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Tom In Cincy
04-11-2005, 02:40 PM
A recent post about the UPA scheduling conflicts with the Berhman's Masters 9 ball tournament and the Dragon Productions just wasn't enough..

NOW the UPA has scheduled a LA event in January of 2006 during the same week as the Derby City Classic.

There hasn't been a word out of the UPA's website with news about these conflicts...just the schedule with some question marks ????tba and such.

If I were a member of the UPA, I would be asking some questions...

Who's running the UPA and why is it taking so long to make any decisions and then even longer to get the decisions out to the players and public?

Or is it only the "Dragon Productions" holding up the show? The UPA will not hold a UPA tournament unless it is a 'Drag-on Production'... is that the process?

Where is the competition for 'drag on productions'?

vapoolplayer
04-11-2005, 03:21 PM
NOW the UPA has scheduled a LA event in January of 2006 during the same week as the Derby City Classic.



they can't be that STUPID..............thats SUICIDE..............what person who makes a living off playing pool would miss the DCC??????

that would be the end of the upa............when they had 10 people show up for a sanctioned tourney with a ton of sponsorship.....................i think they'll change that.

VAP

deadstroke32
04-11-2005, 04:44 PM
they can't be that STUPID..............thats SUICIDE..............what person who makes a living off playing pool would miss the DCC??????

that would be the end of the upa............when they had 10 people show up for a sanctioned tourney with a ton of sponsorship.....................i think they'll change that.

VAP
The UPA is gone nutz .Dcc is the Best thing going .Plus all the top player in the upa Are winners of the dcc 9 ball ..
Hay someone realy needs to look into this u p a mess..
Or one more tour down the river

JAM
04-11-2005, 04:54 PM
Hopefully, there is room for negotiation(s).

Quote from president of Dragon Promotions, Cindy Lee:

"With the continued support of all the players and fans, we are proud to sanction the Predator Florida Open with the UPA. Dragon Promotions have and will continue to work towards sanctioning all our events. We encourage all promoters to take this opportunity to get their events sanctioned by UPA in order to avoid future conflicts."

Full article on AzBilliards Home Page: http://azbilliards.com/2000storya.cfm?storynum=2630

JAM

Michael Webb
04-11-2005, 05:18 PM
The whole situation is really disappointing, There can be unity without dominance. It doesn't matter what is overbooked or power plays pulled. The fans and the players still lose.

lukeinva
04-11-2005, 09:15 PM
Well if you want to win a UPA event there is your chance if your an average player. No one else will be there so you may have a chance of winning!!! Thats just stupid by the UPA with the response jam posted sounds like they are trying to bully the DCC to be a sanctioned UPA event. Sounds like they think they will get the bigger turnout, but I seriously doubt that!

Celtic
04-11-2005, 09:41 PM
Dragon Promotions have and will continue to work towards sanctioning all our events. We encourage all promoters to take this opportunity to get their events sanctioned by UPA in order to avoid future conflicts."

JAM

That is a joke. Basically the UPA is trying to strongarm all the premier events to join the UPA and become a sanctioned event and only THEN will they stop with the blackmailing tactics of putting UPA events at the exact same time and try to destroy those events.

Pool is in bad enough shape and has too few events as it is, the UPA has a small number of events and this putting them on at the exact same time as the DCC and other events is on purpose and is an attempt to gain control over those events via sanctioning. This will simply hurt the DCC AND the UPA event, instead of having 6 good UPA events a year and 6 other major tournaments that dont confict the UPA has decided to not allow the pool players 12 top events in a year but less by purposely schedualing conficts in order to show those "other" tournaments they better join up withe the UPA or face it directly as competition.

sly
04-11-2005, 09:54 PM
go to www.worldpoolchampionship ,north america catagory 4 and 7,it appears the upa has got spots to the worlds,which is a big plus for a lot of players,maybe the best thing to do is work with the upa

Tom In Cincy
04-11-2005, 10:13 PM
Hopefully, there is room for negotiation(s).

Quote from president of Dragon Promotions, Cindy Lee:

JAM

Sadly, the UPA has its own requirements for sanctioning non-UPA events.
Either do it the UPA way or NO sanction.

The UPA wants total control of the format and seeding of players (according to the UPA points totals) and for the non-sanctioned event to put any Guaranteed money into an Escrow account at least 30-days prior to the event.

I wish there were room for 'negotiation(s)' but I don't see it happening any time soon.

