Opinions wanted on clear finishes.

cnyncrvr

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Eric briefly skimmed over this is a kind of round about way but he hit the nail on the head either way.

It does not matter what kind of finish you use. The end result of how the finish turns out will be based far more in the prep work prior to applying the finish than the type of finish you use.

Having worked in the automotive and powersports industry for a number of years (Including in collision repair and refinishing) I have a fairly intimate knowledge of automotive finishes. I have seen some of the best and most expensive automotive finishes absolutely ruined by piss poor prep work.

I have seen guys take Krylon rattle cans and apply them to a properly prepped surface and I would bet an entire weeks pay that the vast majority could not tell the difference between the rattle can finish and that of say PPG, Dupont, Glasurit.

Each product by each manufacturer will have its own surface prep requirements, application techniques and post application processes.

Things like temperature and humidity come into play when applying these finishes as well, applying finish in say Georgia can vary vastly from where I am in California, Catalyst's, Reducers, even the ratio at which they are mixed can vary.

At the end of the day, the way you prep your job will effect the outcome of the finished product far more than the actual product you choose to use!
 

Canadian cue

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Eric briefly skimmed over this is a kind of round about way but he hit the nail on the head either way.

It does not matter what kind of finish you use. The end result of how the finish turns out will be based far more in the prep work prior to applying the finish than the type of finish you use.

Having worked in the automotive and powersports industry for a number of years (Including in collision repair and refinishing) I have a fairly intimate knowledge of automotive finishes. I have seen some of the best and most expensive automotive finishes absolutely ruined by piss poor prep work.

I have seen guys take Krylon rattle cans and apply them to a properly prepped surface and I would bet an entire weeks pay that the vast majority could not tell the difference between the rattle can finish and that of say PPG, Dupont, Glasurit.

Each product by each manufacturer will have its own surface prep requirements, application techniques and post application processes.

Things like temperature and humidity come into play when applying these finishes as well, applying finish in say Georgia can vary vastly from where I am in California, Catalyst's, Reducers, even the ratio at which they are mixed can vary.

At the end of the day, the way you prep your job will effect the outcome of the finished product far more than the actual product you choose to use!

The problem is not so much what it looks like when it leaves the door but how it looks in five years. That has everything to do with what product you use. I have used both the automotive finishes and the CA finish and can get the results I want from either. The problem I have with CA is it was engineered as an adhesive and not as a finish so I am not 100% confident it is designed to last the test of time. As well adding the oil creates a whole new product that becomes a mystery polymer.
https://www.permabond.com/2015/07/02/cyanoacrylate-adhesive-environmental-resistance/
.
 

cnyncrvr

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
The problem is not so much what it looks like when it leaves the door but how it looks in five years. That has everything to do with what product you use. I have used both the automotive finishes and the CA finish and can get the results I want from either. The problem I have with CA is it was engineered as an adhesive and not as a finish so I am not 100% confident it is designed to last the test of time. As well adding the oil creates a whole new product that becomes a mystery polymer.
https://www.permabond.com/2015/07/02/cyanoacrylate-adhesive-environmental-resistance/
.

I will have to agree to disagree with you on this.

I have seen numerous times the "Best" and most expensive finishes leave the shop looking perfect only to return a year, two, 5 years down the road faded, peeling, yellowed, milky. I have seen cheap finishes leave looking amazing and never come back, I have seen vehicles painted 30,40,50 years ago still look to this day like they just came out of the polishing booth.

CA while commercially used as an adhesive, as many have found out here stands up well as a very durable long lasting finish. When prepped properly CA can withstand years of nearly daily use in a variety of climates and conditions. And look nearly as good if not exactly as good as the day it left the makers shop.

Over our history an uncountable number of things were invented for one purpose only to find out at a later time that it had exceptional properties, uses, abilities in area's in which it was never intended or designed for. Some of our kinds greatest innovation has not come from invention but rather repurpose.
 

Canadian cue

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I will have to agree to disagree with you on this.

I have seen numerous times the "Best" and most expensive finishes leave the shop looking perfect only to return a year, two, 5 years down the road faded, peeling, yellowed, milky. I have seen cheap finishes leave looking amazing and never come back, I have seen vehicles painted 30,40,50 years ago still look to this day like they just came out of the polishing booth.

CA while commercially used as an adhesive, as many have found out here stands up well as a very durable long lasting finish. When prepped properly CA can withstand years of nearly daily use in a variety of climates and conditions. And look nearly as good if not exactly as good as the day it left the makers shop.

Over our history an uncountable number of things were invented for one purpose only to find out at a later time that it had exceptional properties, uses, abilities in area's in which it was never intended or designed for. Some of our kinds greatest innovation has not come from invention but rather repurpose.

