Headed to Vegas in July to play BCA 8 ball after having played VNEA for years. Was wondering if somebody familiar with both could give me a quick run down on the rules differences between the two.
Thanks,
Stix
Thanks,
Stix
BCA vs VNEA 8 Ball Rules
- Thread starter stix_n_stones
- Start date
BCAPL allows ball in hand anywhere on the table after a scratch or foul on the break. Just came back from the VNEA Vegas event. First time there. Only difference I remember. Played both 9 ball and 8 ball singles plus teams. Don't have to mark the pocket for the 8 ball in BCAPL BUT you must clearly indicate which pocket you intend to shoot to. That goes for every ball not just the 8.
Biggest play difference you'll find is the tables and cue ball. VNEA on Valley Panthers. BCAPL on Diamond Pro/Am's. BCAPL uses Cyclop ball sets. VNEA uses Aramith ball sets with the Valley Cougar cue ball.
If you were at VNEA Nationals at Bally's, you're familiar with the door nazis keeping outside food and beverages out of the tournament area. Same goes for the BCAPL. Have to admit the vendor food at the BCAPL's was much better than the barely edible overpriced concession at Bally's. The door nazis would not allow outside food and drink in before the concession stands opened or after they closed for the night. Really sad story.
Lyn
Biggest play difference you'll find is the tables and cue ball. VNEA on Valley Panthers. BCAPL on Diamond Pro/Am's. BCAPL uses Cyclop ball sets. VNEA uses Aramith ball sets with the Valley Cougar cue ball.
If you were at VNEA Nationals at Bally's, you're familiar with the door nazis keeping outside food and beverages out of the tournament area. Same goes for the BCAPL. Have to admit the vendor food at the BCAPL's was much better than the barely edible overpriced concession at Bally's. The door nazis would not allow outside food and drink in before the concession stands opened or after they closed for the night. Really sad story.
Lyn
Two other differences are that in VNEA if the table is open, you can hit the 8 ball first to make a ball. Another is that you have to mark the pocket you are shooting the 8 ball at (please note that this can be waived if both parties/teams agree to not use pocket markers).
Damn Ibe, Completely forgot about the eight ball first rule. Played in the Int 8 ball, int/Mstr Classic 8 ball and Int 8 ball team events. It never came up once! Kind of like the APA slop rule. Played for seven years. Came up less than five times in over a thousand games yet it's one of the first things people complain about APA. Go figure!
Lyn
http://www.playcsipool.com/uploads/7/3/5/9/7359673/2014-2015_official_rules_of_csi.pdf
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It seems that when rules allow you to use 8 ball in a combo on an open table they also have BIH in the kitchen if there is a foul on the break, not BIH anywhere like BCAPL
I don't know VNEA rules but things to look at' scratching on the 8 ball is it a loss, are jump shots legal or not, push shots/double hits, and racking rules.
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AT THE BCAPL NATIONALS
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SCRATCHING ON THE 8 BALL: Not a loss unless you also pocket the 8-ball
JUMP SHOTS: Legal. Must call ball and pocket. No scooping the ball, obviously. Jump cues are legal.
PUSH SHOTS/DOUBLE HITS: Foul
RACKING RULES: Rack your own balls. Bottom corner balls must differ (solid/stripe). If you use a magic rack or other template you must allow your opponent to use it.
Obvious shots do not have to be called (including the 8-ball). You must call ball and pocket for all non-obvious shots (banks, caroms, combos, jump shots).
That will help him compare. These seem to be some of the biggest areas of difference
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VNEA: Making The 8-Ball On The Break an automatic win.
BCAPL: If you pocket the 8-ball on the break and do not foul, you may have the 8-ball spotted and accept the table in position or re-rack the balls and break again.
VNEA: Pocketing the 8-ball and the cue ball on the break stroke is loss of game.
BCAPL: If you pocket the 8-ball on the break and foul, your inning ends. Your opponent may have the 8-ball spotted and take ball in hand anywhere on the table or re-rack the balls and break.
VNEA: Not correctly marking the pocket while pocketing the 8-ball is loss of game.
BCAPL: No pocket marker is used. The rules for calling the 8-ball are the same as all other balls.
VNEA: It is a foul when a player scratches on the break, or deflects the cue ball prior to hitting the racked balls. The incoming player receives cue ball in hand behind the headstring.
BCAPL: After a stroke on a break shot, including a miscue, it is a deliberate foul if you intentionally touch or deflect the cue ball. The break is illegal, regardless of whether the cue ball contacts the rack, or whether specific game rules for break shots are met. Your opponent may either re-rack and break or require you to re-rack and break again. BCAPL DELIBERATE FOUL: First violation you will receive a mandatory warning that second and subsequent violations of the same sub-section during the match will be penalized by loss of game.
