Hitting All Balls The Same Speed

wswhiting said:

I asked Corey Deuel once for a tip. "Hit all the balls the same."

A friend at my local room took a lesson from Efren Reyes. He said the pros all do something amateurs fail to do - hit all balls the same. Efren could even turn his back to the table and tell the difference by listening to the balls make contact. What does this mean to you?

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Taking different length back strokes and coming through the cue ball with the same feeling of acceleration. Longer backswing generates more power and shorter for finesse shots. Follow through should be the same for both strokes.

Lee Brett has a video showing this in practice. I believe it is from his APA series in the follow through video.

That is incomplete advice. I believe the beard referred to it as 'placing holes in a student's game'...aka: knowing enough to hurt yourself.

True, a repeated physical motion results in lower margin of error, but unless you play for proper angles and factor in the necessary in/outputs, same speed on every shot isn't going to be of benefit.

I do believe.

wswhiting said:

I asked Corey Deuel once for a tip. "Hit all the balls the same."

A friend at my local room took a lesson from Efren Reyes. He said the pros all do something amateurs fail to do - hit all balls the same. Efren could even turn his back to the table and tell the difference by listening to the balls make contact. What does this mean to you?

Click to expand...

Silly and incomplete advice.

I could buy advise that says, only hit balls hard enough to make them and to get the desired position. But hitting all balls the "same".....nah.

wswhiting said:

I asked Corey Deuel once for a tip. "Hit all the balls the same."

A friend at my local room took a lesson from Efren Reyes. He said the pros all do something amateurs fail to do - hit all balls the same. Efren could even turn his back to the table and tell the difference by listening to the balls make contact. What does this mean to you?

Click to expand...

Doesn't mean anything to me. Advice from pros often doesn't - they're pool players, not teachers.

But I don't think they're talking about speed.

pj
chgo

wswhiting said:

I asked Corey Deuel once for a tip. "Hit all the balls the same."



A friend at my local room took a lesson from Efren Reyes. He said the pros all do something amateurs fail to do - hit all balls the same. Efren could even turn his back to the table and tell the difference by listening to the balls make contact. What does this mean to you?

Click to expand...

I interpret it to be a comment on stroke. Just because a shot is hard, don’t lose your finesse. Don’t jab, poke or smash it. Don’t pop your head up or lunge your body forward. Don’t drop your shoulder. Do the same pre-shot routine. Have the same backswing, same pause (if you normally do), same focus, same follow through, etc. Granted you may need to hit a shot harder but many accomplish that with a longer stroke, not a harder stroke or a different stroke. It my even mean moving the ball more by angles and cueball action than by force. If balls sound like they’re routinely pocketed gently, there’s a sign someone may be on track. If every shot sounds like a cracker, you might be a banger.


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i think they both like half-ball outs.

Golfers generally use nearly the same swing for each distance, just a different club length. Of course you will run into in between shots and shorter shots that require more adjustment, but they generally attempt to play to a certain distance that allows "their" normal swing with a certain club.

I figure that pool can be looked at in two ways, and I have heard different people advise one or the other. You can take the same shot performed at different distances, use the same stroke speed, and just adjust where you hit the ball, or you can hit the ball in a smaller maximum deviation from the center, and adjust your stroke speed more. I think they both have their own merit, but it is my understanding that most people more freely adjust their stroke speed. I personally think its good to be able to shoot shots with as similar of a stroke speed as possible, and I will choose a little more spin with my natural stroke speed to draw the ball further, vs keeping one half tip of draw and adjusting my stroke speed. Granted, their are times that I have to adjust both, but I try to stick with shots at my natural stroke speed, vs varying my stroke speed. This tends to work better for me, especially since my achilles heel comes when I need to stroke hard and I end up using other muscles that shouldn't come into play for my stroke.

Maybe the above has some relevance towards what they are saying.

wswhiting said:

I asked Corey Deuel once for a tip. "Hit all the balls the same."

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Corey means "hit all the balls the same as I would" :thumbup:

michael4 said:

Corey means "hit all the balls the same as I would" :thumbup:

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That's pretty good advice.

IIRC CJ also advocates this.

Sounds like speed of stroke, which I was told about years ago. That said, shots should never be hit harder than necessary, which can be a hard thing to do sometimes.

I've heard people say that pros prefer to hit stun shots rather than roll shots.

For example, if you need to roll forward a few inches, you could roll it and hit at a soft speed to travel forward 5 inches, or you could hit more firmly with just a little bit of high to let it stun forward the same amount.

I know I'm 10x more comfortable rolling it and adjusting speed, but if you're really good at that stun shot I could see some advantages: 1. less throw (on a cut shot) due to the firmer hit, and 2. less chance of roll-off from an unlevel surface.

The only other thing I can think of is that pros are so good at getting just the right angle, that they don't need to pound it off a rail like you see weaker players needing to do all the time. If you always get the proper angle to hit a medium-soft shot, then sure, you can hit it at that speed most of the time.

wswhiting said:

I asked Corey Deuel once for a tip. "Hit all the balls the same."

A friend at my local room took a lesson from Efren Reyes. He said the pros all do something amateurs fail to do - hit all balls the same. Efren could even turn his back to the table and tell the difference by listening to the balls make contact. What does this mean to you?

Click to expand...

I teach this concept, but with more detail. As others have said, this advice is quite incomplete.

BRussell said:

I've heard people say

that pros are so good at getting just the right angle, that they don't need to pound it off a rail like you see weaker players needing to do all the time. If you always get the proper angle to hit a medium-soft shot, then sure, you can hit it at that speed most of the time.

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This is my belief: those bullies are so good at this, they subconsciously know where they need to be to use that speed/ stroke they perfected.

Bob Jewett said:

Maybe they meant that you should hit the cue ball with consistent mechanics. Like set up and follow through. And as straight as you can make it. I think most would agree with that advice.

Efren certainly uses a very wide range of speeds although I don't remember him shooting any really fast shots. Maybe that's because he doesn't have to.

As others have pointed out, without a lot more detail and examples, the advice "hit all balls the same" is worse than worthless.

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This is one time I agree with Bob. You hit all the balls at the same speed and you'll never be a good player. Whoever gave this poor advice is not a real pool player in my book. Corey liked to get into your head, especially if you were his opponent.

i have no idea what you guys are talking
about

perhaps this explains why i never got any good

i did take jersey reds advice

matching up is the most important skill
if you expect to win

reading these threads makes me feel
like i am always out of my debth or
that you guys are full of baloney

i can not decide which

seriously

angle play

I believe this advice applies mostly to how to play position for the correct angles, not how to deal with the wide array of shots that arise during a game.

Bunting balls so softly they barely go into the pocket is risky. Balls can roll off, skid, etc.

Excessive force shrinks the pocket and can lead to a jerky delivery.

There is a nice, smooth, crips speed that lends itself well to accuracy of delivery while keeping the pockets playing comfortably large.

Clearly there are times you'll need to deviate this. But when playing position it's advisable to obtain an angle where you can use this speed of stroke. And when you are hitting your positional spots right and keep leaving yourself the appropriate angles, you may indeed be hitting most shots at the same speed. I think we'd all agree that when a pro is playing well that once they get in line they shouldn't have many shots they dribble or blast. Exceptions would be if they get out of line or in a very unusual spot.