color of money "balabushka"

desertshark · Dec 7, 2012

I know the cue in the movie was a Joss and the reproduction model number is N7.
But does balabushka make a similar cue? I saw a kind of the same one but not detailed enough to actually compare...

deanoc · Dec 7, 2012

george balabushka never made a cue anything like the movie cue

he died over 30 years ago and no one now makes balabushkas

many copy or tribute his designs

the closest thing to a balabushka would be barry szamboti,son of gus szamboti another great legendary cue maker

bob owen,tim sccruggs,paul mottey and several others made similar cues

desertshark · Dec 7, 2012

So the Balabushka's on the market now are not legit, just name badged?

Like Von Dutch, Sailor Jerry and Ed Hardy??

Chopdoc · Dec 7, 2012

desertshark said:
So the Balabushka's on the market now are not legit, just name badged?

Like Von Dutch, Sailor Jerry and Ed Hardy??

The name/signature is licensed. That's all. They are Balabushka brand, not Balabushka made. And they are indeed still made. Adam/Helmstetter of Japan made them for many years, they are now made in China from what I read. The Adam ones generally have a good reputation but tend to be overpriced because of the Blabushka name.

Occasionally we will see somebody insisting their Asian Balabushka is a "real" Balabushka.

As for the JOSS movie cue, I have never seen any "cheap" reproductions of it, though there are JOSS clones out of China I just have not seen that model copied. The JOSS movie cue was not meant to look like a Balabushka, only to stand in for one.

.

.

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cajunfats · Dec 7, 2012

Balabushka

If someone wants to have the closest to a true Balabushka, get Pete Tascarella to make you a cue. Since there is a possibility Pete still utilizes some of George's original equipment, you get the closest proxy to an Original.

However, with all that gobbledeygook I just wrote, buy a Tascarella and have a Great Cue from a Great Cuemaker in his own right.

cajunfats,
doesn't own a tasc,...but dreams of one.

desertshark · Dec 7, 2012

Chopdoc said:
The name/signature is licensed. That's all. They are Balabushka brand, not Balabushka made. And they are indeed still made. Adam/Helmstetter of Japan made them for many years, they are now made in China from what I read. The Adam ones generally have a good reputation but tend to be overpriced because of the Blabushka name.

Occasionally we will see somebody insisting their Asian Balabushka is a "real" Balabushka.

As for the JOSS movie cue, I have never seen any "cheap" reproductions of it, though there are JOSS clones out of China I just have not seen that model copied. The JOSS movie cue was not meant to look like a Balabushka, only to stand in for one.

Ok. That last sentence totally explains it all.

Thanks chopdoc, I should've just asked you in the first place lol

I'm not looking to get one I was just curious and still not too familiar with the names, makes and cue heritage. Still learning...

EagleMan · Dec 7, 2012

desertshark said:
I know the cue in the movie was a Joss and the reproduction model number is N7.
But does balabushka make a similar cue? I saw a kind of the same one but not detailed enough to actually compare...

I'm about to get in trouble here but trust me I mean NO DISRESPECT to custom cue makers and/or very high end production cues.

But pool cues can serve two masters. They can be and many are true works of art containing extremely expensive components parts....including DIAMONDS...like real diamonds if you want them.

Then they can be the tool used to pocket balls on a pool table.

I've just seen TOO many top players who can beat you like a rented mule with a WARPED house cue to believe that "the cue makes the player" or anything remotely resembling that.

TRUE different cues hit differently and different people like different hits but that is often just a personal preference and there is no particular type of hit that is necessarily better than any other type of hit.

And it simply isn't that difficult to produce a production cue with a given balance characteristic.

I happen to own an Adams Limited Edition cue. I've had it for a decade and like it a lot. There have been numerous Balabushka threads like this and LOTS of owners share my favorable views on SOME of these cues including Six Pack. Manwon and many others.

I happen to have swapped out the shafts...TWO came with the original cue so it was not nearly as "over-priced" as some suggest...for an OB but I recently played some with the originals and they have remained DEAD STRAIGHT after all these years and having been exposed to hugely varying climate conditions.

And it looks GREAT.

Bottom line, if you think a high end cue is going to make a big difference in your game, I think you have a disappointed ahead of you.

If you want a WORK OF ART to own and be proud of for the rest of your life...that is TOTALLY COOL.

But there is just flat nothing wrong with MY Balabushka LTD Edition cue. It looks really good...feels good...hits the way I want it to.

Next.

