Please Explain Your "Aiming System"?

stan shuffett

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
When Stan says 15s and 30s, he does not mean that the actual cut angle for the shots is 15 degrees or 30 degrees.

That's true. Each of those perceptions covering a wide range of angles have known CCBs whether it's for inside or outside alignments. It's nothing more than see the perception and align to center.

Stan Shuffett
 

Dan White

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
That's true. Each of those perceptions covering a wide range of angles have known CCBs whether it's for inside or outside alignments. It's nothing more than see the perception and align to center.

Stan Shuffett

Of course this is the crux of the matter and the reason for the debate.

To answer the question, I just see the shot.
 

stan shuffett

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Of course this is the crux of the matter and the reason for the debate.

To answer the question, I just see the shot.

Yup......I see the shot knowingly.......It's boring about like the challenge of seeing a straight in shot in your world, prolly easier.

Stan Shuffett
 

stan shuffett

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Of course this is the crux of the matter and the reason for the debate.

To answer the question, I just see the shot.

Crux of the matter! You have a system in Brian's that gives you a known CCB covering essentially. all shots. You should be good to go. Don't pick on me. What's good for the goose is good for the gander.

Stan Shuffett
 

sixpack

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I aim the outside edge of the CB at the contact point and pivot until it 'snaps' into place, which is pretty close to the center of the ghost ball.
 

BC21

https://www.playpoolbetter.com
Gold Member
Silver Member
When I utilize fractions, I have a known point of aim on the back of the OB before I get down in the shot. The ball is already targeted and just sitting there waiting for the CB to come along and send it home.
 

sixpack

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I also use Poolology - it helps me visualize shots quickly and accurately. I love it when I have a dead nuts 1/2 ball shot.
 

lfigueroa

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Awesome. Now, I'd love to hear from the other instructors and better players on here; Scott Lee, Tony in MD, FranCrimi. Lou, Dan. Let's hear yours.


As I've mentioned before I just see the shot. I get down into shooting position and just look at the whole face of the OB and everything else to include the CB. I consider it aiming by feel.

I will confess that on some bank shots, for which the hit is a very slight offset from dead center, I will sometimes visualize hitting a sliver less of the OB. So I guess that might be considered some sort of overlap type thing.

Lou Figueroa
 

Vorpal Cue

Just galumping back
Silver Member
I don't believe in the pivot systems ....

I use the sides of a pivot triangle to determine the correct visual to use. Then I do a manual half ball pivot to get to the shot line and stroke straight through CCB. I came up with the technique while examining the trigonometry behind a shot. Pivoting systems work, it doesn't matter if you believe in them or not. I have an old post about pivoting angles if you're interested in some pivot math.

The Pivot Triangle : http://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?t=437187

Spider started an interesting thread that uses the edges of your cue stick for aiming with a final pivot. It works just as he describes it. I spent about an hour with it yesterday and will tinker with it some more later tonight. If you're willing to give it a mere half hour you'll see how a pivoting system can be accurate.
 

Dan White

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Crux of the matter! You have a system in Brian's that gives you a known CCB covering essentially. all shots. You should be good to go. Don't pick on me. What's good for the goose is good for the gander.

Stan Shuffett

Jesus, Stan, how is that picking on you? This is simply the matter (mystery) that you are going to disclose in your book, correct? I have not made any mention of CTE other than to point this out in a long time. Don't be so defensive. I have reserved any conclusions about CTE Pro1 until the book comes out. Simple as that.

Fact is every shot is a straight in for me, too. I do not guess at a shot. When you have hit a shot enough times that it is part of your subonscious, then when the shot looks "right" is is NOT guessing, it is knowing. The only other variable (assuming a good stroke) is the condition of the balls and cloth for throw purposes. NO system can account for varying conditions and a little tweaking is necessary until you get the table conditions down, then it is back to auto pilot.

Having said that, I do have a little trouble with back cuts because the pocket is not in my peripheral vision, but even those are going more now if I just practice them and use a little Poolology as needed.
 

Dan White

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Spider started an interesting thread that uses the edges of your cue stick for aiming with a final pivot. It works just as he describes it. I spent about an hour with it yesterday and will tinker with it some more later tonight. If you're willing to give it a mere half hour you'll see how a pivoting system can be accurate.

