The Perfect Pool Instructor?

sjm · Aug 16, 2004

What is it that makes a pool instructor a great one? Is it knowledge? Is it communication skills?

I recall that when I was a college student, I took an economics class and the professor was a Nobel Prize winner. Unfortunately, his great scholarship wasn’t enough to make him a great teacher, because he didn’t seem to have the ability to communicate well with the students in the class. In other economics classes, though, professors having far less scholarship taught me more than the Nobel Laureate because they had superb communication skills.

What, then, is the perfect mix of scholarship and communication skills? In fact, it is really rather simple, it’s all about maximizing P, where:

P = proportion of a subject that can be taught by a teacher
K = knowledge, the percent of a subject that is understood by the teacher
C = communication skills, percentage of the teacher’s knowledge of a subject that they are able to convey to students

The basic idea is that P = K x C

For example, one who understands 80% of a subject and is able to communicate 60% of what they know is capable of teaching only 48% of a subject. A less knowledgeable teacher might only understand 70%, but if they have enough communication skills that they can convey 90% of what they know, they are capable of teaching 63% of a subject, and would qualify as the teacher you’ll learn more from.

The very best pool players tend to have a high K value, but most of them have a C value that is far lower than those who focus on and develop their teaching skills and teaching materials. This explains why, in seemingly every sport, the best players are nearly never the best teachers. The best communicators may have a very high C value, and it's usually more than enough to offset the fact that they may have slightly less knowledge.

Remember, when you choose a pool instructor, try to maximize P, not K. If you’re one of the lucky ones and have already hooked up with a pool instructor with a high K value and a high C value, stay the course, for you’ve got the right instructor working with you.

sjm · Aug 16, 2004

Gremlin said:
*********************************************************

sjm,

There is only one subject put the balls in the pockets.
I stated this in another post so I cut and pasted here for you. All the letters are just confusing double talk.

Cheers,

Gremlin

"I bought Dr. D's Book Billiards Workbook because she sponsors the CAT Tour and a beautiful Austrian women Gerda Hofstatter. Ya know I am a sucker for a beautiful talented women. A women who is not only a great pool player but a brilliant student, world class fencing champion and an expert 3 cushion
player.

Well, about the book the drills are just fine but I love Ray Martins book 99 Critical Shots and Winning One Pocket. I don't do the drills I practice the shots form the books. I figure if I can make the shots in the books no one can ever beat me anyway. LOL

As far as instructors I don't want anyone standing beside me except someone like Grady Matthews, Cecil Tugwell, Keith McCready, Allen Hopkins, Karen Corr, Larry Guninger, Steve Mizerak Jr. Ray Martin and Pete Fusco. Just a few of the people in pool qualified to instruct a "Gremlin" Ya understand been there done that seen em do it.

Jean Balukas 72 tournament championships 36 9-Ball 36-14.1 Robin Dodson. He He He I'll stop there I am sure you get my drift."

With due respect, Gremlin, it's difficult to find any relationship between the subject I introduced and your post. Yes, you've mentioned some of your favorite pool books and given a list of your favorite instructors, all of whom certainly know the game well, but I still see nothing in your post relating to the measurement of the quality of any of these instructors. All I can see is that you have used the space to patronize your favorites, rather than to consider the subject matter presented. Your reply is, therefore, discarded by me as irrelevant.

doublewideclyde · Aug 16, 2004

Gremlin

Gremlin Can You Just Once Read What Someone Has To Say And Stop Putting Your Two Cents In. Just Once Read The Post For What It Is. I Have Not Put You On Ingore Because Somtimes I Enjoy Reading Your Dribble And Not Commenting On It's Contents, Just Reading It. Please In The Future Just Keep Your Comments To Yourself.

TheOne · Aug 17, 2004

Its sure is getting hot around here, only been away a short while! :-o

CaptainJR · Aug 17, 2004

This is a subject that I'm rather familiar with. I'm going to talk at instruction regardless of what the instruction is for, but I am talking about physical instruction (golf, tennis, DANCING, pool, etc.) rather than something like math.

