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View Full Version : Where has the Billiards on tv gone?


dimonsterb
09-08-2013, 09:06 PM
I just don't get it!!! When I was younger and up until a few years ago pool was always on tv!!! Now hardly ever! Where has it gone? They still play the tournaments and even more so, so why not on tv anymore? Does any one have an answer for this??????
I just saying I like to watch some good matches on tv rather than streaming them!!!:angry::angry:

jockey
09-08-2013, 09:53 PM
it's on suscribed cable service, inbetween the infomercials :confused:

dimonsterb
09-08-2013, 10:00 PM
it's on suscribed cable service, inbetween the infomercials :confused:

Its not on Dish!

Bigtruck
09-08-2013, 10:01 PM
I just don't get it!!! When I was younger and up until a few years ago pool was always on tv!!! Now hardly ever! Where has it gone? They still play the tournaments and even more so, so why not on tv anymore? Does any one have an answer for this??????
I just saying I like to watch some good matches on tv rather than streaming them!!!:angry::angry:

I would love your input on something.

Do you prefer to see edited down matches that are recorded? I have considered only streaming the final day of tournaments but have found that a lot of good matches happen early on.

I have thought about doing some edited down recordings.

Thanks,

Ray

CJ Wiley
09-08-2013, 10:17 PM
I just don't get it!!! When I was younger and up until a few years ago pool was always on tv!!! Now hardly ever! Where has it gone? They still play the tournaments and even more so, so why not on tv anymore? Does any one have an answer for this??????
I just saying I like to watch some good matches on tv rather than streaming them!!!:angry::angry:

I just got word that pool is coming back on TV......it's been "on summer vacation" for the last 13 years.....'The Game is the Teacher'

I have a TV Match up from the Million Dollar Challenge Tournament at www.cjwiley.com

It's an "oldie," but a "goodie"......This match is the semi finals between Earl Strickland and myself, we will be putting the Finals up in a couple of weeks. SKY SPORTS TV is creating a documentary on Earl Strickland to lead in to this year's Mosconi Cup too.....things are getting ready to change in the world of Pocket Billiards and TV.

dimonsterb
09-08-2013, 10:25 PM
I would love your input on something.

Do you prefer to see edited down matches that are recorded? I have considered only streaming the final day of tournaments but have found that a lot of good matches happen early on.

I have thought about doing some edited down recordings.

Thanks,

Ray

I like to DVR them when on. A lot of the time I don't get to see streaming or when I do it gets cut short. Then I have to come back and find my spot were I left off. I'm just saying I wish ESPN would at least cover the final rounds like they use to back in the late 80's and early 90's and they usually came on a few times a week!!

CJ Wiley
09-08-2013, 10:39 PM
I like to DVR them when on. A lot of the time I don't get to see streaming or when I do it gets cut short. Then I have to come back and find my spot were I left off. I'm just saying I wish ESPN would at least cover the final rounds like they use to back in the late 80's and early 90's and they usually came on a few times a week!!

The tour I was involved in [PCA] did all the ESPN World Open and Ultimate 9 Ball Events in California and then Disney World in Orlando at the ESPN Club.

We did the ESPN Men's PCA events between 1996 and 1999 with the WPBA as well, we did thousands of International hours of broadcasting in those days.

I left the game in 1999 because of some political issues and submerged myself into the nightclub/pool room/restaurant businesses......it's interesting what happened from there, and sad at the same time. There was a formula that was working, however with Don Mackey and myself out of the picture there was no one to negotiate any TV Events except Matt Braun with the "Challenge of Champions" and a few Trick Shot Shows.

My position has always been that the men and women should play together, however, not everyone shared my opinion. I still think that's the recipe for success....to join forces and create more total synergy.

If You Want to see the TV Show I mentioned at www.cjwiley.com here's the FREE CODE to save the $5

Password: T2LKLM3CJ (Use this code to play the desired video/s on our website)
Expire date: 09 Sep 2013
Total Allowed Views: UNLIMITED
Ticket Price: 4.95 USD
Ticket Name: Earl Strickland vs CJ Wiley
Ticket Description: Earl Strickland vs CJ Wiley

know it all
09-08-2013, 10:49 PM
Big Truck is the only one traveling and doing some real great work.Meet him at Gradys First memorial tournament,with scott raben,doing the live comentary.Hope I spelled scotts name right. Really knows the game and good shot calling,puts you right into the action. Big truck keep doing the good job,I was the man set up with all the cues ,and watched over the cue for gradys,which was made by steve lomax. Didn't see anyone else donate anything except mark rochester,who got the trophy for the one pocket first prize. Out of his OWN POCKET,him and grady where good friends. Rich aka the skunk.

