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POVPOOL
09-16-2013, 11:37 AM
So, I just watched Mike Dechaine miss a shot against Corey Deuel and then he immediately quit with Corey still needing 9 Balls.

The score was 116 each going to 125 at the MD Straight Pool Championships.

Both players were seemingly falling apart at the last minute but the issue here is that I don't think Mike should really be allowed to quit unless it's his turn at the table.

Technically, shouldn't Corey should have to come to the table and be forced to close out the match?

Corey needed 9 balls with actually only 6 open balls at the table, which means Mike still had a chance.

Silly, if you ask me.

bfdlad
09-16-2013, 11:42 AM
So, I just watched Mike Dechaine miss a shot against Corey Deuel and then he immediately quit with Corey still needing 9 Balls.

The score was 116 each going to 125 at the MD Straight Pool Championships.

Both players were seemingly falling apart at the last minute but the issue here is that I don't think Mike should really be allowed to quit unless it's his turn at the table.

Technically, shouldn't Corey should have to come to the table and be forced to close out the match?

Corey needed 9 balls with actually only 6 open balls at the table, which means Mike still had a chance.

Silly, if you ask me.

Bad move on MS's part. We have all seen crazy stuff happen and easy shots missed. However If I was Corey I would have gladly taken the win.

bdorman
09-16-2013, 11:43 AM
Dennis Orcullo did the same thing to Max Eberle in the SBE (?, I think) Bigfoot 14.1 final match. Yeah, I know...a win is a win, but I think it's poor sportsmanship to concede when your opponent is so close to closing out the match (I think Max was 7-8 balls away from winning).

MahnaMahna
09-16-2013, 11:44 AM
If someone wants to quit, they should be able to do it at any time. I don't see a problem.

Edited to add: unless someone was on a high run and they interupted something that would have been good spectator entertainment.

ENGLISH!
09-16-2013, 11:50 AM
One more reason why I am building a 'dislike' of him.

He shoots well but he is building some bad rep. (opening for a personal slur by those that do that)

He's young, but not that young. It is looking more & more to me that he just lacks something 'inside'.

I hope he works things out & finds his way to a better place, because he has talent.

Birriards
09-16-2013, 11:51 AM
If someone wants to throw a temper tantrum and quit against me, feel free to do so at any time.

MD has a long way to go.

KoolKat9Lives
09-16-2013, 11:54 AM
Mike's choice. We weren't there, in his shoes. Mike has to answer to his own. It does sound weak tho, eh?

poolguy4u
09-16-2013, 11:56 AM
:scratchhead:



Hmmm...well maybe the sharking move worked when Cory ordered food when Mike was up and running on him in the middle of the match?

Who orders food in the middle of a match?



This came from Mike------->


This is getting pretty tough. I'm up 70-80 something to 12 on a good run. The guy orders food in the middle of my run. Really?!?!

hang-the-9
09-16-2013, 12:00 PM
Someone posted that Mike missed a ball in hand. If I needed less than a rack to win, had ball in hand and missed, I think I'd be a bit mad at myself and just concede the game.

I have done this a few times when missing an easy shot in 9 or 10 ball even when there were 2-3 balls on the table.

Birriards
09-16-2013, 12:02 PM
:scratchhead:



Hmmm...well maybe the sharking move worked when Cory ordered food when Mike was up and running on him in the middle of the match?

Who orders food in the middle of a match?



This came from Mike------->


This is getting pretty tough. I'm up 70-80 something to 12 on a good run. The guy orders food in the middle of my run. Really?!?!


Mental toughness and focus are a part of athletic (if pool is such...) competition.

Weak excuse.

KoolKat9Lives
09-16-2013, 12:03 PM
:scratchhead:



Hmmm...well maybe the sharking move worked when Cory ordered food when Mike was up and running on him in the middle of the match?

Who orders food in the middle of a match?



This came from Mike------->


This is getting pretty tough. I'm up 70-80 something to 12 on a good run. The guy orders food in the middle of my run. Really?!?!


That sh1t makes me hungry just thinking about it. Gonna make me some beanless chilli (yes TWheels, I gots extra).

hang-the-9
09-16-2013, 12:05 PM
Mental toughness and focus are a part of athletic (if pool is such...) competition.

Weak excuse.

But so is not doing silly stuff to break the other player's concetration in sports like pool. I'd like to see Kasperov order some Chicken Nuggets in the middle of a chess match and see what happenes LOL

sjm
09-16-2013, 12:10 PM
Definitely a strange decision on Mike's part, but I have no problem with the timing of the concession.

AtLarge
09-16-2013, 12:11 PM
Dennis Orcullo did the same thing to Max Eberle in the SBE (?, I think) Bigfoot 14.1 final match. Yeah, I know...a win is a win, but I think it's poor sportsmanship to concede when your opponent is so close to closing out the match (I think Max was 7-8 balls away from winning).

It was at this year's Derby City 14.1 Challenge. Max was at 83 and shooting; Dennis was at 54 and more interested in watching Alex play 9-Ball. So Max needed more than a full rack when Dennis quit.

Sloppy Pockets
09-16-2013, 12:16 PM
Someone posted that Mike missed a ball in hand. If I needed less than a rack to win, had ball in hand and missed, I think I'd be a bit mad at myself and just concede the game.

I have done this a few times when missing an easy shot in 9 or 10 ball even when there were 2-3 balls on the table.

BIH behind the head string in straight pool. It wasn't a hanger in this case.;)

BTW why should Mike always be the heavy? Corey ordering food and wanting to eat it while MD was on a run? Pretty lame move IMO. And as far as getting mad, Corey practically broke his stick when he was about to scratch just before that. It sounded like he may have cracked it.

If Earl did that the whole pool world would be hating on him. It was worse sportsmanship than Dechaine conceding after a tough miss which left a certain runout for Corey laying on the table. MD wouldn't have conceded if he really thought he'd have a chance back at the table.

Anyway, I like both players. They were both playing poorly for most of the match, drilling shots in and missing balls because of it. I'm just glad it's over, it was painful to see 14.1 played that way.

hang-the-9
09-16-2013, 12:17 PM
That sh1t makes me hungry just thinking about it. Gonna make me some beanless chilli (yes TWheels, I gots extra).

Beanless chilli is just a spicy chopped burger.