But what's really the point? Shooting traditionally, you use one straight stroke to aim at varying points on the ob. With this ferrule/pivot system, you aim at an approximate place on the ob and vary the amount of pivot to make the shot. So in both instances you are using feel to determine either (in traditional) the aim point on the ob or (in ferrule/pivot) the amount of ferrule/pivoting. I don't see a benefit. Variable pivoting seems more difficult than variable aim point.

Cornerman Freddie said his CTE system is only necessary if you have trouble imagining sending the cue ball to a point off the surface of the ob.
 

stan shuffett

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Jesus, Stan, how is that picking on you? This is simply the matter (mystery) that you are going to disclose in your book, correct? I have not made any mention of CTE other than to point this out in a long time. Don't be so defensive. I have reserved any conclusions about CTE Pro1 until the book comes out. Simple as that.

Fact is every shot is a straight in for me, too. I do not guess at a shot. When you have hit a shot enough times that it is part of your subonscious, then when the shot looks "right" is is NOT guessing, it is knowing. The only other variable (assuming a good stroke) is the condition of the balls and cloth for throw purposes. NO system can account for varying conditions and a little tweaking is necessary until you get the table conditions down, then it is back to auto pilot.

Having said that, I do have a little trouble with back cuts because the pocket is not in my peripheral vision, but even those are going more now if I just practice them and use a little Poolology as needed.

Surely you don't think that I'm flustered. You're the one that's in the corner.

What's so special ( now ) about knowing CCB? That bridge has already been crossed!
Right?

Surely, you are not saying that I'm breaking new ground.

This is fun just like beating that old Fancy Dan pin ball machine when I couldn't see over the flippers.

Stan Shuffett
 
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stan shuffett

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
But what's really the point? Shooting traditionally, you use one straight stroke to aim at varying points on the ob. With this ferrule/pivot system, you aim at an approximate place on the ob and vary the amount of pivot to make the shot. So in both instances you are using feel to determine either (in traditional) the aim point on the ob or (in ferrule/pivot) the amount of ferrule/pivoting. I don't see a benefit. Variable pivoting seems more difficult than variable aim point.

Cornerman Freddie said his CTE system is only necessary if you have trouble imagining sending the cue ball to a point off the surface of the ob.


I think that Freddie is on record as not knowing (Hal's) CTE. Perhaps he has his own version. I think that he has sharpened up Hall's Small Ball system and Shiskabob.

Stan Shuffett
 
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Dan White

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
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Dan White

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Surely you don't think that I'm flustered. You're the one that's in the corner.

What's so special ( now ) about knowing CCB? That bridge has already been crossed!
Right?

Surely, you are not saying that I'm breaking new ground.

This is fun just like beating that old Fancy Dan pin ball machine when I couldn't see over the flippers.

Stan Shuffett

I have no idea what you are referring to, or why you feel like you are having fun at my expense. Methinks thou doth protest too much. That's Shakespeare, ever heard of him? :rolleyes:
 
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emccune

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I have no idea how I aim. I don't imagine a ghostball or have the amazing ability to keep focused on a contact point. Maybe I learned via ghostball and after a few years it became so automatic that I just started seeing the shots. Can't know for sure because I don't remember exactly how I started.

In about 2006 I started thinking about teaching my daughters to play pool. They were 6 and 8 at the time. Not being able to show them how I do it made it a challenge. So I experimented with several different aiming methods. I don't like pivoting methods because the exact same pivot produces different shot angles depending on the distance between the balls. Back then, years ago, I worked out a way to adjust for this, but it involved having to accurately guess at the distance in order to make it work consistently. Then I looked fractional aiming and liked the concept of straight alignment towards a known aim point. But of course there was the age-old problem of not knowing exactly which fraction to use without knowing the angle of the shot. That's when I started troubleshooting that old-age problem and found a solution.

Now I still aim by what feels like instinct, not focusing on any particular aim. But I also incorporate my fractional system on a shot here and there when I don't quite see it naturally. It also works as a jump start when I find myself hitting the balls poorly. All I do is use the system on every shot for a few balls, sometimes a rack or two, and all of a sudden I'm automatically back in tune and just seeing the shots again.

To each their own. If what you're doing is working, keep doing it. If it's not, try something else.
Sounds what I do. I figured out my own fractional method years ago but it is an approximation only. Normally I find a contact point and line those up and just use the fractional method to verify but sometimes I just cant visualize the contact point so I use fractional aiming to get real close then have to feel the slight adjustment that may be needed. Works good. I cant say i don't miss but most of the time that is due to stroke, alignment issues.
 
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