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12-17-2017, 12:36 PM

In context or not, the comment was out of line. Let's rein it in a little bit.

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12-17-2017, 01:57 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by JC View Post
Take my words out of context like Blue Jam did and say I said something vile that I clearly didn't and push it further and further with follow up nonsense and I dont care to be "in line".

I do not nor have I ever thought that rape is anything other than the violent crime it is. I do have genuine compassion for it's victims of which I have no Idea whether Blue Jam is. Don't even know the gender of this troll. I suspect by it's vocabulary it's from over the pond where insane PC cultures exist.

I do not apologize to anonymous internet trolls who go out of their way to provoke me. Sorry Jay

JC
JC, how could I take your words out of context when I quoted your exact post in my post #263? I will agree with one thing. You do need moderation. Thanks for letting us know.


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12-17-2017, 03:36 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by jay helfert View Post
JC, how could I take your words out of context when I quoted your exact post in my post #263? I will agree with one thing. You do need moderation. Thanks for letting us know.
Sorry if you can't or don't care to keep up with how it got to there. But now that you mention it, yes you were taking the statement out of the context of how I was provoked to that point by dishonest trolling.

Have a happy Sunday

JC


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12-17-2017, 07:54 PM

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Originally Posted by jay helfert View Post
I think you're out of line here JC. To trivialize something as serious as rape is to be totally out of touch with reality. Women who are traumatized in this way are often scarred for life by the experience. It's not something that "they get over" as you so aptly put it. Someone very close to me had two such experiences as a young woman. She was upwardly mobile in a male dominated career. She was afraid to speak out against her ATTACKERS for fear of losing her position that took a long time to reach. There were only men that she could complain to, and all were aligned with the two men who damaged her.

Are you beginning to get the picture now? She went on to have a long and lucrative career, but never fully recovered from these early traumatic experiences. Many other women coming forth now walked a similar path and finally feel free to talk publicly about what happened to them. My friend cannot, even all these years later! To sit there and say "get over it" is callous and cold! I think you owe Blue Jam a heartfelt apology.
Herein lies the crux of this matter. Though I didn't find Oscar's comment offensive to my own sensibilities, the subject is so scarring to those who have been damaged by it that even the sheer mention of it in passing, in a joke none the less, can be more offensive than some people can even imagine. I know everyone wants to stick up for Oscar, and I am certain he is a great guy, it is not Oscar or yourself that matter here. This was on live tv and a widely diverse audience of people were watching. There were most certainly people who were deeply and genuinely offended by this remark. The fact that you cannot understand this and cannot empathize, is your problem and not their's. You have been taught that any measure of offense is not real and in the real world grown ups are not offended. This is simply not true. There are things that can truly be offensive. The fact that they don't offend you,tough guy, doesn't matter because everyone is not you.

One of these posters said something about if you hear these words and get offended and go hang yourself then let him know and he would film it and put it on youtube and charge money to watch it and yadda yadda yadda. My wife's cousin was violently raped in Italy while she was working towards her phd overseas. She never recovered and hung herself within a year after the attack. What if it were something she heard in passing, a simple seemingly harmless remark about a more than harmless subject that pushed her to that edge? You and I will never know her pain, I am thankful for that. There are many living with the same pain she did. I will give them the benefit of believing that their offense is real and warranted.

Imagine your wife were sitting next to you watching this. Now let's imagine at some point in her life she was raped. If you turned to her after Oscar made his remark and saw that she was visibly and completely upset and offended by his remarks, would you tell her to get over it? It was just a joke? Would you call her a hag bag or a snowflake or whatever derogatory remark you have been taught to call people who actually feel things?

To be certain, Jay, the you in this post was not you. Just relating to what you posted.
  
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12-18-2017, 05:50 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by JC View Post
Sorry if you can't or don't care to keep up with how it got to there. But now that you mention it, yes you were taking the statement out of the context of how I was provoked to that point by dishonest trolling.