JumpinJoe
09-16-2013, 12:20 PM
This is one of the reasons pool sucks and stays in tge gutter. Which it always will stay.
The pros want everything, to make all the rules, demands, etc. But they never want to act like PROS.
They will never get REAL sponsors. They should never quit nor be allowed to, if they are beating some amateur they are in heaven talkin about how good they are playin. Then they lose to someone thier equal or better and they whine like asses about how bad they played.

PRO jackoffs is more like it.

pletho
09-16-2013, 12:22 PM
So, I just watched Mike Dechaine miss a shot against Corey Deuel and then he immediately quit with Corey still needing 9 Balls.

The score was 116 each going to 125 at the MD Straight Pool Championships.

Both players were seemingly falling apart at the last minute but the issue here is that I don't think Mike should really be allowed to quit unless it's his turn at the table.

Technically, shouldn't Corey should have to come to the table and be forced to close out the match?

Corey needed 9 balls with actually only 6 open balls at the table, which means Mike still had a chance.

Silly, if you ask me.

its called pride and poor sportsmanship.................. figures

sjm
09-16-2013, 12:25 PM
Dennis Orcullo did the same thing to Max Eberle in the SBE (?, I think) Bigfoot 14.1 final match. Yeah, I know...a win is a win, but I think it's poor sportsmanship to concede when your opponent is so close to closing out the match (I think Max was 7-8 balls away from winning).

Really not a similar situation. Here's what I posted just after watching Dennis Orcullo's concession to Max:

I was watching the match when Orcullo conceded and some context may be necessary here.

Some information that should be considered here:

1) Max was well ahead and was very likely heading for victory. Orcullo obviously knew it, as did others in attendance.
2) From the straight pool arena, one could look down and watch the action on the TV table.
3) Dennis, quite keen on watching the final in which his close friend Alex Pagulayan was competing for the nine ball title, watched Alex's match between his turns, and I think, win or lose, he was hoping the 14.1 match would conclude promptly.
4) Dennis already had close to $25,000 in the bank at the Derby, most of which he won by taking first place in the 10-ball event, so the $1,000 difference between winning and losing the 14.1 final was not as big a deal as it might seem.
5) Max was playing slowly and presided over a very difficult position at 83-54 ahead for quite a long time when Dennis conceded.
6) Dennis won his semifinal on Friday night and waited around all day for Niels to be eliminated from the nine ball, after which Max and Niels would play their semifinal. The 14.1 final should not have started that late and Dennis' impatience was hardly a surprise.

Hence, the were extenuating circumstances surrounding Dennis' concession.
In addition, Max needed seventeen more balls.

Far more similar to this was John Schmidt's concession to Niels Feijen after a miss with Niels needing eighteen. I believe, but I'm not certain, that this was in the quarterfinal of the then WPA sanctioned 2007 World 14,1 Championship.

At the US Open 10-ball event this July at the Rio, Lee Vann Corteza conceded to Chris Bartram trailing 8-3 in the race to 9. Rack 12 of that match never even begun!

Even great players, and Dechaine is certainly a great one, concede occasionally. We'd all prefer that they didn't, but if happens.

Hopefully, there was no Calcutta!

NYC cue dude
09-16-2013, 12:29 PM
Now. Talking about Corey ordering food. Lmao.

Sloppy Pockets
09-16-2013, 12:33 PM
But so is not doing silly stuff to break the other player's concetration in sports like pool. I'd like to see Kasperov order some Chicken Nuggets in the middle of a chess match and see what happenes LOL

I'm pretty embarrassed about the following story, but I have decided to ease my conscience and come clean here.

I inadvertently food-sharked Oscar D. at last winter's Turning Stone. They have tables right along the rail for spectators to get a real close look at the action. I hadn't eaten all day and I was getting a headache. Some guy sat down beside me with a big order of fries and my mouth started to water. I went to the snack bar and got my wife and I each an order of chicken tenders and fries and went back and sat down again.

Oscar and Jason Klatt had just started their match. I was seated near Oscar's seat, and when he missed I noticed he sat down in Jason's chair. I thought maybe my munching was bothering him, so I slid down on the table halfway between the two of them. That's when he came over to me and asked me very nicely to eat elsewhere because he was feeling nauseous and the smell of the chicken was bothering him.

I was mortified and apologized profusely and picked up and ate elsewhere. Later on I told somebody about it and he informed me that Oscar is a vegan.

So Oscar, if you get on here and read this tripe we write, I am sincerely sorry for being an idiot and invading your space. To be fair to myself, I saw folks eating on every table, but I have to admit that chicken was pretty rank smelling, being fried in hot fat near the end of the day. FWIW I wasn't feeling so hot myself after eating it.

westcoast
09-16-2013, 12:35 PM
maybe Corey was really hungry. it is hard to play when you're hungry

justadub
09-16-2013, 12:36 PM
This is one of the reasons pool sucks and stays in tge gutter. Which it always will stay.
The pros want everything, to make all the rules, demands, etc. But they never want to act like PROS.
They will never get REAL sponsors. They should never quit nor be allowed to, if they are beating some amateur they are in heaven talkin about how good they are playin. Then they lose to someone thier equal or better and they whine like asses about how bad they played.

PRO jackoffs is more like it.

Well they sure as hell shouldnt be ordering food in the middle of their match, should they?

Or is this just another bash Mike deal? (Yes, he has earned some of it before.)

Mainplayer
09-16-2013, 12:46 PM
That really wasn't quitting. I missed a pretty easy ball and felt Corey could run the 10 wide open balls on the table. I guess something could have happened but I respect his game.

hang-the-9
09-16-2013, 12:52 PM
That really wasn't quitting. I missed a pretty easy ball and felt Corey could run the 10 wide open balls on the table. I guess something could have happened but I respect his game.

Mike is one of the few (very few) pros that posts on here. CJ I think has his own "pro posting" title though hehe.

Since you're online :smile: did you play in the Predator thing in Snookers? Who else was there and what were the results if you remember? There is a thread on there that Ken M started but there is no replies. I wanted to bring Alex to watch incase you played but we decided to go to his league match instead.

putt-putt44
09-16-2013, 12:56 PM
Another black eye for pool,,,,,,,,,,,,!!!!

Johnnyt
09-16-2013, 01:33 PM
I see players eating at the table while the other guy shoots all the time. If he was slurping his soup loudly I might see a problem. Is it different with the "pure" game of 14.1? :eek: Johnnyt

CrownCityCorey
09-16-2013, 01:41 PM
So, I just watched Mike Dechaine miss a shot against Corey Deuel and then he immediately quit with Corey still needing 9 Balls.

