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View Full Version : Is Straight Pool Officially Dead?


bud green
04-02-2005, 06:42 PM
I was noticing that accu-stats hasn't taped any straight pool in a while and can't recall any mention of a US Championship 14.1 Tourney being planned.

I know there is not a lot of $$ incentive to host the event but does anyone know if any pro 14.1 events in the US are being planned? Europe seems to like the game and host events and a lot of younger players like Mika, Tony Robles, Hatch,Schmidt like the game and can run hundreds but no events seem to be lined up.

Maybe they can hold some event at the DCC, separate from the all round events, while all the talent is already there. Even if it was half assed it would be better than nothing and we can have some kind of reigning champ.

sjm
04-02-2005, 06:54 PM
I was noticing that accu-stats hasn't taped any straight pool in a while and can't recall any mention of a US Championship 14.1 Tourney being planned.

I know there is not a lot of $$ incentive to host the event but does anyone know if any pro 14.1 events in the US are being planned? Europe seems to like the game and host events and a lot of younger players like Mika, Tony Robles, Hatch,Schmidt like the game and can run hundreds but no events seem to be lined up.

Maybe they can hold some event at the DCC, separate from the all round events, while all the talent is already there. Even if it was half assed it would be better than nothing and we can have some kind of reigning champ.

The only place it isn't dead is in the NYC metropolitan area. Especially at the league level, straight pool is alive and well in NYC. You can ususally find a straight pool game if you're looking for one in the major poolrooms of NYC.

As for top pro level competition, the only events of note that I know of are the annual event in Downingtown, Pennsylvania and the NJ State Straight Pool Championships, held just a few miles outside of NYC. Both of these events always draw elite fields. Also, the Tri State tour in the Northeast has a couple of open straight pool events a year. In the last one, both Dan Darouty and Tony Robles, both of them holders of many runs of 200+, were in the field. Neither managed to win it, as dark horse Jonathan Smith, who manged 102 and out on Robles, prevailed.

The last event for which you'd likely find Accu-stats tapes is the 2000 US Open 14.1 event held in NYC. Like you, I know of no major straight pool tourneys, other than those mentioned, that are planned anytime soon.

Finally, I love your idea of doing something with straight pool at Derby City.
Our esteemed AZB forum colleague Williebetmore has often related how enthusiastic people were when Pagulayan and Schmidt squared off in straight pool during the 2003 Derby City Classic.

larrynj1
04-02-2005, 07:01 PM
jack colavita runs the nj state 14.1 championship every year at comet billiards in parsippany,nj. held in sept, last year's tournament saw lou butera, dallas west, tony robles, allen hopkins, jack colavita,bob maidhof, danny barouty, danny harriman and lots of others play for 3 days.

climbtrad
04-02-2005, 07:28 PM
Hi,

I emailed Pat Fleming at Accu-stats a few months ago and suggested he attend the NJ State Straight Pool Tournament in Sept/Oct and add some new straight pool tapes to their current inventory. Didn't hear anything from him.

It is really a shame that the game isn't played more in general and rarely if ever at the major tournament level any more. What can ya do? Guess a game that requires people to pay attention for more than five minutes at a time is too much for people these days. Wish that weren't the case but I would bet straight pool will continue it's decline.

David



I was noticing that accu-stats hasn't taped any straight pool in a while and can't recall any mention of a US Championship 14.1 Tourney being planned.

I know there is not a lot of $$ incentive to host the event but does anyone know if any pro 14.1 events in the US are being planned? Europe seems to like the game and host events and a lot of younger players like Mika, Tony Robles, Hatch,Schmidt like the game and can run hundreds but no events seem to be lined up.

Maybe they can hold some event at the DCC, separate from the all round events, while all the talent is already there. Even if it was half assed it would be better than nothing and we can have some kind of reigning champ.

bruin70
04-02-2005, 09:23 PM
i look at the bright side..........

pool(9ball) will never happen in the US,,,it'll have better fortune overseas. and overseas seems to appreciate 14.1 more than the US.

i can only hope that the rest of the world won't follow the US's flawed thinking with 9ball, and spend more time with 14.1 instead.

