PDA

View Full Version : WPBA crowd at it again


mantis99
03-26-2011, 09:31 AM
I was watching the WPBA masters event that I DVR'd from ESPN. It seemed like the crowd had stopped clapping after EVERY shot in more recent tournaments, but the clapping returned for this event. I can only assume the crowd is instructed to do this, but it is terribly annoying. I certainly think that acknowledging a good shot with clapping is appropriate, but they clap after even the most mundane shots and position plays. It makes the crowd seem less knowledgeable about what it takes to play the game. I imagine I am not the only one annoyed by this as I have seen threads about this on here before. I would love to see the producers of these events stop this ridiculous practice.

TX Poolnut
03-26-2011, 09:36 AM
Yes, the crowd is instructed to do it and yes, it is stupid.

I'm all for the crowd getting into the game, but even my mother knows how stupid clapping for simple shots is.

It doesn't improve from the viewing experience at the venue or on TV. It detracts from the program.

justadub
03-26-2011, 09:40 AM
................

TX Poolnut
03-26-2011, 09:42 AM
I didn't watch the Shane/ Earl match, but clapping for simple shots is stupid whether it's men or women playing.

justadub
03-26-2011, 09:46 AM
...................

mantis99
03-26-2011, 10:01 AM
I seemed to notice a lot of applause between shots during the Earl/SVB match. Didn't keep track of whether it was every shot, but it sure seemed like it was quite often. Does that bother you as much as the ladies televised matches? (Asked sincerely, not as a poke.)

.

The post itself pertained to the ladies matches. I think that applauding after simple shots diminishes the value of applauding after truely good shots. It also makes the crowd look less knowledgeable about the game. If they only clapped at truely good shots, or position plays, viewers that don't know a lot about pool would better be able to tell when something truely special has just happened.

Rob_jerrylee
03-26-2011, 10:03 AM
Believe me I was at the WPBA Masters Event and Steve Tipton instructed us to clap after ever shot , by the time the first semi final got done my hands hurt like hell . It was a nice event since it was close by for me . One thing I did noticed was they spliced the footage of the crowd , I seen my self a few time and every time they would show the spot where I was at I was in a different place each time . Other than that god for sakin clappin it was great .

I got to meet Kelly Fisher , Monica Webb , Ga Young Kim , Dawn Hopkins , and Jasmin . So it was cool :thumbup:

mantis99
03-26-2011, 10:04 AM
Funny. Many times when we lament why pool isn't as popular as we'd like, TV is often mentioned as a reason, either cause or effect. And very often comparrisons with golf are made (likely because of the individual player aspect, and the tournament style of play). Also, when professionalism is discussed, golf is again thrown into the conversation.

Pro Golf is quite popular, both on TV and in person, as the galleries are rather large.

They applaud after the most basic of "gimmie" putts. And every other shot, as well.

I guess I consider it respect, both for the players and their abilities, and in general, like how we applaud any sort of public performance, be they sporting or otherwise.

Like I said, funny.

This is a good post. However, I think that the gallery applauds after a simple putt in response to the entire hole that was just played. They won't really applaud after a short bogey putt, but they will after a short or long birdie putt (or a par put on a tough hole for that matter). That would be kind of similar to the crowd applauding after making a straight in 9 ball to end a run out.

I think it is more disrespectful to applaud a professional for correctly performing a very simple part of their profession, as if the had done something that was not very easy to them. Save the applause for time that it is really deserved.

mantis99
03-26-2011, 10:06 AM
Believe me I was at the WPBA Masters Event and Steve Tipton instructed us to clap after ever shot , by the time the first semi final got done my hands hurt like hell . It was a nice event since it was close by for me . One thing I did noticed was they spliced the footage of the crowd , I seen my self a few time and every time they would show the spot where I was at I was in a different place each time . Other than that god for sakin clappin it was great .

I got to meet Kelly Fisher , Monica Webb , Ga Young Kim , Dawn Hopkins , and Jasmin . So it was cool :thumbup:

That's awesome that yo uahd such a great experience. Why does Tipton think the clapping is necessary. Hasn't anyone brought these concerns up to him. He obviously does a lot for pool, but I think this one should change. Their must be a lot of people that dislike it as the thread about it come up on here fairly frequently.

Rob_jerrylee
03-26-2011, 10:11 AM
That's awesome that yo uahd such a great experience. Why does Tipton think the clapping is necessary. Hasn't anyone brought these concerns up to him. He obviously does a lot for pool, but I think this one should change. Their must be a lot of people that dislike it as the thread about it come up on here fairly frequently.