The Predator/UPA event has (in the last 3 of 4 years) been played on the last weekend of the month of May.
2005 May May 25th-29th
2004 May 8th-9th
2003 May 29th-Jun 1st
2002 May 30th-Jun 2nd
2001 May 31st-Jun 3rd (was the Lucasi event this year)

Celtic
04-11-2005, 10:35 PM
go to www.worldpoolchampionship ,north america catagory 4 and 7,it appears the upa has got spots to the worlds,which is a big plus for a lot of players,maybe the best thing to do is work with the upa

Actually the US open and the BCA 9-ball have spots as well. WTF is the DCC not included in this? The winner of the 9-ball at the DCC should have a spot as well as the overall champ.

vapoolplayer
04-12-2005, 02:14 AM
Hello,

I will bet there are quite a few west coast people who will stay home for a nice paying upa tournament and saving $2,000 expenses. Make a living from pool? :eek:

again, you're looking through ignorant eyes............there is SO MUCH ACTION at the derby, that save the few people who don't need to gamble, and are only interested in the points from the UPA, everyone else will be there.

the only people who will stay home and play in the UPA tourney are:

the ones that arent' good enough, don't gamble, or don't have the bankroll (LARGE GROUP, BUT NO ONE WANTS TO SEE THEM PLAY).......

or

the ones that don't need to gamble, but are interested in the UPA points. (VERY VERY VERY small group)

out of those two categories..........you only have a handful of top talent that would consider the UPA event over the derby...........

considering that ONE person last this year won 40 some thousand.........in TOURNAMENT money ONLY..............there was hundreds of thousands in action OUTSIDE of the tourney.............

and the UPA gives 10,000 to the winner, and you don't have even a 1/4 of the action...............

who do you think in their right mind, except the two groups i mentioned would stay on the west coast????

ask yourself

lets see........do i want to win 10,000 IF IF IF IF i win the UPA event...........or do i want to rely ON MY OWN SKILLS MATCHING UP, and MAKE possibly 50-100,000?????

VAP

JAM
04-12-2005, 04:03 AM
That is a joke. Basically the UPA is trying to strongarm all the premier events to join the UPA and become a sanctioned event and only THEN will they stop with the blackmailing tactics of putting UPA events at the exact same time and try to destroy those events.

Pool is in bad enough shape and has too few events as it is, the UPA has a small number of events and this putting them on at the exact same time as the DCC and other events is on purpose and is an attempt to gain control over those events via sanctioning. This will simply hurt the DCC AND the UPA event, instead of having 6 good UPA events a year and 6 other major tournaments that dont confict the UPA has decided to not allow the pool players 12 top events in a year but less by purposely schedualing conficts in order to show those "other" tournaments they better join up withe the UPA or face it directly as competition.

If memory serves me right, I don't think last year's UPA Season Finale at the Bicycle Club, held on the same dates as the ANNUAL JOB's Music City Open, had a good turnout as far as spectators and railbirds.

It is a sad reality that the first two legs of the Hilton-sponsored NAOT had a very low attendance of "UPA Touring Pros," which has resulted in the NAOT not continuing to have "pro" tournaments, i.e., 43 showed up in Florida and less than 60 showed up in Pittsburgh.

Now let's take the Derby City Classic in Louisville, Kentucky: BIG turnout, players of all caliber, vendors galore, mini tournaments, action, Louie Roberts A/E Award, and the opportunity to mingle with about 1,000 or more pool like-minded folk from around the world.

How about the U.S. Open? They draw about 200 or so players, and this tournament is OPEN to male pool players, and you don't have to be a citizen or resident of the United States or a member of any organization to compete. It is the most prestigious pool title in America, and IMHO, every pool player I know desires to be a U.S. Open champion.

If and when the UPA organization recognizes they will attract more participation with honey rather than vinegar, it will make for a much better pool environment in the United States. As it stands today, the current stance taken by the men's governing body of professional pool is not a good one. Unity is key, but you don't bite the hand that feeds you. Without participation of spectators, pool enthusiasts, fans, railbirds AND aspiring pool players, the UPA vehicle will continue on its merry way, with one tire in the sand.

JAM

vapoolplayer
04-12-2005, 04:27 AM
Quote from president of Dragon Promotions, Cindy Lee:

We encourage all promoters to take this opportunity to get their events sanctioned by UPA in order to avoid future conflicts."



JAM

thats the politically correct way to say "if you don't join us, we'll schedule an event everytime you do"

VAP

JimS
04-12-2005, 04:29 AM
I believe that the DCC will survive no matter who attempts to sabatoge it. It's just an entity unto itself. So too is the US Open. Like Jam said, everybody that can play at that top level desires to win the the Open. The UPA has taken on too much and will suffer from these decisions. It's a shame that they decided to use this tactic. It will destroy them in the long run unless they change.

vapoolplayer
04-12-2005, 05:01 AM
can someone point me in the right direction........i can't find where the UPA has scheduled anything against the DCC next year........