First I think you have to divide the students into two categories. Professional and non-professional. I've taught both and that is one reason I said I'm 'rather familiar' with this subject. I was known for being able to adjust my teaching to fit whomever I was teaching at the moment.

The key in non-professional instruction is communication. The key in professional instruction is subject knowledge. An instructor(coach) for a pro doesn't need to be as good at communication because the student will most times immediately know what the teacher is getting at. A lot of times saying to themselves, 'I knew that'!

On the other hand, an instructor for a non-pro needs to be able to get across what he is trying to say in 'layman's' terms. Much more easily said than done. (Of course there is a cross-over point where a student is on the edge of getting good enough to be a pro.)

Knowledge of the subject is very important. You can't have a teacher that is good at communication teaching incorrect technique, and you'd be surprised how often this happens. The number of times I've said 'who the hell taught you to do that like that'! Please take what I just said with a grain of salt, because I'm sure somewhere along the way, someone said the same thing about something I taught.

Another extremely important issue, and this can decide if a person can teach at any level, is if they can see what is wrong. At the pro level, seeing what the problem is can take a very keen eye.

So, If you can find a teacher with enough knowledge to teach a pro, can communicate well enough that a non-pro can understand it, and can see immediately what the problem is, expect to pay a little more for there instruction. It will be worth it.

CaptainJR · Aug 17, 2004

The original question mentions, why the best pros are not always the best teachers. I think this is more often a seeing the problem issue than communication issue. Being able to see the problem and figure out the solution to the problem seems to be an amazing talent all of it's own. What is it that I'm doing differently today than I was doing last week when everything was going right?

sjm · Aug 17, 2004

Gremlin said:
sjm,

I am sorry but your measurement has no relation to the reality of your subject as you are not qualified to make such a statement or measurement of any of the people I mentioned.

What are your credentials to be qualified to make and ask such subjective
questions. I agree with you my statement deals with reality and not your time wasting billiard forum fanticy. I don't recognize any of your authority to
discard or find my post irrelevant. Say I discard you as irrevelevant

Cheers,

Gremlin

I will reply by private message, very tastefully, and without any personal attacks.

sjm · Aug 17, 2004

CaptainJR said:
First I think you have to divide the students into two categories. Professional and non-professional. I've taught both and that is one reason I said I'm 'rather familiar' with this subject. I was known for being able to adjust my teaching to fit whomever I was teaching at the moment.

The key in non-professional instruction is communication. The key in professional instruction is subject knowledge. An instructor(coach) for a pro doesn't need to be as good at communication because the student will most times immediately know what the teacher is getting at. A lot of times saying to themselves, 'I knew that'!

On the other hand, an instructor for a non-pro needs to be able to get across what he is trying to say in 'layman's' terms. Much more easily said than done. (Of course there is a cross-over point where a student is on the edge of getting good enough to be a pro.)

Great post, Captain. You really make a fine point. How to reinforce or refresh knowledge that's already there and how to plant new knowledge that isn't there are two very different matters.

I agree with you. It is in the planting of new knowledge where the communication skills are more important.

ramdadingdong · Aug 17, 2004

Gremlin said:
*********************************************************

sjm,

There is only one subject put the balls in the pockets.
I stated this in another post so I cut and pasted here for you. All the letters are just confusing double talk.

Cheers,

Gremlin

"I bought Dr. D's Book Billiards Workbook because she sponsors the CAT Tour and a beautiful Austrian women Gerda Hofstatter. Ya know I am a sucker for a beautiful talented women. A women who is not only a great pool player but a brilliant student, world class fencing champion and an expert 3 cushion
player.

Well, about the book the drills are just fine but I love Ray Martins book 99 Critical Shots and Winning One Pocket. I don't do the drills I practice the shots form the books. I figure if I can make the shots in the books no one can ever beat me anyway. LOL

As far as instructors I don't want anyone standing beside me except someone like Grady Matthews, Cecil Tugwell, Keith McCready, Allen Hopkins, Karen Corr, Larry Guninger, Steve Mizerak Jr. Ray Martin and Pete Fusco. Just a few of the people in pool qualified to instruct a "Gremlin" Ya understand been there done that seen em do it.