MrLucky
04-02-2005, 09:35 PM
I was noticing that accu-stats hasn't taped any straight pool in a while and can't recall any mention of a US Championship 14.1 Tourney being planned.

I know there is not a lot of $$ incentive to host the event but does anyone know if any pro 14.1 events in the US are being planned? Europe seems to like the game and host events and a lot of younger players like Mika, Tony Robles, Hatch,Schmidt like the game and can run hundreds but no events seem to be lined up.

Maybe they can hold some event at the DCC, separate from the all round events, while all the talent is already there. Even if it was half assed it would be better than nothing and we can have some kind of reigning champ.
We are starting a straight league at Mr CUES in Atlanta ! :D

pfduser
04-03-2005, 04:00 AM
Good question,I have not seen anybody play straight pool or even talk about it in the south.It's a shame to since it is such a highly skilled game.

TheOne
04-03-2005, 04:08 AM
The only place it isn't dead is in the NYC metropolitan area. Especially at the league level, straight pool is alive and well in NYC. You can ususally find a straight pool game if you're looking for one in the major poolrooms of NYC.

As for top pro level competition, the only events of note that I know of are the annual event in Downingtown, Pennsylvania and the NJ State Straight Pool Championships, held just a few miles outside of NYC. Both of these events always draw elite fields. Also, the Tri State tour in the Northeast has a couple of open straight pool events a year. In the last one, both Dan Darouty and Tony Robles, both of them holders of many runs of 200+, were in the field. Neither managed to win it, as dark horse Jonathan Smith, who manged 102 and out on Robles, prevailed.

The last event for which you'd likely find Accu-stats tapes is the 2000 US Open 14.1 event held in NYC. Like you, I know of no major straight pool tourneys, other than those mentioned, that are planned anytime soon.

Finally, I love your idea of doing something with straight pool at Derby City.
Our esteemed AZB forum colleague Williebetmore has often related how enthusiastic people were when Pagulayan and Schmidt squared off in straight pool during the 2003 Derby City Classic.


I have always been curious why the DCC has banks instead of straight pool as one of the main events? I suspect its for historical reasons, has anyone ever tried to get them to add straight pool or would the venue simply not be able to cope? I had never even heard of banks before this tournmanet and you hear even less about bank tournmanets than straight pool around the world.

14:1, 8 Ball and 9 Ball, that would be my pick :-)

JimS
04-03-2005, 04:41 AM
There's a straights league in Cincy and Chicago and the ole pro Sailor in Racine still teaches it.

bruin70
04-03-2005, 04:58 AM
I have always been curious why the DCC has banks instead of straight pool as one of the main events?,,,,,,,,,,
14:1, 8 Ball and 9 Ball, that would be my pick :-)

i get the impression the dcc has more gambling roots, which pretty much elimiantes 14.1 as a game of choice for fast moving money.

nail
04-03-2005, 07:11 AM
Bud Green:

"Is Straight Pool Officially Dead"?

I sure hope not. 3 out of the 4 billiard parlors here in Syracuse, NY have straight pool leagues. I know most of the members love the game, and many of them are normaly 9-ball players. The love of 14.1 in central NY may somewhat be due to the fact that this was "Babe" Cranfields' home turf. You couldn't help but fall in love with the game if you had the chance to watch him play. 14.1 is a thinking persons game and unfortunately this might be the problem. People today seem to want things faster and easier. TV tries to please their viewers, which in turn pleases their sponsers. That's to be expected. Untill 14.1 can be made viable for TV, I doubt you will see very many tournaments. Straight pool will never die for those who enjoy playing or watching a pocket pool game in its greatest form (IMO).