VAP

vapoolplayer
04-12-2005, 05:27 AM
VAP,

I don't care about action as you call it. I have made more money in the last eighteen years in legitimate business than you will gambling in three lifetimes. Your sick! If I am ignorant then I am happy as hell that way.

You run your mouth about skills? What skills do you have? If you have a day job you better stick to it. That's my ignorant advise.

Wait till the local District Attorney is running for mayor and he decides he needs some free publicity and puts the DCC Action out of action. :rolleyes:
Then how you going to use those skills cleaning toilets? So tell us all how much money you made on DCC Action :rolleyes:

The subject is the UPA and it has a BCA Mandate so it's not going away. The US OPEN hasn't paid all the money it owes the players from previous events. The DCC could be shut down anytime. Men's pool tours here today gone tomorrow. Have the men's tours got you by your N.U.T.S yet? :p

PS. No one watches pool except the players when they aren't playing golf. :eek:

you know, i think i've had this conversation with your idiot ass before..........


READ WHAT IS WRITTEN BEFORE YOU REPLY.................

we're not talking about you, or me here............. :rolleyes:

we're talking about the PRO PLAYERS who MAKE A LIVING playing pool.

which tournament are they going to go to? the one to make little or no money, or the one that has the chance of being a big score???

well you obviously don't know shit about poolplayers..........except how to take their picture........

you talk about how much money you've made........well.......frankly i couldn't give a shit.............either way you're still a pool GROUPIE.........not a fan, not a player........a pool GROUPIE.........who follows poolplayers around and gets his picture taken with them so he can show it off............way to go, i envy you so much............. :rolleyes:

this will probably be the last post you read from me, as i'll probably be on your all-star list here shortly...............so have fun with your crown royal and camera..............GROUPIE........... :D

p.s. as far as my skills.........i let you know who i am, when you end up taking my picture one day............ :D

VAP

AceHigh
04-12-2005, 05:38 AM
you know, i think i've had this conversation with your idiot ass before..........


READ WHAT IS WRITTEN BEFORE YOU REPLY.................

we're not talking about you, or me here............. :rolleyes:

we're talking about the PRO PLAYERS who MAKE A LIVING playing pool.

which tournament are they going to go to? the one to make little or no money, or the one that has the chance of being a big score???

well you obviously don't know shit about poolplayers..........except how to take their picture........

you talk about how much money you've made........well.......frankly i couldn't give a shit.............either way you're still a pool GROUPIE.........not a fan, not a player........a pool GROUPIE.........who follows poolplayers around and gets his picture taken with them so he can show it off............way to go, i envy you so much............. :rolleyes:

this will probably be the last post you read from me, as i'll probably be on your all-star list here shortly...............so have fun with your crown royal and camera..............GROUPIE........... :D

p.s. as far as my skills.........i let you know who i am, when you end up taking my picture one day............ :D

VAP

Gremlin is a guy?

vapoolplayer
04-12-2005, 05:48 AM
Gremlin is a guy?

depends on your definition of "guy"

VAP

kollegedave
04-12-2005, 05:53 AM
Jam, I would respectfully disagree with you here. Neither UPA nor Dragon Productions are in any position to negotiate with the DCC. The DCC is the best thing for pool since Efren came to Houston in the eighties. If the UPA wants to conflict with the DCC, then let them. The UPA will lose.

kollegedave

Hopefully, there is room for negotiation(s).

Quote from president of Dragon Promotions, Cindy Lee:

"With the continued support of all the players and fans, we are proud to sanction the Predator Florida Open with the UPA. Dragon Promotions have and will continue to work towards sanctioning all our events. We encourage all promoters to take this opportunity to get their events sanctioned by UPA in order to avoid future conflicts."

Full article on AzBilliards Home Page: http://azbilliards.com/2000storya.cfm?storynum=2630

JAM

bud green
04-12-2005, 06:18 AM
Is it true that UPA players are also given preference for being picked for the Mosconi Cup team? I thought I heard a lot of grumbling a while back about Charlie W. being on the team still.

The DCC is the best thing in pool right now and no other event will come close to matching it unless the payouts are really big.

Are ladies actually not allowed to play in the US OPEN? On JAMs' post she said it was open to any male player. Allison, Corr, J. Lee can't play if they want? I'm not the worlds biggest WPBA fan but some of these ladies play good enough pool to take their chances in the open- Lee did real well at the DCC two years ago.

jjinfla
04-12-2005, 06:22 AM
Evidently everyone has their minds made up and refuse to look at the facts.

Did any of you go to the UPA website and read the Newsletter?

