1/2 Tip Offset Alignment -- Pivot Effects on Fractional Aiming

BC21

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For the math gurus here who like to scribble and sketch and calculate. This sketch shows the effects of lining up 1/2 tip left or right of a fractional aim line (3/4 ball cut to the right in this example).

Notice how the 14.5° angle can be manipulated a few degrees thicker or thinner using a half-tip parallel pivot. The distance between the balls is 1 diamond (12.5"). At a 2-diamond distance the thin angle would end up being 31.6° to the right, while the thick angle would be 1.1° to the left. Shortening the bridge length would fine tune the adjustments another few degrees tighter.

picture.php
 

cookie man

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
For the math gurus here who like to scribble and sketch and calculate. This sketch shows the effects of lining up 1/2 tip left or right of a fractional aim line (3/4 ball cut to the right in this example).

Notice how the 14.5° angle can be manipulated a few degrees thicker or thinner using a half-tip parallel pivot. The distance between the balls is 1 diamond (12.5"). At a 2-diamond distance the thin angle would end up being 31.6° to the right, while the thick angle would be 1.1° to the left. Shortening the bridge length would fine tune the adjustments another few degrees tighter.

picture.php

No one has commented yet so I guess i will. I've never heard of thinning or thickening a pivot in fractional aiming. Is this covered in more detail in your poolology book?
 

BC21

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No one has commented yet so I guess i will. I've never heard of thinning or thickening a pivot in fractional aiming. Is this covered in more detail in your poolology book?

No sir. Absolutely zero pivoting in Poolology. However, with several aiming systems using pivots or parallel shifts, or a combination of both, and with many players experimenting with various aiming methods to see what works with or complements their preferred method, I thought it'd be good info to share the effects of this style of pivoting.

As you can see from the sketch, a 3/4 fractional aim is close to 15°. Instead of aiming thicker for a 7/8 hit, in case that's hard to visualize, you can thicken the shot up by using this pivot, which at in this example gets you very close to 7/8 aim. Or you can pivot the opposite direction and get a thinner shot, a 3/8 shot. Though I don't use it, I think it's neat. Of course, it would take some time to master the technique because those angles get larger as the distance between the balls increases. Here, at 1 diamond distance, this pivot method can provide a +/- 1/8 fractional adjustment. At 2 diamonds it'd be a little larger than 1/8 adjustments. You could also extend the bridge distance out to about 15 or 16 inches and this pivot would create +/- adjustments of about 1/16. There are lots of fine tuning options available for anyone that wants to invest the time into learning them.

For pivot users, this is good info that could help with understanding what's going on, and therefore maybe speed up the process of becoming proficient at it. A table of distances and angles would be easier to use than doing the math though.
 

cookie man

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
No sir. Absolutely zero pivoting in Poolology. However, with several aiming systems using pivots or parallel shifts, or a combination of both, and with many players experimenting with various aiming methods to see what works with or complements their preferred method, I thought it'd be good info to share the effects of this style of pivoting.

As you can see from the sketch, a 3/4 fractional aim is close to 15°. Instead of aiming thicker for a 7/8 hit, in case that's hard to visualize, you can thicken the shot up by using this pivot, which at in this example gets you very close to 7/8 aim. Or you can pivot the opposite direction and get a thinner shot, a 3/8 shot. Though I don't use it, I think it's neat. Of course, it would take some time to master the technique because those angles get larger as the distance between the balls increases. Here, at 1 diamond distance, this pivot method can provide a +/- 1/8 fractional adjustment. At 2 diamonds it'd be a little larger than 1/8 adjustments. You could also extend the bridge distance out to about 15 or 16 inches and this pivot would create +/- adjustments of about 1/16. There are lots of fine tuning options available for anyone that wants to invest the time into learning them.

For pivot users, this is good info that could help with understanding what's going on, and therefore maybe speed up the process of becoming proficient at it. A table of distances and angles would be easier to use than doing the math though.

So what aiming system would you recommend using this for. Again i've never heard of thick and thin in regards to any fractional system.
 

claymont

JADE
Gold Member
Silver Member
For the math gurus here who like to scribble and sketch and calculate. This sketch shows the effects of lining up 1/2 tip left or right of a fractional aim line (3/4 ball cut to the right in this example).

Notice how the 14.5° angle can be manipulated a few degrees thicker or thinner using a half-tip parallel pivot. The distance between the balls is 1 diamond (12.5"). At a 2-diamond distance the thin angle would end up being 31.6° to the right, while the thick angle would be 1.1° to the left. Shortening the bridge length would fine tune the adjustments another few degrees tighter.

picture.php

What's a "parallel pivot"? How is this accomplished?
 

BC21

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So what aiming system would you recommend using this for. Again i've never heard of thick and thin in regards to any fractional system.