The score was 116 each going to 125 at the MD Straight Pool Championships.

Both players were seemingly falling apart at the last minute but the issue here is that I don't think Mike should really be allowed to quit unless it's his turn at the table.

Technically, shouldn't Corey should have to come to the table and be forced to close out the match?

Corey needed 9 balls with actually only 6 open balls at the table, which means Mike still had a chance.

Silly, if you ask me.

A concession or forfeiture of this nature should be punished with forfeiture of the event; whether or not there was a "b" side.

On a larger scale, with a tour, it should be punishable by tour suspension...

KoolKat9Lives
09-16-2013, 01:41 PM
"They killed Kenny"

OMG Pool is dead!

CrownCityCorey
09-16-2013, 01:42 PM
Another black eye for pool,,,,,,,,,,,,!!!!

Pool has black eyes like Dolly Parton jogging...:grin-square:

prad
09-16-2013, 01:47 PM
If someone wants to quit, they should be able to do it at any time. I don't see a problem.

Edited to add: unless someone was on a high run and they interupted something that would have been good spectator entertainment.

100% agreed.
Sometimes letting it go is the only thing you can do. Other times you need to know how it feels to sit in the chair and watch your opponent take your money, pride, or what ever you playing for.

CreeDo
09-16-2013, 02:08 PM
If I'm out of the tournament the instant I concede...
I'd probably cling to the shred of hope that corey will dog it, especially if he has shown signs of dogging it earlier.

Moving up the bracket is a few hundred bucks right? why not wait 2 minutes before kissing that cash goodbye?
Even just now Johnny Archer missed two routine balls and one toughie in a single match.

oldzilla
09-16-2013, 02:13 PM
So, I just watched Mike Dechaine miss a shot against Corey Deuel and then he immediately quit with Corey still needing 9 Balls.

The score was 116 each going to 125 at the MD Straight Pool Championships.

Both players were seemingly falling apart at the last minute but the issue here is that I don't think Mike should really be allowed to quit unless it's his turn at the table.

Technically, shouldn't Corey should have to come to the table and be forced to close out the match?

Corey needed 9 balls with actually only 6 open balls at the table, which means Mike still had a chance.

Silly, if you ask me.

That really wasn't quitting. I missed a pretty easy ball and felt Corey could run the 10 wide open balls on the table. I guess something could have happened but I respect his game.

MD to say it mildly you are a fool.

Alot can happen in a 9 ball run.

You couldn't stand to sit and watch ? WTF

No spectator respect either.

You sicken me !

I tell you what you should never ever be selected for the Mosconi Cup

Or any other invitational event.

I'm not going to try explain why to you.

You would not understand.

Your head is not shaped that way.

:groucho:

RunOut Apps
09-16-2013, 02:23 PM
No Respect for the Game

The Kiss
09-16-2013, 02:31 PM
If Mike really wanted to blow Corey's mind. There was a foul that was commited by Corey.Towards the end before MD quit Corey made a shot and scratched Corey stopped the cue ball before it hit the pocket. By the book it is a 16 ball foul/penalty. Generally its not called but if you really wanted to be a dick that would have been the perfect time to call it. The tension between misses/sharking/railbirds chirping was at a peak level.

Jaden
09-16-2013, 02:33 PM
But id have to say it's not really that big a deal. Sometimes you just feel like you don't deserve to win a match because of how you played and you don't want to give the other guy a chance to miff it.

Winning when you screw up, making shots with incorrect form or alignment can actually hurt your game in the long run.

The last thing you want when your goal is to play the best possible is get reward for bad behavior.

I think many peoples desire to win over shadows their desire to play the best they can or to do what's best in the long run.

Maybe the right thing to do for mike was to concede to Corey.

We each have to make that decision for ourselves and I don't think it deserves derision.

Just my two cents.

Jaden

Ron Swanson
09-16-2013, 02:45 PM
Who hasn't conceded a match when they think it's over and are pissed off with themselves for missing an easy ball?

Really, people have too much time on their hands.

oldzilla
09-16-2013, 02:53 PM
Two guys matched up at the poolhall,

they can quit anytime they want.

Two guys matched up for a promoter,

have obligations !!!

Besides I have seen more than enough of MD.

I just cannot bring myself like him.

imo you won't be talking about him for ever.

He will be a forgotten player.

MahnaMahna
09-16-2013, 03:09 PM
Two guys matched up at the poolhall,

they can quit anytime they want.

Two guys matched up for a promoter,

have obligations !!!

Besides I have seen more than enough of MD.

I just cannot bring myself like him.

imo you won't be talking about him for ever.

He will be a forgotten player.

The way you space words

Reminds me of a haiku

Its not easy to read.

shinobi
09-16-2013, 03:13 PM
The way you space words

Reminds me of a haiku

Its not easy to read.

Better than an unbroken wall of text by a long shot.

oldzilla
09-16-2013, 03:14 PM
The way you space words

Reminds me of a haiku

Its not easy to read.

Works

for

me !

:groucho:

POVPOOL
09-16-2013, 03:14 PM
Look guys, I'm not trying to bash Mike and frankly I only caught the last 30 minutes of that match and didn't see the Corey, food ordering incident. Furthermore, I was unaware that touching the cue ball was a 15 point foul which, is also a very good point indeed...

The point which I was really trying to make is that technically, a concession can only be made during a player's turn. Not before, or after. A concession cannot be legally accepted by a tournament director or an opponent until it is that person's turn at the table and they physically motion or indicate that they concede the match or game.

I know it sounds nitpicky, but these are rules that have been established for many years. If you've ever watched a snooker match and the player is in the middle of a run and yet has clearly won the frame, you NEVER see the other player get up and say, 'Okay, you win!'

The opponent cannot technically forfeit until the inning is over and it is his turn at the table.

I feel it's important to understand this because this is an integral part of sportsmanship.

Not that the food thing had any merit either.

hang-the-9
09-16-2013, 03:30 PM
- snip -
The opponent cannot technically forfeit until the inning is over and it is his turn at the table.

I feel it's important to understand this because this is an integral part of sportsmanship.

Not that the food thing had any merit either.

I did not think there was actually a rule about when you can forfeit. For example, if you unscrew your cue during your opponents turn, it's counted as a forfeit, which took place in the middle of the opponent's inning.

I have often conceded the last ball to someone if it was easy (9 or 10 ball here), or even if it was semi-easy but they had a good run out to get to it or a good position shot or something. If I respect the player and we have a good match going I would not want to see someone miss a game winner.