Jean Balukas 72 tournament championships 36 9-Ball 36-14.1 Robin Dodson. He He He I'll stop there I am sure you get my drift."

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Thanks Grem for adding me to your list, that was so nice of you. I would like to point on two others on your list were my early teachers, Grady and Ray Martin, that is a strong list you did post, pick any one, you can't go wrong.
Dont pay attention to double wide, most of his posts are attacks and negative, some people are just like that. You posted this grem:
I have been told by my friends some in the pool industry to stay out of the billiard form because most of the posters don't know what they are talking about. I didn't pay any attention to them before but now I am beginning to believe them.
end of quote:
This is why you don't see any pros posting on the forums any more, if they really become their own selves and reveal who they are, their color, their wit, try to be funny, the bozos tear them apart. What ever they say about their selves, they turn it, spin it and use it against them. I posted several jokes about drunk Irish men and stated I am Irish. Bozos on another board are now posting I am a drunk, that is what you get. I have never had a dui, nobody ever, has seen me drunk. I now drink a glass of wine with dinner and 4 beers a night, one an hour, and I am a drunk. The problem is that stuff spreads and gets seen, then half the pool world, now thinks I am a drunk, that is the great danger this thing has.

The bozos use these forums as vendetta launch pads against those they don't like. People who can't play, love to tear down, those who can. That makes them feel big. Then you have the crazies. I have traced and tracked down 4 people posting on just az who have been in mental hospitals and who are seriously mentally disturbed.
Any new pro would be crazy to post in their own name, the price to pay for teaching the bozos for free, is just too high to pay for the little name press you obtain. The pros who do stay, now post little, say nothing and just kiss ass. You don't get anything out of them.
When was the last time Grady gave you a free lesson on here. Grady won't, because he knows what ever he says will just get attacked when 9 nobodies begin to tell him he does not know squat and they do it this and that way.

The only reason I do not leave them is I have already been severaly damaged by them. What are you going to do, kill me twice. As the damage is already done to me, I may as well stay. I am actually gaining ground, at one point, half thought I was nuts and did not know squat, it was 50'/50. I now have it where its 75% pro, 25% says I am a full fledged loooney tune. That is probably about as good as I am going to get, because I figure about 25% of these boards are full fledged bozos with papers. I coined the pool internet term bozo on ccb, a bozo thinks he is a billiards expert who knows every thing and can't be taught nothing and can't run 3 friggen balls. A bozo with papers, has a phd.

Its a free country, we do have free speech, you make a simple post, state your opinion and 9 people jump yo butt to run you down. That is what is wrong with the boards.

Let me tell you what makes me a good teacher, I was taught, how to teach. I listen, I make them put in writing, what they want me to teach them. I am like a visit to your doctors office, I do a full exam on you, I run diagnostics using a digital camera, I know where to look, how to test which is how I find swing flaws the others miss who are spending most of their time yapping and not looking. When you leave me, your stroke is dead on or you don't leave. That is what you should spend you money on, not on some 9 ball pro who can play but can't teach and just takes your money so you can hang with him. That is not a teacher, that is a player.
Any great teacher, ceases to be a player. You can't do both, it will destroy you as a player.

Best Wishes,
Fast Larry Guninger The Power Source Pool School

Rickw · Aug 17, 2004

That was a nice post Captain. I read the "Inner Game of Tennis" recently and the author, who claims to have been a tennis instructor for some time, said that it is bettor to let someone, even a beginner, just observe a proper maneuver and then try to mimmick that same maneuver. He also said that verbal communication got in the way of real learning. It would seem to me then that a good teacher would need to be a pro-level player so the students could mimmick the most appropriate skills. I'm not so sure I totally agree with all of that but I do know that my best learning seems to have come from watching the better players play. What do you think?

ramdadingdong · Aug 17, 2004

Rickw said:
That was a nice post Captain. I read the "Inner Game of Tennis" recently and the author, who claims to have been a tennis instructor for some time, said that it is bettor to let someone, even a beginner, just observe a proper maneuver and then try to mimmick that same maneuver. He also said that verbal communication got in the way of real learning. It would seem to me then that a good teacher would need to be a pro-level player so the students could mimmick the most appropriate skills. I'm not so sure I totally agree with all of that but I do know that my best learning seems to have come from watching the better players play. What do you think?

