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View Full Version : Best "Hard" Tip


Jeff
05-10-2007, 09:12 AM
Wanting some opinions on what you consider the best hard tip, for control, chalk holding, maintaining shape, etc.

RBLilly
05-10-2007, 09:21 AM
As I have said before I prefer Sniper, and you will hear a lot of the same answers you hear every time this thread is started.

Some will say Tailsman
Some will say Moori
Some will say who knows what!

It is always the same answers, the best thing you can do is try them out for yourself and find out what works best for you!

When you buy a car do you ask other people what the best car is? Or do you go out and test drive the cars that you like, and figure out what is best for you?

Jeff
05-10-2007, 09:25 AM
As I have said before I prefer Sniper, and you will hear a lot of the same answers you hear every time this thread is started.


Sniper is not a "hard" tip. I love Snipers but hard they are not. hence my question.

ddcuerepair
05-10-2007, 09:34 AM
Try the Super Pro Waterbuffalo. Holds chalk keeps it's shape and has outstanding cue ball controll on both breaking and jumping.

cyrustong
05-10-2007, 04:53 PM
Wanting some opinions on what you consider the best hard tip, for control, chalk holding, maintaining shape, etc.

If you want to install hard tips on your playing cue, not for jump and break, you can try Kamui H, or even Moori Quick. They are the best for chalk holding, and control.

You can also try TAD Hard tips.

Jeff
05-10-2007, 05:05 PM
If you want to install hard tips on your playing cue, not for jump and break, you can try Kamui H, or even Moori Quick. They are the best for chalk holding, and control.

You can also try TAD Hard tips.

I just sent an MO to Dominak cues for a 1020 and sent along a Moori Q for him to put on. I figured I couldn't go too wrong with the Moori.

Charlie Edwards
05-10-2007, 05:11 PM
Triangles are my favorite.

KJ Cues
05-10-2007, 05:14 PM
When I think of hard tips, the 2 that immediately come to mind are the Chandivert 'Rocky' & the way tall water buffalo tip that comes on the cheapest cues made. That tip is super hard, holds shape & chalk plus it lasts. Ironically,
these are the tips that come on the cues that most entry-level players buy as their first cue. I would only recommend these tips for the advanced player with a very refined stroke otherwise mis-cues will be common.
However, if you've got the game & you've got the stroke,
you'll love this tip. KJ

StevenPWaldon
05-10-2007, 05:14 PM
Ditto. Triangles. Love 'em. I have a cuemaking friend of mine press them for 24 hrs before installing them.

Runner up would be a good le pro, but they're not consistent from box-to-box (or eveni within the same box).

Triangles are my favorite.

KJ Cues
05-10-2007, 05:20 PM
Compared to the water buffalo, both the LePro & Triangle are considered medium. KJ

Secaucus Fats
05-10-2007, 05:52 PM
Triangles are my favorite.

I've tried all kinds of laminated and non laminated tips in all different flavors, Moori, Tiger, Everest, Hercules, Stingray, Chandiverts etc..and like you, Triangles are also my favorite.

Fats

JoeyInCali
05-10-2007, 05:55 PM
Kamui hard

Charlie Edwards
05-10-2007, 06:18 PM
Compared to the water buffalo, both the LePro & Triangle are considered medium. KJ
LePro and Triangle are made from water buffalo hides... as are all Tweeten tips, including Elkmaster.

Jeff
05-10-2007, 07:15 PM
It sounds like a lot of people like the Triangle, even sounds like most people like it better than the more expensive tips like the Moori Q?

iasaxman
05-10-2007, 08:32 PM
You may not consider it a "Hard", but imo, Sniper is my choice, hands down!! I've played with Triangle, Moori Q, Kamui, and various others in the pursuit of a good playable hard tip. The Sniper I have on my Balabushka and the other on the DP are by far the best I've played. They hold chalk, control very well, and even though I break at around 22 mph, I've never had one mushroom in the least. I had 4 Moori tips blow out the sides, not mushroom, actually lose pcs from the side when hitting a med/firm shot. Not even breaking. I like the controllablilty of Moori's, but will never use one again. There are tons of good hard tips out there...just keep trying until you find one that suits your stroke.

Dave

yally
05-10-2007, 11:14 PM
Jensen Milk Duds by far!

Mike sent me a few that I had installed on some of my non-Jensen cues. Guy at the repair store kept cursing how hard they are even turning on the lathe.

