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SGTLARSEN
05-03-2009, 05:45 PM
95224

95225

95226Hello All,
I am a newbie to this site. I would like to thank everyone in advance for the help, and for me bugging you all.
I have a old Brunswick pool table (Brass Plate says Brunswick Regulation Billiard table).. I am trying to find some info out about it. Name of table, what type of pocket Irons I need (I have 1 that is broke, but I can use it still if need be)?

I need to order new Cushions (the Brass plate says The Worlds Famous Monarch Cushions). K55 Cushions I have been told is what I need.



I have done some research online. And do not see any table that is exactly like my table.. The 20th century close
http://www.brunswickbilliards.com/our_rich_history/antique_tables/twentiethcentury.html

(but the legs are different/ rounded on outsides i think),

Also the Metropolitan is closer http://www.brunswickbilliards.com/our_rich_history/antique_tables/metropolitan.html(but the legs look slanted on the Picture, and my legs are square).


Also the Serial Number under the rails is V4004,
And I found another Serial number on the base 4 1/2 X 9 PB4186 (the 1 in the serial number might not be a 1). I think the base is not the original Base. I could be wrong?

Any help would be greatly Appreciated Thank you for your help.



PS Ken from Classic Billiards has been a big help

muttley76
05-03-2009, 06:02 PM
I think you may have hit the nail on the head. You often see some of the old tables with new legs, or even frames, if they can mate. They just look too different, but it is possible that they may have just been repainted, or even the top rail could have been refinished. Good luck, though.

Tbeaux
05-03-2009, 06:23 PM
I think you've identified the right table. It looks like it's going to need some new veneer. As for the pocket irons you'll have to measure them and probably get new leathers for all of them if you're going to restore it.
Here is a link to the different pocket iron measurements, the Brunswick site says they should be #5 or #6 or #7.
http://www.poolndarts.com/94-American-Made-Iron-Leathers/

How is the iron broke? The iron may be fine and the bolt(s) could be broken.

Terry

TX Poolnut
05-03-2009, 06:28 PM
Where has she been all these years?

I'm kinda curious about the tables story.

muttley76
05-03-2009, 06:53 PM
Anything you need, check with Blatt Billiards or www.classicbilliards.com. Both are pretty good at finding the tough stuff.

chin0
05-03-2009, 07:34 PM
Cool table, love those elephant leg antique tables. But it doesn't look like you have enough clearance from all sides to play comfortably. Anyhow, hope to see it restored, and welcome to the forum :)

KOINNKID
05-03-2009, 07:35 PM
Ken Hash at pooltableparts.com 410-256-8388 He will have info or the parts you need.

SGTLARSEN
05-04-2009, 05:13 AM
952611st off thanks for the input…
Muttley: Clowns are SCARY. Lol Thank you
Tbeaux: The Pocket Iron is Broke where the bolt Threads through it.
Txpoolnut: So there I was surfing E-bay. The table caught my Eye. 1 I don’t have a lot of money. 2 It was somewhat close. 3 I like antiques. So I e-mail the Lady and tell her if the Auction does not end I would be interested. I tell her I’m in the Army, she says she will sale it to me for $300 because she really appreciates what I do for the country. The Table has been sitting in her Garage for 25-30 Years her Children use to play but for the last 15-20 yrs it has just sat there. She got it from a gentleman that got divorced; he sold everything to spite his ex? That’s about all I know about the table.
Chin0: I have just re-veneered 2 of the 4 legs. This is a great project that is less complicated then I thought. What do you mean by not enough Clearance?
Koinnkid: Yes I have spoke with ken and he is great.
Table $300
Truck rental $100
Veneer $200
Chrome $200
Leather $350
Cloth/Cushions $350
Misc $100
Total $1600
Hopefully it is worth it?

jay helfert
05-04-2009, 05:34 AM
Looks kind of like a Sport King from the 40's maybe. If you can find a good one, it usually sells for around $1,500. Hope that helps.
That funky old table is probably heavier than a Gold Crown. :)

SGTLARSEN
05-04-2009, 05:33 PM
Jay: Thank You the top is nothing like the sports king I have seen. The bottom is similar... again thanks for everyones help..

chin0
05-04-2009, 06:47 PM
Looking good, keep us posted on how everything goes. There are plenty of great knowledgable folks on here that could be a lot of help to you and your table. What I mean by clearance is, the play area around the table. I don't know if I am correct, but I remember reading somewhere that you should have 6 foot clearance on each side of the table to be able to place on the table comfortably. Just thought I'd mention that to you, because it doesn't seem like you have enough space around to clear the cue and it would get very very annoying when you play to always have to jack your cue up to shoot. It would completely piss me off lol. Good luck buddy.

n10spool
05-04-2009, 06:50 PM
I think your right on with it being a century table table was made for 15+ years. The trim bands are missing from moving, water damage, alot things happen to them. Most of these tables are painted because they were used in the military most most associate them or call them libety tables aas a group name even though its a different table but from the same years. Most were painted that llight tawny brown like the sport kings or were painted olive drab, most of these type tables were painted because it was easy to clean up and sell then to match veeners in color and thickness. This is why so many old brunswick comand high prices.

Your pockets I belive should be #6 irons but measure and compare to the charts @ www.poolndarts.com it should help you. Ken @ www.classicbilliards.net has alot of parts most are not on his website yet and he is real nice to deal with.