(-:

RFranklin · Dec 7, 2012

Tributes

Eagleman, I know what you are saying about the Adams/Balbushkas because I have one. Quality-wise I would put them someplace with Joss and Schon. I know the Schon loyalists will take issue with this but you have to admit the cnc points of Schon's (and Joss) are not nearly as attractive as the Adams/Balabushkas. I will say that Schon metal ringwork is substantially better than the Adams cues. My Adams have shifted and and you can feel the transitions through the finish. I have only played with a Joss plain jane so I cant speak to their ringwork. Having said all of that, I think at a certain price, most butts play very similarly. I play with an LD shaft and have tried it on all three makes with little difference. At the end of the day, you can have a fairly high level production or a entry to mid level custom. They are all just tools. We choose to dress them up.

desi2960 · Dec 8, 2012

can of worms

it is my understanding Balabushka, did not MAKE cues he assembled cues using titlist from 1959-66, burton spain blanks 1966-71, gus szamboti blanks 1971-75.
today if a builder uses someone else's blank, he gets his ass ragged for not being a real builder.

i still want one !!!!!!!!!

Chopdoc · Dec 8, 2012

EagleMan said:
I'm about to get in trouble here but trust me I mean NO DISRESPECT to custom cue makers and/or very high end production cues.

But pool cues can serve two masters. They can be and many are true works of art containing extremely expensive components parts....including DIAMONDS...like real diamonds if you want them.

Then they can be the tool used to pocket balls on a pool table.

I've just seen TOO many top players who can beat you like a rented mule with a WARPED house cue to believe that "the cue makes the player" or anything remotely resembling that.

TRUE different cues hit differently and different people like different hits but that is often just a personal preference and there is no particular type of hit that is necessarily better than any other type of hit.

And it simply isn't that difficult to produce a production cue with a given balance characteristic.

I happen to own an Adams Limited Edition cue. I've had it for a decade and like it a lot. There have been numerous Balabushka threads like this and LOTS of owners share my favorable views on SOME of these cues including Six Pack. Manwon and many others.

I happen to have swapped out the shafts...TWO came with the original cue so it was not nearly as "over-priced" as some suggest...for an OB but I recently played some with the originals and they have remained DEAD STRAIGHT after all these years and having been exposed to hugely varying climate conditions.

And it looks GREAT.

Bottom line, if you think a high end cue is going to make a big difference in your game, I think you have a disappointed ahead of you.

If you want a WORK OF ART to own and be proud of for the rest of your life...that is TOTALLY COOL.

But there is just flat nothing wrong with MY Balabushka LTD Edition cue. It looks really good...feels good...hits the way I want it to.

Next.

(-:

I don't think anybody here was trashing on Adam Balabushka cues, but you seem very sensitive about it.

They are (were) Adam cues, of typical (very good) Adam quality. That said, the Balabushka line is in fact notoriously more expensive even though one can get virtually the same playing cue from a much less expensive cue in the Adam line.

I have several "vintage" Adam cues myself. And I would like an Adam Balabushka, an older one, but I don't have one yet. Why? The price. All of my Adam cues were bought for very, very low prices. It is extremely difficult to find one with the Balabushka name on it for such a low price. The name just attracts too much attention and helps them hold stronger value...in spite of the fact that they aren't really any better than numerous other Adam cues.

But in point of fact, JOSS and Dan Janes do still make sharp pointed cues. Their main production cues have rounded CNC points, but they do still make customs with sharp points. Schon, as you point out, does not, not even on their "customs".

You seem very sensitive about the Adam and/or Balabushka cues. I think I can understand why. I think they have more fans than you realize. Just look at the success of the cue line.

Equally, some others seem to be sensitive in a different way. Any time the cues are mentioned they have to get on a high and mighty horse about the real Balabushka cues. I really think it's a bit over the top. I don't think anybody really tries to compare the Adam cues with real Balabushka cues. Frankly, when people feel the need to rub it in everybody's noses about how many Bushkas they have had or played with it is eminently rude.

.
.

classiccues · Dec 8, 2012

desi2960 said:
it is my understanding Balabushka, did not MAKE cues he assembled cues using titlist from 1959-66, burton spain blanks 1966-71, gus szamboti blanks 1971-75.
today if a builder uses someone else's blank, he gets his ass ragged for not being a real builder.

i still want one !!!!!!!!!

Well can of worms or not.. then you need to throw Rambow under the same bus, as well as Frank Paradise and a slew of others. Rambows cues are infact titlist cues he got from Brunswick, some are modified from an already two piece Brunswick stock Hoppe. Paradise didn't build any blanks for his pointed cues either, and got them from many people including Spain AND he used Sampaio parts.