In fact, several times I have people concede the game winner to me when I felt iffy about making it. Took a load of my mind let me tell you hehe.

MahnaMahna
09-16-2013, 03:33 PM
Wall of text is bad.

Mike deserves all this shit storm.

Straight pool is sweet guys.





<----- fvckin love me some haiku

POVPOOL
09-16-2013, 03:47 PM
Unscrewing your cue, which can be construed as a forfeit actually isn't.

If this were a rule, Jose Parica would have been forfeited from 100's of events. He's very well known for using as many as 3-4 shafts during a match sometimes.

Majic
09-16-2013, 03:48 PM
So, I just watched Mike Dechaine miss a shot against Corey Deuel and then he immediately quit with Corey still needing 9 Balls.

The score was 116 each going to 125 at the MD Straight Pool Championships.

Both players were seemingly falling apart at the last minute but the issue here is that I don't think Mike should really be allowed to quit unless it's his turn at the table.

Technically, shouldn't Corey should have to come to the table and be forced to close out the match?

Corey needed 9 balls with actually only 6 open balls at the table, which means Mike still had a chance.

Silly, if you ask me.
shows the kind of heart he has.

Sloppy Pockets
09-16-2013, 04:03 PM
I know it sounds nitpicky, but these are rules that have been established for many years. If you've ever watched a snooker match and the player is in the middle of a run and yet has clearly won the frame, you NEVER see the other player get up and say, 'Okay, you win!'

Really?

http://uk.eurosport.yahoo.com/blogs/world-of-sport/drago-goes-crazy-himself-bizarre-final-frame-concession-143421711.html

Drago conceded the match after a missed shot, just like Mike did, only in his case he tried to retract the concession and McManus refused to accept the retraction. Of course, Drago then proceeded to beat the shit out of his own head. At least Dechaine didn't do that. ;)

POVPOOL
09-16-2013, 04:08 PM
Well, if I'm wrong I apologize. It's great that these forums exist to keep each other in check.

RobMan
09-16-2013, 04:16 PM
The way you space words

Reminds me of a haiku

Not easy to read.

Fixed it for you! Now it is a haiku: 5-7-5

VIProfessor
09-16-2013, 04:22 PM
https://encrypted-tbn1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSGwTOVI4YGT_s7lK8qxRZSBGCGp791w OKJyP-21bk6qZPqCeNXHTKqcIBV

pt109
09-16-2013, 04:40 PM
Really?

http://uk.eurosport.yahoo.com/blogs/world-of-sport/drago-goes-crazy-himself-bizarre-final-frame-concession-143421711.html

Drago conceded the match after a missed shot, just like Mike did, only in his case he tried to retract the concession and McManus refused to accept the retraction. Of course, Drago then proceeded to beat the shit out of his own head. At least Dechaine didn't do that. ;)

In snooker, it's considered bad form to concede a match when it is not
your turn at the table.....pros have been warned or even fined for it.

I think not conceding anything also makes sense in any tournament..
...especially if there is side action or a calcutta....'cause you're conceding
someone else's money also.

Sloppy Pockets
09-16-2013, 04:45 PM
Well, if I'm wrong I apologize. It's great that these forums exist to keep each other in check.

Well, now, no need to apologize, Daniel. I'm pretty sure you know tons more about pool than I do.;)

Does this let Mike off the hook, though? I really didn't see this as a disrespectful move. However, what Orcullo did to Eberle (and all us fans) at DDC was unforgivable IMHO. Extremely disrespectful to the game IMO.

Sloppy Pockets
09-16-2013, 04:49 PM
In snooker, it's considered bad form to concede a match when it is not
your turn at the table.....pros have been warned or even fined for it.

I think not conceding anything also makes sense in any tournament..
...especially if there is side action or a calcutta....'cause you're conceding
someone else's money also.

I see your point, but champions quit in the chair all the time. What are we do do about that? I've seen Earl do it in pool on several occasions, and even a ferocious tiger like Roberto Duran seemed to know when it was time to say, "No mas."

liakos
09-16-2013, 05:23 PM
:scratchhead:



Hmmm...well maybe the sharking move worked when Cory ordered food when Mike was up and running on him in the middle of the match?

Who orders food in the middle of a match?



This came from Mike------->


This is getting pretty tough. I'm up 70-80 something to 12 on a good run. The guy orders food in the middle of my run. Really?!?!

Mike has done that at a joss tour! They all do that!

lfigueroa
09-16-2013, 05:30 PM
geez. It is just not a big deal.

I loath conceding. But sometimes, depending on the circumstances -- how you're playing, how the other guy is playing, how the match has gone -- you just throw the towel in. It is not a question of heart or sportsmanship or whatever.

Lou Figueroa

liakos
09-16-2013, 05:30 PM
Two guys matched up at the poolhall,

they can quit anytime they want.

Two guys matched up for a promoter,

have obligations !!!

Besides I have seen more than enough of MD.

I just cannot bring myself like him.

imo you won't be talking about him for ever.

He will be a forgotten player.

Very well said sir! I too don't like mike, but you hit the nail in the head with first 2 sentences! Tap tap tap

upindaklub
09-16-2013, 05:54 PM
Beanless chilli is just a spicy chopped burger.

Texas style chili never has beans

http://www.foodnetwork.com/recipes/tyler-florence/tylers-texas-chili-recipe2/index.html

poolguy4u
09-16-2013, 06:37 PM
Mike has done that at a joss tour! They all do that!

:eek:


Playing in the Joss Tour is not the same as this tournament.



So it is now the finals. Is it okay to order something to eat now?

:thud:

3andstop
09-16-2013, 08:34 PM
Well it is certainly bad sportsmanship to quit on the tv table, it was in bad taste. As I suppose it was for Cory to smash his cue into the rail.

But aside from all that....... what's the penalty for quitting out of turn? :scratchhead:

Bob Jewett
09-16-2013, 09:08 PM
... I don't think Mike should really be allowed to quit unless it's his turn at the table. ...
The rule at snooker is:

5. Conceding
(a) A player may only concede when he is the striker. The opponent has the right to accept or refuse the concession, which becomes null and void if the opponent chooses to play on

That is snooker. There is no such "only when it's your turn" rule at pool.

backplaying
09-16-2013, 09:29 PM
I did not think there was actually a rule about when you can forfeit. For example, if you unscrew your cue during your opponents turn, it's counted as a forfeit, which took place in the middle of the opponent's inning.

