Lessons (long)

nyjoe14.1

nyjoe14.1

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I recently contacted Cue-U in Rockford, IL to find out what the traning program entailed. They told me that there were 3 different levels and a little of what each level consited of. I then explaned that I was not a beginner and that the level one class seemed 101 at best and I would be paying $600+ to be tought what I already know. Of couse that didn’t go over so well lol. I asked if I could simply skip that class and go on to the second or third level and they told me that it would not be possible because I wouldn’t have “key knoledge” provided in the first instalment. When I asked what that was they gave several reasons, as I can’t remember what they were verbatim I will some it up: “you won’t know our terminology”. I’m hoping there was more to it than this but that is what I took away from this part of the conversation.

Next I asked them what kind of improvement I could hope to see if I went through the class. At this point they responded w/ a lot of vague generalizations like “you’ll get out of it what you put in” and “that depends on your practice after the classes”. Ok now normally I would be ok w/ this but your looking at well over $1800 for all 3 classes, which is a lot for me to invest w/ out some kind of guarantee. In truth this was the third instructor/instructors that I have contacted and not one would give any type of assurances as to what improvement if any would be seen by taking there lessons.

Finally (because by this point im very leery of the whole thing) I ask for references. I’m thinking that maybe I can talk to some of there former students and get an idea about what they took away from the classes. Of course this was met by “that’s confidential”. They do have a results page on there web site but its only about two dozen one liners. One sentence saying how great the school is, their initials, and the state they were from.

Has anyone gone to this school or one like it? And if so what kind of results did you see?
 
nyjoe14.1 said:
In truth this was the third instructor/instructors that I have contacted and not one would give any type of assurances as to what improvement if any would be seen by taking there lessons.

Finally (because by this point im very leery of the whole thing) I ask for references. I’m thinking that maybe I can talk to some of there former students and get an idea about what they took away from the classes.
Click to expand...

nyjoe14.1...I will GUARANTEE significant improvement, provided you practice what I show you, the WAY I show you (this is probably close to what Cue U told you). No school or instructor can guarantee you will become a better player. Only you can put into practice the new knowledge you take away from a lesson experience. Like anything, there is period of adjustment, to assimilate and/or replace old knowledge with new knowledge. There are several pool schools, and many excellent instructors out there. A very well known school is continually positively reviewed here, and many posters are former students, who have been through the school, either in their home facility, or at road show pool schools around the country. Myself, I offer a guarantee of satisfaction at the end of a personal private lesson, or there is no charge. Keep in mind, that a short term private lesson (2-4 hrs) is not the same experience as a 3-day, 8-hour-per-day pool school. But is quite valuable to almost all students nonetheless. References abound...all you have to do is ask. Good luck in your search!

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com
 
nyjoe14.1 said:
... In truth this was the third instructor/instructors that I have contacted and not one would give any type of assurances as to what improvement if any would be seen by taking their lessons.
...
Has anyone gone to this school or one like it? And if so what kind of results did you see?
Click to expand...
No one can really guarantee what sort of results you will see. Different people learn differently. For a view of lessons from both the student's and instructor's point of view see http://www.sfbilliards.com/articles/2005-09.pdf.

Your post doesn't make it clear what you want to learn or improve on. What I can teach is discussed in the articles http://www.sfbilliards.com/articles/BD_articles.html and http://www.onthebreaknews.com/JewettIndex.htm and Byrne's books, but what I often end up teaching is fundamental mechanics.
 
You are right $ 1800 is a lot of money. Does that cover food,lodging,travel expenses there? I assume from your name(nyjoe) you don't live in IL. I haven't ever taken any lessons but I want to cause I think it would help. I am just afraid these type of places will overload me with too much at one time in a short time and I will not be able to retain it all. I would love it if they were in my town! I would go a couple of times a week.
 
nyjoe14.1,

I've had several types of lessons from various instructors. Some emphasized mechanics, some others emphasized shots and position play.

There is no "Magic Lesson" in pool that will make you a world/regional/local beater right away unless you take the time to assimilate the information to work for you.

Regardless of who may have taught me something, after all these lessons, I refrained from casual play for at least a month and focused on burning into my brain what I had just learned. I would practice what I had been taught exclusively. That's what they mean when they say, "You get out of it what you put into it.".

Barbara
 
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kevin s said:
You are right $ 1800 is a lot of money. Does that cover food,lodging,travel expenses there? I assume from your name(nyjoe) you don't live in IL. I haven't ever taken any lessons but I want to cause I think it would help. I am just afraid these type of places will overload me with too much at one time in a short time and I will not be able to retain it all. I would love it if they were in my town! I would go a couple of times a week.
Click to expand...


No, that’s just the cost of the lessons. I think for that kind of money they should at least be able to tell you that if you run 3 racks of nine ball on any given night now, after there school you should be running 4 packs in the next six months or something. There should be something to back up your investment. **which in my opinion is exactly what it is.