Do you know that the World Summit and UPA Championship will be televised on TV?
And maybe the dates were determined by ESPN.

Do you realize that Danny Basavich is now a millionaire? Yes a millionaire! And all because he played well and WAS ON TV. Now he is very popular and the industry is willing to gamble on him and pay him handsomely.

I am sure that all of you knew that the World Summit and UPA Championship were going to be scheduled again this season because they said so after the last season. And you all knew what months it would be scheduled in. And there are only so many weekends in that month. So if there is a conflict both parties are at fault.

Perhaps it will be best for the UPA and the other tours to go head on and see who the Pros are behind.

I personally believe the pros will go with the chance of being on TV.

And if these UPA events are successful that could be a great shot in the arm for Professional Pool. Or the pro players can go to the DCC where everyone says that is where all the gambling takes place. Just the image pool needs - nothing but gamblers. What a great future. For each winner another player goes home broke. In ring games 5 players lose it all. Not much future there either.

I just can't believe that the TD's couldn't reach Robert Lipson to ensure there were no scheduling conflicts. I'm a nobody in the world of pool and I had a nice conversation with the man a while back and I really do believe that he wants to do what is best for the pros. And he is a businessman and he wants to run a successful business. And yes he wants to make money, for himself and his players. Nothing wrong with that.

Maybe the UPA should contact Donald Trump and propose that his apprentices hold a pool tournament. Twelve UPA pros at one place and twelve at another and see which one can generate the most money. It might give the pool industry some good ideas.

Jake

jjinfla
04-12-2005, 06:37 AM
Is it true that UPA players are also given preference for being picked for the Mosconi Cup team? .

Seems to me that is a benefit of belonging to the UPA.

And they get preference to the WPA too I believe. Another benefit.

And top players get seeded. Another benefit.

Sounds like if you support the UPA they will support you. And the dues to join are only $100 a year. I paid over $300 a year to my union when I was working. And it was either join or don't let the door hit you in the ass on the way otta here. So that sounds like a bargain to me.

It is time Pro Pool players start looking at pool as a job and not just a game. With a job there are responsibilities. Like dues and loyalty and dedication.

Jake

JAM
04-12-2005, 06:48 AM
Jam, I would respectfully disagree with you here. Neither UPA nor Dragon Productions are in any position to negotiate with the DCC. The DCC is the best thing for pool since Efren came to Houston in the eighties. If the UPA wants to conflict with the DCC, then let them. The UPA will lose.

Kollege Dave, I agree with you. :) The proof is in the pudding, as they say. History repeats itself when it comes to pool in the United States. Sadly, many times greed overcomes the initial good intentions of the powers-that-be. It would seem prudent and advantageous for various entities to work together for the betterment of the sport as opposed to pulling against each other.

JMHO, FWIW! :p

JAM

Rich R.
04-12-2005, 09:39 AM
Are ladies actually not allowed to play in the US OPEN? On JAMs' post she said it was open to any male player. Allison, Corr, J. Lee can't play if they want?
A number of years ago, Barry Behrman signed away the rights for the WPBA to use the "U.S. Open" name for their own women's tournament. In the same agreement, women were exluded from his "U.S. Open", so the answer to your question is, yes, ladies are not allowed to play in the U.S. Open.

BTW, the WPBA U.S. Open is not really an open event. A player has to qualify for that tournament the same as any other WPBA tournament. :confused:

DRW
04-12-2005, 11:01 AM
Gremlin is a guy?
No, he is that apendage sticking out of Charlie William's ass!

Koop
04-12-2005, 11:34 AM
Gremlin,

I know what your saying but as far as the 2005 payouts you need to acknowledge that it is only April so there is still quite a bit of earning to go. Not saying many people are getting rich playing pool but the numbers are a little better the closer you get to December.

Regards,
Koop

BazookaJoe
04-12-2005, 12:19 PM
VAP,

I don't care about action as you call it. I have made more money in the last eighteen years in legitimate business than you will gambling in three lifetimes. Your sick! If I am ignorant then I am happy as hell that way.

You run your mouth about skills? What skills do you have? If you have a day job you better stick to it. That's my ignorant advise.

Wait till the local District Attorney is running for mayor and he decides he needs some free publicity and puts the DCC Action out of action. :rolleyes:
Then how you going to use those skills cleaning toilets? So tell us all how much money you made on DCC Action :rolleyes:

The subject is the UPA and it has a BCA Mandate so it's not going away. The US OPEN hasn't paid all the money it owes the players from previous events. The DCC could be shut down anytime. Men's pool tours here today gone tomorrow. Have the men's tours got you by your N.U.T.S yet? :p

PS. No one watches pool except the players when they aren't playing golf. :eek:

Gremlin,
I have been reading your posts lately, and I have formed my opinion.
You are no pool fan. Not quite sure how to categorize you, except as some freaky stalker of women pool players.
DCC is THE premier tournament in pool today.
The US open is THE most coveted title in pool.
Go follow women's tennis and leave pool to the fans.

