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WildWing
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07-05-2017, 02:32 PM

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Originally Posted by cuesblues View Post
It grows on you...
I didn't buy it at first but it grew on me, and I like the way the tan colored veneer matches the wrap.
Also it's a 59" cue 29.5 split, and original rarely played condition
Great history that implex is. In the late 60s to mid 70s, Joss was king, and that was a combination of Joss and JossWest. Most of the window style Joss cues of that day had implex, and many had implex buttplates, to go along with the window buttsleeve motifs. In the mid Atlantic area, those Joss cues were owned by some of the best players in that era.

I also like the tan leather wrap on it, very old school.

I don't make too many posts, but this one is worth it. Great old school collection.

All the best,
WW

Last edited by WildWing; 07-05-2017 at 05:49 PM.
  
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measureman
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07-06-2017, 08:32 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by WildWing View Post
Great history that implex is. In the late 60s to mid 70s, Joss was king, and that was a combination of Joss and JossWest. Most of the window style Joss cues of that day had implex, and many had implex buttplates, to go along with the window buttsleeve motifs. In the mid Atlantic area, those Joss cues were owned by some of the best players in that era.

I also like the tan leather wrap on it, very old school.

I don't make too many posts, but this one is worth it. Great old school collection.

All the best,
WW
Mid 80's a real good player from Jersey, Neptune Joe Frady was playing with a Joss.
He had Gus Szamboti make him a cue and he hated it.
Liked the Joss better.


Playng cue- Troy Downey
Back up cue - The Mighty Lucasi Cocobolo
Still straighter than 90 % of all Meucci cues ever made
"Russian Magic Chalk- good enough to steal".

Russian Magic chalk is the nuts.
Its so good my last and only cube was stolen off the table when I went to the bath room.
They left my $1000 cue but stole my chalk, how strong is that?


The Truth: If you have a stroke the gear don't matter... If you don't have a stroke the gear won't help.
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cuesblues
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07-07-2017, 03:11 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by measureman View Post
Mid 80's a real good player from Jersey, Neptune Joe Frady was playing with a Joss.
He had Gus Szamboti make him a cue and he hated it.
Liked the Joss better.

That's why your attachment to Lucasi is so puzzling



Seriously though, it would be interesting to hear about the tapers Joss & Josswest used back then, and how they compare to each other as well as Joss now, and other pro-tapered shafts.
It's hard for me to just look at them and tell the difference, I have to play with the cue to tell.
I tried to do some shaft taper comparing last night but I need to spend more time with it.


player......Josswest, KMurrell, Dave Kikel, South West
breaker....Bruce Ryan
jumper.....Custom no named 8-point
shooter....Sig Sauer P226 357
cutter.......Spyderco-Massad Ayoob
  
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WildWing
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07-07-2017, 05:12 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by measureman View Post
Mid 80's a real good player from Jersey, Neptune Joe Frady was playing with a Joss.
He had Gus Szamboti make him a cue and he hated it.
Liked the Joss better.
I remember Neptune Joe quite well. Remember watching him in the old McDermott tour, mid-Atlantic, which later became Planet Pool. He beat a lot of good players. I think the only one that beat him that time was George Breedlove. His cue was a plain rosewood four-pointer, which looked like a Tascarella. But, not surprised he liked Joss cues.

All the best,
WW
  
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WildWing
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07-07-2017, 05:29 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by cuesblues View Post

Seriously though, it would be interesting to hear about the tapers Joss & Josswest used back then, and how they compare to each other as well as Joss now, and other pro-tapered shafts.
It's hard for me to just look at them and tell the difference, I have to play with the cue to tell.
I tried to do some shaft taper comparing last night but I need to spend more time with it.
There's no comparison with Joss shaft tapers then, and now. Then, if you're talking late 60s and 70s, shafts were quite large by today's standards, 13 1/4, 13 1/2, and even larger were the norm. Also, pro taper meant just that, the thickness stayed the same for at least the first ten inches or so, then gradually widened. Today, the standard, including Joss would generally be thinner at the start, and gradually increasing, rather than a constant diameter for that section of the shaft.

A whole host of reasons for the difference. First, slower napped cloth was the standard, mostly Brunsco wool, as well as Mali cloth. You had to slug the cue ball a lot harder than today. Second, pool was mostly played by men, with larger hands. Also, the cue butts were much thicker than today, so the shafts naturally were thicker as well. Today, with faster cloth, the shaft thickness has gone down to more like 12 3/4 and 12 1/2, with gradually increasing diameter all the way, not the constant thickness they used to be for a large part of the shaft. Most of today's cues, including shaft tapers, do not resemble the ones of that era.

All the best,
WW
  
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cuesblues
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07-07-2017, 07:13 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by WildWing View Post
There's no comparison with Joss shaft tapers then, and now. Then, if you're talking late 60s and 70s, shafts were quite large by today's standards, 13 1/4, 13 1/2, and even larger were the norm. Also, pro taper meant just that, the thickness stayed the same for at least the first ten inches or so, then gradually widened. Today, the standard, including Joss would generally be thinner at the start, and gradually increasing, rather than a constant diameter for that section of the shaft.

A whole host of reasons for the difference. First, slower napped cloth was the standard, mostly Brunsco wool, as well as Mali cloth. You had to slug the cue ball a lot harder than today. Second, pool was mostly played by men, with larger hands. Also, the cue butts were much thicker than today, so the shafts naturally were thicker as well. Today, with faster cloth, the shaft thickness has gone down to more like 12 3/4 and 12 1/2, with gradually increasing diameter all the way, not the constant thickness they used to be for a large part of the shaft. Most of today's cues, including shaft tapers, do not resemble the ones of that era.