But, they play incredible, get lots of action, and hold chalk perfectly. On everyone of my cues now!

Gregg
05-11-2007, 04:52 AM
Hercules makes a nice hard tip. Last a long time, no miscues, and no mushrooming.

asn130
05-11-2007, 05:22 AM
Wanting some opinions on what you consider the best hard tip, for control, chalk holding, maintaining shape, etc.

I am one of those "weird" people that likes a very hard tip also. It has more to do with being able to "feel" the hit than anything else. I can get loads more english with a medium or soft tip, just don't like em.

I love the standard tip that comes on schon shafts. Everyone else i know thinks they are too hard.

I also like the solid non-layerd WB tips. The only trouble with the WB tips, is you sometimes get one thats too hard & will chip. I've actually had big chunks missing from these tips.

But, if you do get some WB tips...make sure they aren't completely black. The ones that are kinda Brown seem to hold up the best.

dooziexx
05-11-2007, 06:48 AM
I used to love triangle tips. They get harder as the tip gets more play. Now I use Sumo tips. They are hard right off the bat and I love 'em.

Mike in MN
05-11-2007, 11:43 AM
Jeff, my recommendation for you is to do some research. I would check out www.poolndarts.com (this is the Mueller's homepage). They have detailed descriptions and hardness ratings for many different kinds of tips. You can take a look at several different brands and see how they rate compared to each other.

As for personal experience, I am not a big fan of hard tips on my playing cue. I played with the Everest tip that came on my Predator shaft for a while, and I didn't mind it. But when I switched to a Sniper tip, I fell in love.

zcat27
05-11-2007, 12:27 PM
I just sent an MO to Dominak cues for a 1020 and sent along a Moori Q for him to put on. I figured I couldn't go too wrong with the Moori.

Do you know what kind of tip he was going to use if you had not sent the Moori?

Hidy Ho
05-11-2007, 01:09 PM
I used to love triangle tips. They get harder as the tip gets more play. Now I use Sumo tips. They are hard right off the bat and I love 'em.

Me too ... triangle or sumo works for me and good bang for the buck.

Jeff
05-11-2007, 01:11 PM
Do you know what kind of tip he was going to use if you had not sent the Moori?

He uses Triangle tips

Triangles are 81.4 on the hardness scale

The Moori Q is 82.7

For comparison the Sniper is 66.9

ericyow
05-11-2007, 01:17 PM
I use Sniper, period. It's hard enough.

-yow!

Scottster
05-11-2007, 03:33 PM
I think the Sniper tip gets harder with the more play it gets.
I have to shafts, 1 with a triangle, the other with a sniper. After I played with the sniper shaft for about 2 weeks the hit & feel were pretty similar to the other shaft just my $.02

Hidy Ho
05-11-2007, 03:49 PM
Are there tips that do not get harder after more play? It seems logical to me. Not being a smart-ass (that I am) but inquiring mind wants to know.

skins
05-11-2007, 03:53 PM
the best tip i've tried so far is the new Wasabi tips. they feel good and hold chalk like nothing i've ever seen. the other night i was playing and decided to test their chalk holding ability. i was playing straight pool and ran 30 balls on one chalking. i chalked again and did not re-chalk for another 20 balls or so. that's impressive. they feel consistently nice as well even when using extreme english. the only problem is they are in very limited production and are real hard to get. the only one i know that it's possible to get them from is Joe Gold in Chicago. that's where i got mine.

hardknox222
05-11-2007, 04:48 PM
I use sumo, WB and Super Pro laminated tips. All of these are very hard tips but I like them on my playing cue. Out of the 3, I most prefer the Super Pro.

jed1894
05-12-2007, 07:06 AM
He uses Triangle tips

Triangles are 81.4 on the hardness scale

The Moori Q is 82.7

For comparison the Sniper is 66.9

I know this is what the technical data shows, but they sure don't feel that way to me. My Triangle tips sure do feel softer than my Snipers. I've even swapped tips to different shafts and Triangles still feel softer. This if very strange.

Having tried all of them, and I would love to say the sniper, Moori and Talisman are better so I can justify the nice tip, and money being no concern when it comes to my tips, my Triangle does just fine. I can play just as good with the Triangle.

