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View Full Version : What would you do with this 9-ball ball layout?


dr_dave
07-30-2017, 12:37 PM
Whether you voted on this thread or not, please place votes on the new thread (http://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?t=457645) so we can keep track of what most people like. You can select as many of the 21 options as you think are good choices on the new thread..

Thanks,
Dave

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For the "What would you do here?" shot layout shown at the 1:59 point (https://youtu.be/Jcge-otXqiA?t=1m59s) in the following video (https://youtu.be/Jcge-otXqiA), what would you do?

1.) Pocket the 1 in the side and get long-side shape on the 2.

2.) Pocket the 1 in the corner and draw back for short-side shape on the 2.

3.) Pocket the 1 in the corner and and play for a bank shot at the 2.

4.) Hit the 1 into the 3-4 cluster to break it up, and hide the CB behind the 2.

5.) Hit the 1 down table, and hide the CB behind the 8.

6.) Hit the 1 into the 9, attempting to pocket the 1-9 combo for the win and/or kiss the 1-ball into the corner, while keeping the CB up table for a shot at the 2.

7.) Something else (if so, please describe your option).

Please pause the video and come up with your answer before you look at the shot in the video. I look forward to seeing what most people would do in this situation. Obviously, the right choice will depend on the person and the opponent, but try to answer for yourself playing an opponent of equal ability.

For convenience, here's an image showing the shot layout in the video:

http://forums.azbilliards.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=466168

Thanks,
Dave

pt109
07-30-2017, 12:44 PM
I think the angle is there, Doc....
...cue ball behind the eight
...one ball to the end rail and back to softly open up the three-four.

dr_dave
07-30-2017, 12:46 PM
I think the angle is there, Doc....
...cue ball behind the eight
...one ball to the end rail and back to softly open up the three-four.I tried this type of shot and could not move the 1 that far and in quite that direction.

What is your vote, given that?

Thanks,
Dave

pt109
07-30-2017, 12:56 PM
I tried this type of shot and could not move the 1 that far and in quite that direction.

What is your vote, given that?

Thanks,
Dave

Whitey behind the eight...I may still get a chance to make the one and disturb the 3/4
while getting position on the two....
...and the cluster also gives you a three-foul option if you get BIH.

I just don't like giving up table control by riding the nine.....controlling the game is what a
session is all about....you want to be the guy 'asking' the questions, not 'answering' them.

KenRobbins
07-30-2017, 01:01 PM
Play safe banking the 1 ball into the 3 and 4 to break it up a little and hide behind 8.

strmanglr scott
07-30-2017, 01:02 PM
This is one of those situations that kinda depends on how it's going that day.

Going for the runout...
Take the one in the corner and slide the cb down for the breakout then take the two opposite corner of the one.

Brags
07-30-2017, 01:08 PM
there's no option for hit the one into the 3/4 cluster and hide behind the 8.

dr_dave
07-30-2017, 01:16 PM
Whitey behind the eight...I may still get a chance to make the one and disturb the 3/4
while getting position on the two....
...and the cluster also gives you a three-foul option if you get BIH.

I just don't like giving up table control by riding the nine.....controlling the game is what a
session is all about....you want to be the guy 'asking' the questions, not 'answering' them.I like the way you think.

Thanks,
Dave

dr_dave
07-30-2017, 01:17 PM
Play safe banking the 1 ball into the 3 and 4 to break it up a little and hide behind 8.I'm not sure the angle is quite there for that; but if it is, I like it.

Thanks,
Dave

strmanglr scott
07-30-2017, 01:19 PM
there's no option for hit the one into the 3/4 cluster and hide behind the 8.

I didn't say anything about putting it by the 8, I'm talking runout.

Brags
07-30-2017, 01:19 PM
I'm not sure the angle is quite there for that; but if it is, I like it.

Thanks,
Dave

if it isn't, you can bank the 1 into the 4 off the bottom rail. That would give you the angle needed to hide behind the 8. That way you hook him and could break out the cluster.

dr_dave
07-30-2017, 01:19 PM
This is one of those situations that kinda depends on how it's going that day.