Bigtruck
09-08-2013, 11:07 PM
I like to DVR them when on. A lot of the time I don't get to see streaming or when I do it gets cut short. Then I have to come back and find my spot were I left off. I'm just saying I wish ESPN would at least cover the final rounds like they use to back in the late 80's and early 90's and they usually came on a few times a week!!

I have been doing the final 4 or 5 matches on a Youtube private link.for sale in the store on the website. ~10

If you login to Youtube and watch, it remembers where you left off and starts there when up come back. Pretty Nice.

Thanks,

Ray

Bigtruck
09-08-2013, 11:10 PM
Big Truck is the only one traveling and doing some real great work.Meet him at Gradys First memorial tournament,with scott raben,doing the live comentary.Hope I spelled scotts name right. Really knows the game and good shot calling,puts you right into the action. Big truck keep doing the good job,I was the man set up with all the cues ,and watched over the cue for gradys,which was made by steve lomax. Didn't see anyone else donate anything except mark rochester,who got the trophy for the one pocket first prize. Out of his OWN POCKET,him and grady where good friends. Rich aka the skunk.

Hey Skunk, thanks for the kind words. We are trying to put together another Memorial now. Do you think the Grady Memorial should always be one pocket or would Big Table 9 ball still honor him?

Ray

Scaramouche
09-09-2013, 04:26 AM
If you want to watch on TV simply hook your computer up to your TV. :D

Lots of snooker available, LIVE, from around the world,
Mostly on Eurosport, but some of the oddball stuff on Skysport
Live feeds available originating on bookie sites.
Sometimes two table feeds available.
Evening matches in the Far East are breakfast television in North America.
Morning matches are evening entertainment on the west coast.

Some recent coverage
http://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?t=331855
http://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?t=330904

And here is some 8-ball from youtube that was originally shown on Skysport - 60 second shot clock
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3uSgGTvWzBk

NYC cue dude
09-09-2013, 08:13 AM
Hey Skunk, thanks for the kind words. We are trying to put together another Memorial now. Do you think the Grady Memorial should always be one pocket or would Big Table 9 ball still honor him?

Ray

And not think of 1 pocket. It's like the hatfields without the Mccoys.

ctyhntr
09-09-2013, 08:29 AM
TV/Cable make their money from sponsors. Sponsors are concerned reaching to the widest audience for their money.

If you don't see pool on TV its because they can replace it with another show that can draw more viewers/revenue.

CJ Wiley
09-09-2013, 09:48 AM
TV/Cable make their money from sponsors. Sponsors are concerned reaching to the widest audience for their money.

If you don't see pool on TV its because they can replace it with another show that can draw more viewers/revenue.

Barry Hearn put snooker on TV in Europe, and he does the Mosconi Cup and World Cup for pool and puts it on TV.

The USA has no "Barry Hearn's" so there's no pool on TV (Matt Braun is the closest we have and he does "Challenge of Champions")....the games don't put themselves on and produce the money without human participation. Pool's on the internet because real people post it on you tube and do the streaming internet broadcasts.

Humans can make pool, or humans can break pool......and it can change in an instant. 'The Game is the Teacher'

hang-the-9
09-09-2013, 10:58 AM
I would love your input on something.

Do you prefer to see edited down matches that are recorded? I have considered only streaming the final day of tournaments but have found that a lot of good matches happen early on.

I have thought about doing some edited down recordings.

Thanks,

Ray

Take a look at some of the Seminole tour videos that are on http://www.propoolvideo.com/. They cut out the racking and some walking around that the players did and mostly had just the play in the video, got the whole game in without cutting out racks in a decent time.

hang-the-9
09-09-2013, 11:03 AM
I just don't get it!!! When I was younger and up until a few years ago pool was always on tv!!! Now hardly ever! Where has it gone? They still play the tournaments and even more so, so why not on tv anymore? Does any one have an answer for this??????
I just saying I like to watch some good matches on tv rather than streaming them!!!:angry::angry:

You can watch even better matches online than you can find on TV. Check out the TAR videos, or a thousand free videos on YouTube. InsidePool had a ton of great matches online for free. AccuStats streaming videos are available.