I got to Meet Steve has well and he's a pretty down to earth guy , In my opinion he's probably thinkin the clapping will make pool on espn more appealing . Just a thought .

Nostroke
03-26-2011, 10:24 AM
I have been to more than 30 live WPBA events, maybe 50 and at none of those did anyone instruct the crowd to clap after every shot. Yes-they ask you to "show enthusiasm" and Steve will generally point out that a "great safe" is something to clap for. Thats as far as it ever went but the crowd still clapped after every shot.

thuglife520
03-26-2011, 10:46 AM
Baretta vs. Ouscan race to 100 in bikini's and I will find a way to applaud good play!

itsfroze
03-26-2011, 11:55 AM
I got to Meet Steve has well and he's a pretty down to earth guy , In my opinion he's probably thinkin the clapping will make pool on espn more appealing . Just a thought .

Does MR. Tipton think that showing showing little colored pool balls at the bottom of the screen also make the matches ( or I should say partial matches ) more appealing . You know what I'm talking about they show which player made which balls during each game by putting the little colored pool balls that each player made by thier names. Since it only matters who makes the 9 ball to determin the winner why on earth would you do this if you were concerned with people unfimiliar with the game , trying to understand what is going on. Why confuse things for new viewers or new players of the game by doing this when it means nothing? That was almost as good idea as the pocket cam, how down to earth is he? I won't even watch ESPN any more!!!

jay helfert
03-26-2011, 01:14 PM
I have been to many WPBA events, both as a spectator and as a reporter. I clap on good shots and not on others. I don't need anyone to tell me when to clap. Hello!

TX Poolnut
03-26-2011, 01:17 PM
I have been to many WPBA events, both as a spectator and as a reporter. I clap on good shots and not on others. I don't need anyone to tell me when to clap. Hello!

You must spread some reputation around before giving it to jay helfert again.

LAMas
03-26-2011, 01:39 PM
I have been to every WPBA event in Viejas, CA but I only went to the ESPN filmed finals once because of the theatrics. In the early matches, the bring in a bus load of retired seniors who don't know what they are watching....for free to fill the gallery. A nice jesture and necessary.

The first time I went to the Mosconi Cup in Vegas several years ago, I could only stand one session because of the cheerleaders, and moving the spectators down in front of the cameras.

Nostroke
04-11-2011, 08:58 AM
My credentials

Melissa Herndon
04-11-2011, 02:16 PM
I have been to more than 30 live WPBA events, maybe 50 and at none of those did anyone instruct the crowd to clap after every shot. Yes-they ask you to "show enthusiasm" and Steve will generally point out that a "great safe" is something to clap for. Thats as far as it ever went but the crowd still clapped after every shot.

This is quite correct...I have never heard anyone instruct the audience to clap after every shot. It just happens somehow. I think one or two people start it...and everyone just joins in. LOL.

Maybe crowds do it nowadays because they see other audiences do it when they watch the WPBA on ESPN...and they think it is the appropriate thing to do.

Melissa

Melissa Herndon
04-11-2011, 02:18 PM
Does MR. Tipton think that showing showing little colored pool balls at the bottom of the screen also make the matches ( or I should say partial matches ) more appealing . You know what I'm talking about they show which player made which balls during each game by putting the little colored pool balls that each player made by thier names. Since it only matters who makes the 9 ball to determin the winner why on earth would you do this if you were concerned with people unfimiliar with the game , trying to understand what is going on. Why confuse things for new viewers or new players of the game by doing this when it means nothing? That was almost as good idea as the pocket cam, how down to earth is he? I won't even watch ESPN any more!!!

Steve Tipton is a tournament director. He has no input on what gets shown on TV. And he certainly doesn't have anything to do with the graphics.

Melissa

Melissa Herndon
04-11-2011, 02:19 PM
My credentials

You don't have to prove anything to me...LOL. You've probably been to more than I have!!!!

Melissa

I love that pic btw. Awesome that you kept all of those credentials!

Nostroke
04-12-2011, 05:19 AM
You don't have to prove anything to me...LOL. You've probably been to more than I have!!!!

Melissa

I love that pic btw. Awesome that you kept all of those credentials!

I know i was there for your first big finish at the BCA- I was up in the balcony when someone (Jenny Lee?) next to me yelled "WAY TO GO MELISSA". It took you by surprise but you smiled, looked up and waved.

Anyway Thanks for chiming in- I've been the lone voice til now.

Melissa Herndon
04-12-2011, 11:34 AM
I know i was there for your first big finish at the BCA- I was up in the balcony when someone (Jenny Lee?) next to me yelled "WAY TO GO MELISSA". It took you by surprise but you smiled, looked up and waved.

