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stan shuffett
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09-12-2017, 12:17 PM

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Originally Posted by Dan White View Post
Then maybe you should have named it CTE Bore-1 instead?
Good pivot! Fancy Dan. See, you can pivot.

Stan Shuffett
  
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Dan White
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09-12-2017, 12:27 PM

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Originally Posted by stan shuffett View Post
Crux of the matter! You have a system in Brian's that gives you a known CCB covering essentially. all shots. You should be good to go. Don't pick on me. What's good for the goose is good for the gander.

Stan Shuffett
Jesus, Stan, how is that picking on you? This is simply the matter (mystery) that you are going to disclose in your book, correct? I have not made any mention of CTE other than to point this out in a long time. Don't be so defensive. I have reserved any conclusions about CTE Pro1 until the book comes out. Simple as that.

Fact is every shot is a straight in for me, too. I do not guess at a shot. When you have hit a shot enough times that it is part of your subonscious, then when the shot looks "right" is is NOT guessing, it is knowing. The only other variable (assuming a good stroke) is the condition of the balls and cloth for throw purposes. NO system can account for varying conditions and a little tweaking is necessary until you get the table conditions down, then it is back to auto pilot.

Having said that, I do have a little trouble with back cuts because the pocket is not in my peripheral vision, but even those are going more now if I just practice them and use a little Poolology as needed.


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Dan White
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09-12-2017, 12:29 PM

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Originally Posted by stan shuffett View Post
Good pivot! Fancy Dan. See, you can pivot.

Stan Shuffett
..........


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Dan White
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09-12-2017, 12:34 PM

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Originally Posted by Vorpal Cue View Post
Spider started an interesting thread that uses the edges of your cue stick for aiming with a final pivot. It works just as he describes it. I spent about an hour with it yesterday and will tinker with it some more later tonight. If you're willing to give it a mere half hour you'll see how a pivoting system can be accurate.
But what's really the point? Shooting traditionally, you use one straight stroke to aim at varying points on the ob. With this ferrule/pivot system, you aim at an approximate place on the ob and vary the amount of pivot to make the shot. So in both instances you are using feel to determine either (in traditional) the aim point on the ob or (in ferrule/pivot) the amount of ferrule/pivoting. I don't see a benefit. Variable pivoting seems more difficult than variable aim point.

Cornerman Freddie said his CTE system is only necessary if you have trouble imagining sending the cue ball to a point off the surface of the ob.


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stan shuffett
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09-12-2017, 12:37 PM

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Originally Posted by Dan White View Post
Jesus, Stan, how is that picking on you? This is simply the matter (mystery) that you are going to disclose in your book, correct? I have not made any mention of CTE other than to point this out in a long time. Don't be so defensive. I have reserved any conclusions about CTE Pro1 until the book comes out. Simple as that.

Fact is every shot is a straight in for me, too. I do not guess at a shot. When you have hit a shot enough times that it is part of your subonscious, then when the shot looks "right" is is NOT guessing, it is knowing. The only other variable (assuming a good stroke) is the condition of the balls and cloth for throw purposes. NO system can account for varying conditions and a little tweaking is necessary until you get the table conditions down, then it is back to auto pilot.

Having said that, I do have a little trouble with back cuts because the pocket is not in my peripheral vision, but even those are going more now if I just practice them and use a little Poolology as needed.
Surely you don't think that I'm flustered. You're the one that's in the corner.

What's so special ( now ) about knowing CCB? That bridge has already been crossed!
Right?

Surely, you are not saying that I'm breaking new ground.

This is fun just like beating that old Fancy Dan pin ball machine when I couldn't see over the flippers.

Stan Shuffett

Last edited by stan shuffett; 09-12-2017 at 12:43 PM.
  
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stan shuffett
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09-12-2017, 12:41 PM

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Originally Posted by Dan White View Post
But what's really the point? Shooting traditionally, you use one straight stroke to aim at varying points on the ob. With this ferrule/pivot system, you aim at an approximate place on the ob and vary the amount of pivot to make the shot. So in both instances you are using feel to determine either (in traditional) the aim point on the ob or (in ferrule/pivot) the amount of ferrule/pivoting. I don't see a benefit. Variable pivoting seems more difficult than variable aim point.

Cornerman Freddie said his CTE system is only necessary if you have trouble imagining sending the cue ball to a point off the surface of the ob.

I think that Freddie is on record as not knowing (Hal's) CTE. Perhaps he has his own version. I think that he has sharpened up Hall's Small Ball system and Shiskabob.

Stan Shuffett

Last edited by stan shuffett; 09-12-2017 at 12:51 PM.
  
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Dan White
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09-12-2017, 12:51 PM

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Originally Posted by stan shuffett View Post
I think that Freddie is on record as not knowing CTE. I think he has sharpened up Hall's Small Ball system and Shiskabob.

Stan Shuffett
He is on record as not knowing your version of CTE. He know's what Hal taught him very well and he adapted that to something he could (and does) use.