I have often conceded the last ball to someone if it was easy (9 or 10 ball here), or even if it was semi-easy but they had a good run out to get to it or a good position shot or something. If I respect the player and we have a good match going I would not want to see someone miss a game winner.

In fact, several times I have people concede the game winner to me when I felt iffy about making it. Took a load of my mind let me tell you hehe.

I take it you don't gamble? You would never see this mindset with players gambling.

JohnnyP
09-16-2013, 09:32 PM
I tried watching the stream a few times today but all I can see is the chat. The video player window is not there.

See attached screen shot.

I have a mac, tried both safari and firefox. I disabled adblock on firefox for insidepool.tv, still no video player.

I am able to watch the recorded videos.

I watched the stream from steinway recently, no problem.

backplaying
09-16-2013, 09:33 PM
I see your point, but champions quit in the chair all the time. What are we do do about that? I've seen Earl do it in pool on several occasions, and even a ferocious tiger like Roberto Duran seemed to know when it was time to say, "No mas."

You do know that the majority of people thought that fight was a dump, don't you?

Mr. Bond
09-16-2013, 09:40 PM
Beanless chilli is just a spicy chopped burger.

:eek:

<-----plugs ears. lalalalalalalalalalala

The Rules and Regulations for cooks at the World’s Championship, State, Regional and District Cookoffs are as follows:

1. Traditional Red Chili is defined by the International Chili Society as any kind of meat or combination of meats,
cooked with red chili peppers, various spices and other ingredients, with the exception of BEANS and PASTA
which are strictly forbidden.

2. Chili Verde is defined by the International Chili Society as any kind of meat or combination of meats, cooked
with green chili peppers, various spices and other ingredients, with the exception of BEANS and PASTA which
are strictly forbidden.

http://www.chilicookoff.com/Event/event_rules.asp


Mike quit before the game was "over"?

well thats a shame. maybe he smelled chili cooking and wanted to find out if it had beans?

AtLarge
09-16-2013, 10:45 PM
If Mike really wanted to blow Corey's mind. There was a foul that was commited by Corey.Towards the end before MD quit Corey made a shot and scratched Corey stopped the cue ball before it hit the pocket. By the book it is a 16 ball foul/penalty. Generally its not called but if you really wanted to be a dick that would have been the perfect time to call it. The tension between misses/sharking/railbirds chirping was at a peak level.

Actually, under WPA (world-standardized) rules, it is considered unsportsmanlike conduct. The penalty is to be determined by the referee, and can range from just a warning all the way to ejection and forfeiture of any prizes.

SakuJack
09-17-2013, 12:11 AM
In snooker, it's considered bad form to concede a match when it is not
your turn at the table.....pros have been warned or even fined for it.

Players often concede a frame immediately after missing a shot - generally only when they need snookers, though.

SakuJack
09-17-2013, 12:13 AM
You do know that the majority of people thought that fight was a dump, don't you?

Duran/Leonard 2? They really didn't.

3andstop
09-17-2013, 01:45 AM
I tried watching the stream a few times today but all I can see is the chat. The video player window is not there.

See attached screen shot.

I have a mac, tried both safari and firefox. I disabled adblock on firefox for insidepool.tv, still no video player.

I am able to watch the recorded videos.

I watched the stream from steinway recently, no problem.


Have you tried to google. Ustream wont play on mac

http://casadeblundell.com/jonathan/ustream-videos-not-working-fixed/

Could be something with flash player

JohnnyP
09-17-2013, 04:38 AM
Thanks for reminding me about flash. I think I allowed an automatic update for flash a week or so ago. It must have quit working then.

I checked the global settings panels. The video help page says to enable microphone and camera to watch ustream!!??

http://helpx.adobe.com/flash-player/kb/troubleshoot-games-video-audio-flash.html#main_sound

hang-the-9
09-17-2013, 06:33 AM
I take it you don't gamble? You would never see this mindset with players gambling.

I've seen people concede games early gambling, not just the game winner but 2-3 ball run outs when the players were good.

Grady said several times on commentary during matches that "if you were gambling you'd just throw those balls in and start a new game".

Island Drive
09-17-2013, 06:36 AM
Sounds childish....gives little respect to the game if that's what actually transpired.

voiceofreason
09-17-2013, 06:40 AM
Quick question...

If you forfeit a frame at the wrong time, what is the penalty?

Loss of frame?

Is this a real debate that has managed 5 pages????

hang-the-9
09-17-2013, 06:40 AM
Unscrewing your cue, which can be construed as a forfeit actually isn't.

If this were a rule, Jose Parica would have been forfeited from 100's of events. He's very well known for using as many as 3-4 shafts during a match sometimes.

Changing a shaft is a different thing, you do it on your turn and should be pretty obvious you are not just doing it to put away the cue. Only a total jerk would start saying you are quitting in this case.

I've seen people stand 20 feet from their case in line of sight of the guy shooting and they start to slowly take apart the cue while the other guy is finishing the game. That is a loss of game.

robsnotes4u
09-17-2013, 06:57 AM
That really wasn't quitting. I missed a pretty easy ball and felt Corey could run the 10 wide open balls on the table. I guess something could have happened but I respect his game.

Very good point. To me there is a difference between quitting, and conceding. I watched a guy concede, in a tournament, the game after the break playing 8 ball on a bar box to our house pro. Sucked because I had him in the Calcutta.

Could Corey have not got out, possible, but not probable.

It is Mike's decision, nobody elses.

jsp
09-17-2013, 06:58 AM
Bustamante conceded to Neils in the World Straight Pool tournament a few years ago. It was a completely lopsided match and Neils only had a few more balls to run before becoming the champion, but Busty conceded first. Personally, I think Busty's concession was poor etiquette, especially given that it was the finals and a straight pool tournament. Let Neils run the last few balls and get the satisfaction of pocketing that last ball for a climactic finish. But conceding robs him of that thrill.

I don't know if anyone else noticed, but Bustamante actually conceded to Darren in this year's 14.1 tournament BEFORE Darren pocketed his 200th straight ball. WTF? Let Darren get the satisfaction of actually pocketing the last ball and achieving the first ever 200-and-out completely undisturbed. If Francisco actually knew the count when he decided to concede, then this would have been a completely classless move. But I like Busty (a lot, even), and I'm giving him the benefit of the doubt that he simply thought Darren already pocketed the 200th ball before shaking his hand.

robsnotes4u
09-17-2013, 07:07 AM
Look guys, I'm not trying to bash Mike and frankly I only caught the last 30 minutes of that match and didn't see the Corey, food ordering incident. Furthermore, I was unaware that touching the cue ball was a 15 point foul which, is also a very good point indeed...

