Do you foresee an American world champion within the next 5 years?

J

justinb386

Banned
I am curious about your opinions of there possibly being an American winning the World Championships (in 9 ball, or 10 ball, or any of the other pool games, like Banks, 1 pocket or 14.1) within the next 5 years?

Please forgive my ignorance, because I do not even know if there are any current reigning world champions that are from the US (in any of those games).

With the way that Skylar Woodward has improved so quickly over these very recent years, do you foresee him becoming a world champion maybe within the next 5 years?

Or possibly Justin Bergman, because I see that his game has greatly improved also.

Or any of the other young players from the US?

I understand that SVB is a strong possibility, but what do you think about any of the others from the US (within the next 5 years)?

Is 5 years too short of a time frame, or should I have maybe made it within the next 10 years?

Thanks for any opinions about this.
 
Goldcues

Goldcues

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I think so, definitely. And you named 3 top candidates to bring the prize home to the USA; SVB, Bergman, and Woodward. Between those 3 we may see more than one world title. Those guys are awesome and getting stronger.
I would not bet against them.
 
sjm

sjm

Older and Wiser
Silver Member
justinb386 said:
I am curious about your opinions of there possibly being an American winning the World Championships (in 9 ball, or 10 ball, or any of the other pool games, like Banks, 1 pocket or 14.1) within the next 5 years?

Please forgive my ignorance, because I do not even know if there are any current reigning world champions that are from the US (in any of those games).

With the way that Skylar Woodward has improved so quickly over these very recent years, do you foresee him becoming a world champion maybe within the next 5 years?

Or possibly Justin Bergman, because I see that his game has greatly improved also.

Or any of the other young players from the US?

I understand that SVB is a strong possibility, but what do you think about any of the others from the US (within the next 5 years)?

Is 5 years too short of a time frame, or should I have maybe made it within the next 10 years?

Thanks for any opinions about this.
Click to expand...

Shannon Daulton is reigning World Banks Champion, having beaten fellow American John Brumback in last year's final. Skylar is also capable of winning a world championship at banks. Certainly, the Derby City banks is the de facto World Championship. in this discipline, and Americans win this one all the time.

In one pocket, guys like Frost, Bergman, Van Boening, Deuel and a few others can win. Certainly, the Derby City 1-pocket is the de facto World Championship. in this discipline and Americans often win this.

In 9-ball, outside of this year's runnerup SVB, who will likely win one, the only player with a shot over the next few years is Dechaine. He's had a third place finish in the Derby City 9-ball, a fourth place finish in the US Open 9-ball and tied for ninth in this year's world 9-ball championship. None of the other Americans, Bergman and Woodward included, have shown an ability to go very deep in the three toughest 9-ball events of the year. Until they post a top five in one of these elite events, I won't be taking their chances of winning a world championship in 9-ball very seriously. That said, they are young improving players with big upsides, but to me they are more in with a chance if a ten year span is considered.

In 14.1, there is no real world championship, with the Dragon 14.1, the upcoming US Open 14.1 and the European 14.1 championships all being prestigious titles.
 
M

Masayoshi

Fusenshou no Masa
Silver Member
I think the odds are slightly against Shane bringing home the wpa 8, 9, or 10 ball in the next 5 years, but it is within the realm of possibility. Nobody else stands a chance. If Shane doesn't take a world title in that time frame, I think the odds of an American winning a world championship any given year will diminish greatly unless some phenom rises through the ranks in the next few years like Shane did himself years back.

As for the other games, it is fairly likely that Americans will win those titles as those games are almost exclusively played in the US. It would be quite embarassing if an American didn't win a title in those games, actually.
 
iusedtoberich

iusedtoberich

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
sjm said:
Shannon Daulton is reigning World Banks Champion, having beaten fellow American John Brumback in last year's final. Skylar is also capable of winning a world championship at banks. Certainly, the Derby City banks is the de facto World Championship. in this discipline, and Americans win this one all the time.