Nail

Williebetmore
04-03-2005, 07:23 AM
Our esteemed AZB forum colleague Williebetmore

SJM,
You are correct; I am "steamed." :) :) :) Straight pool is NOT dead, just missing from television and tournaments. It is alive and well in the hearts of serious pool players everywhere. We have a straight pool league in Indy that is somewhere around 50 years old. Every beginning player I have taught the game to prefers it over all the others. At DCC this year there were 4 professionals willing to play me to 200 for $50 to $100 (giving me a substantial spot). Either they were desperate for a small amount of cash, or they just love the opportunity to play. Johnny Archer played 4 hours of straight pool with me for FREE; he didn't have to, he just kept saying, "hey, you want to play another game." It's a beautiful game when played properly, and the history of the sport is inextricably linked to it. I foresee a comeback.

kollegedave
04-03-2005, 07:35 AM
The other reason banks is played at the DCC is the south of the United States, and particularly Kentucky, is known for bank pool. Also, I think bank pool is included for the main reason we should have more straight pool events, and that is that fewer and fewer people are capable of playing banks on a world class level. If as a community, we don't take steps to preserve less played games---banks, one-pocket, and straight pool then we are in danger of losing some, if not much, of the knowledge we have of those games.

I think this is why what Steve Booth is doing at www.onepocket.org is important. Bank pool and onepocket, more other games, are in danger of losing its history if it is not written down.

I think if would be great if straight pool could be included at the DCC, but I don't think there is room. I went a few years ago and the place was packed for the whole week.

kollegedave


I have always been curious why the DCC has banks instead of straight pool as one of the main events? I suspect its for historical reasons, has anyone ever tried to get them to add straight pool or would the venue simply not be able to cope? I had never even heard of banks before this tournmanet and you hear even less about bank tournmanets than straight pool around the world.

14:1, 8 Ball and 9 Ball, that would be my pick :-)

TheOne
04-03-2005, 08:36 AM
Just curious but since many people don't like 9 ball and many many players including pros love straight pool why are there hardly any large straight pool tournaments? I still think that the big events should dedicate one table to a high run 14:1 competition. Many tournmants used to do a similar thing in the UK (although it wasn't true straight pool). The crowd would start to get bigger whenever somebody went on a high run. Great side comp to help pass the time, only takes one table and simple to run. It might at the very least showcase 14:1 and increase its popularity :-)

MrLucky
04-03-2005, 08:52 AM
Just curious but since many people don't like 9 ball and many many players including pros love straight pool why are there hardly any large straight pool tournaments? I still think that the big events should dedicate one table to a high run 14:1 competition. Many tournmants used to do a similar thing in the UK (although it wasn't true straight pool). The crowd would start to get bigger whenever somebody went on a high run. Great side comp to help pass the time, only takes one table and simple to run. It might at the very least showcase 14:1 and increase its popularity :-)

I personally believe the answer to that is as a society we have gone from slow and steady development thinking (which is the heart of straight pool philosophy) to the "FAST and FURIOUS" age which is more the philosophy of 6 and 9 ball!!! take business it used to be build profits carefully and safely ! now as evident by ENRON and others it is do it fast by any means possible ! Hell ! you can even buy a damn "gourmet" TV dinner now from high priced chefs!!!! We no longer want to wait an hour to see the end of anything much less a pool match ! :confused: :mad:

Ken_4fun
04-03-2005, 08:58 AM
I have always been curious why the DCC has banks instead of straight pool as one of the main events? I suspect its for historical reasons, has anyone ever tried to get them to add straight pool or would the venue simply not be able to cope? I had never even heard of banks before this tournmanet and you hear even less about bank tournmanets than straight pool around the world.

14:1, 8 Ball and 9 Ball, that would be my pick :-)


BANKS is Huge in Southern Indiana, Kentucky, and Tennessee. I have heard is big in the South as well. Chicago is also known for a bank pool area, as in "Piggy Bank".

Straight pool, rightly or wrongly is thought of a NYC and Northeast game.