All the best,
WW
It would be interesting to take a dozen cues to try out on vintage equipment like the tables/cloth you mentioned, and use the same type balls from that era.


player......Josswest, KMurrell, Dave Kikel, South West
breaker....Bruce Ryan
jumper.....Custom no named 8-point
shooter....Sig Sauer P226 357
cutter.......Spyderco-Massad Ayoob
  
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07-07-2017, 07:21 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by cuesblues View Post
It would be interesting to take a dozen cues to try out on vintage equipment like the tables/cloth you mentioned, and use the same type balls from that era.
This is sort of my hobby now. I really enjoy having cues from different eras to compare. I'll often take several to the hall for that purpose.


Bury me with my JOSS....


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07-07-2017, 07:23 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by WildWing View Post
There's no comparison with Joss shaft tapers then, and now. Then, if you're talking late 60s and 70s, shafts were quite large by today's standards, 13 1/4, 13 1/2, and even larger were the norm. Also, pro taper meant just that, the thickness stayed the same for at least the first ten inches or so, then gradually widened. Today, the standard, including Joss would generally be thinner at the start, and gradually increasing, rather than a constant diameter for that section of the shaft.

A whole host of reasons for the difference. First, slower napped cloth was the standard, mostly Brunsco wool, as well as Mali cloth. You had to slug the cue ball a lot harder than today. Second, pool was mostly played by men, with larger hands. Also, the cue butts were much thicker than today, so the shafts naturally were thicker as well. Today, with faster cloth, the shaft thickness has gone down to more like 12 3/4 and 12 1/2, with gradually increasing diameter all the way, not the constant thickness they used to be for a large part of the shaft. Most of today's cues, including shaft tapers, do not resemble the ones of that era.

All the best,
WW
AFAIK the standard Joss shaft is still 13.25 with a constant diameter for at least the first third of the shaft.


Bury me with my JOSS....


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07-07-2017, 07:41 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by cuesblues View Post
That's why your attachment to Lucasi is so puzzling



Seriously though, it would be interesting to hear about the tapers Joss & Josswest used back then, and how they compare to each other as well as Joss now, and other pro-tapered shafts.
It's hard for me to just look at them and tell the difference, I have to play with the cue to tell.
I tried to do some shaft taper comparing last night but I need to spend more time with it.

If I ever get time I'll take measurements of various shafts I have. I have interest in the Joss lineage and how they all evolved. Joss, JW, and Scruggs in particular. I have various examples.

Comparing those with others is interesting as well of course. My 1981 Huebler has a very interesting taper. Very different. I have a 29 inch for it plus two original 31 inch shafts, very rare. And I have two Scruggs shafts that fit that cue as well. Very cool for comparing.

The really old stuff like Katz, Brunswick, Rieper, Luscher, Victor, and Briggs are cool to compare and contrast with newer stuff as well.

But my best player for 30 plus years is still my Joss with Josswest shafts. Of course I am biased in that matter. It's like what makes one woman better than another in the sack. Not a simple matter.

.

.


Bury me with my JOSS....


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WildWing
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07-07-2017, 08:36 PM

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Originally Posted by Chopdoc View Post
AFAIK the standard Joss shaft is still 13.25 with a constant diameter for at least the first third of the shaft.
Don't bet on that. According to their website, 13 1/4 is the largest they offer, not a standard. And my guess is not many get them that large these days.

Back in the early 70s, we routinely got shafts from Joss that were more like 13 1/2. About 40 to 45 years ago.

All the best,
WW
  
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07-07-2017, 09:06 PM

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Originally Posted by WildWing View Post
Don't bet on that. According to their website, 13 1/4 is the largest they offer, not a standard. And my guess is not many get them that large these days.

Back in the early 70s, we routinely got shafts from Joss that were more like 13 1/2. About 40 to 45 years ago.

All the best,
WW
I understand. But as I understand it, unless you specify otherwise when you order a cue it will come with 13.25mm. That makes it their standard.

Of course, these days most will be ordered smaller.

As far as the taper, the late models I have sampled have a traditional "pro taper" with the diameter constant for at least the first third of the shaft.

Cues sold through distributors would likely be ordered with whatever shafts they think will sell well. But most distributors I see offer whatever you want. Joss shafts are interchangeable anyway, going back decades. So they easily offer various options to end users.

.
.

.

.


Bury me with my JOSS....


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07-16-2017, 11:31 PM

Just added 5 new pics
5 to follow


player......Josswest, KMurrell, Dave Kikel, South West
breaker....Bruce Ryan
jumper.....Custom no named 8-point
shooter....Sig Sauer P226 357
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07-16-2017, 11:41 PM

Plain jane pics



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player......Josswest, KMurrell, Dave Kikel, South West
breaker....Bruce Ryan
jumper.....Custom no named 8-point
shooter....Sig Sauer P226 357
cutter.......Spyderco-Massad Ayoob
  
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07-17-2017, 11:40 AM

OK- Now your pics are giving me an emotional crisis.

Maybe I can sell a kidney or something? Wait a minute...that sounds really bad for a doc to say that.



.


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07-17-2017, 12:02 PM

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OK- Now your pics are giving me an emotional crisis.

Maybe I can sell a kidney or something? Wait a minute...that sounds really bad for a doc to say that.



.
Yeah but you could save a lot by doing the procedure yourself..


Design is a fingerprint of the mind....

  
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