractional lines on each side of the object ball. Different strokes for different folks and you’ve gotta do what gives you the best perception of the shot according to your ball pocketing method.

BC21 · Apr 16, 2018

BobN said:
Short answer is yes. Longer answer: One very popular pro player sights along edge of cue to contact point. Another I know personally sights overlap or contact point to contact point. Another yet, sights Center Cue Ball to an offset to the contact point. ...and yet another (great player) sights Center Cue Ball to one of 8 fractional lines on each side of the object ball. Different strokes for different folks and you’ve gotta do what gives you the best perception of the shot according to your ball pocketing method.

Good post, very insightful.

Straightpool_99 · Apr 16, 2018

I have a friend who runs regular centuries at snooker. He closes one eye and sights along the stick. He uses both eyes when deciding on his aim, standing up. IMO he gets the best of both worlds, he gets to perceive the shot in 3d and then shoot it like you would a rife with no interference from his non dominant eye. I've tried on several occations to do what he does, but I can't explain it, it's like I get fatigued or something almost instantly. It's very weird. I guess maybe I pay more attention to the stick, as it moves during warmup, than he does and it's maybe tougher to keep track of it with one eye only. If I don't do any warmups, then it doesn't happen as quickly. The static sight picture at adress is definitely clearer his way, IMO.

Patrick Johnson · Apr 16, 2018

BobN said:
Short answer is yes. Longer answer: One very popular pro player sights along edge of cue to contact point. Another I know personally sights overlap or contact point to contact point. Another yet, sights Center Cue Ball to an offset to the contact point. ...and yet another (great player) sights Center Cue Ball to one of 8 fractional lines on each side of the object ball. Different strokes for different folks and you’ve gotta do what gives you the best perception of the shot according to your ball pocketing method.

Do you mean their "vision center" is directly over these other alignments, and not over the stick? For example, lots of players say they aim using fractions, but I don't think that necessarily means they actually place their "vision center" over the fractional alignments.

Another way to ask my question: wherever we place our eyes it's usually a tradeoff - (unless we sight along the cue on a straight-in centerball shot) we're either sighting along the cue and estimating how the "aim alignment" parts of the CB/OB are lining up, or we're doing the opposite.

Which tradeoff do you make? I like sighting along the cue for a couple of reasons:
- it's easier to monitor my stroke
- I use the cue as my primary "aiming metric" (judging how far from the OB contact point it should be pointed), so there's no tradeoff, even with offcenter hits

pj
chgo

Ralph Kramden · Apr 16, 2018

BobN said:
Short answer is yes. Longer answer: One very popular pro player sights along edge of cue to contact point. Another I know personally sights overlap or contact point to contact point. Another yet, sights Center Cue Ball to an offset to the contact point. ...and yet another (great player) sights Center Cue Ball to one of 8 fractional lines on each side of the object ball. Different strokes for different folks and you’ve gotta do what gives you the best perception of the shot according to your ball pocketing method.

IMO the fractional aim points in Blue above work best for folks with declining vision.

.

336Robin · May 10, 2018

Patrick Johnson said:
I like keeping my sightline over/along my stick. It allows me to live-monitor my stroke for straightness/accuracy and also to "measure" the cut by pointing the stick a precise distance from the OB contact point.

But once upon a time I liked to sight from contact point-to-contact point, especially for thin cuts, trusting my ability to stroke my stick accurately while sighting beside it rather than over it.

Do you make that choice (or choose another option) consciously?

pj
chgo

The only problem I seem to have is on spot shots. I play a lot of One
Pocket and after several hours I start getting fatigued. I've found sighting down the
cue stick and aiming the tip directly at the edge of the object ball through the stroke
seems to give me an edge on spot shots.

LAMas · May 10, 2018

336Robin said:
The only problem I seem to have is on spot shots. I play a lot of One
Pocket and after several hours I start getting fatigued. I've found sighting down the
cue stick and aiming the tip directly at the edge of the object ball through the stroke
seems to give me an edge on spot shots.

Where do you place the QB? Is it always the same place in the kitchen?

Patrick Johnson · May 10, 2018

336Robin said:
The only problem I seem to have is on spot shots. I play a lot of One
Pocket and after several hours I start getting fatigued. I've found sighting down the
cue stick and aiming the tip directly at the edge of the object ball through the stroke
seems to give me an edge on spot shots.

LAMas said:
Where do you place the QB? Is it always the same place in the kitchen?

FYI, here's a simple way to set up a perfect half-ball spot shot from the kitchen (with built-in overcut for throw).

pj
chgo

View attachment 75022

heismii · May 10, 2018

I setup a similar way. This is a zone A 20/10 shot-but aimed a hair thicker then half ball as its a overcut. On buckets it doesn't matter. Thanks bc21

AtLarge · May 10, 2018

Patrick Johnson said:
FYI, here's a simple way to set up a perfect half-ball spot shot from the kitchen (with built-in overcut for throw). ...

Pat -- the point on the head string to place the base of the CB for a 30° spot shot to center pocket is 10.44" off the side rail ignoring throw. So the placement you show in the diagram, 10 1/16", doesn't allow for much throw (less than ½°).

I have much more success on spot shots by placing the CB a couple inches closer to the side rail. Allowing for 1°, 2°, 3° or 4° of throw would put the base of the CB at, respectively, about 9.5", 8.6", 7.7", or 6.7" off the side rail.

Sight Along Stick or Something Else?

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