Regards
Ken

Jersey
04-03-2005, 09:11 AM
We are starting a straight league at Mr CUES in Atlanta ! :D

When is that starting?...was there weekend before last, didn't hear anything about it?...not saying I'm any good...but love to play it...hmm...maybe if I played more, my game would improve!?...novel idea, huh?... :D

can't believe Accu-Stats wasn't at the NJ Championship...Colavita is well known, and has been carrying the torch of 14:1 forever...and there are big names at the Jersey event?...go figure...yet another problem for the Billiard world to deal with...

Zagiflyer
04-03-2005, 09:36 AM
Straight pool will never die, it will always be there for new players to rediscover. If anything, it seems to be more widely played recently where I play in WI. There was a recent 14.1 tourney in the Northern IL area (Cue-N-You billiards in Belvidere, IL) and there was a great turnout. Hopefully there will be more tournaments. It's very sad that there isn't a major professional 14.1 tournament each year because I would love to see the newer top pros play the game and see how they think when they don't have to shoot in rotation. It's a great game and it uses all the balls, all the pockets, all the defense, all the shots, and lots of strategy. It is THE complete pool game. It's unfortunate that everything has to revolve around fast action and money games, it's taking the class out of the game. Give me top pros in tuxedos playing 14.1 in a beautiful ballroom somewhere, that's class. How could we get the pool community, public and sponsers to embrace it? Any millionaires out there with spare cash that want to sponser a 14.1 tournament. Maybe if we could find enough people who loved the game to kick in some money and find a venue and a promoter.........????? I'm afraid it's up the Europeans to bring 14.1 back at the professional level.

Ken Nelson

Johnnyt
04-03-2005, 09:36 AM
I personally believe the answer to that is as a society we have gone from slow and steady development thinking (which is the heart of straight pool philosophy) to the "FAST and FURIOUS" age which is more the philosophy of 6 and 9 ball!!! take business it used to be build profits carefully and safely ! now as evident by ENRON and others it is do it fast by any means possible ! Hell ! you can even buy a damn "gourmet" TV dinner now from high priced chefs!!!! We no longer want to wait an hour to see the end of anything much less a pool match ! :confused: :mad:
I agree with your post MrLucky. Young people today for the most part want fast games with little thinking. Like pull a handle(casino) or make 9 on the break (lucky). Bring back real pool. Bring back straight pool. Johnnyt

bud green
04-03-2005, 10:29 AM
I knew I'd fire up some folks with this thread. I'm just pissed off that I'm 3000 miles away from New York and can't just drive over and watch Robles,etc... play. There is still a TON of talent on the East Coast alone and plenty of players good enough to warrant filming.

As far as Accu-Stats goes, if it's too expensive for them, maybe worldpool.com will film some matches. They have a section on their site listed for 14.1 but it's "under construction"... meaning no matches yet.

I love bank pool and like the DCC the way they set it up for the all round, but I just thought that since all the greatest players in the world are there, you might as well have a US OPEN the next week there or close by. After the US Open 9-ball might be as good as time as any too.

Teacherman
04-03-2005, 01:36 PM
Straight pool is officially dead and pool is on life support.

Jack Flanagan
04-03-2005, 02:34 PM
I know straight pool is dead,,,buried it out back of Amanda's Gameroom last week,,,barring any miracles, I'm gonna bury the whole damn pool room at the end of April,,,,,just the facts; Mississippi is in a recession,,,politicians won't use the word, but it's already here,,,rest of the nation to follow within a year,,,'film at eleven, back to you Teach,,,'

hobokenapa
04-03-2005, 07:54 PM
I'm just pissed off that I'm 3000 miles away from New York and can't just drive over and watch Robles,etc... play.

It's certainly a perk of living here. Just two nights ago, I was playing a Straight Pool League match and Tony Robles starting shooting on the next table. Both me and my opponent were not paying any attention to our League match when we were in the chair. All eyes were on Tony.

