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View Full Version : New shaft -special equiptment etc.


mastercueartist
04-05-2005, 12:06 AM
This equiptment thing I think is getting the better of a few of you.Now I have set up cues for a few of the top players in the world and have been for years.Now I agree with the fact that good equiptment is a benifit.I also beleave that proper care for this equiptment is also a must.

Here is my point. I do beleave that many of you players need to get your cue
set up for you.Lets put it this way.Lets say MrXXX makes one of the best cues ever made.Does this mean that the cue you own from MrXXX is good for you?I mean it may feel good but are you struggleing with it in any way?

I see non collectors-dealers buying and selling and buying cues trying to find the one that will fit them.Most likely you will keep buying and selling.You guys are asking about laminated shafts and whatnot.Yea the new stuff is neat.

I am awaiting the globel positioning sensor on the 200 laminate titanium shaft to coincide with the holographic imiging senser for the cue.I mean Joe Balisis used one did he not?I thought Ervin Crane had a laminated shaft for sure was it not?Greenleaf was a master just because the super quadroople glue that put his tip on.Yes I guss mosconi was useing GPS he must been.

Dont get me wrong Im not trying to throw a shake to any of the manufactuers-Hey business is business.Im glad for you. I just think you the shooter should work the bugs out of your cue and worry about the game!

As I am retireing from my field I will let you know (kinda) how I set a cue for a player.Answer these questions to yourself and youll get the idea I think.

1st . Take and get the desity of your shafts checked.If it is uneaqual it is uneaqual.Most are !!! laminate or non laminate!

2nd . What is your taper points???? Meaning what is the length of your taper down the shaft and also what is the gauges per point??Do you go from 11.9mm to 13.4mm for 20" down the shaft? (numbers here are hypothetical)

3rd . Whats the weight of the cue for you? Many cuemakers hate this fact and will cut me down on this but sorry! I see time and time again some guy with a screwgun or screwdriver changeing a weight bolt and not considering the change in balance point.If your cue and desired balance is 2.5 forward and some idiot ads to the bolt it came back on you.If you change a bolt the whole cue should be adjusted.I would mill and turn out the weight through a cue for my players.

4th. Whats the length of the cue thats right for you? I mean 1/2 inch makes a difference.Mostly I have only seen the taller guys figure this one out.They get a longer cue made. They are taller.Makes sense.

5th. Width of the butt ?? Hmmm anyone ever think on that one?Is everyones hands the same ?

6th. I call this inlay city. Did you ever consider with that super fancy Ivory cue your more concerned about bumping that dream machine or someone else for that matter hitting it by accident then you are in your game.Hey I love the inlays but I get about 4 refinishes a year from super big names on their almost all wood cues.Wood is easyer all around. End of story.

7th.Tips, hugh guess just because it is expensive and you were told by some real good shooters its the best or MrXXX put it on as the best for you right?Did you try all of them?

I think you get the point.Ive heard tale that a tuner took a sponsers cue and made an exact copy. Lets see if I can remember the set up that I heard won the biggest 9 ball tourn we have.
- Lambros ebony butt (where he used ebony in front and a sleaved rear I think it was like a delronish black stuff sleave.(when his shop was behind the gold club so that had to be the late 80s). I think it was late 80s. converted over to a 5/16/14 ss pin from 3/8/10) Oh yes anything can be done for a price!.The black stuff removed and ebony sleave made from wood from strativarious wood that was bought up when they closed the plant in germany.Mike had and has great stock in lumber he was thoughtfull enough to use the good stuff to keep a great balance on the cues he made then.If he ever knew the plain cue he sold new was cut up the next day he would have been POed if this is at all true.He is a great cuemaker no offence ment at all Mike.
All inlay work coppied exact to a sponsers cue made for a top pro and might I say the sponsers cue was nothing near the level of the cue when finished.BUT the sponser sent the cue to the tuner in the first place for the player. They wanted a winner not a seller.
1 Tad Kahura shaft ssr converted and tuned for the player
1 Runde shaft ssr converted and tuned for the player
white delron butcap
ss joint
non ivory ferrels(will not tell the material but white)
tips cost I think about a $3 each then
I think you get the picture.It was not what was presented.But it did win the biggest 9 ball tourn we have in the US if this is true .I guess moral of the story is maybe you already have the right equiptment just not right for you.