Going for the runout...
Take the one in the corner and slide the cb down for the breakout then take the two opposite corner of the one.I'm not sure I would like my percentages here, but thank you for the additional option.

Regards,
Dave

dr_dave
07-30-2017, 01:21 PM
there's no option for hit the one into the 3/4 cluster and hide behind the 8.I'm not sure the angle is there for that; but if it were, the right poll option to pick is "7 - something else"

Thanks,
Dave

Brags
07-30-2017, 01:24 PM
I didn't say anything about putting it by the 8, I'm talking runout.

I was talking about he poll.

Brags
07-30-2017, 01:26 PM
I'm not sure the angle is there for that; but if it were, the right poll option to pick is "7 - something else"

Thanks,
Dave

If the angle isn't there just come off the bottom rail with the one ball first.

Ralph Kramden
07-30-2017, 01:28 PM
7) A slow roll bank off the end rail and let the 1 ball stop somewhere behind the 3/4 cluster.

.

dr_dave
07-30-2017, 01:29 PM
If the angle isn't there just come off the bottom rail with the one ball first.I think that is a good option. If you and/or others like this option, please vote number 7 (something else) in the poll.

Thanks,
Dave

strmanglr scott
07-30-2017, 01:31 PM
I was talking about he poll.

I was too. I'll take option 7.

dr_dave
07-30-2017, 01:32 PM
7) A slow roll bank off the end rail and let the 1 ball stop somewhere behind the 3/4 cluster.Are you just trying to hide and/or tie up the 1, and do you plan to position the 1 to be able to use it for a break-out shot? Please pick option 5 or 7, depending on which you think is a better description of your choice.

Thanks,
Dave

Ralph Kramden
07-30-2017, 01:37 PM
Depends upon my opponents next shot. I can't plan ahead if the balls are in different positions.
I'm not planning on hiding behind the 8... so # 7 as I stated in post 16

KenRobbins
07-30-2017, 01:43 PM
I'm not sure the angle is quite there for that; but if it is, I like it.

Thanks,
Dave

This is how I was thinking of playing it.
https://youtu.be/JSRTzLkhT7Q

dr_dave
07-30-2017, 01:46 PM
This is how I was thinking of playing it.
https://youtu.be/JSRTzLkhT7QThank you for posting that. That is a good option, and nicely played.

Regards,
Dave

pt109
07-30-2017, 01:59 PM
This is how I was thinking of playing it.
https://youtu.be/JSRTzLkhT7Q

That was my first choice, Mr Robbins....
..gas up the car, we goin' on the road...:happydance:

peppersauce
07-30-2017, 02:00 PM
I'm guessing no BIH? I'm just curious because Bob completely changed the position of the CB for his second attempt at the 1-9 combination.

dr_dave
07-30-2017, 02:02 PM
I'm guessing no BIH? I'm just curious because Bob completely changed the position of the CB for his second attempt at the 1-9 combination.That is correct. No BIH. Judge your vote based on the first CB position.

Thanks,
Dave

peppersauce
07-30-2017, 02:19 PM
That is correct. No BIH. Judge your vote based on the first CB position.

Thanks,
Dave

Well, I kind of ruined it for myself. I took it as BIH and voted the last option for the run out.
https://youtu.be/ooeMP2glFPg

It turned out to be tougher than I thought and, hindsight, I should've chosen a good offensive safety--even if I did have BIH. I like the option already mentioned where you play the one into the 2-3 cluster and roll the CB behind the 8. I think I would hit it with a speed that allows me to separate the cluster though, if the angle allows.

dr_dave
07-30-2017, 02:24 PM
Well, I kind of ruined it for myself. I took it as BIH and voted the last option for the run out.
https://youtu.be/ooeMP2glFPgNot exactly a "Plan A" or "high percentage" run-out, but nicely done.

