whats the call?
- Thread starter magix
- Start date
magix said:
Table is open until a called shot is made. He can't call the 6 and play safe at the same time. He has to make up his mind.
right
He can call safe and pocket the ball but should not call the shot too.
Not sure about VNEA but for BCA if he did not make it clear he was calling a safety the opossing player can require him to shoot again.
He can call safe and pocket the ball but should not call the shot too.
Not sure about VNEA but for BCA if he did not make it clear he was calling a safety the opossing player can require him to shoot again.
magix said:
VNEA Rules
C. OPEN TABLE
The table is ?open? when the choice of groups (stripes or solids) has not yet been
determined. When the table is open, it is legal to hit a solid first to make a stripe or
vice versa. Note: The table is always open immediately after the break shot. When
the table is open it is legal to hit any solid or stripe or the 8-ball first in the process of
pocketing the called stripe or solid. On an open table, all pocketed balls remain pocketed.
The choice of stripes or solids is not determined on the break even if balls are
made from only one or both groups. THE TABLE IS ALWAYS OPEN IMMEDIATELY
AFTER THE BREAK SHOT. The choice of group is determined only when a player
legally pockets a called object ball after the break shot.
magix said:
4.10 CHOICE OF GROUP
The choice of stripes or solids is not determined on the break even if balls are made from only one or both groups, because the table is always open immediately after the break shot. The choice of group is determined only when a player legally pockets a called object ball after the break shot.
If the groups have been determined and the player mistakenly shoots at and pockets a ball of the group, the opponent must call a foul on him before he takes his next shot. If he fails to do so, the player automatically takes over the group of balls (solids or stripes) at which he has been shooting during this inning.
4.12 ?SAFETY? SHOT
For tactical reasons, a player may choose to pocket an obvious object ball and also discontinue a turn at the table by declaring ?safety? in advance. A safety shot is defined as a legal shot. If the shooting player intends to play safe by pocketing an obvious object ball, then prior to the shot, the shooter must declare a ?safety? to the opponent. It is the shooter?s responsibility to make the opponent aware of the intended safety shot. If this is not done, and one of the shooter?s object balls is pocketed, the shooter will be required to shoot again. Any ball pocketed on a safety shot remains pocketed.
http://www.bca-pool.com/play/tournaments/rules/rls_8bl.shtml
edit: I posted BCA rules, but they don't appear to be much different then VNEA in this situation.
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pooltchr said:
No, that is not the case. You can't call a ball AND play safe and ONLY a called shot counts.
This situation is identical to making a ball on the break, calling the 10 in the side and it goes in the corner. The table is still open and it's not your turn.
I remember being in the same position "B". My opponent then told me that I could'nt do that. So I called the conveinor and he said I couldnt safety while pocketing a ball after the dry break. Sounds like bullshit to me but thats what happened. VNEA. I have not come across this situation in my BCA league yet. Unfortunately in some of the pool leagues there are many grey area that may not be covered in the rule book. I always thought that there should be no problem with a safety after the break while potting a ball. Hope this helps. Ask your league conveinor on this situation.
Either the ball counts and he continues shooting or the safety counts and the table is open. Pick one.
Isn't there an old saying about having and eating cake? :thumbup:
In all seriousness Jude has to be right. Even on a open table you must call a ball and pocket. If you call safety you aren't calling the pocket.
In all seriousness Jude has to be right. Even on a open table you must call a ball and pocket. If you call safety you aren't calling the pocket.
TheNewSharkster said:
Its a widely known (BCA and VNEA) rule to be able to pocket a ball and give up your turn by calling safe before the shot. Why would the fact that the table is open at the time make any difference? I couldn't find that in the rule book.
desmocourtney said:
You're sorta mixing it up. The difference is, the shooter wants to pocket a ball and choose a group AND play safe. Determining solids & stripes is only done on a called shot. That's it. Safeties are not called shots.
Jude Rosenstock said:
I am not saying you are wrong but where is the rule that says that?
desmocourtney said:
There is no safety rule specific to when the table is open. There is a safety rule. There is an open table rule. That's it.
magix said:
The Open Table rule covers this scenario. Only a called shot can determine group. That's it. You wanna think otherwise, good luck to you in life.
The only variation of rules that would allow a player to continue shooting would be slop rules (i.e. APA).
Jude Rosenstock said:
why the personel attack?you know jude you just might be wrong this time.there might not be a rule to cover this and the best we got is thats just the way it is.and jude just cause you don't know the answer you don't have to be a smart azz.