MrLucky
04-04-2005, 04:11 AM
When is that starting?...was there weekend before last, didn't hear anything about it?...not saying I'm any good...but love to play it...hmm...maybe if I played more, my game would improve!?...novel idea, huh?... :D

can't believe Accu-Stats wasn't at the NJ Championship...Colavita is well known, and has been carrying the torch of 14:1 forever...and there are big names at the Jersey event?...go figure...yet another problem for the Billiard world to deal with...
its in the primary stages richard just ok'd saturdays @ 3PM as the time he could do it ! Ive been in NY on some family issues so I have been handicapped in getting things rolling ! though Gerald who is up your way is going to work with me to start one at the pool room in Marrietta! :D

titanic
04-04-2005, 11:32 PM
Red Skelton was called into the office and sat down with the heads of programming at NBC. He was introduced to a new word "DEMOGRAPHICS." He was the first fatality. The powers that be simply said " Red.....Jello has determined that their product is not being purchased by the people who watch your show and you are out!"

Let's face it pool is a great game to play but it is not too much fun to watch. Especially if you are a non - player and do not even know what to look for.So..........the media determines what the public is gonig to see.

There is no excitement for the average citizen. Why? There are no stats kept on players that get into the news on a regular basis! Ask the next 100 people you see walking down the street who Earl Strickland or Efren Reyes is.

Go back two weeks later and ask the same people who Minnesota Fats or Willie Moscone is?

You will get some interesting results. My last count was Moscone high run 14.1 continuous 526.

Eddie Taylor bank pool 27.

This has to be made known to the public and every tournament winner should get a crack at both of those records with a substantial monetary reward and official recognition.

Until the public is made aware as to how difficult these records are no one is going to revive pool.

If you revive it the only hope to keep it alive is from the ground up.That means emphasis on Junior Pool.

In the old days if you wanted to learn how to play it cost you money. The oldtimers felt they learned the hard way and so must you. Now it is time to create an atmosphere of learning and to get it into the Olympics and let America find the GOLD again.

Titanic Jerry

vagabond
04-05-2005, 03:18 AM
Eddie Taylor bank pool 27.



Titanic Jerry

Hi,
It was 37 (12-15-10) done in a after hours match in Ashville,North carolina.
Vagabond

Black-Balled
04-05-2005, 04:59 AM
DCC has banks b/c that area of the country has traditionally been the best bank pool area. And I would have to say that 14.1 is dead in my area but I still try to run more than 14 a couple ofx a week.I have always been curious why the DCC has banks instead of straight pool as one of the main events? I suspect its for historical reasons, has anyone ever tried to get them to add straight pool or would the venue simply not be able to cope? I had never even heard of banks before this tournmanet and you hear even less about bank tournmanets than straight pool around the world.

14:1, 8 Ball and 9 Ball, that would be my pick :-)

catscradle
04-05-2005, 05:00 AM
i get the impression the dcc has more gambling roots, which pretty much elimiantes 14.1 as a game of choice for fast moving money.

BINGO!!!! And that also explains why 14.1 has declined so much since it's heyday. It also explains why Texas Hold-em has displacing stud poker, it is faster and has a greater element of luck, providing the illusion that anybody can win. Same thing with 14.1 vs 9-ball, 9-ball is a better gambling game and for a lot of people it is all about gambling and pool is just a vehicle to gamble. And at the moment at least it would appear that 9-ball is being hurt by poker for the same reasons 9-ball overtook 14.1.
One last thought, Texas Hold 'Em, Texas Express; coincidence? :D

dmgwalsh
04-07-2005, 06:55 AM
Straight pool will never die, it will always be there for new players to rediscover. If anything, it seems to be more widely played recently where I play in WI. There was a recent 14.1 tourney in the Northern IL area (Cue-N-You billiards in GraysLake, IL) and there was a great turnout. Hopefully there will be more tournaments. It's very sad that there isn't a major professional 14.1 tournament each year because I would love to see the newer top pros play the game and see how they think when they don't have to shoot in rotation. It's a great game and it uses all the balls, all the pockets, all the defense, all the shots, and lots of strategy. It is THE complete pool game. It's unfortunate that everything has to revolve around fast action and money games, it's taking the class out of the game. Give me top pros in tuxedos playing 14.1 in a beautiful ballroom somewhere, that's class. How could we get the pool community, public and sponsers to embrace it? Any millionaires out there with spare cash that want to sponser a 14.1 tournament. Maybe if we could find enough people who loved the game to kick in some money and find a venue and a promoter.........????? I'm afraid it's up the Europeans to bring 14.1 back at the professional level.