JEd

Jeff
05-12-2007, 07:38 AM
I know this is what the technical data shows, but they sure don't feel that way to me. My Triangle tips sure do feel softer than my Snipers.

Yes, feel and perception can certainly be different than what tests show.

Here is where I got the data:

http://www.wolfbite.com/tip-selection.htm

Pushout
05-12-2007, 10:17 AM
I know this is what the technical data shows, but they sure don't feel that way to me. My Triangle tips sure do feel softer than my Snipers. I've even swapped tips to different shafts and Triangles still feel softer. This if very strange.

Having tried all of them, and I would love to say the sniper, Moori and Talisman are better so I can justify the nice tip, and money being no concern when it comes to my tips, my Triangle does just fine. I can play just as good with the Triangle.

JEd

I bought a Gilbert from a local that had Triangles one it. The local had been raving about them for some time, so I went ahead and used them. Didn't feel very hard to me and mushroomed every time I played with it. I sold the Gilbert and now play with Mooris on my playing cue.

playonepocket
05-12-2007, 10:49 AM
I came across a Tim Scruggs Medium/Hard on E-bay a couple months ago.

I put it on one of my "leave in the trunk" cues. At first it made a clicking ping, but after a while and reshaping it, it played great. No mushrooming, held it's shape.

On my playing cues I use Moori Quick tips. With the Moori's, I feel that if you really beat the piss out of them from the start and get them to "super mushroom" you can then cut them down again and they play great, not to mention much harder.

Also keep in mind, I play pool everyday and my stroke is fairly consistent. If you aren't hitting the balls very often you might not want to use these types of tips.

Broken in Moori Mediums play semi-hard and are easier to move the cue ball with. They are definitely more forgiving when it comes to striking whitey on his outer edge.

pwd72s
05-12-2007, 10:55 AM
When I think of hard tips, the 2 that immediately come to mind are the Chandivert 'Rocky' & the way tall water buffalo tip that comes on the cheapest cues made. That tip is super hard, holds shape & chalk plus it lasts. Ironically,
these are the tips that come on the cues that most entry-level players buy as their first cue. I would only recommend these tips for the advanced player with a very refined stroke otherwise mis-cues will be common.
However, if you've got the game & you've got the stroke,
you'll love this tip. KJ

My break cue is a cheap (made in Taiwan?) "Palmer" sneaky with one of those way tall water buffalo tips. It hasn't mushroomed yet...:D

Playing cue is a Jacoby J-2 with an X shaft, sniper tip...now that I've had it a couple of months, I think I'm adjusting...played pretty well by my standards yesterday afternoon.

JimS
05-12-2007, 07:57 PM
I like my Morri Quick's and I like the Talisman Hard.

SPINDOKTOR
06-11-2007, 06:41 PM
I like Triangle's hardness, or maybe a lil harder, But I dont like super Hard tips, Some shots require traction, and super hard tips cant grip the cue ball enough to be effecive at slower speeds. IMHO

Le Pro IMO had a really good tip a while back, so good Id say it was the best tip all around, BUT THEY SURE MESSED THAT UP.

Same thing with Triangle. However the Triangle Chalk is very good


I just invented a revolutionary tip, the harder you strike the cue ball, the harder the tips gets, so if you strike the cue ball easy the tips is soft, if you strike the cue ball hard the tip instantly firms up.

Never mushrooms and chalk is optional, only 250$ each. with a minimum order of 5, get yours TODAY!!!




























:)




































































SO YEAH IM A LIAR but hey some day someone may actualy put Science to use and develop a real tip. Until then, I'll use triangle





SPINDOKTOR

HollyWood
06-11-2007, 07:06 PM
Do you want a hard tip because of no proporsity - meaning the tip doesn't change on impact Kamui II's are the only tip I will use now! Go to Kamuibrand.com click on Movie clip and watch. Why isn't your question what tip allows me to play the best. What shape is your tip nickel dime qtr. In the 60's-70's joss was famous for their tips crown jewels, Richard Black, Tad Kohara all had tips made still do. We don't have waterbuffalo Hides over two inches thick in this day and age to compress. The Origional French Champions hade a shape of there own but did mushroom,so what. It is not very hard or expensive to shape clean or seal,burnish tips. I do it every time I play with a shaft keeping it in the best condition. Remember it is not just the tip that gives you the hard feel it is shaft wood, ferrule matterial, tip. all three. with that said ivory ferrule hard moori regular shaft best hard feel I'll stop. Try this cover the joints on different cues see if you think you can tell any diff. you can't. Look at the grain in your shaft bank ball with the grain up and 90 degrees from that spot find the difference in radial consticistancy in your shaft