It turned out to be tougher than I thought and, hindsight, I should've chosen a good offensive safety--even if I did have BIH. I like the option already mentioned where you play the one into the 2-3 cluster and roll the CB behind the 8. I think I would hit it with a speed that allows me to separate the cluster though, if the angle allows.I don't think the angle allows a cluster break and hide ... not on my table anyway, but I like that option too.

Thanks,
Dave

Neil
07-30-2017, 02:48 PM
I've never liked giving up the table unless I can better the situation or put my opponent in a trap.

I am shooting the one in the side. I would have to actually be at the table to be sure just where I want the cb for the two.( I am picking the easiest route, either to the upper or lower pocket for the two. Which ever is easiest to get on.) But, in any case, I am playing for an angle on the two. Then I am shooting the two and attempting the breakout on the 3-4.

I don't normally like breaking out a ball that I have to also get shape on, but this, I think, is one of the exceptions to that rule. If I don't get the breakout (which I would be peeved if I didn't get it), or if I don't like the shot on the 3 afterwards, then I can always play safe off the 3. But, I am giving myself a chance to get out with no real downside to it.

dr_dave
07-30-2017, 02:52 PM
I've never liked giving up the table unless I can better the situation or put my opponent in a trap.

I am shooting the one in the side. I would have to actually be at the table to be sure just where I want the cb for the two.( I am picking the easiest route, either to the upper or lower pocket for the two. Which ever is easiest to get on.) But, in any case, I am playing for an angle on the two. Then I am shooting the two and attempting the breakout on the 3-4.

I don't normally like breaking out a ball that I have to also get shape on, but this, I think, is one of the exceptions to that rule. If I don't get the breakout (which I would be peeved if I didn't get it), or if I don't like the shot on the 3 afterwards, then I can always play safe off the 3. But, I am giving myself a chance to get out with no real downside to it.... so did you pick option 1?

Thanks Neil,
Dave

strmanglr scott
07-30-2017, 03:03 PM
That is correct. No BIH. Judge your vote based on the first CB position.

Thanks,
Dave

My bad, I was thinking bih.

Neil
07-30-2017, 03:05 PM
... so did you pick option 1?

Thanks Neil,
Dave

I actually picked option 7. I did that because I wasn't sure just where I was going to pocket the two.

Ralph Kramden
07-30-2017, 03:18 PM
Depends upon my opponents next shot. I can't plan ahead if the balls are in different positions.
I'm not planning on hiding behind the 8... so # 7 as I stated in post 16

If the opponent is behind the 8 he most likely won't hit the 1 ball. If he can bank the CB to hit the 1 he'll probably break up your 3/4 cluster.
That's why I suggested to slow roll the 1 off the end rail as in post 16. But if he does foul, you can bank again, hiding the 1 for his 2nd foul.

.

Straightpool_99
07-30-2017, 04:07 PM
Don't see what the big deal is? Shoot the 1 straight in the corner. Shoot the 2 from the short side with inside and break up the cluster. Just make sure to leave enough angle, so you keep the object ball speed reasonably low. You wouldn't want to pound this shot. This cluster is a humongous target! It's almost half a diamond, maybe even more. If you can't pull this off, then you probably will get some sort of bank on the 3 or at least a safe. You'd be quite unlucky to get hooked. Ducking shots like this won't win high level tournaments. A rail first hit will leave some sort of shot most of the time. Shooting with inside is a vital skill to master. Unless you're on super tight triple shim pockets this shot is more or less a duck, at least to make, and most will come close on the breakup too with a little practise.

If you insist on playing safe, I'd do it on the one. Just slowly drift behind the 8, trying to keep the 1 down table. That way, if you do get ball in hand, you'll be in position to break the cluster. And if your opponent does make it, he'll have to deal with it.