Actually, Stan Shuffett has a 5-line quarter fractional lesson in which he talks about adjusting thicker or thinner than a known quarter aim. Times are changing. I see pivots like this, which are also used in CTE (YouTube "Gerald Williams"), as being good knowledge for those interested in acquiring as much pool knowledge as possible.
 

BC21

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What's a "parallel pivot"? How is this accomplished?

Do you know how back hand english is applied? (Pivot your cue tip from center CB to the left or right to apply english, keeping your bridge hand planted)....well, a parallel pivot is simply shifting your bridge hand and cue left or right, parallel to the straight center CB alignment/aim, then plant your bridge hand there and pivot the tip back to center. It's an interesting way to tweak cut shots. You can experiment with 1/2 tip shifts, full tip, quarter tip, or whatever. A half tip is simply shifting over until the edge of your tip is flush with the center of the CB, then pivot the tip back to center CB.
 

Ralph Kramden

BOOM!.. ZOOM!.. MOON!
Silver Member
Do you know how back hand english is applied? (Pivot your cue tip from center CB to the left or right to apply english, keeping your bridge hand planted)....well, a parallel pivot is simply shifting your bridge hand and cue left or right, parallel to the straight center CB alignment/aim, then plant your bridge hand there and pivot the tip back to center. It's an interesting way to tweak cut shots. You can experiment with 1/2 tip shifts, full tip, quarter tip, or whatever. A half tip is simply shifting over until the edge of your tip is flush with the center of the CB, then pivot the tip back to center CB.

Brian... When I parallel shift from CCB using fractions, I aim at a different OB fraction point. I never pivot back to CCB.
If I parallel shift using fractions, I'll aim at a fraction line next to my intended fraction point, to compensate for deflection.

When I do pivot I won't use OB fractions. I always pivot from inside of the OB cut line. The cue 1st aims at CCB to COB
for alignment, then parallel shifts, and aligns to the same spot on both balls. The cue then pivots back toward CB center.

These 2 different ways of aiming work well for me... but then... YMMV

.
 

BC21

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Brian... When I parallel shift from CCB using fractions, I aim at a different OB fraction point. I never pivot back to CCB.
If I parallel shift using fractions, I'll aim at a fraction line next to my intended fraction point, to compensate for deflection.

When I do pivot I won't use OB fractions. I always pivot from inside of the OB cut line. The cue 1st aims at CCB to COB
for alignment, then parallel shifts, and aligns to the same spot on both balls. The cue then pivots back toward CB center.

These 2 different ways of aiming work well for me... but then... YMMV

.

Same here. I use parallel and BHE, depending on the shot. I don't consciously choose which method I'm goiing use -- I just automatically use what feels right based on experience.

I've noticed (since coming up with Poolology and working more with fractions) that when I apply a full tip of inside English, using BHE/pivot method, my cue ends up being aligned exactly 2 quarter aim points away from the aim point needed if I were shooting ccb. In other words......on a half ball shot, when I apply a tip of inside english, my tip/stroke is lined one tip from ccb and pointed at the center of the OB. So I know instead of lining up for ccb to OB edge, then pivoting to a tip of inside spin, I can go straight into the shot alignment without using BHE. Simply aim at center ob from one tip left or right of center.

Different cues of course will play differently when applying spin, so each player must learn how to compensate for english based on their particular cue. Paying attention to where your stroke is aimed when pocketing a ball (while applying BHE) is a quick way to learn how to go straight into that alignment without pivoting next time.
 

SpiderWebComm

HelpImBeingOppressed
Silver Member
No sir. Absolutely zero pivoting in Poolology. However, with several aiming systems using pivots or parallel shifts, or a combination of both, and with many players experimenting with various aiming methods to see what works with or complements their preferred method, I thought it'd be good info to share the effects of this style of pivoting.

As you can see from the sketch, a 3/4 fractional aim is close to 15°. Instead of aiming thicker for a 7/8 hit, in case that's hard to visualize, you can thicken the shot up by using this pivot, which at in this example gets you very close to 7/8 aim. Or you can pivot the opposite direction and get a thinner shot, a 3/8 shot. Though I don't use it, I think it's neat. Of course, it would take some time to master the technique because those angles get larger as the distance between the balls increases. Here, at 1 diamond distance, this pivot method can provide a +/- 1/8 fractional adjustment. At 2 diamonds it'd be a little larger than 1/8 adjustments. You could also extend the bridge distance out to about 15 or 16 inches and this pivot would create +/- adjustments of about 1/16. There are lots of fine tuning options available for anyone that wants to invest the time into learning them.

For pivot users, this is good info that could help with understanding what's going on, and therefore maybe speed up the process of becoming proficient at it. A table of distances and angles would be easier to use than doing the math though.

Look at all of this! I have to applaud you for venturing forth and experimenting with pivots in conjunction with your fractional system.

Who knows what the future may hold?! Poolology VI might morph into having all of those fractions on both sides of the ball down to only 3 or 5 visuals. Wouldn't THAT be something!