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Yes, that is how I teach, I show it to you mechnically, technically, explain the physics of it, and that usually just confuses you. If you don't get it, I then model the shot for you, have you stand at several angles and just watch me doing it, asking you to just see it, feel it, then step up and do it, that is part of my methods I use. I teach my dogs to play pool the same way. This is a feel game, it must be taught that way, it must be played that way.

That is what I have always said, you don't have to be Sigel to teach, but you have to play at some advanced level, or there will be things you can't pass on because if you can do them you can't teach them because you don't understand them.
To become an instructor in this main school, you buy your certificate, my dog could walk in with $750 in his paw and he would graduate. Nobody flunks, that proves my point.
I have long called for a minimum level of skill a teacher has to prove in order to teach. I believe that should be he must in an hour, break and run one table of 8 ball. Rest for 15 minutes, then have to break and run one rack of 9 ball in the 2nd hour. If he can't do that, he should not be teaching, he should be in my pool school taking lessons from me on how to play. Put that in and you will lose 2/3rds of that big schools teachers over night. I would bet you my ranch, my lear jet, my dog, sue linda, that neither Fels or Byrne could pass this test either. There would be others like them that would flunk badly as well. There are a lot of big names out there teaching, that can't play, and I think that is a travesty to their students.

Grady or Ray Martin can pass that test, by the way, neither one of them is a BCA instructor, what does that tell you? None of my teachers were BCA instructors, Bennie Allen, Jimmy Caras, Rick Wright, Ray Schuler, Bob Meucci, Omaha Fat, Minnesota Fats. Fast Eddy Parker, none of these people, needed some worthless piece of paper you buy, to teach. You bought their knowledge and experience, not their purchased worthless piece of paper they paid $25 bucks for and spent a grand getting that paying off the instructor to pass them and travel fees going half way across the country to be approved. This school has 133 teachers, for the entire country. Tennis and Golf, has tens of thousands of teachers. Their school is a massive failure which has helped to destroy pool. They go through a day and a half, watching another guy teach them a lesson, they are never, taught how to teach, which is why this school does not work.

A quote: This same teaching method could be applied to teaching pool. Ask the student to shoot a shot, but don't tell them how to do it. After the student attempts the shot several times, then tell them how to shoot the shot...
end of quote, my student begins by running 15 balls out on the open table, while I asses his strengths and weaknesses. We then turn his weakness into a strength. When they fail at a shot, I step in and show them how to, yes this is also important to do. I teach with a camera, golf has shown that the traditional yap and show method, now used in pool, was bad, when they turned to video teaching methods, they found the student progreses 4 times faster that the yap yap teaching. In Tennis, Golf, every one uses a camera.
I offer two, vhs or digital. If your pool instructor is not offering video taped lessons, I question if you have a real teaching pro on your hands, sounds like to me if he does not, you have a pool bum needing a quick 50 bucks. Refuse to take any lesson that is not video taped, if you do, you are being cheated as you will progress 4 times slower than you would with me, so your paying the guy too cheap to buy a camera, 4 times more than you would give to me to achieve the same results.
Always seek out the best, in the long run, that is the cheapest.
Best Wishes,
Fast Larry Guninger The Power source pool school

bill190 · Aug 17, 2004

I saw a program on TV about teaching in the U.S. -vs- teaching in some foreign countries. (And why U.S. students don't learn much whereas they do.)

It is quite simple. In some foreign countries, they first ask the student to spend about 45 minutes trying to solve a problem, but they don't tell the students *how* to solve the problem.

Then after 45 minutes, the instructor tells the students how to solve the problem. Of course each and every student is listening intently to the solution as they have been racking their brains trying to find a solution. The lesson sinks in.