In one pocket, guys like Frost, Bergman, Van Boening, Deuel and a few others can win. Certainly, the Derby City 1-pocket is the de facto World Championship. in this discipline and Americans often win this.

In 9-ball, outside of this year's runnerup SVB, who will likely win one, the only player with a shot over the next few years is Dechaine. He's had a third place finish in the Derby City 9-ball, a fourth place finish in the US Open 9-ball and tied for ninth in this year's world 9-ball championship. None of the other Americans, Bergman and Woodward included, have shown an ability to go very deep in the three toughest 9-ball events of the year. Until they post a top five in one of these elite events, I won't be taking their chances of winning a world championship in 9-ball very seriously. That said, they are young improving players with big upsides, but to me they are more in with a chance if a ten year span is considered.

In 14.1, there is no real world championship, with the Dragon 14.1, the upcoming US Open 14.1 and the European 14.1 championships all being prestigious titles.
Click to expand...

DCC banks is not a world championship. That's as bad as calling Charlie's 14.1 event a world championship.
 
iusedtoberich

iusedtoberich

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I think only Shane and Bergman have a chance. I don't know of any 15 year olds coming up.

Skylar is not in their league, imo.
 
T

TheLoneSilencer

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Unless the WPA creates a true world championship in a discipline outside of rotation, I don't see any American getting the job done.

The only way I could maybe see them having a shot is if the event is held in the United States where they might be able to sneak away with a win.
 
GideonF

GideonF

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
TheLoneSilencer said:
Unless the WPA creates a true world championship in a discipline outside of rotation, I don't see any American getting the job done.

The only way I could maybe see them having a shot is if the event is held in the United States where they might be able to sneak away with a win.
Click to expand...


This makes no sense to me. SVB came second last year in Doha, and (IMHO) would have won except for Ko getting a shit-ton of rolls. That happens, of course, and Ko is the champ, but it is hard to say SVB doesn't have a shot of winning one outside the US in the next five years.

I think SVB's chances of winning a world title in 9 or 10 ball are as good as those of the other super elite pros. The issue to me is that those other super elite pros have a good chance too, so someone like Bob Jewett or Mike Page needs to run the math.

Gideon
 
T

TheLoneSilencer

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
iusedtoberich said:
I think only Shane and Bergman have a chance. I don't know of any 15 year olds coming up.

Skylar is not in their league, imo.
Click to expand...

GideonF said:
This makes no sense to me. SVB came second last year in Doha, and (IMHO) would have won except for Ko getting a shit-ton of rolls. That happens, of course, and Ko is the champ, but it is hard to say SVB doesn't have a shot of winning one outside the US in the next five years.

I think SVB's chances of winning a world title in 9 or 10 ball are as good as those of the other super elite pros. The issue to me is that those other super elite pros have a good chance too, so someone like Bob Jewett or Mike Page needs to run the math.

Gideon
Click to expand...

All people want to bring up are the rolls. Yet people conveniently forget that he played a terrible position shot towards the end that ended up costing him the match. Regardless of the "rolls", he had a chance to still win & failed to execute.

There are too many foreign players who are better than him where his dominance does not intimidate them.
 
K

King T

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
You miss the point

TheLoneSilencer said:
All people want to bring up are the rolls. Yet people conveniently forget that he played a terrible position shot towards the end that ended up costing him the match. Regardless of the "rolls", he had a chance to still win & failed to execute.

There are too many foreign players who are better than him where his dominance does not intimidate them.
Click to expand...

I agree with you about the rolls, doesn't matter SVB had more than his fair chance to win, put that to bed.

But as far as him needing to intimidate the field or other players to win..., well how about him just playing good and winning? He is a great player and will have his chance so long as he continues to do what it takes to be where he is.

Yes there are lots of players that as good, opinions say some are better, but none are so far above that he couldn't beat them on any given day.
 
JB Cases

JB Cases

www.jbcases.com
Silver Member
justinb386 said:
I am curious about your opinions of there possibly being an American winning the World Championships (in 9 ball, or 10 ball, or any of the other pool games, like Banks, 1 pocket or 14.1) within the next 5 years?