Anyway Thanks for chiming in- I've been the lone voice til now.

I think it was Stefanie Boch (nee Nakagawa) :D

At that point in our history...I doubt Jenny Lee would have cheered for me...LOL.

Melissa

mantis99
04-12-2011, 02:00 PM
I really don't know why the crowds do this. The point is simply that it is very annoying to watch, and it would probably be a good idea to educate the crowd on the fact that they do not need to clap after every shot.

justadub
04-12-2011, 02:04 PM
I find it fascinating that applause at a televised event is so annoying to people.

Almost elitist. "The poor dumb audience doesn't know what to clap for..."

Nostroke
04-12-2011, 02:10 PM
I think it was Stefanie Boch (nee Nakagawa) :D

At that point in our history...I doubt Jenny Lee would have cheered for me...LOL.

Melissa

That's who it was. Havent seen her in so long. Outa sight, outa mind I guess.

mantis99
04-12-2011, 08:04 PM
I find it fascinating that applause at a televised event is so annoying to people.

Almost elitist. "The poor dumb audience doesn't know what to clap for..."

Interesting statement to call that elitist. It is both annoying and somewhat condescending in my opinion. To clap for a shot is generally done because the player has done something worth clapping for. To clap for a straight in stop shot seems condescending to me, as if the player had done something they couldn't normally do in their sleep. It also seems phony and forced, as even a novice pool player can tell what is a very simple shot, or a more difficult shot. Clapping for every shot also decreases the value of celebrating a truely good shot.

How can that be elitist? You clap because you understand that what just occured was somewhat special. To do so without reasonable cause puts forth the image of someone either truely not understanding what is going on, or trying to create an atmoshphere of more excitement than what is naturally there.

pwd72s
04-13-2011, 12:05 AM
Baretta vs. Ouscan race to 100 in bikini's and I will find a way to applaud good play!

Really? ;)

Nostroke
04-19-2011, 06:51 AM
I find it fascinating that applause at a televised event is so annoying to people.

Almost elitist. "The poor dumb audience doesn't know what to clap for..."

They really dont at most WPBA events. Im guessing more than half the crowd comes solely for a chance to get on TV. I once saw a crowd clapping on a deliberate foul which set up a 1-9 for her opponent.

justadub
04-19-2011, 07:02 AM
Interesting statement to call that elitist. It is both annoying and somewhat condescending in my opinion. To clap for a shot is generally done because the player has done something worth clapping for. To clap for a straight in stop shot seems condescending to me, as if the player had done something they couldn't normally do in their sleep. It also seems phony and forced, as even a novice pool player can tell what is a very simple shot, or a more difficult shot. Clapping for every shot also decreases the value of celebrating a truely good shot.

How can that be elitist? You clap because you understand that what just occured was somewhat special. To do so without reasonable cause puts forth the image of someone either truely not understanding what is going on, or trying to create an atmoshphere of more excitement than what is naturally there.

Yet we hear time and again how pool needs to attract more casual fans... Better make sure those folks who don't understand the game get properly educated as to what constitutes a shot worthy of applause, and which shots are supposed to be made and therefor the fan must sit still lest they be considered morons, and worthy of contempt.

(That seems elitist to me.)

Imagine a television program trying to create a sense of excitement in the arena... wow. Why oh why would TV producers ever want a sense of excitement in the arena where an event was taking place? You want the fans to sit quietly unless something "with reasonable cause" occurs? Yet folks boo hoo about pool not being televised.

Yep, that attitude will certainly help attract more casual fans to our sport.

Bigtruck
04-19-2011, 08:37 AM
My credentials

Is that a pair of reading glasses there in the middle? Wait, let me get mine. :shocked:

I love that pic. You are a loyal fan!

Ray

Str8PoolMan
04-19-2011, 09:31 PM
It's not that the crowd claps on every shot that bothers me. It's that they clap THE SAME for every shot. The applause level and enthusiasm never seems to vary whether it is a two-rail kick shot or a tap-in of a hanger.

I mean, come on. Even a casual fan can at least tell the difference between a difficult shot and an ultra-easy one. Or am I giving people too much credit? Surely, there's actual pool fans at a tournament who can tell the difference and adjust their enthusiasm accordingly. Yet, the applause meter never moves a hair.

The only time I hear any actual cheering from the crowd is during the introductions, or possibly after the match winning shot. If someone is "pumping up" the crowd before these televised matches, they are doing a very poor job.