This same teaching method could be applied to teaching pool. Ask the student to shoot a shot, but don't tell them how to do it. After the student attempts the shot several times, then tell them how to shoot the shot...

CaptainJR · Aug 17, 2004

Rickw said:
That was a nice post Captain. I read the "Inner Game of Tennis" recently and the author, who claims to have been a tennis instructor for some time, said that it is bettor to let someone, even a beginner, just observe a proper maneuver and then try to mimmick that same maneuver. He also said that verbal communication got in the way of real learning. It would seem to me then that a good teacher would need to be a pro-level player so the students could mimmick the most appropriate skills. I'm not so sure I totally agree with all of that but I do know that my best learning seems to have come from watching the better players play. What do you think?

Rick
Well, sorry but I just can't agree much at all. Maybe for a very beginner who just picked up a cue stick two weeks ago, but after a very few lessons of mimicking, the teacher has to begin to teach. Yes, you can pick up some things by watching the pros, but you won't be correcting the things you personally do wrong. Furthermore, your adding your impression of what the pro is doing to what you are doing wrong, which can create a real mess. (not trying to be insulting here, but if your not a pro and you don't think your doing some things wrong, well, you need to think again)

Mimicking just can't replace good instruction. It should be a little easier for me to find a teacher that I can mimic. Why? because I'm a lefty. I could lean over the table and watch the teacher like a mirror image. But NO, I had to find a teacher that was a lefty (LOL Fred).

You can only learn so much from watching or the teaching and coaching business would be out of business.

ramdadingdong · Aug 17, 2004

CaptainJR said:
Rick
Well, sorry but I just can't agree much at all. Maybe for a very beginner who just picked up a cue stick two weeks ago, but after a very few lessons of mimicking, the teacher has to begin to teach. Yes, you can pick up some things by watching the pros, but you won't be correcting the things you personally do wrong. Furthermore, your adding your impression of what the pro is doing to what you are doing wrong, which can create a real mess. (not trying to be insulting here, but if your not a pro and you don't think your doing some things wrong, well, you need to think again)

Mimicking just can't replace good instruction. It should be a little easier for me to find a teacher that I can mimic. Why? because I'm a lefty. I could lean over the table and watch the teacher like a mirror image. But NO, I had to find a teacher that was a lefty (LOL Fred).

You can only learn so much from watching or the teaching and coaching business would be out of business.

______________________________________________________
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Capt, I am right handed, but I teach lefties, my rate is $50 an hour, for lefties it is $100, double,you make me think backwards. If you are an engineer with a degree, you make me word double, I have to teach you two lessons, one by mechanics, then by physics, then take that away from you and make you play by feel, your rate is $100. If you have a PHD, that is now $200. If you are a lefthanded engineer with a phd, your new rate is now $300 an hour. tee hee hee, just kidding, as you can see, I dont take this stuff that serious, if you play pool or take a lesson and its not fun and work, you are doing it all wrong.
Fast Larry Guninger The power source pool school....

Rickw · Aug 17, 2004

Thanks Captain. I think people will be debating these issues for a long, long time. I would suggest giving "Inner Game of Tennis" a read, if for no other reason than getting to see another perspective. I don't disagree with you I just wanted to hear someone take the other side from this book and you did, and I thank you for that. Unlike some on this board, I like hearing both sides of a debate, it makes life more interesting.

Off the subject, do you own a boat? I used to have a couple. I had a 30' Hunt, cabin cruiser, that I completely re-did the hull (White Cedar Plank) and was that a chore!!! I also had a 27' Pacific Seacraft Orion sailboat and loved it.

CaptainJR said:
Rick
Well, sorry but I just can't agree much at all. Maybe for a very beginner who just picked up a cue stick two weeks ago, but after a very few lessons of mimicking, the teacher has to begin to teach. Yes, you can pick up some things by watching the pros, but you won't be correcting the things you personally do wrong. Furthermore, your adding your impression of what the pro is doing to what you are doing wrong, which can create a real mess. (not trying to be insulting here, but if your not a pro and you don't think your doing some things wrong, well, you need to think again)

Mimicking just can't replace good instruction. It should be a little easier for me to find a teacher that I can mimic. Why? because I'm a lefty. I could lean over the table and watch the teacher like a mirror image. But NO, I had to find a teacher that was a lefty (LOL Fred).

