Learn to win?

3

3RAILKICK

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
:confused:Is this a crazy question? Did you have to learn to win?

Was there something specific that allowed you to get out of your own way?

Did you progress from a 'dead money' mind set to being competitive to being a threat to win every time you played? I'm not talking about gambling-but rather tournament or league play.

When and how did it become OK to win. Why wasn't it OK to win? Did you reevaluate the 'gotta go" mentality of low percentage shots and adopt instead a 'how to win from here' approach?, possibly including two-way shots that yield a safety if you miss but shape if you make it.

Did some big bright light bulb come on for you?

Thanks

3railkick

my bulb is dim:confused:
 
pooltchr

pooltchr

Prof. Billiard Instructor
Silver Member
When you stop thinking about winning, and start thinking about playing, you will be well on your way.

Thinking about winning is one of the best ways I know of to lose.

Steve
 
K

kryptonite9

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Absolutely you have to learn to win at every level. Once you win you can then move to the next level. Alot of players play good enough to have the ability to win, but never do. They play perfect until a mistake, then fall apart. For me gambling has taught me to level my emotions and keep a positive attitude for the most part. In tournament play you can get mad and effect your game with little penality. When gambling you better learn to control this or you will loose alot of money. I am not playing much now but my attitude and ability to grind it out has helped me cash in more tournaments. Any player can win when playing great, the great ones win while playing bad.
 
jrt30004

jrt30004

just jokin' around
Silver Member
pooltchr said:
When you stop thinking about winning, and start thinking about playing, you will be well on your way.

Thinking about winning is one of the best ways I know of to lose.

Steve
Click to expand...

with all due respect to a certified teacher, i have to disagree. if you're not thinking about winning, you're thinking about losing. i used to play in my leagues thinking about just wanting to hang in with this player or that player. enter tournaments and think about just being able to play well enough to get by a few rounds. and that was all centered on thinking about my playing. how is my stroke? have i worked hard enough on my drills? have i practiced the shots that give me trouble? i have in the last year developed a mantra that i say not only to myself, but to the team i captain and to every player on every team i play with - "step on thier throats and kill them". all i think about is is beating my opponent. when i am home at night and thinking and visualizing and mentally preparing and practicing i see myself winning. and since i have adapted this way i have won more than i have lost, in league and tournaments and recently playing for small money. yes it's true you have to play the table more than you have to play your opponent but even that is somewhat flawed. if you know your opponent has a hard time with a long tough kick and you are forced to leave him a safe, you must try to play your opponent and leave him a shot that is tough for him. it goes back to the book The Art of War, "all battles are won or lost before they are fought". if you prepare only to play or only to compete, that is all you will do. if you prepare to win that is what you will do.
 
corvette1340

corvette1340

www.EpawnMarket.com
Silver Member
I think half of it is natural and half comes from learning. If you are born a winner then you are gonna succeed in pretty much anything you do. Ie..If I'm good at one thing then I'm gonna do the things necessary to win at another.

You can learn the steps to becoming a more consistent winner in almost everything you do. I'm not the best pool player in the world, in fact probably a c player, but I book around 80% winners when I play because I've learned how to match up and slow play, sand bag, etc...when people are watching.

The main thing to being a winner is confidence. If you believe that you have the best of it in anything whether it be pool, golf, work related, etc...then you have a huge advantage over your opponent.

The next time you bet on a pool match that is "even" on paper. Look at which person is the most excited about the match up, ie..which person "thinks" they have the best of it. That is who you should bet on.
 
W

WoodyJ

Sacred Cow=Best Hamburger
Gold Member
Silver Member
pooltchr said:
When you stop thinking about winning, and start thinking about playing, you will be well on your way.

Thinking about winning is one of the best ways I know of to lose.

Steve
Click to expand...

I agree.

Just concentrate on playing your game at your own rhythm while you are at the table; and, when it's your opponent's turn, be ready to pounce out of your chair the instant your opponent gives you a turn at the table.

In general, I try not to speak while I'm playing and keep the following thoughts in my mind:

- The only thing that's important is the next time I hit the ball.
- No unforced errors.
- Play the percentages (e.g., if I think my chance of making a shot is not at least 80+%, then I'll play a safety or a harder 2-way shot, if available).
- Never give up.

If you loose, so be it because you hopefully made your opponent earn their win. Congratulate your opponent, analyze your mistakes (if any) and adjust your game accordingly and then move on and have more fun.
 
gpeezy

gpeezy

for sale!
A good book that discusses this is the Pro Book. It talks about status and letting go. It's all about learning to apply your best game in the 'Spotlight'. Spotlight play for a lot of people causes some anxiety which will cause them to dog their play. Also losing in the spotlight when "you were supposed to win can be brutal also". Part of learning to win is to know your situation and but not letting it affect you. A seasoned player is a guy that has learned to win. Kind of a 'been there, done that, and I know what I have to do' and then doing it.
 