Have a happy Sunday

JC
This is a cop out! I'd suggest you read the post above very carefully.
I realize you meant no harm JC, but like Oscar, harm may be done without realizing the consequences of your words. We've all spoken out of turn before and regretted it later. Sometimes we realize right away what we've done and sometimes it can take days for it to set in that we said something that was hurtful to someone else. The important thing for me when I've done that is to apologize if possible. Good luck to you and I wish you a Merry Christmas.


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12-18-2017, 06:18 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by jay helfert View Post
This is a cop out! I'd suggest you read the post above very carefully.
I realize you meant no harm JC, but like Oscar, harm may be done without realizing the consequences of your words. We've all spoken out of turn before and regretted it later. Sometimes we realize right away what we've done and sometimes it can take days for it to set in that we said something that was hurtful to someone else. The important thing for me when I've done that is to apologize if possible. Good luck to you and I wish you a Merry Christmas.
And this is the world of New Speak...where everything you say may be held against you.
....a touch of a rapist...which is the key word in this phrase?

Everything you say is a Rorschach test for the 7 billion plus people in this world.
..it is impossible to be responsible for anybody to avoid triggering someone's
memory of a negative experience...April 22th...."Oh no, that's the day
a car ran over my cat!"...


...oh, and keep ignoring the f-bombs....and dwell on the word in red


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12-18-2017, 09:25 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by AzHousePro View Post
In context or not, the comment was out of line. Let's rein it in a little bit.

Mike
Quote:
Originally Posted by jay helfert View Post
This is a cop out! I'd suggest you read the post above very carefully.
I realize you meant no harm JC, but like Oscar, harm may be done without realizing the consequences of your words. We've all spoken out of turn before and regretted it later. Sometimes we realize right away what we've done and sometimes it can take days for it to set in that we said something that was hurtful to someone else. The important thing for me when I've done that is to apologize if possible. Good luck to you and I wish you a Merry Christmas.
I'm taking the advice above Jay.

Merry Christmas to you as well.

JC


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I would give you more rep , but I it won't let me.. - 12-18-2017, 02:47 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by pt109 View Post
And this is the world of New Speak...where everything you say may be held against you.
....a touch of a rapist...which is the key word in this phrase?

Everything you say is a Rorschach test for the 7 billion plus people in this world.
..it is impossible to be responsible for anybody to avoid triggering someone's
memory of a negative experience...April 22th...."Oh no, that's the day
a car ran over my cat!"...


...oh, and keep ignoring the f-bombs....and dwell on the word in red
  
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12-18-2017, 03:48 PM

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Originally Posted by erhino41 View Post
Herein lies the crux of this matter. Though I didn't find Oscar's comment offensive to my own sensibilities, the subject is so scarring to those who have been damaged by it that even the sheer mention of it in passing, in a joke none the less, can be more offensive than some people can even imagine. I know everyone wants to stick up for Oscar, and I am certain he is a great guy, it is not Oscar or yourself that matter here. This was on live tv and a widely diverse audience of people were watching. There were most certainly people who were deeply and genuinely offended by this remark. The fact that you cannot understand this and cannot empathize, is your problem and not their's. You have been taught that any measure of offense is not real and in the real world grown ups are not offended. This is simply not true. There are things that can truly be offensive. The fact that they don't offend you,tough guy, doesn't matter because everyone is not you.

One of these posters said something about if you hear these words and get offended and go hang yourself then let him know and he would film it and put it on youtube and charge money to watch it and yadda yadda yadda. My wife's cousin was violently raped in Italy while she was working towards her phd overseas. She never recovered and hung herself within a year after the attack. What if it were something she heard in passing, a simple seemingly harmless remark about a more than harmless subject that pushed her to that edge? You and I will never know her pain, I am thankful for that. There are many living with the same pain she did. I will give them the benefit of believing that their offense is real and warranted.

Imagine your wife were sitting next to you watching this. Now let's imagine at some point in her life she was raped. If you turned to her after Oscar made his remark and saw that she was visibly and completely upset and offended by his remarks, would you tell her to get over it? It was just a joke? Would you call her a hag bag or a snowflake or whatever derogatory remark you have been taught to call people who actually feel things?

