Opinion on a definition of fair offers

classiccues

Don't hashtag your broke friends
Silver Member
$ 2800.00 cue from a mid level tier cuemaker....

Unplayed cue.. mint condition

Whats a fair offer? -10% -15% $ 2500 / 2400 ish...

Whats stealing? -20% -25% $ 2250 - $ 2100 ish

Direct from cuemaker / cuedealer doesn't matter....

JV
 

ribdoner

SATISFACTION GUARANTEED
Silver Member
classiccues said:
$ 2800.00 cue from a mid level tier cuemaker....

Unplayed cue.. mint condition

Whats a fair offer? -10% -15% $ 2500 / 2400 ish...

Whats stealing? -20% -25% $ 2250 - $ 2100 ish

Direct from cuemaker / cuedealer doesn't matter....

JV


In todays market "fair" is impossible to quantify, being thick skinned is an asset.

How many dealers would live with parameters defining "fair" when buying or taking cues in trade.
 

classiccues

Don't hashtag your broke friends
Silver Member
ribdoner said:
In todays market "fair" is impossible to quantify, being thick skinned is an asset.

How many dealers would live with parameters defining "fair" when buying or taking cues in trade.

The last question is for another thread I plan on starting... and we touched on it a while back about "fair" trade offers... but with the influx of a lot of new cuemakers maybe it should be revisited...

JV
 

Kevin Lindstrom

14.1 Addict
Silver Member
Very well said

ribdoner said:
In todays market "fair" is impossible to quantify, being thick skinned is an asset.

How many dealers would live with parameters defining "fair" when buying or taking cues in trade.

Here Here I plan to find that out this year at the Super Billiards Expo as I plan to buy and trade
 

n10spool

PHD in table mechanics
Silver Member
Most cue dealers I talk to try to buy the cues direct for 35%+ off from the maker Then adjust prices from there. As for used cues you have to be carefull I keep hearing about stolen cues or the person only had the cue a few days and now trying to resell it quick sale , fire sale but that I feel should be in another thread for debate I think...

Craig
 

Cuephoric

1hole anyone?
Silver Member
n10spool said:
Most cue dealers I talk to try to buy the cues direct for 35%+ off from the maker Then adjust prices from there. As for used cues you have to be carefull I keep hearing about stolen cues or the person only had the cue a few days and now trying to resell it quick sale , fire sale but that I feel should be in another thread for debate I think...

Craig

Nailed it on the head again!
 

jazznpool

Superior Cues--Unchalked!
Gold Member
Silver Member
Hey Joe, One of the HUGE variables affecting "fair offer/ pricing" is how realistic is the $2,800 price to begin with? Does the maker, in fact sell most of the cues himself for that price or does he back door or discount them to individual customers? With some makers, their price is realistic and solid. With others it is not. JMO.

Martin




classiccues said:
$ 2800.00 cue from a mid level tier cuemaker....

Unplayed cue.. mint condition

Whats a fair offer? -10% -15% $ 2500 / 2400 ish...

Whats stealing? -20% -25% $ 2250 - $ 2100 ish

Direct from cuemaker / cuedealer doesn't matter....

JV
 
Last edited:

Fast Lenny

Faster Than You...
Silver Member
jazznpool said:
Hey Joe, One of the HUGE variables affecting "fair offer/ pricing" is how realistic is the $2,800 pirice to begin with? Does the maker, in fact sell most of the cues himself for that price or does he back door or discount them to individual customers? With some makers, their price is realistic and solid. With others it is not. JMO.

Martin
Well said. :cool:
 

ridewiththewind

♥ Hippie Hustler ♥
Silver Member
I am curious if the reputation of the maker might not play in to this as well? What may be a fair offer on one maker's cue may not be as fair an offer on another maker's cue.

Lisa
 

classiccues

Don't hashtag your broke friends
Silver Member
This is why I said a second tier cue maker. (I know even that is subjective) Any cuemaker giving 35% or better off, please e-mail me. :D

I am trying to generalize as not to give an opinion of a second tier cuemaker. Also remember the same answer is going to apply to a "trade" for Kevin. As far as the number being reasonable from the cuemaker initially, lets assume it is, for this exercise.

JV
 

pocketspeed

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
free market ecomony

classiccues said:
$ 2800.00 cue from a mid level tier cuemaker....

Unplayed cue.. mint condition

Whats a fair offer? -10% -15% $ 2500 / 2400 ish...

Whats stealing? -20% -25% $ 2250 - $ 2100 ish

Direct from cuemaker / cuedealer doesn't matter....

JV

what i never understand is why when selling cues the laws of a free market ecomony are always ignored. prices for goods are always really set by the market, not the producer. is the offer "fair"? the market will determine that. you cant just say that taking 10% less than msrp is fair and an offer of 15% is an insulting lowball offer. it all depends on what the market will bear. if you trying to sell a $2800 cue and every offer you get is in the $2000 range then the offer is "fair" (in a free market ecomony youre not guarenteed a profit). as the seller you can either pull the trigger and take the loss or put the product back on the shelf and wait for better market conditions. also just curious here but if all the offers came in at $2800 and i offered you $3000 b/c i really wanted the cue you were selling would you think that you "stole" from me.

brian
 

Bigjohn

Support Our Troops!
Silver Member
classiccues said:
$ 2800.00 cue from a mid level tier cuemaker....