Big Perm

Big Perm

1pkt 14.1 8 Banks 9 10
Silver Member
Yes, learning to win is imperative.....winning breeds winning....or something like that....it gives you the confidence and knowledge to know you can close the deal.....

While champions do think of winning and take it very seriously, most are at their best when their focus is in the moment......focusing on execution, while tracking results, will get you far....focusing on just results doesn't often provide that consistent winning edge.....focus on execution - stable stance, smooth stroke, perfect aim....boom, the ball falls....
 
Tom In Cincy

Tom In Cincy

AKA SactownTom
Silver Member
To me, winning is a byproduct of execution. When you play well, winning will happen. But, also your opponent can play well and winning will come to them.

When you can turn your practice routines into executions, your game will improve. When your game improves your winning percentage will increase. When your winning percentage increases, your confidence level will increase, when your confidence level increases... no matter who you play or what Mantra they have, it is very difficult to beat 'near flawless execution'

Trust what you know, always go through your pre-shot routine and always accept the results.

Winning comes to those that prepare. Preparing to win is done with hard work and practice. What have you done to make sure you are going to shoot better next time you go to the table to complete?
 
pooltchr

pooltchr

Prof. Billiard Instructor
Silver Member
WoodyJ said:
I agree.

Just concentrate on playing your game at your own rhythm while you are at the table; and, when it's your opponent's turn, be ready to pounce out of your chair the instant your opponent gives you a turn at the table.

In general, I try not to speak while I'm playing and keep the following thoughts in my mind:

- The only thing that's important is the next time I hit the ball.
- No unforced errors.
- Play the percentages (e.g., if I think my chance of making a shot is not at least 80+%, then I'll play a safety or a harder 2-way shot, if available).
- Never give up.

If you loose, so be it because you hopefully made your opponent earn their win. Congratulate your opponent, analyze your mistakes (if any) and adjust your game accordingly and then move on and have more fun.
Click to expand...

Exactly the point I was trying to make. If you are thinking about winning, your mind is on the outcome of the match. If that is where your mind is, it can't possibly be focused on the job at hand, which is making the shot in front of you. And if you aren't focused on making the shot in front of you, your odds of winning decrease drastically.

I remember my grandfather telling me if you save your pennies, the dollars will come. Same thing here. Focus on playing your best on every shot, and the wins will come.

Steve
 
W

WoodyJ

Sacred Cow=Best Hamburger
Gold Member
Silver Member
jrt30004 said:
with all due respect to a certified teacher, i have to disagree. if you're not thinking about winning, you're thinking about losing. i used to play in my leagues thinking about just wanting to hang in with this player or that player. enter tournaments and think about just being able to play well enough to get by a few rounds. and that was all centered on thinking about my playing. how is my stroke? have i worked hard enough on my drills? have i practiced the shots that give me trouble? i have in the last year developed a mantra that i say not only to myself, but to the team i captain and to every player on every team i play with - "step on thier throats and kill them". all i think about is is beating my opponent. when i am home at night and thinking and visualizing and mentally preparing and practicing i see myself winning. and since i have adapted this way i have won more than i have lost, in league and tournaments and recently playing for small money. yes it's true you have to play the table more than you have to play your opponent but even that is somewhat flawed. if you know your opponent has a hard time with a long tough kick and you are forced to leave him a safe, you must try to play your opponent and leave him a shot that is tough for him. it goes back to the book The Art of War, "all battles are won or lost before they are fought". if you prepare only to play or only to compete, that is all you will do. if you prepare to win that is what you will do.
Click to expand...

When I was younger I used to think along the same lines. Helped me to have a tough mental attitude and use the adrenaline rush to my advantage many many times (i.e., I would think over and over -- hate, stomp, kick, kill, ...) Kinda reminds me of the old Conan the Barbarian movie where a young Arnold was asked what turned him on (and he said something like), "Crushing your enemy, burning their village and hearing the wails and lamentations of the women."

However, I've found over the years that it's a whole lot more fun and more intimidating to opponents to just be confident in your abilities, smile, show no weakness (such as anger), be patient and then crush them when they make an unforced error.
 
paksat

paksat

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Just stop giving a sh*t in short...

It's pool, it's not like you bet your familys life on the game.

When a person learns to shoot for fun and nothing but fun, the game becomes much easier and enjoyable.

Seems stupid simple, but i'd say 8 out of 10 serious pool players don't even have this thought enter their mind during competition. They are so focused on the job at hand that that is exactly what it becomes.... a job.
 
m79a

m79a

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
This is a very interesting subject to me and there have been some great points made. I struggle in tourneys, I have know idea why. I can win and do win most of the time gambling. Of course there is a big difference because you can choose who to gamble with and the spot if there is to be one. In a tourney, if it's a handicap, which is what I play in most of the time you have no power over either of these things. I guess it's just a confidence factor with me. With most who gamble and are any good at it, are not going to gamble with someone unless they are pretty sure they can win.
 
jrt30004

jrt30004

just jokin' around
Silver Member
WoodyJ said:
When I was younger I used to think along the same lines. Helped me to have a tough mental attitude and use the adrenaline rush to my advantage many many times (i.e., I would think over and over -- hate, stomp, kick, kill, ...) Kinda reminds me of the old Conan the Barbarian movie where a young Arnold was asked what turned him on (and he said something like), "Crushing your enemy, burning their village and hearing the wails and lamentations of the women."