Realistically though, if you cannot make the 2 ball shot at least most of the time, then you probably won't run this table from the 1 with ball in hand, anyway. Breaking the cluster from a low 1 and getting good on the 2 is almost as difficult, so you're only prolonging your agony. Pointless to get ball in hand early when you can't run 5 balls. Just saying. You'd have to play safe at least one more time, breaking the cluster and hiding behind the balls, then get ball in hand and run out. It's not an easy runout for a bad player, even if the 3/4 were easily pocketable, so good luck. For instance, it's easy to get into trouble on the 7 with a bad angle on the 5, and the 7 to 8 transition can be screwed up, at least by someone who's not good.

So if you are a bad player and you know it, the best course of action is to bank the 1 slowly into the cluster (from behind) and forget about the cueball all together. Play object ball speed and direction only, very slow, just enough to reach. That way, there is a chance your opponent will screw up and break the cluster for you or you might make the ball pocketable yourself, while still hooking the opponent or giving him a tough bank. . Even if you don't reach, your opponent likely won't have a good shot and may be hooked. I think it is important to consider your own ball running ability when planning runouts like this. Also there is a chance you will have to play safe again from your ball in hand, even in this instance.

dr_dave
07-30-2017, 04:53 PM
Don't see what the big deal is? Shoot the 1 straight in the corner. Shoot the 2 from the short side with inside and break up the cluster. Just make sure to leave enough angle, so you keep the object ball speed reasonably low. You wouldn't want to pound this shot. This cluster is a humongous target! It's almost half a diamond, maybe even more. If you can't pull this off, then you probably will get some sort of bank on the 3 or at least a safe. You'd be quite unlucky to get hooked. Ducking shots like this won't win high level tournaments. A rail first hit will leave some sort of shot most of the time. Shooting with inside is a vital skill to master. Unless you're on super tight triple shim pockets this shot is more or less a duck, at least to make, and most will come close on the breakup too with a little practise.

If you insist on playing safe, I'd do it on the one. Just slowly drift behind the 8, trying to keep the 1 down table. That way, if you do get ball in hand, you'll be in position to break the cluster. And if your opponent does make it, he'll have to deal with it.

Realistically though, if you cannot make the 2 ball shot at least most of the time, then you probably won't run this table from the 1 with ball in hand, anyway. Breaking the cluster from a low 1 and getting good on the 2 is almost as difficult, so you're only prolonging your agony. Pointless to get ball in hand early when you can't run 5 balls. Just saying. You'd have to play safe at least one more time, breaking the cluster and hiding behind the balls, then get ball in hand and run out. It's not an easy runout for a bad player, even if the 3/4 were easily pocketable, so good luck. For instance, it's easy to get into trouble on the 7 with a bad angle on the 5, and the 7 to 8 transition can be screwed up, at least by someone who's not good.

So if you are a bad player and you know it, the best course of action is to bank the 1 slowly into the cluster (from behind) and forget about the cueball all together. Play object ball speed and direction only, very slow, just enough to reach. That way, there is a chance your opponent will screw up and break the cluster for you or you might make the ball pocketable yourself, while still hooking the opponent or giving him a tough bank. . Even if you don't reach, your opponent likely won't have a good shot and may be hooked. I think it is important to consider your own ball running ability when planning runouts like this. Also there is a chance you will have to play safe again from your ball in hand, even in this instance.Thanks for the input.

So it sounds like your choice is option 2. Please vote. Nobody has picked that option yet.

Thanks,
Dave

JC
07-30-2017, 09:47 PM
Whitey behind the eight...I may still get a chance to make the one and disturb the 3/4
while getting position on the two....
...and the cluster also gives you a three-foul option if you get BIH.

I just don't like giving up table control by riding the nine.....controlling the game is what a
session is all about....you want to be the guy 'asking' the questions, not 'answering' them.

^^^^^This^^^^

JC

Bob Jewett
07-31-2017, 10:11 AM
I do like the suggestion of banking the 1 behind the 3-4 and freezing to the 8. What level of player would get that right most of the time?

De420MadHatter
07-31-2017, 10:37 AM
I do like the suggestion of banking the 1 behind the 3-4 and freezing to the 8. What level of player would get that right most of the time?