Craig

SGTLARSEN
05-05-2009, 08:49 AM
chino: “Play area” I gotcha now, I am kind of slow sometimes… lol The Pictures are of the place I picked it up from. I have played in houses where there is not enough room to shoot and it does make you highly upset.
The Pictures are of the place I picked it up from. I have played in houses where there is not enough room to shoot and it does make you highly upset.

n10spool: Thanks for the help.. I never thought about it being a military table. That actually makes a lot of sense to me. Trim bands I am planning on doing them in walnut to match the Legs and rest of the veneer. and the muller website(production plant) is state of the art...


Again thanks everyone for your help.

scruffy1
05-05-2009, 05:08 PM
I think your right on with it being a century table table was made for 15+ years. The trim bands are missing from moving, water damage, alot things happen to them. Most of these tables are painted because they were used in the military most most associate them or call them libety tables aas a group name even though its a different table but from the same years. Most were painted that llight tawny brown like the sport kings or were painted olive drab, most of these type tables were painted because it was easy to clean up and sell then to match veeners in color and thickness. This is why so many old brunswick comand high prices.

Your pockets I belive should be #6 irons but measure and compare to the charts @ www.poolndarts.com it should help you. Ken @ www.classicbilliards.net has alot of parts most are not on his website yet and he is real nice to deal with.

Craig

Craig, these tables do not use #6 irons, they actually use a iron specifically for this table. They are actually called 20th century irons.
there is so many older irons it gets confusing!:)

muttley76
05-05-2009, 07:35 PM
Looks kind of like a Sport King from the 40's maybe. If you can find a good one, it usually sells for around $1,500. Hope that helps.
That funky old table is probably heavier than a Gold Crown. :)



I was thinking that it looked like a mix. Sport King, but with the corner castings being more similar to a Centennial or Anniversary(in terms of pattern, with the ribbed metal).

TATE
05-05-2009, 07:48 PM
Here's a scan of the 1939 catalog:


http://www.palmercollector.com/Brunswick1939.html

According to the catalog above, the ball rack slots were optional on the 20th century. This one shown on page 3 has got to be close. The logo is pretty well consistent with the time period. Maybe you can check the details in the catalog to see if it's the right time frame. I have other catalogs I haven't scanned yet.

Chris

DeepBanks
05-05-2009, 08:01 PM
Ken Hash at pooltableparts.com 410-256-8388 He will have info or the parts you need.

Helped me get NEW parts for my 59 Brunswick Sport King . . . AZ'er . . . very knowledgeable . . . recommended.

SGTLARSEN
05-06-2009, 03:33 PM
Thanks again... Now how about the Serial number??? Does anyone have a book or anything? to verify the serial numbers.

Does anyone have an adobe copy of the Brunswick Table moderazation manual
That is pictured on bottom left of this page?
http://billiardrestoration.com/Antique-Pool-Table-Hall-of-Shame/index.htm


Thanks again everyone. and on another note gotta go try and Eat a 2 lb Steak... anyone ever done it before????

TX Poolnut
05-06-2009, 04:23 PM
From the Brunswick site:

"Archival information on post-1945 tables: Contact us with your table's model name (Celebrity, VIP, Monarch, etc.) We regret that there are no serial number archives at Brunswick, so numbers stamped anywhere on table parts will not lead to historical data. Archival data at Brunswick is available by model name only."

LINK: http://www.brunswickbilliards.com/index.php?t=q_a/faq_text&q_a_type_id=10&q_a_front_id=27

Tbeaux
05-06-2009, 04:59 PM
From the Brunswick site:

"Archival information on post-1945 tables: Contact us with your table's model name (Celebrity, VIP, Monarch, etc.) We regret that there are no serial number archives at Brunswick, so numbers stamped anywhere on table parts will not lead to historical data. Archival data at Brunswick is available by model name only."

LINK: http://www.brunswickbilliards.com/index.php?t=q_a/faq_text&q_a_type_id=10&q_a_front_id=27

This is correct. My understanding is some (many?) years ago the Brunswick factory and headquarters went through a major flood and practically all records were lost.

SGTLARSEN
11-15-2009, 10:59 AM
my 20th century (I think its a 20th century top) all most complete. I still have to do the blinds/aprons..


Things I did or had done

860HR
new cushions
Shields re-chromed
Bronze corners polished
Hood Leather pockets
re-veneered whole frame
stripped, sanded, staind, lacquer rails
replaced brass nameplate, and polished
replaced 1 missing mother of pearl inlay
made new feet
................AND A WHOLE LOT OF MONEY GONE..................................

jimmyg
11-15-2009, 11:12 AM
Table looks absolutely great...good luck with it. Nice looking family also. :ok:

Jim

SGTLARSEN
11-15-2009, 11:19 AM
Thanks for the compliments on the table. and the family was just a paid stage family.. lol

cant wait tell its complete.

Quesports
11-15-2009, 11:22 AM
WOW the table is way cool. You did an excellent job and the next generation looks to be enjoying the fruits of your labor. Great thread!!!
Enjoy!
Dan

SGTLARSEN
11-16-2009, 07:52 AM
Thank You.. Yes the kids really love it.. I Just dont like letting them play when im not down there..