To Bob, and Scott thanks for the heads up. Ill look into the links you provided.
 
Nyjoe14.1,

We also require all students to take our first class in mechanics before taking our second and third classes. We do this because we have yet to have a prospective student who has an accurate and consistent stroke, a consistent and efficient shooting sequence, and has good speed control. Without these, it is difficult to accurately and consistently control the cue ball.

Many students who have taken our first class felt that they already had a good stroke and expected to learn little from the class. After they have learned about mechanics in depth, and have reviewed their personal video, they were amazed to see the serious flaws they had in their mechanics. They also realize that this is why their game hadn’t been improving.

As others pointed out, taking a mechanics class will not guarantee that your game will improve. What they will all say is that after taking a class you will have the knowledge and tools needed to develop rock solid mechanics, but it’s up to you to practice what you learned in order to improve.

You should consider having your stroke evaluated by Cue U. It probably will change your mind about taking the class.
 
nyjoe14.1 said:
I recently contacted Cue-U in Rockford, IL to find out what the traning program entailed. They told me that there were 3 different levels and a little of what each level consited of. I then explaned that I was not a beginner and that the level one class seemed 101 at best and I would be paying $600+ to be tought what I already know.
<snip>
Click to expand...

Holy Canoly ... $600 per lesson and there are three of them?
I did not know pool lessons were that expensive.

I do know some players that went to pool school.
They should have stayed home and spent the money on beer and table time for all the good it did them.
I guess you can lead a horse to water .....

Here is the real way to quickly improve your game ...
Buy a $600 custom Willee cue. <grin>

Willee
 
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nyjoe14.1 said:
I recently contacted Cue-U in Rockford, IL to find out what the traning program entailed. They told me that there were 3 different levels and a little of what each level consited of. I then explaned that I was not a beginner and that the level one class seemed 101 at best and I would be paying $600+ to be tought what I already know. Of couse that didn’t go over so well lol. I asked if I could simply skip that class and go on to the second or third level and they told me that it would not be possible because I wouldn’t have “key knoledge” provided in the first instalment. When I asked what that was they gave several reasons, as I can’t remember what they were verbatim I will some it up: “you won’t know our terminology”. I’m hoping there was more to it than this but that is what I took away from this part of the conversation.

Next I asked them what kind of improvement I could hope to see if I went through the class. At this point they responded w/ a lot of vague generalizations like “you’ll get out of it what you put in” and “that depends on your practice after the classes”. Ok now normally I would be ok w/ this but your looking at well over $1800 for all 3 classes, which is a lot for me to invest w/ out some kind of guarantee. In truth this was the third instructor/instructors that I have contacted and not one would give any type of assurances as to what improvement if any would be seen by taking there lessons.

Finally (because by this point im very leery of the whole thing) I ask for references. I’m thinking that maybe I can talk to some of there former students and get an idea about what they took away from the classes. Of course this was met by “that’s confidential”. They do have a results page on there web site but its only about two dozen one liners. One sentence saying how great the school is, their initials, and the state they were from.

Has anyone gone to this school or one like it? And if so what kind of results did you see?
Click to expand...


$1800 ??? Wow.

I will charge you 1/10 of that price for those lessons and the rest of the money you can use for something else. I'll let my reputation back up teh effectiveness of my instruction. Sorry, but no lesson in pool should cost that much and I don't care who is giving the class. I have always tried to keep my instruction/coaching rates at a price where everybody can afford them.
 
Scott Lee said:
nyjoe14.1...I will GUARANTEE significant improvement, provided you practice what I show you, the WAY I show you (this is probably close to what Cue U told you). No school or instructor can guarantee you will become a better player. Only you can put into practice the new knowledge you take away from a lesson experience. Like anything, there is period of adjustment, to assimilate and/or replace old knowledge with new knowledge. There are several pool schools, and many excellent instructors out there. A very well known school is continually positively reviewed here, and many posters are former students, who have been through the school, either in their home facility, or at road show pool schools around the country. Myself, I offer a guarantee of satisfaction at the end of a personal private lesson, or there is no charge. Keep in mind, that a short term private lesson (2-4 hrs) is not the same experience as a 3-day, 8-hour-per-day pool school. But is quite valuable to almost all students nonetheless. References abound...all you have to do is ask. Good luck in your search!

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com
Click to expand...

Hi Scott please don't forget to contact me when you're planning to get near sacramento again. thanks
Sam
 
correct me if i'm wrong

the class is $650 for sixteen hours of instruction...
roughly $40/ hr.. much cheaper than most instructors charge.

nyjoe14.1 when you find a school with a guarantee please post some info.
 