The point which I was really trying to make is that technically, a concession can only be made during a player's turn. Not before, or after. A concession cannot be legally accepted by a tournament director or an opponent until it is that person's turn at the table and they physically motion or indicate that they concede the match or game.

I know it sounds nitpicky, but these are rules that have been established for many years. If you've ever watched a snooker match and the player is in the middle of a run and yet has clearly won the frame, you NEVER see the other player get up and say, 'Okay, you win!'

The opponent cannot technically forfeit until the inning is over and it is his turn at the table.

I feel it's important to understand this because this is an integral part of sportsmanship.

Not that the food thing had any merit either.

So Mike could only forfeit before he missed the ball in hand? When is it still considered your turn, when you sit down, or when the balls stop rolling.

If he leaves not to come back is the tournament stopped until he returns, what if he doesn't return.

Stupid rule, and totally unenforceable.

decent dennis
09-17-2013, 07:14 AM
Look guys, I'm not trying to bash Mike and frankly I only caught the last 30 minutes of that match and didn't see the Corey, food ordering incident. Furthermore, I was unaware that touching the cue ball was a 15 point foul which, is also a very good point indeed...

The point which I was really trying to make is that technically, a concession can only be made during a player's turn. Not before, or after. A concession cannot be legally accepted by a tournament director or an opponent until it is that person's turn at the table and they physically motion or indicate that they concede the match or game.

I know it sounds nitpicky, but these are rules that have been established for many years. If you've ever watched a snooker match and the player is in the middle of a run and yet has clearly won the frame, you NEVER see the other player get up and say, 'Okay, you win!'

The opponent cannot technically forfeit until the inning is over and it is his turn at the table.

I feel it's important to understand this because this is an integral part of sportsmanship.

Not that the food thing had any merit either.

"I quit" ...."no you can't quit it is not your turn"...... "watch me".... Really?

decent dennis
09-17-2013, 07:16 AM
Really?

http://uk.eurosport.yahoo.com/blogs/world-of-sport/drago-goes-crazy-himself-bizarre-final-frame-concession-143421711.html

Drago conceded the match after a missed shot, just like Mike did, only in his case he tried to retract the concession and McManus refused to accept the retraction. Of course, Drago then proceeded to beat the shit out of his own head. At least Dechaine didn't do that. ;)

Probably would have took a chunk out of the rail.

SpiderWebComm
09-17-2013, 07:20 AM
What's the difference between quitting in a pool set and a fighter throwing in a towel? Pro golfers quit mid round when they play like a hack and just blame it on their back.... seen it a lot.

If someone quits... it's the same as an MMA fighter tapping out. Don't make a huge deal over it.

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk 2

CreeDo
09-17-2013, 07:49 AM
Really?

http://uk.eurosport.yahoo.com/blogs/world-of-sport/drago-goes-crazy-himself-bizarre-final-frame-concession-143421711.html

Drago conceded the match after a missed shot, just like Mike did, only in his case he tried to retract the concession and McManus refused to accept the retraction. Of course, Drago then proceeded to beat the shit out of his own head. At least Dechaine didn't do that. ;)

Only because he knew he'd be charged for heavy damage to the table.
HOOOOOHHHHHH

that was mean, sorry.

Drago tried to take it back because he'd forgotten there's a 500ish dollar fine for conceding like that.
He was bashing his head because he basically just set fire to his rent money.

boradriver
09-17-2013, 07:58 AM
So, I just watched Mike Dechaine miss a shot against Corey Deuel and then he immediately quit with Corey still needing 9 Balls.

The score was 116 each going to 125 at the MD Straight Pool Championships.

Both players were seemingly falling apart at the last minute but the issue here is that I don't think Mike should really be allowed to quit unless it's his turn at the table.

Technically, shouldn't Corey should have to come to the table and be forced to close out the match?

Corey needed 9 balls with actually only 6 open balls at the table, which means Mike still had a chance.

Silly, if you ask me.

I don't see it being a big deal for Mike to quit. From what I can gather it was a frustrating match for both and it sounds like the miss was the last straw for Mike.

Sloppy Pockets
09-17-2013, 07:59 AM
You do know that the majority of people thought that fight was a dump, don't you?

They do? I hadn't noticed that. Maybe the majority of the bettors who had Duran as a favorite to win felt he dumped. :rolleyes:

IMO the only dive taken in that one was Duran's popularity back in Panama. If he wanted to dump, he could have made it more convincing than just suddenly raising his hands in defeat late in the fight.

Leonard fought his fight and Duran was unable to deal with it. He quit in frustration and embarrassment, not wanting the humiliation to go on any further. That's what many (including I) feel happened.

Sloppy Pockets
09-17-2013, 08:09 AM
I don't see it being a big deal for Mike to quit. From what I can gather it was a frustrating match for both and it sounds like the miss was the last straw for Mike.

That's exactly what it looked like to me. It could happen to anyone. Actually, I'm surprised it wasn't Corey to quit. He finally had the match in his grasp but should have lost after that careless scratch. I wish folks here would give Mike a break and just enjoy his great talent with a cue.

Sloppy Pockets
09-17-2013, 08:15 AM
Only because he knew he'd be charged for heavy damage to the table.
HOOOOOHHHHHH

that was mean, sorry.

Drago tried to take it back because he'd forgotten there's a 500ish dollar fine for conceding like that.
He was bashing his head because he basically just set fire to his rent money.

Why are you quoting me out of context? I didn't say anything about Dechaine hitting the table with his head, that was somebody else. I came on here to defend him, for Christ's sake.

If you want to attack somebody, go attack Dennis Walsh, who called him "Douchaine" on the chat. Real nice from a supposed pillar of the sport, and a lawyer at that.:angry:

hang-the-9
09-17-2013, 09:14 AM
Why are you quoting me out of context? I didn't say anything about Dechaine hitting the table with his head, that was somebody else. I came on here to defend him, for Christ's sake.

If you want to attack somebody, go attack Dennis Walsh, who called him "Douchaine" on the chat. Real nice from a supposed pillar of the sport, and a lawyer at that.:angry:

No-one said Dechaine hit his head, people were talking about Tony.

Island Drive
09-17-2013, 09:36 AM
I don't see it being a big deal for Mike to quit. From what I can gather it was a frustrating match for both and it sounds like the miss was the last straw for Mike.