I would say any shortstop, is gin, about 85% of the time. If you still go by an APA ranking, your probably at 35% or less. On the first try, no practice. As straightpool said, if you can shoot, the runout is there. I don't see any one, who has the ability to run balls, ducking in this situation.

iusedtoberich
07-31-2017, 08:55 PM
Put the CB behind the 8, and the 1 ball behind the 3/4 cluster. It looks like the angle is on to do that. From there, you might win BIH, and can either go for a 3 foul, or possibly make the 1 and break out the 3/4 if there is enough room to do that (if the 1 is not kissing them).

I did not read the responses before posting...

dr_dave
08-01-2017, 06:17 AM
Put the CB behind the 8, and the 1 ball behind the 3/4 cluster. It looks like the angle is on to do that. From there, you might win BIH, and can either go for a 3 foul, or possibly make the 1 and break out the 3/4 if there is enough room to do that (if the 1 is not kissing them).

I did not read the responses before posting...Sounds good.

To you and others: Please vote on the poll if you haven't done so yet.

Originally, I thought option 5 ("Hit the 1 down table, and hide the CB behind the 8.") would include options like this, but option 7 ("Something else (if so, please describe your option).") might also apply if an important part of the shot is to hide the 1 or bump the cluster.

Thanks,
Dave

alstl
08-01-2017, 08:35 AM
Can't tell from the video but it looks like you might have an angle to pocket the 1 up table in the corner and send the cue ball into the 3-4 to open it up leaving a shot on the 2. The other option would be 1 uptable in the corner, draw back slightly for 2 uptable and send the cue ball into the 3-4.

dr_dave
08-01-2017, 08:46 AM
For convenience, here's an image of the layout from the video:

466168

MitchAlsup
08-01-2017, 08:53 AM
If I were in "safety mode" that night, I think I would lob the 1-ball softly into the 3-4 and use top on CB to position the 7-9 in the way of hitting 1 on the opponent's shot.

If I were in "Efren Mode" that night, I would follow StraightPool_99 plan.

alstl
08-01-2017, 11:10 AM
I do like the suggestion of banking the 1 behind the 3-4 and freezing to the 8. What level of player would get that right most of the time?


The problem I see with that is with both balls on the rail the kick is pretty simple. I saw an excellent video on the internet by a guy named Bob Jewett regarding something called the plus two system.

Petros Andrikop
08-01-2017, 11:38 AM
The angle for breaking the cluster and getting by a stun kind of shot behind the 2 is actually there, considering that the 1 has to hit the long cushion first before contacting the 3.
In case the safety is not perfectly achieved there is still a chance of leaving quite a mess for the opponent since the 1 after the 3 should travel towards the 7.
Speed is essential, not an easy shot but worth trying in case one doesn't feel going for breaking the cluster after the 2, the offensive option.
The behind the 2 safety is quite stronger than safety behind the 8 (second best defensive option), giving more chances for breaking the cluster efficiently while resulting most likely in banking "away" from the 1 for re-safe.

Bob Jewett
08-01-2017, 11:53 AM
I think a lot depends on the level of the players. If both players are, say, APA 5s, neither can really expect to run the table with that cluster present. If it goes into a safety battle, it's likely a toss up as to who will get the first shot. In that kind of situation, the value of an early nine increases. There is also the psychological effect on the opponent of seeing the money moving.

peppersauce
08-01-2017, 01:19 PM
What's the angle on the one ball? Is it straight in the corner, inline with the long rail, or in line with the short rail? It's hard to tell from the pic.

dr_dave
08-01-2017, 01:27 PM
What's the angle on the one ball? Is it straight in the corner, inline with the long rail, or in line with the short rail? It's hard to tell from the pic.
If you hold up a piece of paper to the screen with the edge through the centers of the CB and 1, it looks pretty straight into the right side of the pocket. I think you need to cut the 1 a hair to the left to pocket the ball.

Here it is again:

http://forums.azbilliards.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=466168

Does that change your vote?