You can only learn so much from watching or the teaching and coaching business would be out of business.

Rickw · Aug 17, 2004

Good point Bill. When I was in college, I had to take Algebra and was not looking forward to it because I barely passed it in high school. They had just developed a new method of teaching that eliminated lecture. Instead of the in-class lectures, the classes were all labs that included tutors. You worked out of a workbook and textbook at your own pace and if you stumbled a little, a tutor was available to answer any questions. I got a solid A in that class. I can't understand why they don't incorporate that kind of teaching in all of our schools today. It doesn't seem to require any more resources and they know for a fact that lecture is the least productive method for teaching.

bill190 said:
I saw a program on TV about teaching in the U.S. -vs- teaching in some foreign countries. (And why U.S. students don't learn much whereas they do.)

It is quite simple. In some foreign countries, they first ask the student to spend about 45 minutes trying to solve a problem, but they don't tell the students *how* to solve the problem.

Then after 45 minutes, the instructor tells the students how to solve the problem. Of course each and every student is listening intently to the solution as they have been racking their brains trying to find a solution. The lesson sinks in.

This same teaching method could be applied to teaching pool. Ask the student to shoot a shot, but don't tell them how to do it. After the student attempts the shot several times, then tell them how to shoot the shot...

CaptainJR · Aug 17, 2004

Rickw said:
Thanks Captain. I think people will be debating these issues for a long, long time. I would suggest giving "Inner Game of Tennis" a read, if for no other reason than getting to see another perspective. I don't disagree with you I just wanted to hear someone take the other side from this book and you did, and I thank you for that. Unlike some on this board, I like hearing both sides of a debate, it makes life more interesting.

Off the subject, do you own a boat? I used to have a couple. I had a 30' Hunt, cabin cruiser, that I completely re-did the hull (White Cedar Plank) and was that a chore!!! I also had a 27' Pacific Seacraft Orion sailboat and loved it.

Just a small boat. My daughters are the ones that started the CaptJR thing. I took off with it at league night and it stuck. I've had this size of boat for a long time. Just big enough to take to the bay, yet still small enough to do some river fishing.

http://www.robertsdigitography.com/CaptJRs/boat.htm

ramdadingdong · Aug 17, 2004

whitewolf said:
I think that your post was quite interesting. At this point I would like to add to what you are saying if I may by modifying your equation a little bit.

P=KxCxS

Let's call S the 'Student' factor. I think this part is one of the most overlooked variables left out of the 'P'roportion taught/learned. It takes a long time to learn how to be a good student and get the most out of what you are taught. Part of this teaching process is how well you teach yourself. For example, how many of you take some good lessons, review the tapes, read books, and end up getting worse rather than better? You are probably not teaching yourself correctly if that makes any sense.

Last month I shot really well in Baltimore and a teammate asked me what it took to get as good as I was (I'm just an average player here on this forum)? My answer to him was all of the above, but most important of all I used to learn from watching good players play. I told him that being a good student could do him more good than anything.

One key to mention here is that you must write things down while they are fresh on your mind. Keep a notebook noting what works well for you. Rework/refine constantly and you will get better over time. Be honest with yourself. Getting professional lessons is great up to a point, but the STUDENT has to take the ball and run with it. When you are shooting bad, don't say: gee, I need to see and instructor right away. Get your notebook out and self analyze.

BTW, I had a lesson from Tony Robles (one of my most favorite instructors), and was I surprised when he pulled out his pocket book with all things important to him written down? No, I was just very very impressed. This guy especially attacks the mental side of pool. Tony is a real student as is Fast Larry. They both take everything into consideration when teaching and learning/listening, even the mental side for example.