Unplayed cue.. mint condition

Whats a fair offer? -10% -15% $ 2500 / 2400 ish...

Whats stealing? -20% -25% $ 2250 - $ 2100 ish

Direct from cuemaker / cuedealer doesn't matter....

JV

I personally feel that "fair offer" must fluctuate with the market.
 

cubswin

Just call me Joe...
Silver Member
I think a fair offer is whatever is accepted. Low balls do get accepted from time to time, so they must be fair.
 

KCarson1

Diebold-2008 Pres Results
Silver Member
pocketspeed said:
what i never understand is why when selling cues the laws of a free market ecomony are always ignored. prices for goods are always really set by the market, not the producer. is the offer "fair"? the market will determine that. you cant just say that taking 10% less than msrp is fair and an offer of 15% is an insulting lowball offer. it all depends on what the market will bear. if you trying to sell a $2800 cue and every offer you get is in the $2000 range then the offer is "fair" (in a free market ecomony youre not guarenteed a profit). as the seller you can either pull the trigger and take the loss or put the product back on the shelf and wait for better market conditions. also just curious here but if all the offers came in at $2800 and i offered you $3000 b/c i really wanted the cue you were selling would you think that you "stole" from me.

brian

Tap, tap, tap to Brian.

The market sets the price, end of story. Fair is in the eyes of the beholder.

If the cuebuilder supports the list price the dealer, which bought at a discount, can make a buck.

With so many new/second tier/unknown cuebuilders building good looking, nice hitting cues, I personally don't think the prices of a year or two ago will ever return.

(Hope I'm wrong)
 

cueaddicts

AzB Gold Member
Silver Member
classiccues said:
$ 2800.00 cue from a mid level tier cuemaker....

Unplayed cue.. mint condition

Whats a fair offer? -10% -15% $ 2500 / 2400 ish...

Whats stealing? -20% -25% $ 2250 - $ 2100 ish

Direct from cuemaker / cuedealer doesn't matter....

JV


Fair offer given these parameters has too many variables to offer an easy or even clear answer. Especially when you consider Martin's reply....which is oh, so true, and dead-on correct. I would say that on the secondary market, a "fair offer" is pretty easy to define....it's an offer that does not offend the seller....although the amount may vary, depending on the seller's position at that time (i.e. need to sell). Over the last ten-fifteen years cue buyers have been "programmed" to think that most custom cues will appreciate over time, but as the market has come to a halt (for most cues), fair offer considerations are constantly changing and being redefined.

To summarize and end my point, Joe, anything under your new asking price for your uber-clean JF South West that doesn't seem to want to move, would be stealin !!!!
 

classiccues

Don't hashtag your broke friends
Silver Member
Then when trading your "unknown" second tier cuemaker's cue, don't get offended when the other person says.. to much for someone only known on AZ and in his immediate locale. Remember, fair market value?!?!?

So I also gather that people who have responded have no problem saying to a cuemaker, you know what, your asking price is to much how about xxxx?? I wonder if a cuemaker will chime in and tell us if this has happened or not? Personally if I am at a show, or whatever, if a cue maker gives me a price I don't agree with I just walk away, or say, good luck (in a non-condescending tone). I realize they are proud of their work and don't want to be told it isn't worth that much.

I also don't agree with new cuemakers coming out of the box asking for first tier money. Hey, not my fault you bought all that stuff, a video and a book, and saw a 4 point Tascarella go for 2k. You're a good fella, only rhymes with Tascarella, it doesn't equate the price.

I see alot of interesting conversations coming at the show in March. I can't wait. I see a lot of my dollar offers coming. :) Don't be mad when you're new unknown "internet wunderkind" cue gets an offer of a hundred dollars on a trade. Also I fail to see the logic of buying an internet buzz cue and trying to trade it in. I have had multiple offers of some new cuemakers cues, used as barter material for South Wests, James Whites, and Motteys. Sorry you bought it, you get rid of it. Also do yourself a favor and do not say cuemaker xxxx says its a 1200 cue new from him, for the same reasons that have been said on here. People have a short memory when it comes to talking on the boards then trying to pawn their stuff.

JV (--maybe it's easier to sell lower end stuff??
 

classiccues

Don't hashtag your broke friends
Silver Member
cueaddicts said:
To summarize and end my point, Joe, anything under your new asking price for your uber-clean JF South West that doesn't seem to want to move, would be stealin !!!!

Well then someone got a steal because it went for less!!!!

JV (---South Wests are now worth 1200 on trade ins... :D New market price!!
 

cubswin

Just call me Joe...
Silver Member
classiccues said:
So I also gather that people who have responded have no problem saying to a cuemaker, you know what, your asking price is to much how about xxxx?? ?

I'd have to say if a customer says that then the cuemaker should be able to explain their price. If not then I'd think 1 of 2 things would happen. The cuemaker would come down on the price, or tell the customer to shop elsewhere.

In most lines of work outside of retail stores (and even at some retail stores) haggling over price is part of doing business. At my work place we explain why our price is our price, if people want something cheaper they are free to go elsewhere.

If our price is too high, then we will notice it with a decrease in clients and have to adjust.
 
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