I DID NOT MENTION ANY NAMES OR DATES AND STATED I HEARD IT .DO NOT WORRY IT IS probibly not TRUE :) !!!!!!! I just want people to really understand how a few of the PRODUCTION CUE COMPANIES WORK!!!!!.Its mostly sales guys just shoot pool.

ScottR
04-05-2005, 05:01 AM
This equiptment thing I think is getting the better of a few of you.Now I have set up cues for a few of the top players in the world and have been for years.Now I agree with the fact that good equiptment is a benifit.I also beleave that proper care for this equiptment is also a must.

Here is my point. I do beleave that many of you players need to get your cue
set up for you.Lets put it this way.Lets say MrXXX makes one of the best cues ever made.Does this mean that the cue you own from MrXXX is good for you?I mean it may feel good but are you struggleing with it in any way?

I see non collectors-dealers buying and selling and buying cues trying to find the one that will fit them.Most likely you will keep buying and selling.You guys are asking about laminated shafts and whatnot.Yea the new stuff is neat.

I am awaiting the globel positioning sensor on the 200 laminate titanium shaft to coincide with the holographic imiging senser for the cue.I mean Joe Balisis used one did he not?I thought Ervin Crane had a laminated shaft for sure was it not?Greenleaf was a master just because the super quadroople glue that put his tip on.Yes I guss mosconi was useing GPS he must been.

Dont get me wrong Im not trying to throw a shake to any of the manufactuers-Hey business is business.Im glad for you. I just think you the shooter should work the bugs out of your cue and worry about the game!

As I am retireing from my field I will let you know (kinda) how I set a cue for a player.Answer these questions to yourself and youll get the idea I think.

1st . Take and get the desity of your shafts checked.If it is uneaqual it is uneaqual.Most are !!! laminate or non laminate!

2nd . What is your taper points???? Meaning what is the length of your taper down the shaft and also what is the gauges per point??Do you go from 11.9mm to 13.4mm for 20" down the shaft? (numbers here are hypothetical)

3rd . Whats the weight of the cue for you? Many cuemakers hate this fact and will cut me down on this but sorry! I see time and time again some guy with a screwgun or screwdriver changeing a weight bolt and not considering the change in balance point.If your cue and desired balance is 2.5 forward and some idiot ads to the bolt it came back on you.If you change a bolt the whole cue should be adjusted.I would mill and turn out the weight through a cue for my players.

4th. Whats the length of the cue thats right for you? I mean 1/2 inch makes a difference.Mostly I have only seen the taller guys figure this one out.They get a longer cue made. They are taller.Makes sense.

5th. Width of the butt ?? Hmmm anyone ever think on that one?Is everyones hands the same ?

6th. I call this inlay city. Did you ever consider with that super fancy Ivory cue your more concerned about bumping that dream machine or someone else for that matter hitting it by accident then you are in your game.Hey I love the inlays but I get about 4 refinishes a year from super big names on their almost all wood cues.Wood is easyer all around. End of story.

7th.Tips, hugh guess just because it is expensive and you were told by some real good shooters its the best or MrXXX put it on as the best for you right?Did you try all of them?