Maybe you didn't see Freddie's post:

http://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?t=456929


Dan White

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09-12-2017, 12:53 PM

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Originally Posted by stan shuffett View Post
Surely you don't think that I'm flustered. You're the one that's in the corner.

What's so special ( now ) about knowing CCB? That bridge has already been crossed!
Right?

Surely, you are not saying that I'm breaking new ground.

This is fun just like beating that old Fancy Dan pin ball machine when I couldn't see over the flippers.

Stan Shuffett
I have no idea what you are referring to, or why you feel like you are having fun at my expense. Methinks thou doth protest too much. That's Shakespeare, ever heard of him?


Dan White

Last edited by Dan White; 09-12-2017 at 01:32 PM. Reason: typo
  
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stan shuffett
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09-12-2017, 01:14 PM

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Originally Posted by Dan White View Post
He is on record as not knowing your version of CTE. He know's what Hal taught him very well and he adapted that to something he could (and does) use.

Maybe you didn't see Freddie's post:

http://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?t=456929

I only know what he told a recent caller. What I said.

Stan Shuffett
  
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  (#40)
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09-12-2017, 01:15 PM

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Originally Posted by BC21 View Post
I have no idea how I aim. I don't imagine a ghostball or have the amazing ability to keep focused on a contact point. Maybe I learned via ghostball and after a few years it became so automatic that I just started seeing the shots. Can't know for sure because I don't remember exactly how I started.

In about 2006 I started thinking about teaching my daughters to play pool. They were 6 and 8 at the time. Not being able to show them how I do it made it a challenge. So I experimented with several different aiming methods. I don't like pivoting methods because the exact same pivot produces different shot angles depending on the distance between the balls. Back then, years ago, I worked out a way to adjust for this, but it involved having to accurately guess at the distance in order to make it work consistently. Then I looked fractional aiming and liked the concept of straight alignment towards a known aim point. But of course there was the age-old problem of not knowing exactly which fraction to use without knowing the angle of the shot. That's when I started troubleshooting that old-age problem and found a solution.

Now I still aim by what feels like instinct, not focusing on any particular aim. But I also incorporate my fractional system on a shot here and there when I don't quite see it naturally. It also works as a jump start when I find myself hitting the balls poorly. All I do is use the system on every shot for a few balls, sometimes a rack or two, and all of a sudden I'm automatically back in tune and just seeing the shots again.

To each their own. If what you're doing is working, keep doing it. If it's not, try something else.
Sounds what I do. I figured out my own fractional method years ago but it is an approximation only. Normally I find a contact point and line those up and just use the fractional method to verify but sometimes I just cant visualize the contact point so I use fractional aiming to get real close then have to feel the slight adjustment that may be needed. Works good. I cant say i don't miss but most of the time that is due to stroke, alignment issues.
  
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09-12-2017, 01:16 PM

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Originally Posted by Dan White View Post
I have no idea what you are referring to, or why you feel like you are having fund at my expense. Methinks thou doth protest too much. That's Shakespeare, ever heard of him?

You just what you are doing and it's called PIVOTING.

Let's get to the crux of the matter for the CCB concern that you have.

Stan Shuffett
  
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09-12-2017, 01:32 PM

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Originally Posted by stan shuffett View Post
I only know what he told a recent caller. What I said.

Stan Shuffett
I only know otherwise directly from the horse's mouth.


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09-12-2017, 01:36 PM

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Originally Posted by stan shuffett View Post
You just what you are doing and it's called PIVOTING.

Let's get to the crux of the matter for the CCB concern that you have.

Stan Shuffett
Stan, I really don't know what you are asking me, honestly. If you are referring to the multiple outcome angles from the same visual (aka, the mystery) then yes, that is what I was referring to. I didn't think I was saying anything new and wasn't trying to elicit anything new. You said it will be in your book so fine.

If you are talking about something else then you'll have to be more specific.


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09-12-2017, 01:42 PM

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Originally Posted by Dan White View Post
I only know otherwise directly from the horse's mouth.
Freddie had no reason to tell this individual anything other than factual info. The relay to me was that he did not learn CTE from Hal but that he did develop a thorough understanding for Small Ball and S-Bob. I don't think it's a secret.
Freddie, I'm sure, is very accommodating and I hope that we meet and discuss Hal's work one day. I have already expressed that to him. If, in fact, he does teach CTE, then call him and get the info or just try and meet up with him. Then compare what you learn to what I have unraveled over a ten year plus period in studying Hal's work.
I have no reason to speak with a forked tongue!

Stan Shuffett

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09-12-2017, 01:59 PM

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Originally Posted by Dan White View Post
Stan, I really don't know what you are asking me, honestly. If you are referring to the multiple outcome angles from the same visual (aka, the mystery) then yes, that is what I was referring to. I didn't think I was saying anything new and wasn't trying to elicit anything new. You said it will be in your book so fine.

If you are talking about something else then you'll have to be more specific.
That's it alright. I just know why that you are touting another system as essentially having known CCBs across the board. Therefore, why is it such a mystery for me to have known CCBs across a small number of perceptions? Do you see the contradiction or I am missing something?

Stan Shuffett
I'm a pin ball wizzard! Lol

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