CA may very well be a great finish but I have yet to see anyone back these claims with facts. When I called a reputable manufacturer of CA and asked them if their product would make a reliable finish there answer was they couldn't recommend it as one because they don't have the test data to support it. Simply put they didn't engineer it for this purpose. Automotive finish on the other hand was engineered for the purpose of being a finish. They have clarity, UV protection and durability all factored into there product. Can you confidently say the same thing for CA? The link that I posted clearly states that CA will break down with water, our sweat is made predominantly of water. So according to my logic handling your cue constantly specifically on a wrap less cue raises some concerns don't you think? My point here is not to bash CA finishes or to offend anyone just frank discussion.
 

eihi

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
can you ask,"Those who have used/use Solarez, do you prefer epoxy or fiberglass version?"
thanks
 

cueman

AzB Gold Member
Gold Member
Silver Member
I doubt I have put on as many super glue finishes as many of you have, but I have probably been doing it longer than most have. Well over 20 years so I have seen what it does over time. I can say they can yellow and yet sometimes don't even using the same brand. It has been a little more brittle than some other finishes with more noticeable cracks around ring work than some other finishes. But the ease of use with practice and crystal clear deep look are some advantages that offset the disadvantages. The speed is the main advantage. All finishes have their pros and cons that I have tried.
 

Palmetto cue

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
DSCF7081.jpg

The tip on which CAs to use was the ticket! Those blotches didn't appear at first. They showed up after letting it set about an hour. I thought it was some type of reaction to the ring material I was using, so I coated with epoxy first, and then applied the CA. Same thing happened. Using the exact same methods, switching to the right CA did the trick! Thanks Eric, Bob, and everyone else that contributed! Lot of great info on this thread for me at least! Thanks again for the help!
 

Palmetto cue

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
View attachment 489715

The tip on which CAs to use was the ticket! Those blotches didn't appear at first. They showed up after letting it set about an hour. I thought it was some type of reaction to the ring material I was using, so I coated with epoxy first, and then applied the CA. Same thing happened. Using the exact same methods, switching to the right CA did the trick! Thanks Eric, Bob, and everyone else that contributed! Lot of great info on this thread for me at least! Thanks again for the help!

http://forums.azbilliards.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=489868&stc=1&d=1523645910

Had to polish a little more but much better results! Thanks again!
 

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scdiveteam

Rick Geschrey
Silver Member
Hi,

I use Polyurethene Automotive high solids and a spray booth for my cue finishing 100 percent of the time.

That being said using CA for finishing is a great way to go if you master the procedure. I have mastered the use of CA and use it for many repair projects I do for my customers.

The two most important factors to resolve are:

1.) CA is fast and you can ship the same day after buffing. Many who use CA buy cheap deluded stuff from Hobby Lobby or Ace. To get a great job without the white demons, you must use 100 percent CA that is not deluded. To keep with forum rules there is a certain cue supply co in Wheeling Il that sells the pure CA at a very low cost respectivly.

2.) if you use automotive clear to aquire the most lasting coating and finish you must be very patient. 30 cure days before final wet sanding and buffing over a fully cured adhesion coat. A total finish time of 50 days. Although CA produces a fantastic finish buff out, it in my opinion the Poly Clear buffed after a full chemical cure is a little better and worth the cure time. Buffing a Cue before full cure exposes the clear coat to shrink after heat has been removed.

Rick
 

JoeyInCali

Maker of Joey Bautista Cues
Silver Member
Hi,

I use Polyurethene Automotive high solids and a spray booth for my cue finishing 100 percent of the time.

That being said using CA for finishing is a great way to go if you master the procedure. I have mastered the use of CA and use it for many repair projects I do for my customers.

The two most important factors to resolve are:

1.) CA is fast and you can ship the same day after buffing. Many who use CA buy cheap deluded stuff from Hobby Lobby or Ace. To get a great job without the white demons, you must use 100 percent CA that is not deluded. To keep with forum rules there is a certain cue supply co in Wheeling Il that sells the pure CA at a very low cost respectivly.

2.) if you use automotive clear to aquire the most lasting coating and finish you must be very patient. 30 cure days before final wet sanding and buffing over a fully cured adhesion coat. A total finish time of 50 days. Although CA produces a fantastic finish buff out, it in my opinion the Poly Clear buffed after a full chemical cure is a little better and worth the cure time. Buffing a Cue before full cure exposes the clear coat to shrink after heat has been removed.

Rick
What heat?
If you use a flow enhancer, it evaporates eventually.
And that causes most of the shrinkage.
 
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