Regards,
Dave

peppersauce
08-01-2017, 01:31 PM
If you hold up a piece of paper to the screen with the edge through the centers of the CB and 1, it looks pretty straight into the right side of the pocket. I think you need to cut the 1 a hair to the left to pocket the ball.

Here it is again:

http://forums.azbilliards.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=466168

Does that change your vote?

Regards,
Dave

Gotcha! I didn't think to use a piece of paper to get the line. Thanks!

dr_dave
08-01-2017, 01:37 PM
Gotcha! I didn't think to use a piece of paper to get the line. Thanks!You're welcome. I aim to swerve. :grin-square:

Regards,
Dave

Koop
08-01-2017, 02:16 PM
For convenience, here's an image of the layout from the video:

466168

I might try and play the one ball towards the side but not in and try and put the cue ball on the 5 ball, bottom rail. Tough to tell when not at the table but looks like an option to me.

dr_dave
08-01-2017, 05:38 PM
I might try and play the one ball towards the side but not in and try and put the cue ball on the 5 ball, bottom rail. Tough to tell when not at the table but looks like an option to me.That option hasn't been mentioned yet. That seems reasonably safe, with a chance to get a break out shot from the side pocket. And if you miss, you aren't selling out.

Good one,
Dave

Yotehntr
08-01-2017, 07:13 PM
Hard to tell without being behind the cue ball but it looks like hit the 1 with draw pull cue ball near right corner pocket. 1 ball, rail 1st into the 3 breaking them (lightly) 1 goes toward 5 giving at best long hard cut or maybe hung behind 7 & 9. May be able to slide the cue behind the 2?

Set it up on my table 1st try,hid the CB behind the 2, broke the 3,4 up rolled across and as my luck would go 5 ball fell! LOL

Cornerman
08-01-2017, 08:14 PM
As much commentating I do, I can tell you that this is why it's near impossible to say what you'll do based on a snapshot. I'm forever trying to see every angle in the real world, and that's tough enough.

That being said, I can't imagine why I wouldn't pocket the one ball, pocket the 2-ball, and try to play safe on 3-ball. If the angle is there for the left side pocke as we view it, then that's where I'd play the 1-ball. If it's not there (and having to tell us that the angle is not there highlights the difficulty of using a snapshot), then up table it goes.

Freddie

The-Professor
08-01-2017, 09:13 PM
For the "What would you do here?" shot layout shown at the 1:59 point (https://youtu.be/Jcge-otXqiA?t=1m59s) in the following video (https://youtu.be/Jcge-otXqiA), what would you do?

1.) Pocket the 1 in the side and get long-side shape on the 2.

2.) Pocket the 1 in the corner and draw back for short-side shape on the 2.

3.) Pocket the 1 in the corner and and play for a bank shot at the 2.

4.) Hit the 1 into the 3-4 cluster to break it up, and hide the CB behind the 2.

5.) Hit the 1 down table, and hide the CB behind the 8.

6.) Hit the 1 into the 9, attempting to pocket the 1-9 combo for the win and/or kiss the 1-ball into the corner, while keeping the CB up table for a shot at the 2.

7.) Something else (if so, please describe your option).

Please pause the video and come up with your answer before you look at the shot in the video. I look forward to seeing what most people would do in this situation. Obviously, the right choice will depend on the person and the opponent, but try to answer for yourself playing an opponent of equal ability.

For convenience, here's an image showing the shot layout in the video:

http://forums.azbilliards.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=466168

Thanks,
Dave

These are great puzzles and can really tell you a lot about what level people play at in my opinion.

I would consider option #4 if the angle let me feel really comfortable getting behind the 2.

I would also consider #7.... If this was a hill/hill match etc... I would probably clip the 1 toward the 8 and put the cue ball close to the 5 on the bottom rail.

I would also consider #7.... shooting the 1 into the 3 (If I thought I could hit it flush in stick it there bringing the cue ball down behind the 9 (and the other ball).. if I hit it flush I'm almost assured to shoot again... even if I don't get behind the cluster.