PS. - watching pool on television is what brought me to the sport.
I assume some snooker playing wretched woman was your first (and only)piece. Maybe that's what brought you to the sport. :confused:
That may explain

Kerry Impson
04-12-2005, 12:25 PM
That's true, DDKoop; below I've listed just the earnings for the women so far this year, taken from the WPBA Web site (updated 4/6/05):

1 Allison Fisher $69300
2 Karen Corr $68200
3 Julie Kelly $36800
4 Jeanette Lee $40600
5 Gerda Hofstatter $33600
6 Monica Webb $29100
7 Vivian Villarreal $27900
8 Kelly Fisher $25850
9 Ga Young Kim $29200
10 Helena Thornfeldt $25100
11 Tiffany Nelson $24350
12 Melissa Herndon $24900

It drops below $20,000 after #12, but that's not bad money and most of these players also have sponsors to help with expenses (and there are five more events this year). I know it's a tough way to make a living even with sponsors, but it's slowly and surely getting better. Compared to 20 or 30 years ago when first place in women's pro events was, like, $400, we've come a long way, baby!! :)

JAM
04-12-2005, 01:25 PM
That's true, DDKoop; below I've listed just the earnings for the women so far this year, taken from the WPBA Web site (updated 4/6/05):...1 Allison Fisher $69300....12 Melissa Herndon $24900...
Compared to 20 or 30 years ago when first place in women's pro events was, like, $400, we've come a long way, baby!! :)

Those are very impressive stats provided by the WPBA website. It's nice to see one of AzBilliards' resident pros' (Melissa Herndon) name in the top 12, too! :)

It is my understanding that one of the bonuses of sanctioning with the men's governing body of professional pool is that the INDEPENDENT promoter(excluding Dragon Promotions) would be GUARANTEED the participation of the UPA Touring Pros.

It must have been very disappointing for the promoter of the Hilton-sponsored NAOT to have such a small turnout attend the first two legs of this tour ($20,000 added to each event), after he agreed to have his first two tournaments sanctioned by the UPA. As a result, the NAOT has turned its back on professional pool and is going to make a go of it with the amateur pool-playing public, and I wish them every success.

The WPBA has a fine product to offer, and it looks to me like they follow through with their commitment: providing top lady players to the independent promoter's events.

Non-participation by members of the men's professional organization is a deterrent for other non-pool-related sponsors to jump on the professional pool band wagon. It is difficult to deliver a product when the product is dwindling. In an ideal world, the UPA could make an effort to create a membership organization which would be attractive to aspiring players and independent promoters (excluding Dragon Promotions) alike. The independent promoters would be happy, the players would be happy, and pool in these United States of America would benefit.

I was very pleased to read the press release by Matchroom Sport to include the U.S. Open champion as a player in the upcoming WPC as opposed to solely relying on the flawed ranking system which used to be the ONLY qualifying criteria for American players. If something doesn't change, I agree with Gremlin that folks should be addressing their concerns to the BCA itself, IMHO.

BTW, gotta say it again, it's GREAT seeing Melissa Herndon's name in the Top 12 of the WPBA! :)

JAM

1pocket
04-12-2005, 01:34 PM
<snip> I know it's a tough way to make a living even with sponsors, but it's slowly and surely getting better. Compared to 20 or 30 years ago when first place in women's pro events was, like, $400, we've come a long way, baby!! :)And the men might, too, IF they could finally come up with some leadership that took a teamwork approach to building something really big together, instead of trying to 'build' by chipping away at their few successful 'competitors'
:confused:

JAM
04-12-2005, 02:13 PM
And the men might, too, IF they could finally come up with some leadership that took a teamwork approach to building something really big together, instead of trying to 'build' by chipping away at their few successful 'competitors'....

That's a mighty big IF, 1pocket! And I not only agree with you 100 percent, but I would like to see it become a reality.

Again, any and all concerns or opinions about the current state of affairs relating to the sanctioning authority in men's professional pool should be addressed to the appropriate source who can EFFECT a change for the better. Billiard Congress of America is the granting entity which gives sanctioning power to an organization in the U.S., just as Gremlin described in an earlier post!

I also agree with Gremlin that paying $100 to become a so-called "professional" a/k/a "touring pro" is not the way most professional membership organizations work in sports. Aspiring players who want to go pro usually have to qualify in order to be classified as a "professional" (IMO).