I think you get the point.Ive heard tale that a tuner took a sponsers cue and made an exact copy. Lets see if I can remember the set up that I heard won the biggest 9 ball tourn we have.
- Lambros ebony butt (where he used ebony in front and a sleaved rear I think it was like a delronish black stuff sleave.(when his shop was behind the gold club so that had to be the late 80s). I think it was late 80s. converted over to a 5/16/14 ss pin from 3/8/10) Oh yes anything can be done for a price!.The black stuff removed and ebony sleave made from wood from strativarious wood that was bought up when they closed the plant in germany.Mike had and has great stock in lumber he was thoughtfull enough to use the good stuff to keep a great balance on the cues he made then.If he ever knew the plain cue he sold new was cut up the next day he would have been POed if this is at all true.He is a great cuemaker no offence ment at all Mike.
All inlay work coppied exact to a sponsers cue made for a top pro and might I say the sponsers cue was nothing near the level of the cue when finished.BUT the sponser sent the cue to the tuner in the first place for the player. They wanted a winner not a seller.
1 Tad Kahura shaft ssr converted and tuned for the player
1 Runde shaft ssr converted and tuned for the player
white delron butcap
ss joint
non ivory ferrels(will not tell the material but white)
tips cost I think about a $3 each then
I think you get the picture.It was not what was presented.But it did win the biggest 9 ball tourn we have in the US if this is true .I guess moral of the story is maybe you already have the right equiptment just not right for you.

I DID NOT MENTION ANY NAMES OR DATES AND STATED I HEARD IT .DO NOT WORRY IT IS probibly not TRUE :) !!!!!!! I just want people to really understand how a few of the PRODUCTION CUE COMPANIES WORK!!!!!.Its mostly sales guys just shoot pool.
HUH??? :confused:

drivermaker
04-05-2005, 05:14 AM
I DID NOT MENTION ANY NAMES OR DATES AND STATED I HEARD IT .DO NOT WORRY IT IS probibly not TRUE :) !!!!!!! I just want people to really understand how a few of the PRODUCTION CUE COMPANIES WORK!!!!!.Its mostly sales guys just shoot pool.


Hey now wait a minute pardner...if you're trying to tell me that a Predator isn't the greatest thing since sliced bread, hasn't revolutionized how the game is played, and improved everyone that owns one by 3 balls....I take some serious offense to that. :mad:

jjinfla
04-05-2005, 05:28 AM
#1 I don't understand. #2-#6 I totally agree with.

Just bought a Schon LTD and I am going to have the diameter of tip/ferule cut down a bit. Too fat to suit me. But the weight, length, balance, butt diameter, are great.

Now I am just an average player but if this bothers me then I wonder how hyper critical these things are to the pros.

Jake

lukeinva
04-05-2005, 05:41 AM
Hey now wait a minute pardner...if you're trying to tell me that a Predator isn't the greatest thing since sliced bread, hasn't revolutionized how the game is played, and improved everyone that owns one by 3 balls....I take some serious offense to that. :mad:


The predator also helps with your aiming!!! :D

vapoolplayer
04-05-2005, 07:24 AM
The predator also helps with your aiming!!! :D

i see the opportunity for a cheapshot...........so i'm taking it..........lol

in DM's case luke.......NOTHING could help him with his aiming............


VAP

drivermaker
04-05-2005, 07:47 AM
i see the opportunity for a cheapshot...........so i'm taking it..........lol

in DM's case luke.......NOTHING could help him with his aiming............


VAP


I do AIM to spend some money on a good time though. :p :D

vapoolplayer
04-05-2005, 07:54 AM
I do AIM to spend some money on a good time though. :p :D

yea yea...............speaking of which..........has it been 4 weeks yet?

drivermaker
04-05-2005, 07:58 AM
yea yea...............speaking of which..........has it been 4 weeks yet?


Do you remember how Roy Rogers used to get Trigger to count? Trigger would pound his hoof on the ground and stop at the right number. Try it...