Johnnyt
04-19-2011, 09:35 PM
Maybe ESPN puts the clapping in when/if they do the editing. Johnnyt

hippiepool2
04-19-2011, 09:38 PM
Maybe ESPN puts the clapping in wheen/if they do the editing. Johnnyt

That's a disturbing thought ............

mantis99
04-19-2011, 10:01 PM
Yet we hear time and again how pool needs to attract more casual fans... Better make sure those folks who don't understand the game get properly educated as to what constitutes a shot worthy of applause, and which shots are supposed to be made and therefor the fan must sit still lest they be considered morons, and worthy of contempt.

(That seems elitist to me.)

Imagine a television program trying to create a sense of excitement in the arena... wow. Why oh why would TV producers ever want a sense of excitement in the arena where an event was taking place? You want the fans to sit quietly unless something "with reasonable cause" occurs? Yet folks boo hoo about pool not being televised.

Yep, that attitude will certainly help attract more casual fans to our sport.

You have been a little bit defensive about this whole thing from the start, almost as if you have some stake in it. You are blowing the original statement way out of proportion. A simple statement that people should only clap when there is actually a reason to do so is not cause for someone to get this upset. Clapping on every shot certainly does not create a sense of excitement. It creates a sense that the audience either is not very knowledgeable about the game, or that their reaction has been solicited and is not genuine.

When anything is falsified, it creates some irritation in those that truely participate in that function. Trying to increase the excitement level is one thing, but getting so far away from real as to clap after EVERY shot is another thing that looks completely produced, and one that I personally takes more away than it adds. Just my opinion!

mantis99
04-19-2011, 10:03 PM
Maybe ESPN puts the clapping in when/if they do the editing. Johnnyt

You can generally see the crowd clapping inthe backround

Johnnyt
04-19-2011, 11:32 PM
You can generally see the crowd clapping inthe backround

Well that shoots down that thery then. Johnnyt

justadub
04-20-2011, 05:53 AM
You have been a little bit defensive about this whole thing from the start, almost as if you have some stake in it. You are blowing the original statement way out of proportion. A simple statement that people should only clap when there is actually a reason to do so is not cause for someone to get this upset. Clapping on every shot certainly does not create a sense of excitement. It creates a sense that the audience either is not very knowledgeable about the game, or that their reaction has been solicited and is not genuine.

When anything is falsified, it creates some irritation in those that truely participate in that function. Trying to increase the excitement level is one thing, but getting so far away from real as to clap after EVERY shot is another thing that looks completely produced, and one that I personally takes more away than it adds. Just my opinion!

I'm not upset at all. Sorry if I come off as defensive, as you are correct, I don't have any direct stake in it. But we all, as pool players, ought to be thankful for what pool coverage we do get on TV here in the states. So we all do have a bit of a stake in it. And I find it interesting that people get so worked up about applause, and which shots should be applauded.

It's quite obvious that I'm not gonna win this argument, since I appear to be the only one (that will post) who finds it funny how pool players can wish for more TV coverage and then complain about spectators actually applauding the participants. It really doesn't matter what kind of shot they are applauding, they are appreciating the players and their performance.

To insist that spectators be better informed on what is a good shot versus one that is made in their sleep is foolish. EVERY routine play made in a professional baseball game is applauded. EVERY free throw that Ray Allen makes in his sleep is applauded. Every 2 foot putt that EVERY golfer makes on the PGA tour is applauded. The applause doesn't have to be specific to the difficulty of the task, it can merely be polite and appreciative. Like EVERY other televised performance.

That is how TV works. If we as pool players want more pool on TV, we shouldn't be complaining about the players being applauded too much.

Just my opinion... :p

Nostroke
04-20-2011, 06:19 AM
To insist that spectators be better informed on what is a good shot versus one that is made in their sleep is foolish. EVERY routine play made in a professional baseball game is applauded. EVERY free throw that Ray Allen makes in his sleep is applauded. Every 2 foot putt that EVERY golfer makes on the PGA tour is applauded. The applause doesn't have to be specific to the difficulty of the task, it can merely be polite and appreciative. Like EVERY other televised performance.

That is how TV works. If we as pool players want more pool on TV, we shouldn't be complaining about the players being applauded too much.

Just my opinion... :p

I hear ya but when a golfer makes that 2 foot putt, he has now posted a score and the BB player has scored also. The baseball team has attained a specific goal and ended an offensive attempt. It's not quite the same in my book-not to mention before the WPBA no one applauded routine shots-Were they rude?

justadub
04-20-2011, 06:22 AM
I hear ya but when a golfer makes that 2 foot putt, he has now posted a score and the BB player has scored also. The baseball team has attained a specific goal and ended an offensive attempt. It's not quite the same in my book-not to mention before the WPBA no one applauded routine shots-Were they rude?