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Lessons

nyjoe;

I am not an instructor. I have been a student of several top instructors. Before my first lesson I could run racks of 9 w/o a problem and at one time ran 70s and 80s in 14.1 often enough. I took lessons because I plateaued and had been away from the game for awhile. While I felt I was more advanced, we began at step one. I was surprised to realize that I had some flaws in my mechanics that were holding me back. Thats why you start at the beginning. Its necessary to identify any flaws you have and correct them because if you don't, the more advanced lessons will be worthless. An experienced instructor will identify your flaws, or weaknesses and give you tools to develope a better foundation.

You need to be a good student first. You've been given some good advice from the AZ forum instructors, and they are right. You need to accept that and start from the beginning, you will be amazed at how much some of the smallest adjustments will improve your game. Only then will you be able to properly execute some of the drills and practice routines that you will need to learn to become a better player.

I went through the same thought process that you are going through now and the best advice is to listen, if you can afford it, then do it. Or perhaps like some other posters suggest, buy another cue, which is BS, but if you believe that, I will be happy to sell you a guaranteeeeed improvement cue:)

I wish you luck, been there, done that.

Mike
 
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For $1800 I would -

Buy all the videos I could find. Then find a pro or top quality player to take lessons from more locally. I'd seriously consider Blackjacks offer if I were you.


I'd be weary to give an instructor $1800 unless they, themselves, could play at a real high level. I am a firm believer in "those that can do and those that can't coach". No offense to the local instructors here in the forums. i have no idea how they play but if somebody is going to teach me, they better play jam up.

Forcing you to buy a lower lesson is also a marketing strategy to get more money. Alot of businesses use that as a model. Like DirectTv. they force you to buy channels you do not want in order to get channels you want. I am pretty sure thats why DTV was/is illegal in Canada.

Not saying they are doing that but it is a widely used strategy to increase profits.


After thinking about it, I would decline the classes cause of them forcing you to take a lower lesson. I wonder if they would make Efren take 101 lol



Again, buy videos and pay a man like Blackjack. I think you will get far more for your cash...
 
I used to live in Illinois and was thinking about going to this school also. I probably would have but I moved away too soon. I wasn't concerned about starting with the first class, because it said the classes were not "beginner, intermediate, and advanced." I figured since there was so much personal instruction it would probably be fine.

I don't think it's entirely fair to concentrate on the "$1800 for 3 classes" point. They can't force you to take all 3 classes. If you weren't satisfied with the first one ($600), you certainly don't have to take two more. Not that it doesn't suck to lose $600, but it's better than losing $1800!!!

However, after reading your post I went to their website again, and checked out the prices again. This point really bothered me:

Students who complete a one-day pool training class may not enroll in the two-day format of a subsequent pool class and are limited to the one-day version of the later pool classes.
Click to expand...

That seems ridiculous to me, and may have really turned me off to this school if and when I return closer to home.

nyjoe, you might get better answers on this particular school if you mention its name in the title of the thread.
 
Ill charge you $5 a game hehe. Post a video I am sure mechanical problems can be explained/fixed via the web. After that it is just a battle of knowledge and your mental game. Some things if you have not figured out on your own might be taught in these classes and will be worth it. Whether it will be worth the cash or not I guess it depends on how good you honestly already are .............

Eric.
 
http://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?t=64416

Few people viewed this thread, and fewer listened to the link.

Never heard of the book (new)
Never heard of the writer (she has a Real Job)
Never listen to that Socialist National Public Radio

But if you had you would have learned the low cost way to better pool:

Dress up in drag and head for where the pros (as in pool players) hang out. For example, Amsterdam Billiards. The guys take delight in teaching beautiful women the secrets of the game and may pay for table food and drink.:D

Would more have viewed the thread if I had titled it ‘An Interview With Monica Webb’?:D
 
books, video's and live lessons

I am a buyer of books and video's. Often they are of quite a bit of help. However, the video's rarely go into enough depth in the exact areas I am interested in and the books have often been subject to seemingly minor misinterpretation which leads to major changes in results.

I have made huge strides from a single sentence maybe a half dozen times in my life, delivered face to face. Trying to assign concrete cost/benefit ratios to live lessons is a wasted effort. Consider it more like investing money. You will usually get a fair return for your dollar, you may lose some or all of it, and you may get a return beyond your dreams. The return may come from the overall day's session or as little as a single sentence or phrase. Regardless, you have to take a lesson to have any chance of benefiting from it.

A series of lessons, each one lasting no longer than many individual pool lessons made me a Master CNE when there were less than two thousand in the world. Those in the computer industry know what that was worth. I was also fortunate to have almost all great instructors so I learned far more than what was in the lesson plans. To put the cost of the pool lessons in perspective, total cost of these lessons was over twenty thousand dollars ten years ago.

You and you alone can decide if you can afford to invest the six hundred dollars and where you want to invest it. This is a generalization and may not apply to you but the majority of people who think they don't need a basics course are the ones most in need of it and those more than willing to take another look at basics are often the ones with sound fundamentals. Correcting one fundamental flaw, if it happens, is worth more than learning any advanced technique because a basic flaw will hold back everything in a person's game.

Hu
 
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