Please forgive my ignorance, because I do not even know if there are any current reigning world champions that are from the US (in any of those games).

With the way that Skylar Woodward has improved so quickly over these very recent years, do you foresee him becoming a world champion maybe within the next 5 years?

Or possibly Justin Bergman, because I see that his game has greatly improved also.

Or any of the other young players from the US?

I understand that SVB is a strong possibility, but what do you think about any of the others from the US (within the next 5 years)?

Is 5 years too short of a time frame, or should I have maybe made it within the next 10 years?

Thanks for any opinions about this.
Click to expand...

Yes, as long as they get there early enough to get over jet lag and get comfortable with the tables they have as good a chance as anyone of winning the tournament.

This past 9 ball WPC Shane is said to gotten there a week early and he rolled over just about everyone to get to the finals and was only beaten in the finals by a few COLD ROLLS where his opponent got lucky.
 
P

pro9dg

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
US players who have a chance are restricted to SVB, Justin and Skylar.

But they are unlikely to do so until they close the skill gap that currently exists between them and top players from Asia and Europe.

The good news for them is that they have the resources to help them to make this happen. Shane is a fantastic player but he could improve at least 25% under the wing of Mark Wilson, his Mosconi Team Coach.

The other two have already enjoyed some success but they could take their skill level Up by at least 50% with One To One attention.
However they will have to dedicate themselves to putting any improvements to the test on a world stage.
Right now they are pedalling to only just keep up. Meanwhile the rest of the world re still seriously getting better with the best example of his being Johan Ruysink being given a long term contract by Russia
 
CreeDo

CreeDo

Fargo Rating 597
Silver Member
iusedtoberich said:
DCC banks is not a world championship. That's as bad as calling Charlie's 14.1 event a world championship.
Click to expand...

SJM called it the "de facto" world championship, which is not the same as calling it a world championship.

What he's saying is, there is no other bank tournament on earth with a larger field, better players, and more money.

World championship is just a label, at the end of the day it's just another tournament. Kind of like a lot of State Championships are really just "Local Pool Tour Stop #14".
 
spartan

spartan

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
justinb386 said:
I am curious about your opinions of there possibly being an American winning the World Championships (in 9 ball, or 10 ball, or any of the other pool games, like Banks, 1 pocket or 14.1) within the next 5 years?

Please forgive my ignorance, because I do not even know if there are any current reigning world champions that are from the US (in any of those games).

With the way that Skylar Woodward has improved so quickly over these very recent years, do you foresee him becoming a world champion maybe within the next 5 years?

Or possibly Justin Bergman, because I see that his game has greatly improved also.

Or any of the other young players from the US?

I understand that SVB is a strong possibility, but what do you think about any of the others from the US (within the next 5 years)?

Is 5 years too short of a time frame, or should I have maybe made it within the next 10 years?

Thanks for any opinions about this.
Click to expand...

I would say SVB and Bergman have best chance. I like Bergman, great temperament to go far.if not World championship at least a major (US Open, China Open or All Japan)
Skylar has some way to go to reach their level.

The biggest and toughest World is the World 9 Ball (W9B). It is the jewel in crown that most pro players want to win (Even though some do not want to say it) . At one time when Matchroom was running it, it was called WPC (World Pool Championship)
Winning W9B is super super tough these days cos at least 50 or half the field can win whole thing unlike 20 years ago
SVB may win it some day but not in immediate future cos the odds are against him appearing in another final very soon. Just as the odds are againt Big Ko appearing in another W9B final this year.
In fact in the last 10 years, no player has appeared in 2 consecutive finals. The closest gap is 5 years. Kuo and Alcano were in 2 finals 5 years apart. The last consecutive final appearance was Alex more than 10 years ago
That is why I recall some on stream and here in azb saying Shane or Ko have to grab the chance. cos if not they will have to wait long time or never appear in another final in their lifetime
:D
 
GideonF

GideonF

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
spartan said:
I would say SVB and Bergman have best chance. I like Bergman, great temperament to go far.if not World championship at least a major (US Open, China Open or All Japan)
Skylar has some way to go to reach their level.

