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View Full Version : CALL 9 vs WILD 9?


Porter
04-24-2003, 03:33 PM
There is a debate in our state association as to which to use.

I am in Arkansas.

What leagues or tournements are using the call 9?

What are the most widely used rules? BCA? Texas Express?

Our state has been playing call 9 for several years and there is a debate on wheather to keep it or go to the wild 9.


Opinions are appreciated.

Porter

1-P
04-24-2003, 03:53 PM
In my area it is mix of BCA and Texas Express. I would love to see the game go to all call 9, but it is seldom played that way.

1-P

1-P
04-24-2003, 04:10 PM
I find this a very interesting topic because it has come several times locally. Oddly enough, even those who complain about 9-ball being slop pool will not support a rule change for a called 9.

I think it is interesting that most pro tournaments don't use a called 9.

1-P

AzHousePro
04-24-2003, 04:13 PM
But how often does a top player really make a wild 9 when it is not on the break. I would be willing to bet that you could examine every match at an event like the US Open and not see one slopped in 9 if you didn't count the breaks.

Mike

1-P
04-24-2003, 04:22 PM
Originally posted by AzHousePro
But how often does a top player really make a wild 9 when it is not on the break. I would be willing to bet that you could examine every match at an event like the US Open and not see one slopped in 9 if you didn't count the breaks.

Mike

Good point, but you could make the same claim of most rules at the pro level. When was the last time you saw a three foul rule used in a pro tournament? And I have seen pro tournaments that did use the called 9.

I don't want to argue the point, I just find it odd.

1-P

AzHousePro
04-24-2003, 05:02 PM
I think a three foul happens more often than a slopped 9 amongst the pros. Not at the average bar players level, a slopped 9 happens many more times as often as a 3 foul.

Mike

Porter
04-24-2003, 05:02 PM
Mike

I have seen more than a few 9 balls spotted up in the past few years that we have had this rule , and by some pretty good players. Most often when a 1 rail turns into a 2 rail, or when a tough break out is being shot. Double kiss........

Our rule is that if the 9 goes in an uncalled pocket, and it is the only ball pocketed, then the 9 spots and the other player has an option to shot or pass it back. The Q ball is not moved, and it is not a foul. It is treated just like a push.

I don't like this rule because if any other ball is slopped, you keep shooting. But if you slop the 9, it gives the other player an advantage when a ball was made without a foul having accured.

Opinion?

Porter

Rickw
04-24-2003, 05:50 PM
Personally, I like the call-9 rule. There is more room for strategy in call-9. If I had to play a weaker player, I'd rather play him/her call-9. I play some people that also play carom pretty good. They ride the 9 better than most and it's not slop but they don't exactly call it either.

Rick

stick8
04-24-2003, 08:54 PM
Call 9 will benifit the better player, as In a rated tourny the begginers look to roll the 9 , o.k. on pro level .It is working o.k. why change? STICK

weelie
04-25-2003, 06:28 AM
Originally posted by 1-P
When was the last time you saw a three foul rule used in a pro tournament?
1-P

Howabout the last and final match of the latest pro tourney? :D

http://www.azbilliards.com/2000storya.cfm?storynum=845

joe666
04-25-2003, 06:29 AM
I'm in Arkansas too.

Everyone I know and play uses the call 9
calling your shots is the way to go IMOP
anyone can bust balls around the table and make one in
It take talent to call your shots and then pocket the ball.

jjinfla
04-25-2003, 06:37 AM
The wild 9 keeps the weaker players entering the weekly tournaments. By smashing the balls they think they have a better chance against the better players. And occassionaly it does work out that way. Jake

1-P
04-25-2003, 07:10 AM
Porter,

I gave this some thought last night after my initial response and realize there are two questions to be answered;

1. How would you like to see 9-ball played?
2. What rules do you want to play under?

To the first question, I would like to the rules changed to make 9-ball a call shot game, period. If 9-ball must be the Championship game of pool, then rules should reflect the fact that it is a game of skill, not slop. Whether it should be the Championship game is a topic of a whole other discussion, but assuming that it is, let's make it appear to be based on skill.

Regarding question 2, I would always want to see 9-ball played under the existing rules so that 9-ball doesn't end up like 8-ball with different rules in every room. BCA and Texas Express are very close, so take you pick and go with it, but I would not want to advocate any local rule changes that differ from those two.

So, my point is that I would advocate a rule change to make 9-ball a call shot game, but until that time, I would hope that 9-ball is played under the current rules.

Just my opinion.

1-P

Rich R.
04-25-2003, 08:43 AM
For any players rated C or above, calling the 9 would make very little difference in their game.
Other than on the breaks, most players know when they have a chance to make the 9 on a shot. Although some shots are low percentage, a player could still call the 9. There is no penalty for missing. Completely slopping in the 9, with no clue that it was going to happen, is very rare for any average player.

Rich R.

Kerry
04-25-2003, 09:19 AM
Originally posted by AzHousePro
But how often does a top player really make a wild 9 when it is not on the break. I would be willing to bet that you could examine every match at an event like the US Open and not see one slopped in 9 if you didn't count the breaks.