What about the public and those that came to watch? If there were youngsters there that too speaks volumes. When your on a high level, no one owes you anything, but the room owner and the intangibles deserve better.

xplor
09-17-2013, 10:04 AM
Did you see J.A. throw in the towel.

poolguy4u
09-17-2013, 10:05 AM
What about the public and those that came to watch? If there were youngsters there that too speaks volumes. When your on a high level, no one owes you anything, but the room owner and the intangibles deserve better.

:sorry:


I believe it was free to watch. Out of respect for Cory's game, Mike threw in the towel.

This is common practice among great players who have respect.


What if it was Cory that threw in the towel early, would this keep going on and on?

I don't see anything wrong with what Mike did. He said it was over and he could hear the fat lady singing.:smile:

Island Drive
09-17-2013, 10:37 AM
:sorry:


I believe it was free to watch. Out of respect for Cory's game, Mike threw in the towel.

This is common practice among great players who have respect.


What if it was Cory that threw in the towel early, would this keep going on and on?

I don't see anything wrong with what Mike did. He said it was over and he could hear the fat lady singing.:smile:

If he literally threw in the towel, we all know that meaning. But if I was a parent watching it with his kid, the kid would ask....what happened?

poolguy4u
09-17-2013, 10:42 AM
If he literally threw in the towel, we all know that meaning. But if I was a parent watching it with his kid, the kid would ask....what happened?

:D:D:D:D


Really not that complicated....

One guy wins and the other loses.:thumbup:

AtLarge
09-17-2013, 11:15 AM
That really wasn't quitting. I missed a pretty easy ball and felt Corey could run the 10 wide open balls on the table. I guess something could have happened but I respect his game.

Just for accuracy, Mike: there were still 12 balls on the table -- 6 loose and 6 in a cluster. You were both at a score of 116. Running 9 balls from that position was by no means automatic.

Sloppy Pockets
09-17-2013, 11:21 AM
Did you see J.A. throw in the towel.

I saw it. Saw Thorsten leave that last ball up on the table as well.

But then Johnny went to the table and pocketed that last ball himself, so I guess the win counts?

Gsitz89
09-17-2013, 03:37 PM
So, I just watched Mike Dechaine miss a shot against Corey Deuel and then he immediately quit with Corey still needing 9 Balls.

The score was 116 each going to 125 at the MD Straight Pool Championships.

Both players were seemingly falling apart at the last minute but the issue here is that I don't think Mike should really be allowed to quit unless it's his turn at the table.

Technically, shouldn't Corey should have to come to the table and be forced to close out the match?

Corey needed 9 balls with actually only 6 open balls at the table, which means Mike still had a chance.

Silly, if you ask me.

Is this really surprising? Ive seen several videos of mike and have never once thought of him a professional.

spartan
09-18-2013, 03:06 AM
Who hasn't conceded a match when they think it's over and are pissed off with themselves for missing an easy ball?

Really, people have too much time on their hands.

Well said. Just a storm in a teacup.


I know it sounds nitpicky, but these are rules that have been established for many years. If you've ever watched a snooker match and the player is in the middle of a run and yet has clearly won the frame, you NEVER see the other player get up and say, 'Okay, you win!'

The opponent cannot technically forfeit until the inning is over and it is his turn at the table.

I feel it's important to understand this because this is an integral part of sportsmanship.

Not that the food thing had any merit either.

Don't think you can compare with snooker which is a straight laced tuxedo game ? All kinds of nitpicky and silly arcane rules (no offence to snooker players). Played with a drunk snooker player on a barbox in a drinking bar ( and yes it was a social game not a tournament. And yes it was 8 ball game not snooker ) and when he was on the black ball, this drunkard told me that I cannot hang up my cue as it is disrespectful to him. I told him we are not playing World Championship snooker and told him to fxxxing shoot and stop whining. He shot, potted the black and also scratched. I almost did an Alex Pagalayan victory lap
:thumbup: :D

scsuxci
09-18-2013, 03:37 AM
This can happen with any type of individual sport and personally see
nothing wrong with it.If Mike felt that was enough and wanted to concede,
so be it!
I've seen it in Boxing ,Tennis,Golf,that when a player has reached his breaking
point,then its time to go home.If he would of stayed and freaked out,people
would of said what a idiot he was.
The people that don't like Mike will find something to down him about,no matter
what he does.He's in a loose loose situation when it comes to the critics.

Boddabing
09-18-2013, 07:38 AM
A true farcical comedy of errors, only thing was nobody was laughing! Tournament directors should be more strict with this kind of shocking behaviour. No. 1 - you don't quit no matter how the balls lay and they did not lie that great for Corey after Mike's miss! No. 2 - slammimg cues should come with a heavy dollar fine so it hurts these measely paid pros right in their pocket! No. 3 - and this is the punchline your behaviour should be worthy of the sport you have chosen sadly no etiquette!

Boddabing - yes I am preachin cos its way overdue It needs to be preached!!!!

alstl
09-18-2013, 07:58 AM
Really not a similar situation. Here's what I posted just after watching Dennis Orcullo's concession to Max:



Hence, the were extenuating circumstances surrounding Dennis' concession.
In addition, Max needed seventeen more balls.

Far more similar to this was John Schmidt's concession to Niels Feijen after a miss with Niels needing eighteen. I believe, but I'm not certain, that this was in the quarterfinal of the then WPA sanctioned 2007 World 14,1 Championship.

At the US Open 10-ball event this July at the Rio, Lee Vann Corteza conceded to Chris Bartram trailing 8-3 in the race to 9. Rack 12 of that match never even begun!

Even great players, and Dechaine is certainly a great one, concede occasionally. We'd all prefer that they didn't, but if happens.

Hopefully, there was no Calcutta!

I was watching the match when Orcollo quit. If there had been a shot clock that wouldn't have happened and there should ALWAYS be a shot clock in 14.1 - one of the best runs ever was Sigel's 150 vs Zuglan and there was a shot clock. It would have taken Max 45 minutes to run that remaining rack and a half.

But, the way to prevent forfeits is to stipulate in advance withholding prize money in the event of a forfeit.

Sloppy Pockets
09-18-2013, 09:50 AM
Only because he knew he'd be charged for heavy damage to the table.
HOOOOOHHHHHH

that was mean, sorry.

Drago tried to take it back because he'd forgotten there's a 500ish dollar fine for conceding like that.
He was bashing his head because he basically just set fire to his rent money.