JAM

Nostroke
04-12-2005, 02:49 PM
That's true, DDKoop; below I've listed just the earnings for the women so far this year, taken from the WPBA Web site (updated 4/6/05):

1 Allison Fisher $69300
2 Karen Corr $68200
3 Julie Kelly $36800
4 Jeanette Lee $40600
5 Gerda Hofstatter $33600
6 Monica Webb $29100
7 Vivian Villarreal $27900
8 Kelly Fisher $25850
9 Ga Young Kim $29200
10 Helena Thornfeldt $25100
11 Tiffany Nelson $24350
12 Melissa Herndon $24900

It drops below $20,000 after #12, but that's not bad money and most of these players also have sponsors to help with expenses (and there are five more events this year). I know it's a tough way to make a living even with sponsors, but it's slowly and surely getting better. Compared to 20 or 30 years ago when first place in women's pro events was, like, $400, we've come a long way, baby!! :)

Those are not year to date earnings-there have only been 3 tournaments this year and if you won them all you would have earned $30K give or take 4K and no one did that.

Those I'm sure are the earnings that relate to the Rankings which are taken from the LAST 10 tournaments or the last year and one quarter!!Now take away the $500 entry per tournament that everyone must pay- no exceptions and there isnt enough to go around for more than the top 3-4 at best.

Kerry Impson
04-12-2005, 03:21 PM
Oops! You are both right - those were 10-tournament results. I stand corrected. :(

Now take away the $500 entry per tournament that everyone must pay- no exceptions and there isnt enough to go around for more than the top 3-4 at best.I doubt very many of these players are paying the entry fee out of their own pockets; most have sponsorships/endorsements which at least cover the entry fee. I figure that if a player's entry fee is paid and she wins only one match, she can break even (hotel room, food, airfare and miscellaneous expenses are probably less than $550, which is payout for 33rd-48th place). Of course, the goal isn't to break even, but most of these players aren't trying to raise a family so I think the "poverty level" term can be misleading.

Year-to-date earnings (Top 20):

1 Allison Fisher $53000
2 Karen Corr $63000
3 Jeanette Lee $41000
4 Julie Kelly $32325
5 Gerda Hofstatter $24200
6 Ga Young Kim $26200
7 Monica Webb $20725
8 Melissa Herndon $20700
9 Vivian Villarreal $18200
10 Jennifer Barretta $16350
11 Helena Thornfeldt $17100
12 Hsin Huang $14450
13 Sarah Ellerby $13800
14 Tiffany Nelson $14250
15 Melissa Little $14050
16 Romana Dokovic $13100
17 Jennifer Chen $14000
18 Sarah Rousey $11725
19 Kim Shaw $12050
20 Jeannie Seaver $10125

(Hey JAM, now it looks even better for the AZB pros!!) ;)

Nostroke
04-12-2005, 03:36 PM
Oops! You are both right - those were 10-tournament results. I stand corrected. :(

I doubt very many of these players are paying the entry fee out of their own pockets; most have sponsorships/endorsements which at least cover the entry fee. I figure that if a player's entry fee is paid and she wins only one match, she can break even (hotel room, food, airfare and miscellaneous expenses are probably less than $550, which is payout for 33rd-48th place). Of course, the goal isn't to break even, but most of these players aren't trying to raise a family so I think the "poverty level" term can be misleading.

Year-to-date earnings (Top 20):

1 Allison Fisher $53000
2 Karen Corr $63000
3 Jeanette Lee $41000
4 Julie Kelly $32325
5 Gerda Hofstatter $24200
6 Ga Young Kim $26200
7 Monica Webb $20725
8 Melissa Herndon $20700
9 Vivian Villarreal $18200
10 Jennifer Barretta $16350
11 Helena Thornfeldt $17100
12 Hsin Huang $14450
13 Sarah Ellerby $13800
14 Tiffany Nelson $14250
15 Melissa Little $14050
16 Romana Dokovic $13100
17 Jennifer Chen $14000
18 Sarah Rousey $11725
19 Kim Shaw $12050
20 Jeannie Seaver $10125

(Hey JAM, now it looks even better for the AZB pros!!) ;)

I don't know what that is but it isnt YTD either. As i said there have only been 3 tournaments and top prize has been 10K in each. Allison has probably made 22K and Kelly F is probably next with about 17.5

Note that Kelly F isn't even on your list!