OldHasBeen
04-05-2005, 08:26 AM
I agree with almost all of which mastercueartist has said. I got the biggest kick out of seeing Efren (The Best Player, Today), playing at the DCC with a piece of tape hanging off the wrap of his cue.
Now I'm in Sales, so I'm sure not knocking the salesmanship that goes into marketing cue-sticks - BUT - I do get upset at the cue makers who say they are "Custom Cue Makers" when they have 200 cues "For Sale" and on display.
Many, Many years ago while having dinner with Larry Hubbard, Buddy Hall, Louie and Bob Mueccie (?spelling), at a big tourney in Nashville, Bob asked everyone what they thought of his cues. No one said much until I said - "I think you make a hell of a "PRODUCTION CUE".
He got very defensive and argumentative and claimed he was a "Custom Cue Maker". I said, NO, George Balabushka, Gus Szamboti & Danny Janes are "Custom Cue Makers". I said I knew of a fellow back in St. Louis who just bought 150 sticks from him - WHATS CUSTOM ABOUT THAT?
Now that "I'm Back", I can honestly say that I don't think I have missed a ball with my $89 Lucasi from eBay, that I would have made with my 42 year old Balabushka.
A cue is a tool - just like money.
I make money - money doesn’t make me.
I make the balls - my cue can't do anything without me.

TY & GL

drivermaker
04-05-2005, 09:08 AM
I agree with almost all of which mastercueartist has said. I got the biggest kick out of seeing Efren (The Best Player, Today), playing at the DCC with a piece of tape hanging off the wrap of his cue.
Now I'm in Sales, so I'm sure not knocking the salesmanship that goes into marketing cue-sticks - BUT - I do get upset at the cue makers who say they are "Custom Cue Makers" when they have 200 cues "For Sale" and on display.
Many, Many years ago while having dinner with Larry Hubbard, Buddy Hall, Louie and Bob Mueccie (?spelling), at a big tourney in Nashville, Bob asked everyone what they thought of his cues. No one said much until I said - "I think you make a hell of a "PRODUCTION CUE".
He got very defensive and argumentative and claimed he was a "Custom Cue Maker". I said, NO, George Balabushka, Gus Szamboti & Danny Janes are "Custom Cue Makers". I said I knew of a fellow back in St. Louis who just bought 150 sticks from him - WHATS CUSTOM ABOUT THAT?
Now that "I'm Back", I can honestly say that I don't think I have missed a ball with my $89 Lucasi from eBay, that I would have made with my 42 year old Balabushka.
A cue is a tool - just like money.
I make money - money doesn’t make me.
I make the balls - my cue can't do anything without me.

TY & GL


C'mon OHB...don't you read all of the sage advice promoting the benefits of a custom cue vs. a production cue here on AZ? There are always a couple of threads going on just about everyday. You only THINK "you're back". You'd REALLY be back if you went out and got yourself a brand new SP or plain Jane from a custom cue maker. You might not miss ANY balls.... ;)

Jersey
04-05-2005, 09:12 AM
This equiptment thing I think is getting the better of a few of you.Now I have set up cues for a few of the top players in the world and have been for years.Now I agree with the fact that good equiptment is a benifit.I also beleave that proper care for this equiptment is also a must.

Here is my point. I do beleave that many of you players need to get your cue
set up for you.Lets put it this way.Lets say MrXXX makes one of the best cues ever made.Does this mean that the cue you own from MrXXX is good for you?I mean it may feel good but are you struggleing with it in any way?

I see non collectors-dealers buying and selling and buying cues trying to find the one that will fit them.Most likely you will keep buying and selling.You guys are asking about laminated shafts and whatnot.Yea the new stuff is neat.

I am awaiting the globel positioning sensor on the 200 laminate titanium shaft to coincide with the holographic imiging senser for the cue.I mean Joe Balisis used one did he not?I thought Ervin Crane had a laminated shaft for sure was it not?Greenleaf was a master just because the super quadroople glue that put his tip on.Yes I guss mosconi was useing GPS he must been.

Dont get me wrong Im not trying to throw a shake to any of the manufactuers-Hey business is business.Im glad for you. I just think you the shooter should work the bugs out of your cue and worry about the game!