George could not fabriacate the short splice in his already crammed space, so he purchased the best available. Lets see if anyone on this list gave a crap about the fact George didn't build his own blanks.

Irving Crane, Lassiter, Balsis, Mosconi, Caras, Mizerak, Hopkins, Liscotti, Martin, Cicero Murphey, Dallas West, and I am sure I am missing a few. Think they cared? Do you think George would have cared that he couldn't pass the "test" for one of the organizations, no disrespect intended to them BTW. The guy made the best cues, used by the best players (and they paid for them), in his era. I would love to see the next closest custom cuemaker claim a similar list in this era.

JV

desertshark · Dec 8, 2012

I was just curious. For one, I'm a car/motorcycle guy. Once a movie gets big there are companies making repops of the original. Gone in 60 seconds spawned Shelby with an authentic Elenor and a lot of aftermarket companies pushing car kits. Easyrider promoted Paughco to have a complete captain America refresh and build kit as well as other companies.

I was just curious if this was the case seeing as Joss made the cue, Cruise called it by a different name and I've seen a lot of similar styles. I also saw the poolhall junkies movies and the cue used in that movie by Mars Calahan looked like a repop from color of money.

I like my Falcon since I've weighted it. I like the Joss butt I have enough to have ordered a shaft for it and I like my break cue too.

Trust me, I'm not that good that I can justify spending a few grand on a cue and then go actually use it without being paranoid of messing it up or dropping it. I'm not in a high enough tax bracket that I can afford those luxuries yet.

I would be ok dropping up to 700 on a good player, but I want to play pool with it. Not mount it on the wall and look at it. Seeing as how I had to downgrade my life since the economy crash, I don't have a pool table so I'm still at the mercy of pool halls and bars.

desi2960 · Dec 8, 2012

classic

George could not fabriacate the short splice in his already crammed space, so he purchased the best available. Lets see if anyone on this list gave a crap about the fact George didn't build his own blanks.
i do not understand the reference to short splice, his cues were full splice cues

Chopdoc · Dec 8, 2012

I thought he cut many of the full splice cues and put a handle in. I also thought that at least some of the blanks he used were in fact short splice, at least later on. Correct me if I am wrong.

.

kvinbrwr · Dec 8, 2012

Chopdoc said:
I thought he cut many of the full splice cues and put a handle in. I also thought that at least some of the blanks he used were in fact short splice, at least later on. Correct me if I am wrong.

.

Gus only provided shorties. Many of the Spain blanks George used were short splice. And yes, George converted some full splice cues.

Kevin

desi2960 · Dec 8, 2012

i probably am wrong

i was under the imperession, no one would cut a full splice titlist, to make a short splice.
once again i was wrong

Poolhalljunkie · Dec 8, 2012

Color of money cue

desertshark said:
I know the cue in the movie was a Joss and the reproduction model number is N7.
But does balabushka make a similar cue? I saw a kind of the same one but not detailed enough to actually compare...

The original color of money cue was a J-18, the most recent production was labeled N-7. I have seen two versions of the J-18 and even a few custom reproductions by Dan Janes. I have owned a J-18 it was since cue regret selling it.

kvinbrwr · Dec 8, 2012

desi2960 said:
i was under the imperession, no one would cut a full splice titlist, to make a short splice.
once again i was wrong

For one thing, you have to push the cue "up" so far to lathe it down to get the points straightish that you would have to add to the butt anyway. Plus many build to a formula (Gina for example) that includes a maple handle, so that's just the way they do it. Some leave them spliced into the handle, some convert the whole deal into a shortie.

George did some conversions where he left the cue full, I don't really know if he ever turned a full splice into a shortie or not but I do know he built plenty of cues out of shortie blanks.

Kevin

Chopdoc · Dec 8, 2012

OK. That's what I thought. I remember reading there was something unique about his A joint and buzz ring arrangement.

I also remember reading something about him cutting full splice blanks to put in an A joint.

.

kvinbrwr · Dec 8, 2012

Chopdoc said:
OK. That's what I thought. I remember reading there was something unique about his A joint and buzz ring arrangement.

I also remember reading something about him cutting full splice blanks to put in an A joint.

.

Yup he used a butterfly pin for the A joint that is used to (x-ray) distinguish his cues.

Here's a Gina, that started as a full-splice that now has a maple handle in there:

Kevin

color of money "balabushka"

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