Kerry Impson
04-12-2005, 06:02 PM
I don't know what that is but it isnt YTD either. As i said there have only been 3 tournaments and top prize has been 10K in each. Allison has probably made 22K and Kelly F is probably next with about 17.5

Note that Kelly F isn't even on your list!Well, you may be right - it sure doesn't seem correct, does it? But I copied it from the WPBA Web site at this link: http://www.wpba.com/cms/?pid=1002945 "Player Year-to-Date Rankings"

Incidentally, Kelly Fisher is ranked #22 on that list with $8350 in prize money.

sjm
04-12-2005, 06:13 PM
My understanding of the money listed in the WPBA.com rankings is that it is all money earned in the period of pertinence to the rankings. That would mean the period of time since the tenth most recent WPBA rankings event. I believe the figure would include all money earned in WPBA sanctioned events, meaning money won in WPBA events, WPBA regional tour events, and other fully sanctioned events.

I'm not sure whether money won at the Amway Cup or in the Challenge of Champions would count.

jjinfla
04-12-2005, 06:13 PM
In 2005 Allison Fisher won $20,000 and Kelly Fisher won $7500. To see the 2005 payouts go to Mike's home page and look under players.

Jake

jjinfla
04-12-2005, 06:49 PM
Plus the winner of the US Open and members of the Mosconi Cup and a person named Earl Strickland.

Jake

Nostroke
04-12-2005, 08:27 PM
Well, you may be right - it sure doesn't seem correct, does it? But I copied it from the WPBA Web site at this link: http://www.wpba.com/cms/?pid=1002945 "Player Year-to-Date Rankings"

Incidentally, Kelly Fisher is ranked #22 on that list with $8350 in prize money.

I think that the WPBA likes to "act as if" when it comes to how they portray their success. In fact I know it.

No one enjoys the tournaments as much as I but IMHO they continually try to paint a picture that just isn't there. It may be better than it was but it isnt really anywhere yet.

In fact when they had Gordons as a sponsor- weren't there more tournaments and bigger purses for a smaller field? SJM should know the answer to that one.

cardiac kid
04-12-2005, 08:52 PM
OK now, lets get back to the original premise of this thread. The dates for the DCC and the Bicycle UPA event. In past years, the DCC was held the third full week in the month of January. The Bicycle was held the first full week in January last year and scheduled for that time frame next year. Perhaps someone here should ask Greg Sullivan why he scheduled the DCC on the UPA weekend! I think you have it backwords!!!!! :confused:

By the way, I still think forcing the regional tours to bow to the demands of the UPA is rediculous. I understand the need for one governing body. Holding a gun to the heads of the regional promoters is not going to achieve that result. I ask one simple question. What will the regional tours get in return for a UPA sanction? Think long and hard before you answer!

BazookaJoe
04-13-2005, 04:13 AM
Joe,

You type like a reactionary fool. The US Open got in trouble because the cash didn't equal the payouts and the local John Laws were looking for publicity in an election year so they busted Berry who had been serving alcohol to minors for years.

As far as i know a nice guy like Danny Herriman still hasn't been paid the money that is owed him by Berry. So I have a different perception of the US Open than you. I will never see it or even think about it.

The DCC as of right now has no pro women just like Valley Forge so I will never go to them again till the pro women are back. I came to this game (It's not a sport) because I love it. The Tokyo 9-Ball was the greatest tournament in the history of pool and my first tournament. Ever since then all greedy pool people have been doing is destroying it. You stick the DCC and the US Open you know where. Don't let the pool promoters get you by your N.U.T.S. :p

Great!!!
Sounds like I will never have to run into you at either event.
You stand up to those greedy tyrants!
We should run pool without promoters (damn tyrants!)
Or ONLY go with Dragon events. Yeah, cause Charlie is doing what's good for pool. Yeaaah.
My post was not a reaction spurred by one post. It was something cooked from the ingredients you have bee providing for some while now.

PS - You spelled everyone's name wrong.

PPS -You're a wanker

Mike Templeton
04-13-2005, 05:33 AM
Don't let the pool promoters get you by your N.U.T.S. :p
You're still out there, but this is a pretty funny quote :) .

Mike

Greg/Diamond
04-15-2005, 06:34 PM
OK now, lets get back to the original premise of this thread. The dates for the DCC and the Bicycle UPA event. In past years, the DCC was held the third full week in the month of January. The Bicycle was held the first full week in January last year and scheduled for that time frame next year. Perhaps someone here should ask Greg Sullivan why he scheduled the DCC on the UPA weekend! I think you have it backwords!!!!! :confused:

By the way, I still think forcing the regional tours to bow to the demands of the UPA is rediculous. I understand the need for one governing body. Holding a gun to the heads of the regional promoters is not going to achieve that result. I ask one simple question. What will the regional tours get in return for a UPA sanction? Think long and hard before you answer!
CardiacKid, Glad for the chance to explain about the dates.
PAST DCC's
1st DCC Jan 22 - Jan 30 1999
2nd DCC Feb 4 - Feb 12 2000
3rd DCC Jan 26 - Feb 3 2001
4th DCC Jan 4 - Jan 12 2002
5th DCC Jan 3 - Jan 11 2003
6th DCC Jan 16 - Jan 24 2004
7th DCC Jan 14 - Jan 22 2005
COMING DCC's
8th DCC Jan 6 - Jan 14 2006
9th DCC Jan 5 - Jan 13 2007
10th DCC Jan 4 - Jan 12 2008
TBA

The first 3 years were year by year contracts with the motel. As the event grew I signed a five year agreement. I've been jumping around in Jan avoiding a big farm show or home show, I'm not exactly sure which at this time. Anyway, other than the 2000 event I've been in Jan and will try and stay there. I've now signed another 5 year agreement thru 2011, but I can't tell you all the exact dates from memory. I'll definitely post them later on my web site for the DCC. The only reason I remember the next couple years is that they go down 1 day a year closer to New Years Eve and I have a hard time getting setup help during those dates......I know the 11th DCC will most likely go back to the middle of Jan......................
I'd like to say that there is no way I'd intensionally conflict with any event. Nor would I move them at the last minute in harms way. The 8th DCC for 2006 has been on the books since 2001! I wouldn't want to put any player in that spot. I must add that I'm COMPLETELY satisfied that Charlie Williams and the UPA DID NOT try to conflict with the DCC. I've heard that the UPA's dates are not in stone and every effort is being taken to fix things. I'm keeping my fingers crossed!....................
I'd like to add that Charlie has been very helpful the last few years at the DCC. He took on the job of selecting players overseas that I have been helping with entries and rooms as well providing me a list of the UPA points winners so I could do the same with players in the states. I'ts my job to try and get the best players I can at the DCC for the spectators as well as lesser players trying to win games against them. The short races and drueling format is tuff enough.....I must add that I'm honored the DCC is even mentioned along with events as the US Open, but I must say the DCC was not designed as a format for Pro Pool. It was designed by me to I guess I'll say "Please Me". I hope that doesn't sound selfish, It's just I wanted to try it my way!..................
I started to go into my feelings on the direction of the UPA, but I won't go into detail at this time. I'll only say I wish I could have had a chance to sanction with a pool players association ; then the date issue would not have happened!.............

Greg/Diamond

Tom In Cincy
04-15-2005, 07:54 PM
CardiacKid, Glad for the chance to explain about the dates.
PAST DCC's
1st DCC Jan 22 - Jan 30 1999
2nd DCC Feb 4 - Feb 12 2000
3rd DCC Jan 26 - Feb 3 2001
4th DCC Jan 4 - Jan 12 2002
5th DCC Jan 3 - Jan 11 2003
6th DCC Jan 16 - Jan 24 2004
7th DCC Jan 14 - Jan 22 2005
COMING DCC's
8th DCC Jan 6 - Jan 14 2006
9th DCC Jan 5 - Jan 13 2007
10th DCC Jan 4 - Jan 12 2008
TBA
Greg/Diamond

Greg,
With the growth factor included;
when the city of Louisville builds you a stadium for the 300 tables you need for the 10,000 pool players that signup for the 2012 event... I wish you luck.. the camera crews will probably take up 1000 rooms at the nearest hotel.

If you play pool and want to have the experience of you life... the DCC is the only place to be.

Nostroke
04-15-2005, 11:45 PM
I'd like to add that Charlie has been very helpful the last few years at the DCC. He took on the job of selecting players overseas that I have been helping with entries and rooms as well providing me a list of the UPA points so I could do the same with players in the states.
winners Greg/Diamond

Wait-Are you saying he gave you names that you had to pay entry fees and hotels for but you don't get sanctioning and you are calling this help?

cardiac kid
04-16-2005, 04:58 AM
Hi Greg,

Thanks for the reply. As you know, I have the greatest respect for you and your products. The original thread topic became a UPA bashing for their choice of dates. Only the UPA board knows why they sometimes choose conflict. The paid membership is in the dark. The DCC/Bicycle date conflict obviously has two sides. The interested posters on this thread are waiting to hear from the UPA. Given the choice of LA, Vegas for the 2006 electronics show or the DCC, I'm in Louisville!!!!!!!!!!

Mike Zuglan's Joss Northeast Tour recently scheduled a $25,000 added event at the Turning Stone Casino and Hotel for the last weekend in August. I'm waiting to see if a schedule conflict suddenly pops up for that event. Anyway, I'm looking forward to seeing you somewhere in Vegas next month. Thanks for doing what you do best.