Mosconi Cup Players all Losing

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coco9

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
So unless Billy Thorpe beats Wu then all the Mosconi CUP players (including Europe - Ralf) will have lost heir first match at the open.

Not exactly a great sign especially when you have Bergman comfortably winning against one of the USA team and also Josh Roberts with a great win over a very strong player.

I was hoping for a close cup this year but that does not look overly likely based on these showings....................
 
sjm

sjm

Older and Wiser
Silver Member
To be fair, despite the bad miss in rack 18, SVB played respectably but Van Den Berg, a great player and likely member of 2017 Team Europe, shot the lights out, with an Accu-stats rating of nearly .920. Unlucky draw for Shane, who fell behind 6-1 and fought back bravely to get within 8-7 before falling.

This super-strong field means that some of the elite won't even cash.
 
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coco9

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Yes agreed but it still is not a great showing regardless of the strength of the field.

I think the Bergman result just emphasises the point that he should have been an automatic pick if USA have genuine ambitions to even get close to Europe this year.
 
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Ak Guy

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Well.....

Other then the fame and prestige of the U.S. Open, what does a race to 7 or 9 or 11 or 13 prove when you have the worlds best 9 Ballers all shooting each other over the course of a few days?

It proves on that day and that match they played better then their opponent. Who ya gonna bet on in a race to 25 or 50, Shane or Nick?

What does winning 5 U.S. Open's prove? It proves your a top tier 9 Baller.

Other then that, I agree with JohnnyT
 
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coco9

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Look SVB has better pedigree than NVB of course he does.

I wouldnt be worried about SVB (other than because of his previous Mosconi performances).

I think when they are all losing, most pretty comfortably it doesn't look great, I agree 1 match doesnt tell us much but 5 players losing 1 match is a bit more telling.

Anyway I think the main point here is one that has been discussed previously that not to include Bergman probably threw away any small chance USA had of winning or making this competitive.
 
J

JAM

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
When does Billy Thorpe play?

I miss the player locater on the live coverage, but I'm not complaining because it's free, and I appreciate it.
 
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kollegedave

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Ak Guy said:
Other then the fame and prestige of the U.S. Open, what does a race to 7 or 9 or 11 or 13 prove when you have the worlds best 9 Ballers all shooting each other over the course of a few days?

It proves on that day and that match they played better then their opponent. Who ya gonna bet on in a race to 25 or 50, Shane or Nick?

What does winning 5 U.S. Open's prove? It proves your a top tier 9 Baller.

Other then that, I agree with JohnnyT
Click to expand...

By the same logic, Shane's record at the Mosconi Cup proves he should not be on the team. Historically, he has played poorly at that event. You are right that Shane is a heavy favorite in a race to 50--which is never played at the Mosconi Cup.

How a player performs in a SHORT race and in a situation where the break means less should drive the U.S. decisions in who they pick for the team. Shane has a great break, which is largely neutralized in the MC format.

kollegedave
 
iba7467

iba7467

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
JAM said:
When does Billy Thorpe play?

I miss the player locater on the live coverage, but I'm not complaining because it's free, and I appreciate it.
Click to expand...

He is about to play Wu Jiaqing. It is not looking good for USA to get it's first victory.
 
sjm

sjm

Older and Wiser
Silver Member
Johnnyt said:
It's only ONE match. One match means nothing. Johnnyt
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In truth, one match means a lot, but a loss isn't fatal. SVB took an early loss last year to JL Chang, who went on to win the hot seat, but it was SVB who prevailed in the final. He's still in it.

Historically, the US Open has brought out the best in the elite, and major upsets have been a rarity when it comes to the top few in the world. Only the stars of the game are up to dealing with the pressure of the US Open, and that 's why they are so hard to beat. The cream rises to the top at the US Open because races to eleven have always been enough to sort out which players are the game's most elite.

This year will be no different. Look for four of the game's superstars to remain when we get to Saturday's final rounds.

Anyone can beat anyone in a race to eleven? That's an AZB myth. History says it's not the case at the US Open.
 
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King T

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
The voice of Reason, Thanks!

sjm said:
In truth, one match means a lot, but a loss isn't fatal. SVB took an early loss last year to JL Chang, who went on to win the hot seat, but it was SVB who prevailed in the final. He's still in it.

Historically, the US Open has brought out the best in the elite, and major upsets have been a rarity when it comes to the top few in the world. Only the stars of the game are up to dealing with the pressure of the US Open, and that 's why they are so hard to beat. The cream rises to the top at the US Open because races to eleven have always been enough to sort out which players are the game's most elite.

This year will be no different. Look for four of the game's superstars to remain when we get to Saturday's final rounds.

Anyone can beat anyone in a race to eleven? That's an AZB myth. History says it's not the case at the US Open.
Click to expand...

Every match for the USA players means something. When you start thinking well this one isn't important your in trouble and the results will reflect that.
 
Cardigan Kid

Cardigan Kid

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
What does Billy defeating Wu say for team USA?
With all the negativity, here's a chance to actuality be positive about it all!
 
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mmktierney

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
So...if we are already beaten, why not just concede this year and wait until we are the prohibitive favorite and then play? Makes sense .... waste of time and money to go if you read the posts on AZB. These predictions are never wrong...right?
 
spartan

spartan

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
coco9 said:
So unless Billy Thorpe beats Wu then all the Mosconi CUP players (including Europe - Ralf) will have lost heir first match at the open.

Not exactly a great sign especially when you have Bergman comfortably winning against one of the USA team and also Josh Roberts with a great win over a very strong player.

I was hoping for a close cup this year but that does not look overly likely based on these showings....................
Click to expand...

Well the optics sure does not look good.
But it really is not that bad.
Of the 4 losses, only SVB loss was to a top Euro NVB (and very likely MCupper)
Of the 4 losses, 3 were to those with much higher Fargo
Then also MC is quite different-team format with alt break, race to 5 or 6, ref rack (wooden rack), shot clock so you are comparing waffle and pancake :smile:
 
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Carolina_Giant

Perfection=Serenity
Silver Member
Well Thorpe won his so at least we got 1/5.

While Ralf did lose his match, Filler who is number 2 world rankings won his match, NVB won his match obviously, Alcaide who is a likely wild card pick won his match, Jason Shaw who is another possible card pick won his match, and Ouschan won his match quite handily.

Personally, while I admire what Johan is doing, the fact that not a single spot is up for grabs on the Cup team for the US I think hurts their motivation. All 5 of those guys know they are getting a guaranteed 10-20 grand payday without having to go overseas. The Euros are all playing with fire, and so are the Chinese Taipei crowd. Even Kiamco is having a resurgence.


I think Shane will fight to the bitter end, but none of the other Mosconi Cup players for USA have even been in contention for a US Open title for a long time. And with alternate break instead of winner break format with a short race, a tournament like the US Open is no indicator of how they will play in a month. It's disappointing to see almost all of them end up on the B side so soon, but this will be a test of their mettle and how bad do they really want this title.
 
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