As I am retireing from my field I will let you know (kinda) how I set a cue for a player.Answer these questions to yourself and youll get the idea I think.

1st . Take and get the desity of your shafts checked.If it is uneaqual it is uneaqual.Most are !!! laminate or non laminate!

2nd . What is your taper points???? Meaning what is the length of your taper down the shaft and also what is the gauges per point??Do you go from 11.9mm to 13.4mm for 20" down the shaft? (numbers here are hypothetical)

3rd . Whats the weight of the cue for you? Many cuemakers hate this fact and will cut me down on this but sorry! I see time and time again some guy with a screwgun or screwdriver changeing a weight bolt and not considering the change in balance point.If your cue and desired balance is 2.5 forward and some idiot ads to the bolt it came back on you.If you change a bolt the whole cue should be adjusted.I would mill and turn out the weight through a cue for my players.

4th. Whats the length of the cue thats right for you? I mean 1/2 inch makes a difference.Mostly I have only seen the taller guys figure this one out.They get a longer cue made. They are taller.Makes sense.

5th. Width of the butt ?? Hmmm anyone ever think on that one?Is everyones hands the same ?

6th. I call this inlay city. Did you ever consider with that super fancy Ivory cue your more concerned about bumping that dream machine or someone else for that matter hitting it by accident then you are in your game.Hey I love the inlays but I get about 4 refinishes a year from super big names on their almost all wood cues.Wood is easyer all around. End of story.

7th.Tips, hugh guess just because it is expensive and you were told by some real good shooters its the best or MrXXX put it on as the best for you right?Did you try all of them?

I think you get the point.Ive heard tale that a tuner took a sponsers cue and made an exact copy. Lets see if I can remember the set up that I heard won the biggest 9 ball tourn we have.
- Lambros ebony butt (where he used ebony in front and a sleaved rear I think it was like a delronish black stuff sleave.(when his shop was behind the gold club so that had to be the late 80s). I think it was late 80s. converted over to a 5/16/14 ss pin from 3/8/10) Oh yes anything can be done for a price!.The black stuff removed and ebony sleave made from wood from strativarious wood that was bought up when they closed the plant in germany.Mike had and has great stock in lumber he was thoughtfull enough to use the good stuff to keep a great balance on the cues he made then.If he ever knew the plain cue he sold new was cut up the next day he would have been POed if this is at all true.He is a great cuemaker no offence ment at all Mike.
All inlay work coppied exact to a sponsers cue made for a top pro and might I say the sponsers cue was nothing near the level of the cue when finished.BUT the sponser sent the cue to the tuner in the first place for the player. They wanted a winner not a seller.
1 Tad Kahura shaft ssr converted and tuned for the player
1 Runde shaft ssr converted and tuned for the player
white delron butcap
ss joint
non ivory ferrels(will not tell the material but white)
tips cost I think about a $3 each then
I think you get the picture.It was not what was presented.But it did win the biggest 9 ball tourn we have in the US if this is true .I guess moral of the story is maybe you already have the right equiptment just not right for you.

I DID NOT MENTION ANY NAMES OR DATES AND STATED I HEARD IT .DO NOT WORRY IT IS probibly not TRUE :) !!!!!!! I just want people to really understand how a few of the PRODUCTION CUE COMPANIES WORK!!!!!.Its mostly sales guys just shoot pool.