However, I've found over the years that it's a whole lot more fun and more intimidating to opponents to just be confident in your abilities, smile, show no weakness (such as anger), be patient and then crush them when they make an unforced error.
Click to expand...

make no mistake, i never mentioned anger, or hate. yes i use the annalogy to step on someone'e throat, to shut them down, don't let them breathe, don't let them up. but i don't hate my opponent. i have earned the nickname evil amoung my friends and team mates because before i play i match i can have everyone in a thirty foot radius belly laughing but once it's time to play everything changes. i don't want to talk to you, i could care less about your kids or your family, my girlfriend isn't someone i readily recognize in the crowd. and the thing people notice the most, the look on my face changes. at 5'10" 320 lbs. covered with tattoos and piercings i am not the friendliest looking person to begin with, but let a match start and i have very few people wanting to ask if they can borrow the chalk from my table. everything i mentioned was about being confident, knowing you can beat someone before you break the balls. and if you can't (ie a money game) don't play. again from the art of war and simmilar to what vette said in his post about booking winners based on match up. and let me say i am not young at 38, i know i am not 50 or 60 but almost 40 isn't a kid, and i still think like this. i was taught from a young age losing isn't good. i hate this soft assed society we are cultivating. everyone makes the team, everyone gets a trophy for trying. f*ck that s*it. you don't get rewarded for mediocrity in life when you're older it should not happen when you are younger. we are raising a generation of sissy assed losers who are going to look around when they are in a tough spot and not know what to do. you bet your ass if i'm in competition i'm there to win. and if i don't i am not happy. and if people think this sounds silly i give a s*it less. ask a pro at anything what they think of thier competition. you think in the middle ot the supperbowl tom brady thought eli manning was a swell guy. i'll bet more than a few bucks no. he thought someone on the d needs to break the f*ck in two. before and after the game it's probobly different, but in the heat of things i'm pretty sure that's about right.
 
Fatboy

Fatboy

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
jrt30004 said:
make no mistake, i was taught from a young age losing isn't good. i hate this soft assed society we are cultivating. everyone makes the team, everyone gets a trophy for trying. f*ck that s*it. you don't get rewarded for mediocrity in life when you're older it should not happen when you are younger. we are raising a generation of sissy assed losers who are going to look around when they are in a tough spot and not know what to do. you bet your ass if i'm in competition i'm there to win. and if i don't i am not happy. and if people think this sounds silly i give a s*it less. ask a pro at anything what they think of thier competition. you think in the middle ot the supperbowl tom brady thought eli manning was a swell guy. i'll bet more than a few bucks no. he thought someone on the d needs to break the f*ck in two. before and after the game it's probobly different, but in the heat of things i'm pretty sure that's about right.
Click to expand...


I agree, if you "like" your opponent you will find a way to lose.
 
A

accustatsfan

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
pooltchr said:
Exactly the point I was trying to make. If you are thinking about winning, your mind is on the outcome of the match. If that is where your mind is, it can't possibly be focused on the job at hand, which is making the shot in front of you. And if you aren't focused on making the shot in front of you, your odds of winning decrease drastically.

I remember my grandfather telling me if you save your pennies, the dollars will come. Same thing here. Focus on playing your best on every shot, and the wins will come.

Steve
Click to expand...

Great thoughts. I like the concept if you don't execute this shot you won't win. I don't know how many times I would run out when I wasn't thinking about it but not run out a layout because I figured it was to easy.

I always hear about "mantras" does somebody have an example?
 
ceebee

ceebee

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I have found that WINNING can be a frame of mind. Running a rack of 9-Ball cam become as ordinary as walking. It can also be a barrier big as a mountain for some.

Confidence is omnipotent. Without confidence, you are waiting for someone to let you win...

Good Luck
 
P

pvc lou

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
here's a book to read

3RAILKICK said:
:confused:Is this a crazy question? Did you have to learn to win?

Was there something specific that allowed you to get out of your own way?

Did you progress from a 'dead money' mind set to being competitive to being a threat to win every time you played? I'm not talking about gambling-but rather tournament or league play.

When and how did it become OK to win. Why wasn't it OK to win? Did you reevaluate the 'gotta go" mentality of low percentage shots and adopt instead a 'how to win from here' approach?, possibly including two-way shots that yield a safety if you miss but shape if you make it.

Did some big bright light bulb come on for you?

Thanks

3railkick

my bulb is dim:confused:
Click to expand...

try this book: "the Inner Game of Tennis"
 
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