Koop
08-02-2017, 09:24 AM
That option hasn't been mentioned yet. That seems reasonably safe, with a chance to get a break out shot from the side pocket. And if you miss, you aren't selling out.

Good one,
Dave

That was exactly my thought.

Thanks
Koop

Island Drive
08-02-2017, 11:06 AM
There's only one shot. It's fairly easy to execute seeing it's just a pure speed control shot. Cue it high about 11:50 and roll forward....with the resulting cut angle a natural to draw back and open up the 3. And if ya hit the break out a little short and miss the 3, you've got a close up look at a 3 ball bank safe. Hard to lose table control if ya get right on your 2 ball shape to the 3.

KenRobbins
08-02-2017, 02:08 PM
If you hold up a piece of paper to the screen with the edge through the centers of the CB and 1, it looks pretty straight into the right side of the pocket. I think you need to cut the 1 a hair to the left to pocket the ball.

Here it is again:

http://forums.azbilliards.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=466168

Does that change your vote?

Regards,
Dave

I never voted, but this image of the layout changes everything. I previously thought the 9 and 7 ball were all but frozen, but they're not. Throw the 1 ball into the corner pocket with high inside and your automatically going into the 3 and 4 ball. Your also almost gaurenteed a shot on the 2 ball this way. I would vote to runout since the 7 and 9 ball aren't frozen. If they were, I'd still play the safety and try to mentally break down my opponent. My runout. https://youtu.be/c614aFis_gs

dr_dave
08-02-2017, 02:21 PM
I never voted, but this image of the layout changes everything. I previously thought the 9 and 7 ball were all but frozen, but they're not. Throw the 1 ball into the corner pocket with high inside and your automatically going into the 3 and 4 ball. Your also almost gaurenteed a shot on the 2 ball this way. I would vote to runout since the 7 and 9 ball aren't frozen. If they were, I'd still play the safety and try to mentally break down my opponent. My runout. https://youtu.be/c614aFis_gsThank you for posting another video. That break out and shape on the 2 worked out nicely.

I just got done filming a bunch of video of all of the options discussed so far in addition to some not discussed yet. I'm about to start editing the video now and I'll post something tonight or tomorrow. I'll post a link here when it is available.

Catch you later,
Dave

Island Drive
08-02-2017, 04:04 PM
Thank you for posting another video. That break out and shape on the 2 worked out nicely.

I just got done filming a bunch of video of all of the options discussed so far in addition to some not discussed yet. I'm about to start editing the video now and I'll post something tonight or tomorrow. I'll post a link here when it is available.

Catch you later,
Dave

To those of you taking this game seriously even tho this was the outcome by going forward, his route is the lower percentage run out breakout shot pattern, shooter has much less cue ball control while the breakout 3 is going to the foot rail and a tough thin cut to the corner will be next up with lots of draw.

Cornerman
08-02-2017, 07:42 PM
I never voted, but this image of the layout changes everything. I previously thought the 9 and 7 ball were all but frozen, but they're not. Throw the 1 ball into the corner pocket with high inside and your automatically going into the 3 and 4 ball. Your also almost gaurenteed a shot on the 2 ball this way. I would vote to runout since the 7 and 9 ball aren't frozen. If they were, I'd still play the safety and try to mentally break down my opponent. My runout. https://youtu.be/c614aFis_gs

Nice dose of reality. If that's the angle, IMO, there's no reason not to shoot it that way. This game is tough enough. Not going for the runout when there's something available doesn't seem to ever win tournaments.


Freddie

peppersauce
08-02-2017, 08:22 PM
Nice dose of reality. If that's the angle, IMO, there's no reason not to shoot it that way. This game is tough enough. Not going for the runout when there's something available doesn't seem to ever win tournaments.


Freddie

I agree with what you said before, Freddy. I think a person would have to be standing at the table looking at the actual layout to decide what to do. The way I set the balls up, the 7 didn't pass into the side. If that's an option, it really opens up possibilities.