And with the newfangled TVs you can hook up your computer to them and watch on the good ole idiot box.

CJ Wiley
09-09-2013, 11:20 AM
You can watch even better matches online than you can find on TV. Check out the TAR videos, or a thousand free videos on YouTube. InsidePool had a ton of great matches online for free. AccuStats streaming videos are available.

And with the newfangled TVs you can hook up your computer to them and watch on the good ole idiot box.

TV is about the "Show".....watching two people play pool is barely better than watching baseball, golf, or football without the "Show Qualities".

Try imagining ANY sport or game without the "show qualities" and it's boring.....it's not the game's fault, it just takes entertainment components outside of the game it's self to capture someone's attention. The average on line viewer watches something for 3 minutes before moving on to something else.

There's a reason they call them "TV SHOWS".....it's about the "Sizzle," not the Steak.

dimonsterb
09-09-2013, 04:44 PM
You can watch even better matches online than you can find on TV. Check out the TAR videos, or a thousand free videos on YouTube. InsidePool had a ton of great matches online for free. AccuStats streaming videos are available.

And with the newfangled TVs you can hook up your computer to them and watch on the good ole idiot box.

Thanks for those links! Great stuff!!

Donny Lutz
09-10-2013, 09:15 AM
I just don't get it!!! When I was younger and up until a few years ago pool was always on tv!!! Now hardly ever! Where has it gone? They still play the tournaments and even more so, so why not on tv anymore? Does any one have an answer for this??????
I just saying I like to watch some good matches on tv rather than streaming them!!!:angry::angry:

The television networks and potential sponsor/businesses are owned and managed by old men who still believe that pool players are low class people who don't spend money...

CJ Wiley
09-10-2013, 03:59 PM
The television networks and potential sponsor/businesses are owned and managed by old men who still believe that pool players are low class people who don't spend money...

That's not true at all. I've met several of them lately and none of them fit that description...not even close.

There's a lot of influential people that really like pool, however, if no one gives them a proposal they can't do anything good or bad for the game/sport.

Just like when I owned a major nightclub I didn't care what beer or liquor I sold, that's why the REPS came by and show cased their brands to my Bar Manager. The manager at the Radio and TV Networks are the same way, they only know what they're told and shown. 'The Game is the Teacher'

jay helfert
09-11-2013, 05:00 AM
I just don't get it!!! When I was younger and up until a few years ago pool was always on tv!!! Now hardly ever! Where has it gone? They still play the tournaments and even more so, so why not on tv anymore? Does any one have an answer for this??????
I just saying I like to watch some good matches on tv rather than streaming them!!!:angry::angry:

It is on TV - in ASIA! On my last trip to the Philippines I was able to watch many Accu-Stat matches from this years events on local sports channels. They buy this stuff because they have an audience there who will watch it and sponsors who will pay for air time/commercials on these shows. Like CJ said, that's how the TV biz works. If people will watch and sponsors will buy time, then they have a viable show to put on their network. There are many countries in Asia (CHINA, Taipei, Japan, Korea, Thailand etc.) they are regularly airing various pool and snooker tournaments (men's and women's) on their networks.

The major events that are held in China each year (both for men and women) are shown throughout the country (and the region) and have huge audiences, well into the millions. The women players are celebrities in China and other parts of the far East. The best women players can make a very healthy living over there with endorsements, appearances, commercials and prize money. The fans love the women players who are attractive and play well. The men less so. :sad:

Donny Lutz
09-11-2013, 11:29 AM
That's not true at all. I've met several of them lately and none of them fit that description...not even close.

There's a lot of influential people that really like pool, however, if no one gives them a proposal they can't do anything good or bad for the game/sport.

Just like when I owned a major nightclub I didn't care what beer or liquor I sold, that's why the REPS came by and show cased their brands to my Bar Manager. The manager at the Radio and TV Networks are the same way, they only know what they're told and shown. 'The Game is the Teacher'

"That's not true at all" is quite a blanket statement. As was mine I suppose.