I am sorry if I overshadowed or changed the subject your original post, but I just felt like blabbing for a short time. Regards, WW

_______________________________________________________--
*************************************************

The hustler movie, 61, Fast Eddy Felson. Quote, what you have to be, is real student of the game."
Fast Larry Guninger the power source pool school...

sjm · Aug 17, 2004

whitewolf said:
I think that your post was quite interesting. At this point I would like to add to what you are saying if I may by modifying your equation a little bit.

P=KxCxS

Let's call S the 'Student' factor. I think this part is one of the most overlooked variables left out of the 'P'roportion taught/learned. It takes a long time to learn how to be a good student and get the most out of what you are taught. Part of this teaching process is how well you teach yourself. For example, how many of you take some good lessons, review the tapes, read books, and end up getting worse rather than better? You are probably not teaching yourself correctly if that makes any sense.

Last month I shot really well in Baltimore and a teammate asked me what it took to get as good as I was (I'm just an average player here on this forum)? My answer to him was all of the above, but most important of all I used to learn from watching good players play. I told him that being a good student could do him more good than anything.

One key to mention here is that you must write things down while they are fresh on your mind. Keep a notebook noting what works well for you. Rework/refine constantly and you will get better over time. Be honest with yourself. Getting professional lessons is great up to a point, but the STUDENT has to take the ball and run with it. When you are shooting bad, don't say: gee, I need to see and instructor right away. Get your notebook out and self analyze.

BTW, I had a lesson from Tony Robles (one of my most favorite instructors), and was I surprised when he pulled out his pocket book with all things important to him written down? No, I was just very very impressed. This guy especially attacks the mental side of pool. Tony is a real student as is Fast Larry. They both take everything into consideration when teaching and learning/listening, even the mental side for example.

I am sorry if I overshadowed or changed the subject your original post, but I just felt like blabbing for a short time. Regards, WW

Wow, Whitewolf, you really make an excellent point about the student factor. Every teacher is, at least in part, constrained by the willingness of a student to reinforce lessons learned and to supplement their knowledge of a subject between lessons. While I believe that the perfect insturctor can help to motivate the student to commit to reinforcing and supplementing their knowledge on their own time, for the most part, this is a matter of the student's work ethic.

As you say, Tony Robles, whom I count as a close friend, increases his own capacity to communicate what he knows by keeping notes. I also admire Tony Robles for the way he encourages and motivates his students. A special guy all around.

Thanks for your insights.

ramdadingdong · Aug 18, 2004

cons, hustlers, thieves and liars

Gremlin said:
FL,

I am sorry to say this but I am out of here. Nothing but a retirement home for a bunch of old retired pitch men trying to eliminate there competition by chracter assassination and telling lies. Like my friends in pool said get out of the Billiard forum. Well, I am gone.

35 years of pool experience and only an A player in some sand bag league. No one like that is qualified to teach anyone pool. Con men at best! Back slapping bullshit artists at the worst. FL there all yours!

I am going to spend my time supporting the ladies tours. I have a new champion (Kelly Fisher) to cheer for and every squire has to have a champion or he would be no squire.

Cheers,

Gremlin

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Well grem, at least you know exactly what you are dealing with, a buch of board losers, who could not make it on the road, were failures, had to take a day job and now live in this walter mitty world they create over the internet.
The world they could not OBTAIN, THE WORLD THEN WANTED, THAT REJECTED THEM. ITS BEEN 20 YEARS FOR MOST OF THEM, THEY STILL HAVE NOT BEEN ABLE TO ACCEPT THIS, THEY ARE NEVER GOING TO BE FAST EDDY IN THE HUSTLER MOVIE.....

THEY ARE NOW ALL BOARD EXPERTS, ALL RUN OUT MONSTERS, ALL OF THIS BS IS 20 years behind them. There has to be 30 of these losers, could be 300, who knows, who cares. When they run into somebody like me, who has actually made their living playing pool as a pro now for 10 full years out on the road and has never busted out, grem they cant handle it, their only reaction out of jealousy is to try and chop me down, that makes the losers feel big and important. They cannot understand how I could make it and they could not, simple, they are fu**kin dumb, I am f**Kin smart.
Grem, you are being hit by the same bloody bull s*** I am.