VNEA: When placing the cue ball in position, any forward stroke motion contacting the cue ball will be a foul, if not a legal shot.
BCAPL: When you have ball in hand, you may use your hand or any part of your cue, including the tip, to position the cue ball. If you use your cue to place the cue ball, any action that would be a legal stroke will be considered a shot, and must meet the requirements of a legal shot or it is a foul.
VNEA: Coaching is a foul. Any member of a team called for coaching will result in a foul on the team member shooting.
BCAPL: Coaching is a foul. Any member of a team called for coaching will result in a foul on ALL TEAM TABLES.
VNEA: ACCIDENTALLY moving or touching any object ball is not a foul unless a moved ball makes contact with the cue ball
BCAPL: It is not a foul if you accidentally touch or move a SINGLE stationary object ball unless the disturbed ball has an effect on the outcome of the shot. "Effect on the outcome of the shot" means that either the disturbed ball contacts any ball set in motion as a result of the shot, or that the base of any ball set in motion as a result of the shot passes through the area originally occupied by the disturbed ball. That area is defined as a circle approximately seven inches in diameter centered on the position originally occupied by the disturbed ball.
VNEA: With cue ball in hand, touching any object ball with the cue ball is a foul or touching any object ball with your hand while touching the cue ball is a foul.
BCAPL: Immediately after a foul, when you are picking up or moving the cue ball the FIRST TIME to take ball in hand (as opposed to placing the cue ball or picking it up again for successive placements before the next shot), it is NOT a foul to disturb a single object ball.
BCAPL: If you pocket the 8-ball on the break and do not foul, you may have the 8-ball spotted and accept the table in position or re-rack the balls and break again.
VNEA: Pocketing the 8-ball and the cue ball on the break stroke is loss of game.
BCAPL: If you pocket the 8-ball on the break and foul, your inning ends. Your opponent may have the 8-ball spotted and take ball in hand anywhere on the table or re-rack the balls and break.
VNEA: Not correctly marking the pocket while pocketing the 8-ball is loss of game.
BCAPL: No pocket marker is used. The rules for calling the 8-ball are the same as all other balls.
VNEA: It is a foul when a player scratches on the break, or deflects the cue ball prior to hitting the racked balls. The incoming player receives cue ball in hand behind the headstring.
BCAPL: After a stroke on a break shot, including a miscue, it is a deliberate foul if you intentionally touch or deflect the cue ball. The break is illegal, regardless of whether the cue ball contacts the rack, or whether specific game rules for break shots are met. Your opponent may either re-rack and break or require you to re-rack and break again. BCAPL DELIBERATE FOUL: First violation you will receive a mandatory warning that second and subsequent violations of the same sub-section during the match will be penalized by loss of game.
VNEA: When placing the cue ball in position, any forward stroke motion contacting the cue ball will be a foul, if not a legal shot.
BCAPL: When you have ball in hand, you may use your hand or any part of your cue, including the tip, to position the cue ball. If you use your cue to place the cue ball, any action that would be a legal stroke will be considered a shot, and must meet the requirements of a legal shot or it is a foul.
VNEA: Coaching is a foul. Any member of a team called for coaching will result in a foul on the team member shooting.
BCAPL: Coaching is a foul. Any member of a team called for coaching will result in a foul on ALL TEAM TABLES.
VNEA: ACCIDENTALLY moving or touching any object ball is not a foul unless a moved ball makes contact with the cue ball
BCAPL: It is not a foul if you accidentally touch or move a SINGLE stationary object ball unless the disturbed ball has an effect on the outcome of the shot. "Effect on the outcome of the shot" means that either the disturbed ball contacts any ball set in motion as a result of the shot, or that the base of any ball set in motion as a result of the shot passes through the area originally occupied by the disturbed ball. That area is defined as a circle approximately seven inches in diameter centered on the position originally occupied by the disturbed ball.
VNEA: With cue ball in hand, touching any object ball with the cue ball is a foul or touching any object ball with your hand while touching the cue ball is a foul.
BCAPL: Immediately after a foul, when you are picking up or moving the cue ball the FIRST TIME to take ball in hand (as opposed to placing the cue ball or picking it up again for successive placements before the next shot), it is NOT a foul to disturb a single object ball.
I took these right off of the VNEA website. As GUTSHOT points out, a few of these VNEA break rules are specific to league play and are not used at the National level.
I am strictly a BCAPL player so I only know of VNEA what I read.