No, it's just how televised sports have evolved. I guess.

TheBook
04-20-2011, 06:54 AM
That is one reason why pool will never be more than a fill in or a program that has to pay to be on.

I don't watch any pool on ESPN. There is too much good stuff on live stream that is available or other matches that are archived. Also find it better to buy DVDs from Accu Stats. The matches aren't edited, better commentary, and don't have that idiotic pocket camera. Plus I can choose what match I want to watch.

SCCues
04-20-2011, 07:21 AM
I was watching the WPBA masters event that I DVR'd from ESPN. It seemed like the crowd had stopped clapping after EVERY shot in more recent tournaments, but the clapping returned for this event. I can only assume the crowd is instructed to do this, but it is terribly annoying. I certainly think that acknowledging a good shot with clapping is appropriate, but they clap after even the most mundane shots and position plays. It makes the crowd seem less knowledgeable about what it takes to play the game. I imagine I am not the only one annoyed by this as I have seen threads about this on here before. I would love to see the producers of these events stop this ridiculous practice.

I couldn't agree with you more. Clapping for a good (tough) shot or a really good position shot is great, but for the crowd to clap when a player taps in a ball sitting in the jaws of the side pocket is ridiculous! I know I won't be missed by ESPN or the WPBA, but I can't watch pool with the audience clapping after every shot and it ruins the whole broadcast IMO.

James

3andstop
04-20-2011, 09:11 AM
I can't even watch those events because the damned clapping is so annoying. If no one is telling them to clap after every shot, perhaps someone should tell them not to instead. :idea:

Tom In Cincy
04-20-2011, 09:38 AM
This year is 2011. Most remote controls have a mute button.

If you don't like the clapping, HIT MUTE. :o

Simple huh? :wink:

I keep the sound turned off anyway...the announcers usually don't have anything worth hearing. :D

DShlemp
04-20-2011, 10:07 AM
I disagree if anyone says that any coverage is good coverage. If anything, this kind of coverage is detrimental to the game. I've had friends that don't know anything about pool watch WPBA matches and ask "why is everyone clapping for those easy shots?"
There are quite a few things wrong with WPBA coverage. The clapping for every shot is definitely one of those things. I think it's condescending to the women who play. Are we trying to say that they play so bad that every easy shot is an incredible feat for them? Hardly... But that's how it comes across. And as far as trying to build some excitement, no, if it looks fake and forced then the casual viewer will eventually pick up on it and realize that's it's really not all that exciting. Then you add the useless commentary and it's all down hill. There are way too many times that I've heard the female pro say something like "yeah, i'm not really sure what she should do here." And please don't get me started on Mitch Laurance. I agree with the graphics comment also, what does it matter who sunk which ball? And what exactly is the point of the pocket cam?
I'm sorry, but I would rather have no TV coverage at all then watch pool get dragged through the dirt like this. It's embarassing. And I would say the same thing if this is how they showed men's pool, but we don't really have to worry about that anymore, do we?
And there's no need to compare pool to golf or any other games, it needs to have it's own identity and reasons for clapping. Anyone who has watched an accu-stats or TAR match knows when it's appropriate to clap. A break and run, a tough shot with tough position, emaculate cue ball control on a shot or safety or a semi tough shot under pressure. I think this is standard stuff and for the casual viewer it would be way more educational and I believe would teach them how to properly appreciate the game.

Wags
04-20-2011, 10:25 AM
I don't care for how ESPN shows pool! I still have timers set for everytime pool is on. I don't watch it but....

I think that cable companies get feedback from what is being watched. If you have a "box", PPV access, etc. the companies are only stupid if they don't get that information. That will only tell them what shows/stations, etc. are the most popular and what to carry.

Hence, I think everyone should always turn the TV to pool, of any kind, that is being broadcast. It might help the ratings, competion among the stations and give us better programming of pool.

Just 'cause it's on the TV doesn't mean I have to watch it.

3andstop
04-20-2011, 10:35 AM
This year is 2011. Most remote controls have a mute button.

If you don't like the clapping, HIT MUTE. :o

Simple huh? :wink:


In this year of 2011 we also have over 200 other channels with sound. Is there anyone left in this year of 2011 with enough brains to tell the damned audience to shut the hell up?

itsfroze
04-20-2011, 11:32 AM
Steve Tipton is a tournament director. He has no input on what gets shown on TV. And he certainly doesn't have anything to do with the graphics.

Melissa

Something that I read on page one about him telling people to clap is why I thought it was him my mistake my apology to Steve, but not to the jack ass who came up with the griphics or the pocket cam ideas.