Ken Nelson

Hi, Ken.

As you know, we are doing what we can to keep it alive in Chicago. Last night, I had my straight league matches until about Midnight at the Illinois Billiards Club. Monday was straight league at Red Shoes in Alsip.

Red Shoes in Alsip, Illinois (708 388-3700) is also putting on an open straight tournament on May 7, 2005 starting at 11:00 a.m. $500 added (based upon a full field of 32) . For you One Pocket afficianados, same format on May 21, 2005 at the same time.

Jersey
04-07-2005, 07:08 AM
its in the primary stages richard just ok'd saturdays @ 3PM as the time he could do it ! Ive been in NY on some family issues so I have been handicapped in getting things rolling ! though Gerald who is up your way is going to work with me to start one at the pool room in Marrietta! :D

Cool...I'll keep my ears peel'd...I'll be playing the APA Scotch Doubles 8-Ball Tourny at Cues on 4.17...would be great to get something going at The Pool Room...they run every league format there is, and have an 8/9 Ball Tourny almost everyday of the week...great room!

sniper
04-07-2005, 08:49 AM
I'm afraid it's up the Europeans to bring 14.1 back at the professional level.




I'm afraid your probably right, in Germany especially 14.1 is very popular almost as popular as nine ball. I guess that's why every german that comes over plays an impressive straight pool game (Hohmann, Engert, etc.)
My uncle spent a couple years over there and said their straight pool league is very competitive and loaded with good players.

lewdo26
04-07-2005, 10:15 AM
I'm afraid your probably right, in Germany especially 14.1 is very popular almost as popular as nine ball. I guess that's why every german that comes over plays an impressive straight pool game (Hohmann, Engert, etc.)
My uncle spent a couple years over there and said their straight pool league is very competitive and loaded with good players.
I agree, our hopes for professional straight pool may have to derive from somewhere other than its native soil. As Mr. Lucky and catscradle said, contemporary American culture is about money (or debt) changing hands quick. Just look at the Wall Street casino for a clue.

But reality is, America's quick and easy culture is also compromising its 9 ball and everything else. The future of 9 ball also appears to be looking to Asia for answers.

mastercueartist
04-07-2005, 10:59 AM
I was noticing that accu-stats hasn't taped any straight pool in a while and can't recall any mention of a US Championship 14.1 Tourney being planned.

I know there is not a lot of $$ incentive to host the event but does anyone know if any pro 14.1 events in the US are being planned? Europe seems to like the game and host events and a lot of younger players like Mika, Tony Robles, Hatch,Schmidt like the game and can run hundreds but no events seem to be lined up.

Maybe they can hold some event at the DCC, separate from the all round events, while all the talent is already there. Even if it was half assed it would be better than nothing and we can have some kind of reigning champ.
The big boys play it still but none on the tube.There have been some pretty large games as of late and I know of one that went over 6 figs in the uK last month.*I personally really really wish that the game would resurface as it is the tell of who is who.I love all games but straight pool cleaned the field .Say Im averageing 200 balls . I can set 9 racks in 9 ball and see a guy run out a set on me and not be able to shoot.Even though he may be able to only run 10 or 15 balls.Im a better shooter then him but he wins.Thats the only dry taste in my mouth about the loss of straight pool and to try to compensate it with 1 pocket did not fit well either.Yes the game needs to return in a BIG way so people can see what a real heavy hitter is.

shinyballs
04-07-2005, 11:12 AM
I'm afraid it's up the Europeans to bring 14.1 back at the professional level.

Yeah, it's worked so well for snooker!! It'll never happen because Americans have a fast food mentality when it comes to sports.

The answer is yes, it's been dead for a while now.