If you keep playing with it I'm sure you'll have the EUREKA MOMENT where it kicks in and you'll be saying, "Son of a b*tch! That old guy Hal and then Stan really were on to something. I finally see it!"

You might have to gulp down some grilled crow with a few shots of Tequila but I'm sure all of us will forgive you.

Just don't say you invented it.;):D
 

BC21

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Look at all of this! I have to applaud you for venturing forth and experimenting with pivots in conjunction with your fractional system.

Who knows what the future may hold?! Poolology VI might morph into having all of those fractions on both sides of the ball down to only 3 or 5 visuals. Wouldn't THAT be something!

If you keep playing with it I'm sure you'll have the EUREKA MOMENT where it kicks in and you'll be saying, "Son of a b*tch! That old guy Hal and then Stan really were on to something. I finally see it!"

You might have to gulp down some grilled crow with a few shots of Tequila but I'm sure all of us will forgive you.

Just don't say you invented it.;):D

Thanks for the applause. No crow eating, as I already understand the concept of using basic quarters in conjunction with offset pivoting techniques. I prefer straight-aiming with my nose and my stroke directly behind the CB, except when using BHE, but that's an adjustment made from a known shot line to counter deflection and cb squirt, not a method of finding the shot line.

No eureka moment. I don't waste a lot of table time on offset pivots. I simply sketched a few shots to learn exactly how it works, then went to the table and proved the reality of the sketches. I think it's neat, but in my opinion there are several years of adjustments/moving parts that need to be perfected before a player develops consistency. For example, how long have you been doing it? How many years have gone by with the same handful of players here on AZ still working on those pivots? I'm not saying it wont work, eventually. I'm just saying the same thing you have said, or Stan has said, that you have to be willing to work at it, shooting several hundred balls per day until you get it working proficiently.

I prefer being a noser -- target shooting, with the target being exactly where the CB needs to be in order to pocket the ball. For other nosers that have gotten good at it, incorporating a little offset pivot on certain shots can be a great tool. For pivot players that have perfected their method, occassionally incorporating a straight aim toward a distant target can also be a great tool. The more tools a player has the more prepared he/she is to win.
 

SpiderWebComm

HelpImBeingOppressed
Silver Member
Thanks for the applause. No crow eating, as I already understand the concept of using basic quarters in conjunction with offset pivoting techniques. I prefer straight-aiming with my nose and my stroke directly behind the CB, except when using BHE, but that's an adjustment made from a known shot line to counter deflection and cb squirt, not a method of finding the shot line.

There are far more ways than just one or two to play the game.

No eureka moment. I don't waste a lot of table time on offset pivots

Your prerogative. Also maybe your loss. Still your choice.

I simply sketched a few shots to learn exactly how it works, then went to the table and proved the reality of the sketches. I think it's neat, but in my opinion there are several years of adjustments/moving parts that need to be perfected before a player develops consistency.

Nope. Several weeks can do it. If a player has to spend a year learning something while doing it daily, they should have given it up long before.


For example, how long have you been doing it?

Going on 12 years but I grasped it in a matter of a couple of days.
Actually Hal got it working for me in the FIRST telephone session. That's what grabbed me by the nuts and I got hooked immediately.


How many years have gone by with the same handful of players here on AZ still working on those pivots?

None! They either got it or moved on to what they were doing pretty quick.

I'm not saying it wont work, eventually. I'm just saying the same thing you have said, or Stan has said, that you have to be willing to work at it, shooting several hundred balls per day until you get it working proficiently.

I don't have time now but I was shooting several hundred balls per day everyday with other stuff. It didn't matter to me.

I prefer being a noser -- target shooting, with the target being exactly where the CB needs to be in order to pocket the ball.

The CB always needs to end up at a place on the OB in order to pocket it. A good number of ways to get there and visualize it. You still haven't given any insight or explicit details how you do it since you DO NOT use Poolology when playing. Please describe the indescribable. At least I know what I'm looking at and see. You've given no indication on the FEEL method.

For other nosers that have gotten good at it, incorporating a little offset pivot on certain shots can be a great tool. For pivot players that have perfected their method, occassionally incorporating a straight aim toward a distant target can also be a great tool. The more tools a player has the more prepared he/she is to win.

I can go along with all of the above. I probably pivot for everything except an edge to edge when you're trying to skin the paint fumes off the OB. Just so you know the word pivot isn't just done manually. When done visually it's not called a pivot.
 

BC21

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I can go along with all of the above. I probably pivot for everything except an edge to edge when you're trying to skin the paint fumes off the OB. Just so you know the word pivot isn't just done manually. When done visually it's not called a pivot.

"skin the paint fumes off the ball"

I'm going to use that! :thumbup:

And I understand the concept of visualizing the pivot from a standing position, then coming into the shot according to where that visual pivot indicates. Then you could call it a sweep or air pivot. The same move can be done when applying english, instead of pivoting BHE, the player can visualize the bhe pivot and simply come in on the appropriate alignment.
 
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