First of all...the rant's are classic! Drivermaker & VAP!...LMAO...now about the Master Cue Artist...I agree with you're point...I think the industry while maybe genuinely trying to improve products and the performance of the players that buy their equiptment...I do think that maybe it's mostly smoke and mirrors...they are a business afterall...and business in the good ole USA is all about the $$$ afterall...now can you give a hack league player an idea about how to really address all of those things you lay out?...who can I go see that can help me in 'fitting' my current playing cue to my size, style of play etc.?...who can give me sound advice on tips, ferrules, tapers, balance points, overall weight, butt diameter etc?...I mean I've been playing pool for 25+years, and not until I became introduced to league play about 3 years ago did I really care about any of this stuff!?...I played with a 21oz CueTec Graphite I've had for at least 20yrs...once I started playing APA I began to run into what I call 'Pool Snobs'...you know, mediocre players with $1k cues and $500 cases and all the trinkits I'm sure we all have...hell I have them now!?...has any of it improved my game?...not really...but I certainly 'look' the part when I lug all my crap into the local poolroom!...what has really improved my game is consistent play against a diverse group of hacks and pool nuts like myself...

my 2c-

Fred Agnir
04-05-2005, 09:13 AM
I think you get the picture.
I didn't get the picture.

Fred

ScottR
04-05-2005, 09:25 AM
C'mon OHB...don't you read all of the sage advice promoting the benefits of a custom cue vs. a production cue here on AZ? There are always a couple of threads going on just about everyday. You only THINK "you're back". You'd REALLY be back if you went out and got yourself a brand new SP or plain Jane from a custom cue maker. You might not miss ANY balls.... ;)
Yeah . . . . . speaking of which, why didn't you roast those other people on the Schon vs custom thread, like you did when I dared to suggest a mid-priced custom?

It's because you like me, isn't it? :p

drivermaker
04-05-2005, 09:49 AM
Yeah . . . . . speaking of which, why didn't you roast those other people on the Schon vs custom thread, like you did when I dared to suggest a mid-priced custom?

It's because you like me, isn't it? :p


Sometimes you just get tired of the same old crap...and other times you just get tired of the same old crap.

Sure.....I likes you Scotty....now beam me up, goddamn it!!!

mastercueartist
04-05-2005, 10:28 AM
First of all...the rant's are classic! Drivermaker & VAP!...LMAO...now about the Master Cue Artist...I agree with you're point...I think the industry while maybe genuinely trying to improve products and the performance of the players that buy their equiptment...I do think that maybe it's mostly smoke and mirrors...they are a business afterall...and business in the good ole USA is all about the $$$ afterall...now can you give a hack league player an idea about how to really address all of those things you lay out?...who can I go see that can help me in 'fitting' my current playing cue to my size, style of play etc.?...who can give me sound advice on tips, ferrules, tapers, balance points, overall weight, butt diameter etc?...I mean I've been playing pool for 25+years, and not until I became introduced to league play about 3 years ago did I really care about any of this stuff!?...I played with a 21oz CueTec Graphite I've had for at least 20yrs...once I started playing APA I began to run into what I call 'Pool Snobs'...you know, mediocre players with $1k cues and $500 cases and all the trinkits I'm sure we all have...hell I have them now!?...has any of it improved my game?...not really...but I certainly 'look' the part when I lug all my crap into the local poolroom!...what has really improved my game is consistent play against a diverse group of hacks and pool nuts like myself...

my 2c-

Thats where its Tricky Jersey . While It took me the most part of 25 years to learn to set a cue per player it is a very slim field here in the US for people who can do it.Private email the state your in if your serious and Ill see if I can connect you with someone who can do this for you. Its not cheap and usually cost more then the cue itself but the end result is worth it.

Mr. Wilson
04-05-2005, 11:05 AM
Anyone ever hear of an agent provocateur?

Dave

mastercueartist
04-05-2005, 11:10 AM
Anyone ever hear of an agent provocateur?

Dave

Yes but how are you referencing this to the post ? Also weirdly enough your in the same town I am.

mastercueartist
04-05-2005, 02:02 PM
I didn't get the picture.

Fred

Sorry Fred most never do.

Mr. Wilson
04-06-2005, 07:45 AM
Yes but how are you referencing this to the post ? Also weirdly enough your in the same town I am.

Just pokin ya.

Drop a line sometime. I'd look forward to meeting other players.

Dave