So what do we do laddie, run and hide, no that is what the bloodie blighters want, f em, I say stand up and fight them till the end. Let us talk pool, share our stories with the young laddies and lassies, share our tips, pass on what was passed on to us, and as best we can, try to ignore, those poor losers filled with hate towards us, simply because we succeded where they failed..
Grem, I now state, sir, You are a real man, by my standards of what that means dear sir. I know you are a warrior, I am so one as well and I say to you now sir, a real man, never allows cowards, losers, to run him off of any playing field. I say sir, stay and fight, defend your right to do what you do, be proud of your art work, I am proud of the beauty you spread, the losers who attack you spread no beauty, they only spread hate, so please sir, stay and fight with me. I beg you dear sir, stay. I cannot continue this fight alone, I am simply too badly out numbered by bozos.

Grem, we just press on, ignore their insults, their lies, their slanders, their attacks, I know who I am, you know who you are, that sir, is all that matters, cheers, bottom up mate. Dont you even think of leaving, do not give the bastards that. Stay put and aggravate them.
Fast Larry Guninger

----------------------------------------
Reply (Sung to the tune of "Rawhide"
----------------------------------------

Trollin', Trollin', Trollin,
For those whose heads are swollen.
Keep them suckers rollin',
Reply

Wood and felt and leather,
No squirt from a Predator,
Wishin for my bushka at my side.
All the things I'm missin,
Good laughs, grins, and friction
Are waiting when the emails all arive.

Chorus:

Prod em' on,..... Stir em' up,.......
Type em' up,..... Send em' out
Prod em' on,..... Stir em' up,.......
Reply!

Piss em' off,.... Suck em' in,.....
Suck em' in,..... Piss em' off,
Send em' out,.... Stir em' up ....
Reply!.....

Keep does bozos mailin'
Though they're loudly wailing',
Keep them emails movin' & alive
Reply!

Don't try to understand them,
Just poke, prod, and land 'em
Soon we'll be livin' high and wide.

Screw em up, post it wrong, whos dat wolf, who knows,rawhide.
Smorgs too fat to ride and purds gonna to kill you, run from the eric it, rawhide.
Yap it out, yup it in, who let it out, raw hide.

May God bless and peace be with you. May there now be peace between us. If you are a real pool player, then fast truly loves you. He just does not like bozos. May the wind be always on your back and all 9 balls fall.
VENI VIDI VICI, OMNIA VINCIT AMOR. “Fastus Maximus. “ Latin for “I came, I saw, I conquered, love conquerors all. Yes I really did do it all and you can believe it, or not. If you don’t believe it, C’est La Vie. A prophet is not recognized in his own land. You cannot win an argument with an ignorant man. Many are not ready for the truth, most can’t handle the truth, when the student is ready for the truth, only then does the teacher appear in front of him.

I don’t want to be a millionaire; I just want to live like one. I want to live 3 lifetimes in the time I was given to live one, but do not hurry, do not worry, be sure to take the time, to smell all the flowers along the way.
"All men, by their nature, desire to know." “ All I know, is I now know nothing”- Aristotle
"Know Thyself." - The First Delphic Precept
This is a feel game and a mind game. When the mind is pure, pure perfect pool will follow. Being in dead punch is the ultimate trip.
Align your chi, your center, put your wa at peace and then let your natural forces, just flow, go with that which is natural for you, and go with what you know.
Rack em sausage, Go play fast and loose. Ride em hard, put em up wet, leave the ladies smiling and die free owing no man anything. In time, it’s all dust in the wind anyway. Don’t take your self, or anything else, too serious, just be happy and healthy. Laughter and song is the best medicine. Email fastlarry@bellsouth.net The Power Source Traveling Pool School. To see my web page come alive click http://www.fastlarrypool.com “Fast Larry” Guninger

The Perfect Pool Instructor?

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Shiver me timbers.

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AzB Silver Member

Banned

AzB Silver Member

Shiver me timbers.

Banned

AzB Silver Member

AzB Silver Member

Shiver me timbers.

Banned

Older and Wiser

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