The biggest and toughest World is the World 9 Ball (W9B). It is the jewel in crown that most pro players want to win (Even though some do not want to say it) . At one time when Matchroom was running it, it was called WPC (World Pool Championship)
Winning W9B is super super tough these days cos at least 50 or half the field can win whole thing unlike 20 years ago
SVB may win it some day but not in immediate future cos the odds are against him appearing in another final very soon. Just as the odds are againt Big Ko appearing in another W9B final this year.
In fact in the last 10 years, no player has appeared in 2 consecutive finals. The closest gap is 5 years. Kuo and Alcano were in 2 finals 5 years apart. The last consecutive final appearance was Alex more than 10 years ago
That is why I recall some on stream and here in azb saying Shane or Ko have to grab the chance. cos if not they will have to wait long time or never appear in another final in their lifetime
:D
Click to expand...

I agree with the post generally, but I think the passage in bold (if I did it right) regarding the odds of getting back to a final is wrong. Unless you are suggesting that a player's performance falls for some reason in subsequent world events after reaching a final (say a mental thing), the odds of them getting to a final are not reduced by the fact that they got there last year. Think of the old game theory question - odds of a coin flip coming up heads 100 times in a row are astronomical, but after the 99th toss, the odds on the 100th toss being heads are still 50-50.

Gideon
 
Cornerman

Cornerman

Cue Author...Sometimes
Gold Member
Silver Member
CreeDo said:
World championship is just a label, at the end of the day it's just another tournament. Kind of like a lot of State Championships are really just "Local Pool Tour Stop #14".
Click to expand...

LOL!!! This is all me (or worse) I have a State Championship, and it's not a league title or handicapped anything. But no pros either! I used to say, "Ive got a state title, but it's......"

Mr Robles told me to stop putting the "but" disclaimer and enjoy the big tournament win. But...

Freddie <~~~ World Champion of Albert Drive
 
Cardigan Kid

Cardigan Kid

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
justinb386 said:
I am curious about your opinions of there possibly being an American winning the World Championships (in 9 ball, or 10 ball, or any of the other pool games, like Banks, 1 pocket or 14.1) within the next 5 years?

Please forgive my ignorance, because I do not even know if there are any current reigning world champions that are from the US (in any of those games).

With the way that Skylar Woodward has improved so quickly over these very recent years, do you foresee him becoming a world champion maybe within the next 5 years?

Or possibly Justin Bergman, because I see that his game has greatly improved also.

Or any of the other young players from the US?

I understand that SVB is a strong possibility, but what do you think about any of the others from the US (within the next 5 years)?

Is 5 years too short of a time frame, or should I have maybe made it within the next 10 years?

Thanks for any opinions about this.
Click to expand...

I may catch shrapnel for this view but what the heck.....

The WPA 9-ball title is the big boy on the block, the crown jewel of pool as others have put it and they are correct.
Will Shane or another American ever win it?
Like Spartan stated Shane's odds are extremely slim of making it back to the finals after appearing in them last year.

For Shane and the rest of American pool, I feel the distraction of Chinese 8-ball, bar box 7-footer table events and 1-pocket will be more of a hurdle as the years go by. I see much of Europe and Asia all playing big tables, and never touching 1-pocket. Is it any wonder they are so focused and strong when it comes to 9-ball world championships?
 
B

Blue Jam

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
CreeDo said:
SJM called it the "de facto" world championship, which is not the same as calling it a world championship.

What he's saying is, there is no other bank tournament on earth with a larger field, better players, and more money.

World championship is just a label, at the end of the day it's just another tournament. Kind of like a lot of State Championships are really just "Local Pool Tour Stop #14".
Click to expand...

You missed "that he knows about" but at least we are agreed, not a world championship.
 
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