But you say you've met "several"? I know you have much experience as a player and promoter, but "several" does not convince me. I've been involved in pool (and other sports) since 1955. I also have some experience with television producers and sponsors since 1964.

My opinion is as I said, most of them look down at pool and pool players, as do most people who don't play.

CJ Wiley
09-11-2013, 01:21 PM
"That's not true at all" is quite a blanket statement. As was mine I suppose.

But you say you've met "several"? I know you have much experience as a player and promoter, but "several" does not convince me. I've been involved in pool (and other sports) since 1955. I also have some experience with television producers and sponsors since 1964.

My opinion is as I said, most of them look down at pool and pool players, as do most people who don't play.

I'm not sure how you could possible know what "most people" like or dislike. I make no such claims, the claim I do make is many people like pool and have no stigma attached to it either way.....they are "pool neutral".

I believe it would be surprising to know the truth about pool and how people honestly see it......it's intriguing to many professional athletes and when I was in Utah with Hank Haney he played EVERY day and kept track of EVERY game he played. Mark O'meara also has a place there at Deer Valley and they both have pool tables and play on a consistent basis when they're on ski trips (and Hank has one of my old tables in his house in Dallas).

I've personally played with MANY professional basketball, football, and golf athletes. There's even been a pool table in the White House for many years and I recently met with a man and played at an exclusive club in downtown Ft. Worth.

He's worth more than all of us put together and plays ever Saturday (and sometimes Sunday) morning on the emasculate table they have there. They have a display case with the original cues from many World Champions like Luther Lassitor. There's many more of these type people out in the world.....pool is alive and well, it's just not in the public eye right now....that can be corrected, and will be very soon.

Pool has not had anyone to push it on TV and develop the entertainment aspect of it, but to say that is "impossible" is ludicrous. The same people would have said that about poker and reality shows 20 years ago.

Times are changing and pool only need to change and adapt with it, and it will be successful again. I believe this with all my heart, mind and body.....that's the ONLY reason I'm back involved is because there's a hundred million dollars laying on the table and it's ALL up for grabs to the first people that see the opportunity, develop the opportunity and broadcast it for all to see. 'The Game will be their Teacher'

malidave
09-16-2013, 10:17 AM
I have noticed even WPBA is not on ESPN, they had about 3 to 4 main events, this is the driest year I have ever seen.

I think either ESPN is less interested in billiards or there is a negotiation issue between the two.

dimonsterb
09-16-2013, 01:26 PM
It is on TV - in ASIA! On my last trip to the Philippines I was able to watch many Accu-Stat matches from this years events on local sports channels. They buy this stuff because they have an audience there who will watch it and sponsors who will pay for air time/commercials on these shows. Like CJ said, that's how the TV biz works. If people will watch and sponsors will buy time, then they have a viable show to put on their network. There are many countries in Asia (CHINA, Taipei, Japan, Korea, Thailand etc.) they are regularly airing various pool and snooker tournaments (men's and women's) on their networks.

The major events that are held in China each year (both for men and women) are shown throughout the country (and the region) and have huge audiences, well into the millions. The women players are celebrities in China and other parts of the far East. The best women players can make a very healthy living over there with endorsements, appearances, commercials and prize money. The fans love the women players who are attractive and play well. The men less so. :sad:

I like all of the comments so far and as for your comment Jay with all the Asians here in the USA you would think that they would want to show some kind of Billiards on TV. There is a far pool hall in the Raleigh area that when you go in you are in a Asian country and they love to gamble/tournament play and gather around big money games.. Even were I am now in Pittsburgh PA we have lost a lot of pool halls because of the economy but if you go to the big halls they are still there!! Someone needs to get the Billiards industry a good swift kick in the pants to get it out of this funk, If they don't get it back on the air all the sponsors commercials will not get to the "ones" who are not into pool that much like "we" AZer's are and they just might get pulled into the game and find a new love for it they never knew they had!!!!!!

mikefeiman
09-16-2013, 03:39 PM
I have noticed even WPBA is not on ESPN, they had about 3 to 4 main events, this is the driest year I have ever seen.