To be certain, Jay, the you in this post was not you. Just relating to what you posted.
Exactly what happens when a person is offended?
  
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12-18-2017, 05:55 PM

Having known Ernesto, since the seventies. OD screwed up. I am surprised, but the demographic makeup of a pool player, skews ones character in time. Some are effected more, others not so much. Miked up and barking..............screams, immaturity. One things for sure, I'm not throwing the first stone. Merry xmas, and too all a good night.


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12-19-2017, 09:24 AM

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Originally Posted by JoeyA View Post
I've actually heard that term before. Most likely it was in a pool room.

A rapist's touch is revulsive, hence Hatch's touch on that shot was revulsive. It's a simple joke to make light of Hatch's missed shot to lighten Hatch's burden.

While I don't use the next joking term either but I hear it regularly from some of the other young players, right here in New Orleans; "You oughta go kill yourself."

These type of remarks are almost always said in jest and are satirical in nature and rarely are they ever said to get under someone's skin. I'm sure Hatch took it as a good-natured ribbing from his teammate.

If the twits want to condemn someone, they should start with their own crowd as I have never read such despicable remarks against the American Mosconi Cup Team as I saw in some of the European social media. Some of their criticism was quite embarrassing even to my well assaulted eyes, but I'll get over it.


Trying to remember, but I think "Earl" made some unique remarks in the past and he didn't get crucified over it. In fact, in an interview Barry Hearn hammed it up (Earl's meltdown) as part of the excitement that Earl brings to the Mosconi Cup. That was the impression I got from one of the videos I saw in the past.

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12-19-2017, 09:45 AM

It may be a conspiracy. I confess that I have been listening to the flat earthers primarily to just hear their theory about why all of the governments are lying about the globe.

Now today, I read about a UFO sighting that has never been explained and it happened in 2004. Even the U.S. Government has supposedly acknowledged the recent existence of a program dedicated to studying UFO's. Maybe my pal (who for the time being shall remain anonymous) knows more about dimension doors than he is letting on.

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12-19-2017, 03:40 PM

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Exactly what happens when a person is offended?
I don't know? I'm not the one offended and I do not know the circumstances of their existence.

I know there is a lot of feigned offense for the means of furthering the "offended's" cause. We see this all the time in the media/political circus. In this case we are talking about a subject that can be irreparably scarring to someone. In this case the offending remark can have dire consequences. I know you don't want to believe that it can, and I know Oscar certainly would not have meant it to carry as much harm as it may, but it can. Now would I hold Oscar responsible if his words actually lead to some harm? No I would not. Would he? What if he learned that they did? What if someone heard that and it was the last straw?

There most certainly has to be things that are off limits to talk about in a joking manner in mixed company. This has to be o e of them. I know "this is a free country and I'll say what I want!", and you certainly have the right. Others also have the right to lay judgment upon what you say. You certainly have to have some sensitivity to those who can hear what your saying. I'm quite certain Oscar would not have said that remark to his mother.
  
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12-19-2017, 06:30 PM

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"You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to JoeyA again.". Haven't been logged on here in maybe 2 years and I still can't rep you, WTF? Read the first three pages and the last two, you win the best post award, Joey...
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12-19-2017, 06:54 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by erhino41 View Post
I don't know? I'm not the one offended and I do not know the circumstances of their existence.

I know there is a lot of feigned offense for the means of furthering the "offended's" cause. We see this all the time in the media/political circus. In this case we are talking about a subject that can be irreparably scarring to someone. In this case the offending remark can have dire consequences. I know you don't want to believe that it can, and I know Oscar certainly would not have meant it to carry as much harm as it may, but it can. Now would I hold Oscar responsible if his words actually lead to some harm? No I would not. Would he? What if he learned that they did? What if someone heard that and it was the last straw?

There most certainly has to be things that are off limits to talk about in a joking manner in mixed company. This has to be o e of them. I know "this is a free country and I'll say what I want!", and you certainly have the right. Others also have the right to lay judgment upon what you say. You certainly have to have some sensitivity to those who can hear what your saying. I'm quite certain Oscar would not have said that remark to his mother.
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