After setting the 1-9 up straight through the right side of the corner pocket opening and looking at it, the break out (following into the cluster off the 1) wasn't there either--at least not on my table. My pockets are a little snug and don't offer a lot of room for cheating to get the angle to do that. If it's available on a given table though...solid choice for the out, imo.

I tried the aforementioned option of drawing back for the long cut on the 2 and using that angle to get the breakout--shot it three times, got the breakout twice, and both times the three tied up with the 5.

Mkindsv
08-02-2017, 09:11 PM
I would play the 1 in the corner with bottom right pulling back off the rail to the left and trying to come to rest on the rail about where your piece of chalk is. Play a sliding cue ball with a touch of top to break out the 3/4...then I would get out

KenRobbins
08-03-2017, 12:28 AM
[QUOTE=peppersauce;5939512]I agree with what you said before, Freddy. I think a person would have to be standing at the table looking at the actual layout to decide what to do. The way I set the balls up, the 7 didn't pass into the side. If that's an option, it really opens up possibilities./QUOTE]

If you watch Dave's video again, when Bob shoots the 1 to 9 combo for the corner. The 9 ball clears the 7 ball and hits the short rail. I didn't keep up with the rest of the class on the first round and didn't put that much thought into it. After re watching the video again to make sure I didn't miss something. I noticed Dave had the 8 ball and 2 ball off the rail much more than I did, missed that. Either way, those are hangers, right? LOL

dr_dave
08-03-2017, 03:17 PM
I just got done filming a bunch of video of all of the options discussed so far in addition to some not discussed yet. I'm about to start editing the video now and I'll post something tonight or tomorrow. I'll post a link here when it is available.Here's the link to the new poll with 21 different shot options listed and demonstrated:

9-Ball Layout With 21 Different Shot Options! Which Do You Like Best? (http://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?t=457645)

Enjoy,
Dave

dr_dave
08-03-2017, 03:25 PM
Here's the link to the new poll with 21 different shot options listed and demonstrated:

9-Ball Layout With 21 Different Shot Options! Which Do You Like Best? (http://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?t=457645)
Whether you voted on this thread or not, please place votes on the new thread (http://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?t=457645) so we can keep track of what most people like. You can select as many options as you think are good choices.

Thanks,
Dave

Cornerman
08-03-2017, 04:09 PM
If you watch Dave's video again, when Bob shoots the 1 to 9 combo for the corner. The 9 ball clears the 7 ball and hits the short rail. I didn't keep up with the rest of the class on the first round and didn't put that much thought into it. After re watching the video again to make sure I didn't miss something. I noticed Dave had the 8 ball and 2 ball off the rail much more than I did, missed that. Either way, those are hangers, right? LOL

I'm not sure what you're asking. The 8-ball and 2-ball are certainly should-make shots.

Freddie

Yotehntr
08-03-2017, 04:14 PM
The option that I had added earlier 1 into the 3&4 rail 1st was intended to hide the 1 ball behind the 7 &9 and near the 5. I stated that I had made the 5 on my 1st try (accidentally) which screwed me as I had the CB hidden behind the 2 and my opponent could make me shoot again. Making the 5 wasn't intended as an option. Just to clarify, you can leave it in ;)

KenRobbins
08-03-2017, 04:46 PM
I'm not sure what you're asking. The 8-ball and 2-ball are certainly should-make shots.

Freddie

I most definitely agree with you, that's why I called them hangars. Wasn't really asking a question. Looks like Dave set the 2 ball about a half ball distance from the rail, same as the 8 ball. I can't remember if I froze those balls on the rail or almost frozen when I set the 8 and 2 ball up. Basically either way those balls are going into the hole is where I was getting at. I now understand what Dave and Bob are trying to teach some players here. I'm going to just sit back lurk.

dr_dave
08-05-2017, 07:58 AM
A lot of people who posted and voted in this poll have not voted in the new thread (http://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?t=457645) yet. Please take a minute to vote in the new poll (http://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?t=457645) so you can see how others voted and so we can all see the options preferred by the majority of AZB members.

Thanks,
Dave