I think either ESPN is less interested in billiards or there is a negotiation issue between the two.

I don't know what the situation is with the WPBA, but I can tell you that ESPN is not interested in billiards programming. This was made very clear to me by my rep at ESPN. This is why you won't even find old matches on ESPN Classic.

According to my rep, billiards programming is all getting pushed to ESPN3 (streaming) and the company has no immediate plans to bring billiards back to the flagship, ESPN2 or ESPN Classic.

It's all about ratings and billiards programming doesn't pull strong enough numbers to keep ESPN interested.

chilli dipper
09-16-2013, 04:04 PM
Pool has a decent "playing" following but a really small tv and live "viewing" following in america. The only future in viewing pool is live streaming and even that wont generate decent numbers.The people involved and the players in the past missed the opportunity in the past, they dropped the ball. It is what it is now unless a miracle happens, pool is done on the tube or being considered a legit sport/game in america! Its seems to me the people involved in the 70's/80's blew it for the sport...my opinion

MisterBanker
09-16-2013, 05:24 PM
I don't know what the situation is with the WPBA, but I can tell you that ESPN is not interested in billiards programming. This was made very clear to me by my rep at ESPN. This is why you won't even find old matches on ESPN Classic.

According to my rep, billiards programming is all getting pushed to ESPN3 (streaming) and the company has no immediate plans to bring billiards back to the flagship, ESPN2 or ESPN Classic.

It's all about ratings and billiards programming doesn't pull strong enough numbers to keep ESPN interested.

You turn on ESPN classic and you see old wrestling shows from the 80s and early 90s, how big are the ratings for stuff like that?

spartan
09-16-2013, 05:44 PM
I just don't get it!!! When I was younger and up until a few years ago pool was always on tv!!! Now hardly ever! Where has it gone? They still play the tournaments and even more so, so why not on tv anymore? Does any one have an answer for this??????
I just saying I like to watch some good matches on tv rather than streaming them!!!:angry::angry:

Ya agree. They should get Miley Cyrus to twerk on pool table. Now that would get pool tonnes of eyeballs.;)

CJ Wiley
09-16-2013, 07:00 PM
I have noticed even WPBA is not on ESPN, they had about 3 to 4 main events, this is the driest year I have ever seen.

I think either ESPN is less interested in billiards or there is a negotiation issue between the two.

Yes, producing shows that don't have more "sizzle" isn't going to entice anyone - filming Jeanette Lee playing is exciting because the audience knows and can relate to her on another level. The key is knowing the players and branding them as characters.

Pool, like all other games is boring to watch unless there's an emotional attachment....pool's no different than any other game, although it may actually be better in some respects.

Not branding the players is the biggest issue and that can't be overcome by just showing two robots playing pool......the characters personality is the "sizzle" that sells the steak (the production of the pocket billiard show). This is true in every major sport/game, it's just not obvious because these major sports are already so well branded.

Tony_in_MD
09-16-2013, 07:19 PM
From what I was told Espn is paid to cover and broadcast events. Who is going to pay for that service now?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk.

mikefeiman
09-17-2013, 07:12 AM
You turn on ESPN classic and you see old wrestling shows from the 80s and early 90s, how big are the ratings for stuff like that?

Clearly they're better than what classic pool would pull. Keep in mind that current WWE wrestling programming typically pulls in the 3.0 to 3.3 range (as compared to new billiards programming which would typically pull around a 0.2).


From what I was told Espn is paid to cover and broadcast events. Who is going to pay for that service now?


This has been discussed ad nauseum. No one paid ESPN to cover and broadcast events. The standard deal was that the producer paid for production of the event, gave the programming to ESPN for broadcast and then split the ad inventory (ESPN would take some of the inventory and the rest would go to the producer to sell). ESPN would typically agree to do an original broadcast and a rerun for each hour of programming.

10 years ago, there wasn't enough programming for ESPN to fill the hours, so they'd rerun pool regardless of ratings. Today, they have more programming in their archives than they need, so it has become a ratings game. Whatever pulls the best numbers gets the airtime.

dimonsterb
09-17-2013, 08:18 AM
Ya agree. They should get Miley Cyrus to twerk on pool table. Now that would get pool tonnes of eyeballs.;)


Yeah a lil twerking might work!!!
lol