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ddg45
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08-15-2017, 11:05 AM

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Originally Posted by ddg45 View Post
Good evening folks. I know there are a lot of Joss fans out there but I was wondering...I'm thinking of buying a Joss but I'm a little concerned about their warranty. As far as I can tell it's weak compared to others in the industry? All the other quality made-in-USA cue companies such as McDermott, Viking (I know, they're more of a mass-produced product) but also Schon, OB, and Pechauer have lifetime warranties, and most include warpage. The Joss warranty seems pretty restricted and to me it indicates they're not willing to stand behind their product like the others. It may not be a big deal to many and I know I'm a little OCD, but am I wrong or have others had the same concern and bought something else? Thanks for your feedback.
I've had some Joss users get really defensive about my question above and talk about what a legend Dan Janes is, and that's fine, but I was actually mocked for thinking a better warranty would be a good idea. For people who've had nothing but great experiences using Joss cues I would expect you to be loyal. However, below is a post on Joss's Facebook page from an unhappy customer of theirs they refused to help. I've heard other similar stories regarding Joss cues, but I haven't heard anything like this from Pechauer, OB, or McDermott customers. This is exactly my concern, and I don't believe I will support a company that treats their customers like this.
" May 15, 2017
I recently sent my Joss Cue back to the manufacturer due to the shaft splitting in half in a way that seemed abnormal, and possible a defect. I was quite disappointed when I got a call from Dan at Joss, advising me they have no lifetime warranty, nor were they willing to offer any assistance, other than charging full price for a new shaft. To top it all off, after I paid to have the cue shipped there, they expected me to foot the bill for them to send it back. For anyone looking to purchase a new cue, I would think twice about choosing Joss. I would certainly check into a company that stands behind their workmanship and at least makes an effort to keep their customers satisfied."
  
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08-15-2017, 05:03 PM

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Originally Posted by DaveM View Post
The "lifetime" warranty is a marketing tool, and not the reason I would buy a particular cue. I suppose it comes in handy for some at times. I have a Joss merry widow and wouldn't hesitate to buy another Joss cue.
A Hyundai has a longer warranty than any other make including Acura, Lexus, Mercedes and Cadillac. They're good vehicles, but aren't better vehicles than many other brands with a shorter warranty. Nor do they necessarily have better customer service.
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08-15-2017, 06:27 PM

Broken shaft? I have heard similar stories about all the makers you mention. Customer service failures, unsatisfied customers, refusals to cover something on warranty. Pretty standard for anybody selling any product.

Do you understand such anecdotal evidence is generally not a good indicator?

You got that from their Facebook page? And they didn't delete it?

Sounds pretty honest to me.

What's odd is that you reject the most experienced opinions. I have over 85 cues. I collect and have intensively studied their construction for many years. In addition I follow the market and technology developments closely and have for many years.

I am not a "Joss fan" and I am not defensive about Joss. Just honest and outspoken.

Are you aware of what's inside any of the cues you are talking about? At all? I would think that should be very important to you.

The most expensive part of the Joss is inside the butt. You can't even see it. https://josscues.com/the-joss-way/cu...oss-way-today/

You seem to be focusing on the shaft warranty. Are you aware you can buy a Joss without a shaft and use a shaft from another manufacturer?


For the public record the OP PMed me and does not want my opinion. He seems to feel I am "negative".

I am honest. That's all. No more. No less. If I don't know, I'll tell you. If I do, I'll tell you.

Joss quality is excellent and their quality control is excellent. Their warranty? I don't even look at warranties on such things as cues.



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Bury me with my JOSS....


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08-17-2017, 08:30 AM

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Originally Posted by ddg45 View Post
By coincidence...I own a Hyundai Sonata and it's been a great car but recently had some suspension problems that would have cost $hundreds repaired for free with a smile. I was glad I had that 100,000 mile warranty then.
First off Hyundais have a 100,000 mile powertrain waranty. Engine, transmission , drive system (fwd or awd). You got lucky somehow. Good on ya.

Secondly you won't find a more upstanding cue maker than Dan Janes. I just picked up a custom from him thet we designed together at this years expo. Exceeded my expectations in the aesthetics department as I gave him leeway to be creative. He is Mr. Overdeliver. Answers your questions promptly through the whole process and takes incredible pride in his product.


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11-19-2017, 03:41 PM

I bought an entry level Joss in 1990. It had ivory ferrules on both shafts with an ivory butt plate, $100 down or something like that and wait for 6 months. School and family life got the best of me and it sat for several decades with an occasional game or two. I just got back into playing pool and noticed both shafts and butt were warped. After contacting Dan to see if he could fix it, he said buy a new cue. He didn't offer any type of discount for customer loyalty, which I would have gladly taken him up on. Anyway, I did buy a new cue, but it was with a company that has a lifetime warranty. If I live another 30 years and it warps, I'll return it for a replacement
  
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Kim Bye
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11-19-2017, 05:47 PM

You need to look at how cues are used by the players...
Look at the fine print on the "lifetime warranty" you will find that there are alot caveats for that warranty to be valid. This goes back to how players use their equipment, not protecting their cue in a proper way when transporting it, not taking good care of their cue (stuff like never cleaning their linen wrap, putting some leather conditioner on their leather wrap, sanding the shaft, not installing a tip the proper way etc.) and then you have outright abuse, wich happens all the time. Smacking that shaft on the table, floor or any other surface, dropping the cue or even throwing! the cue is quite common, how do you warranty a piece of wood against that?
The Joss warranty simply seems more reality oriented.
If you are worried that you have to use the warranty, before you even buy a product, then I think you might not treat your equipment right, and you know it...



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ddg45
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Yesterday, 01:28 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kim Bye View Post
You need to look at how cues are used by the players...
Look at the fine print on the "lifetime warranty" you will find that there are alot caveats for that warranty to be valid. This goes back to how players use their equipment, not protecting their cue in a proper way when transporting it, not taking good care of their cue (stuff like never cleaning their linen wrap, putting some leather conditioner on their leather wrap, sanding the shaft, not installing a tip the proper way etc.) and then you have outright abuse, wich happens all the time. Smacking that shaft on the table, floor or any other surface, dropping the cue or even throwing! the cue is quite common, how do you warranty a piece of wood against that?
The Joss warranty simply seems more reality oriented.
If you are worried that you have to use the warranty, before you even buy a product, then I think you might not treat your equipment right, and you know it...
Sorry Kim Bye but I couldn't disagree more. There are many stories on this site that speak to great customer service by companies like McDermott, Lucasi, OB, etc. with lifetime warranties that replaced warped shafts immediately with no questions asked even after years of use. Sadly, there are similar stories about Joss where Dan just said "tough luck."
I understand the high esteem in which Mr. Janes is held by many people but if all other things are equal and one company stands behind their product and another doesn't, it becomes an easy decision. After playing a Joss cue at a local billiards supply store I bought a McDermott because I happened to prefer the way it felt. The fact they take care of their customers much better is just a bonus.


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Pechauer JP02-N retired.
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