Mike

Actually, check out the 2002 US Open finals. I think this qualifies as a pro tournament. Alex Pagulayan most definitely slops a 9 in against Ralf Souquet. It definitely happens, though I agree rarely. I doubt it is enough to effect any outcomes (Pagulayan lost that match anyway). Still, no one likes a 9 slopped in against them, and I don't think any good player comes to the table hoping they can somehow slop it in. So why not have it called?

Kerry

cheesemouse
04-25-2003, 11:45 AM
Leave it wild...if it's call you will find players calling the nine on any shots where it only has the remotest chance of going but what the heck they might as well call it somewhere......I like it the way it is. When it's wild you don't have to explain yourself to every Tom, Dick and Harry.....:) :)

Kerry
04-25-2003, 12:34 PM
Cheesmouse,
You make a very good point. I can't say I have ever had a problem with the way it is. Honestly, I'd say the slop 9's I make these days are rare, as are the 9's that get slopped in against me. It would be very irritating to constantly have to call it. Plus, you might see something that your opponent doesn't. If you don't call it, you can be a little more relaxed about the shot, since if you totally miss the nine you can pretend you were not really trying for it ;-)

Kerry

LAMas
04-26-2003, 11:16 AM
We are proud of California cheese - slop the 9. The better player can get more matches if slop is allowed.

dennis
04-26-2003, 12:02 PM
Isnt slop an art form??especially when done by a master of the game.I always enjoy seeing a lesser player slop around the table only to "choke"on the money ball and lose,deserved justice?

weelie
04-30-2003, 02:40 AM
the possibility of a slop or a combinations for the 9 are there to draw the suckers in. Good players don't do neither (usually).

KASPER
04-30-2003, 10:56 AM
YOU CAN DOG IN 8 OTHER BALLS, BUT YOUR SUPPOSED
TO CALL THE NINE. NICE RULE!

HAVE NOT MET MANY PEOPLE THAT PLAY CALL NINE WHEN
GAMBLING. THAT WOULD JUST BRING UP MORE PROBLEMS.

torment
04-30-2003, 02:21 PM
sickening feeling to claw your way back into a race just to have your opponent slop the nine in 4 rails, 3 kisses later on the case game.....for any substantial wager, its GOTTA be call every shot, kinda like old school 8 ball, except ball in hand on scratches

maximillion
04-30-2003, 07:53 PM
since nine ball is such a gambling game and gambling includes some degree of luck, even in pool, wild nine only adds to the flavor

Chucklez65
05-01-2003, 05:26 AM
In my opinion:

The wild nineball takes the 'gamble' out of the game. Without it a lesser player would not have any incentive to play a better player - the only ones that want a call nineball format is the better player.

It sucks to lose to an opponent who rolled the cheese and it went in somewhere that no one expected...but that is part of the excitement of the game. Without it, you would not fill up the tournaments - at the amateur level anywayz - and it would be hard for anyone to get a proposition game with someone unless they wanted to play out of their level.

Anywayz....thats my humble opinion

Chuck

Rickw
05-01-2003, 07:32 AM
I played this guy one time and he was cheezin every chance he got and he had no idea where the nine might go. The game was a lot closer than it should have been and this guy was really thinking he was hot stuff. I asked him if he wanted to play call the nine and since he was on a high, he agreed immediately. I beat him to death! It really took the wind out of his sails.
I do agree with chucklez, though, if you want to gamble, you have to play the game with the nine wild. Sometimes the weaker players don't realize how big a difference there is between the two games.

Keith Legros
05-01-2003, 10:42 AM
I knew a guy that had:

"At all times keep your eye on the yellow stripe ball"

embroidered right on his shirt!

This guy would try any shot to slop the nine.

Most "entertaining" guy to watch at the hall.

P.S. There was always a line up to play this guy.

Also, it drove players nuts at how many times he would slop the nine.

Maybe it is an art?

torment
05-01-2003, 11:28 AM
it is true that there is usually a line to play these kind of whack-a-mole players....more often than not they end up broke, busted, disgusted, and not to be trusted after their initial lucky phase subsides....very good points by all, i feel fortunate to have stumbled upon this site

Porter
05-01-2003, 05:42 PM
I am still looking for the answer to this question from the players that are in support of call nine.

What is, or what should the rule be, when the 9 is the only ball pocketed and it was not the called pocket?

PORTER

jjinfla
05-01-2003, 05:53 PM
I just played in a league where it was call 9. If you call the 9 and it goes in the wrong pocket you lose. If you make the 9 and don't call it it gets spotted, loss of turn, other player plays CB where it stops. Jake

Chucklez65
05-02-2003, 05:27 AM
Ive played in a few cities and states and I have never yet been told the the rule of the house is call the 9ball. The only time it is ever even brought up is after a "better" player loses to someone that he believes he is not supposed to lose to on a "lucky" shot. So, in my experience, since you want an answer, is that the 9ball does not have to be called unless you want to make that rule prior to starting the match.

Chuck