Hey, sorry for thinking you accused me of making fun of MD's head yesterday. After I re-read it all I see that it was YOU who was making fun! But that's OK, you don't come across as a MD hater to me, just having a bit of fun at his head's expense. LOL

I was in an evil mood yesterday, looking to pick a fight. My little buddy Cody - my sweet cat of 10 years - started meowing really loud the day before. When I went outside to see what was wrong, he came through the door gasping for air, staggered and fell down, and died in my arms right there. He seemed perfectly fine earlier in the day when he followed me out to the garden. I think somebody must have poisoned him. I'm not ordinarily a violent man, but it ain't gonna be pretty if I find out who did this to him.

Anyway, not usually my way, I just felt a need to lash out because I was so furious at the cruelty some folks are capable of.

CreeDo
09-19-2013, 11:27 AM
Hey, sorry for thinking you accused me of making fun of MD's head yesterday. After I re-read it all I see that it was YOU who was making fun! But that's OK, you don't come across as a MD hater to me, just having a bit of fun at his head's expense. LOL

I was in an evil mood yesterday, looking to pick a fight. My little buddy Cody - my sweet cat of 10 years - started meowing really loud the day before. When I went outside to see what was wrong, he came through the door gasping for air, staggered and fell down, and died in my arms right there. He seemed perfectly fine earlier in the day when he followed me out to the garden. I think somebody must have poisoned him. I'm not ordinarily a violent man, but it ain't gonna be pretty if I find out who did this to him.

Anyway, not usually my way, I just felt a need to lash out because I was so furious at the cruelty some folks are capable of.

Man, if that happened to one of my cats I'd be a wreck. I'm sorry to hear about that man.
Hope the vet figures it out. It's better if it was just natural causes, you don't want to waste
your time being angry at the sick people in the world who would hurt an animal...
you will just get frustrated and depressed cuz there's so many of them and often they look harmless
and you have no idea what kind of ****ed up stuff is going on under the surface.

Best if you just get peace of mind knowing it was some strange unlucky illness and at least it was quick.

Anyway, we're 100% good, I can see where the misunderstanding happened.
I shouldn't tease Mike, he's a good guy, sometimes I can't resist the easy joke.
Hope you get some peace... maybe a visit to the shelter?

Apocalypse2017
09-19-2013, 12:06 PM
Man, if that happened to one of my cats I'd be a wreck. I'm sorry to hear about that man.
Hope the vet figures it out. It's better if it was just natural causes, you don't want to waste
your time being angry at the sick people in the world who would hurt an animal...
you will just get frustrated and depressed cuz there's so many of them and often they look harmless
and you have no idea what kind of ****ed up stuff is going on under the surface.

Best if you just get peace of mind knowing it was some strange unlucky illness and at least it was quick.

Anyway, we're 100% good, I can see where the misunderstanding happened.
I shouldn't tease Mike, he's a good guy, sometimes I can't resist the easy joke.
Hope you get some peace... maybe a visit to the shelter?

Check out this link, almost killed my dog using this product.

http://www.hartzvictims.org/

Sloppy Pockets
09-19-2013, 02:22 PM
Man, if that happened to one of my cats I'd be a wreck. I'm sorry to hear about that man.
Hope the vet figures it out. It's better if it was just natural causes, you don't want to waste
your time being angry at the sick people in the world who would hurt an animal...
you will just get frustrated and depressed cuz there's so many of them and often they look harmless
and you have no idea what kind of ****ed up stuff is going on under the surface.

Best if you just get peace of mind knowing it was some strange unlucky illness and at least it was quick.

Anyway, we're 100% good, I can see where the misunderstanding happened.
I shouldn't tease Mike, he's a good guy, sometimes I can't resist the easy joke.
Hope you get some peace... maybe a visit to the shelter?

Thanks for the condolences, CreeDo.

It's been a tough couple years for pets with me, this year being a nightmare. A few years ago I had to put down my gorgeous little English Setter after 14 of the best years of my life with her as my constant companion. Then we had to move here, and this spring I lost my little Russian Blue cat to a coyote. All that was left was a few tufts of her beautiful gray fur out by a tree in the back.

Last month my wife came running out to tell me something was seriously wrong with her pet conure (a miniature parrot). We took him to the vet but there was nothing she could do except to try dietary treatment for what she said was probably kidney failure. We thought the little guy was making a miraculous turnaround when all of a sudden he went downhill fast and died in my hands only minutes after showing symptoms again. He was 17 years old, so I guess it was just his time.

Now with Cody gone and the kids long gone I am truly alone here most of the time. I was always really close with all my kids, so this empty nester thing was kinda hard on me. The pets were a nice substitute for the kids, and they never once asked to borrow the car. The wife and I are getting another baby conure, so that should cheer things up around here. For the moment, I just don't have the courage to fall in love with another dog or cat, so I'm steering clear of the shelters. We'll see, though. My daughter's dog died last year and she got an amazing Pit-Lab mix from the pound. I get to babysit her all the time, along with the two grandkids. Feels like a young family again when they're all here. :wink:

FWIW I've narrowed it down to two possibilities with Cody. Either he got poisoned somewhere (intentionally or not) or he got stung and had an anaphylactic reaction to it. He was convulsing and gasping for air, but he was gone before I could even get my shoes on and get him in the truck. I guess I'll never know for sure, but I'm gonna take your advice and assume he just got a sudden illness and died. I have a hard enough time with humans as it is without adding more fuel to my misanthropy.

CreeDo
09-20-2013, 09:06 AM
That's some of the worst luck I heard of. It's kind of a win-win that your daughter can drop off the kids
and you actually enjoy having 'em around, she's lucky. I bet you'll eventually try another cat or dog.

Ever consider an indoor cat? All my cats are indoors, there's just so many bad ends for a cat outdoors.
I hate to think about it. The vets I've known all seem to recommend it.
At first I felt like I'd be depriving the cat if I don't let 'em out,
but I've had indoor cats for years and I promise they are happy campers.
Cats are simple and probably don't think too much on the differences between one area and the other.

justadub
09-20-2013, 09:46 AM
Sorry to hear about your pets, Sloppy.

I dread when the time comes with my dogs, and the older one is 11 or 12 now, so I worry some.

I agree with.CreeDo, the last time we had cats, they were indoor only, and had no issues with it.

You are suffering now, understandibly so. You'll need to weight that vs all the joy they brought you for the time you had with them. Take your time, enjoy your grandkids and grandpup, and who knows, you may just find yourself ready again at some point.