cueman
06-11-2007, 10:24 PM
He uses Triangle tips

Triangles are 81.4 on the hardness scale

The Moori Q is 82.7

For comparison the Sniper is 66.9
Rubber duraometer hardness scales are almost useless for leather tips. The Sniper and triangle play very similar. Where as the Moori and Lepro play very similar. You have to press most tips before putting them on to eliminate mushrooming and they will be much harder then, but that is where they will get to after pounding balls for several hours anyway.
I don't judge tips off of a rubber hardness scale, but off a feel scale. Here is how I judge the most popular broken in tips after many hours of play.
Phenolic is rock hard.
Buffalo is super hard.
Moori and most layered tips are hard.
Lepro is hard.
Triangle is Medium.
Sniper is medium.
Tiger Soft is soft.
Elk Master is soft.
I hope this helps.

Chris
www.cuesmith.com
www.internationalcuemakers.com

ribdoner
06-11-2007, 10:35 PM
Those in the know have dubbed TRIANGLES "dick" tips....the more you play with them the harder they get:confused:

HollyWood
06-11-2007, 11:11 PM
Forgot to say test with a razor blade stick it in the middle and measure depth. You'll know quality when stanley turns it down.

Scott Lee
06-12-2007, 06:09 AM
has outstanding cue ball controll on both breaking and jumping.

WOW!:eek:...and here I thought CB control came from having a good stroke! :D Guess I better run out and get me some of them tips! :rolleyes:

It never ceases to amaze me how many people think one tip "gets" more spin than another! LOL BALONEY! Tip hardness is merely a personal preference. It has nothing to do with whether or not (or how much) you can spin the CB. Stroke has EVERYTHING to do with whether or not (or how much) you can spin the CB! Someone with a good stroke can take any cue with any tip and make just about any shot! They may prefer one over another, but they can make any work!

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com

CaptainHook
06-12-2007, 06:45 AM
Here is a link to check out.

http://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?t=43255&highlight=spreadsheet

seymore15074
06-12-2007, 08:29 AM
Sniper is not a "hard" tip. I love Snipers but hard they are not. hence my question.

What is your intention, then?! Post it...:rolleyes:

I like Triangles, I hardly ever scuff up, they're cheap, and they play great. But if you're talking about breaking with a hard tip, they are not hard tips...

CrownCityCorey
06-12-2007, 09:24 AM
Wanting some opinions on what you consider the best hard tip, for control, chalk holding, maintaining shape, etc.

If you must have a hard tip, then the "Tiger Hard" is your tip :D .

Get your Tiger Hard here! (http://bluemarblebilliards.com/catalog/product_info.php?manufacturers_id=32&products_id=39&osCsid=9046a6395aa3b4248152641c96bccdcd)

ccshrimper
06-12-2007, 03:55 PM
I use a hercules tip and I love the way it plays but I keep having the same problems with them. I have them cut down when put on to a little bigger than half size. After very little playing, the tips crack in the middle and half the tip falls off. I don't know if it's something I'm doing (breaking, scuffing etc...) or if it's just a bad batch of tips the guy has, but I'm getting tired of paying $25 a tip for less than 10 hours playtime.

bnall
06-12-2007, 06:14 PM
I seen these Black Diamond med/hard tips on ebay. Has anyone tried these before?


http://cgi.ebay.com/6-Black-Diamond-11-layer-cue-tips-I-love-these-tips_W0QQitemZ110107753525QQihZ001QQcategoryZ75188 QQrdZ1QQssPageNameZWD1VQQcmdZViewItem

Thecoats
06-12-2007, 06:22 PM
I had Jeff Olney put 'Tad' hard tips on both my cues from him. Not sure how easy they are to come by though. Came with fibre backing pad also. They hold shape very well with moderate chalk retention if you remember to chalk often. Used them both for breaking and playing.

eventually switched to Morri M on my playing though. Couldn't control my speed as well with the hard

You can buy Tad tips from JJ America, www.jjcue.com

-don

vinniebabarooch
06-12-2007, 07:14 PM
WOW!:eek:...and here I thought CB control came from having a good stroke! :D Guess I better run out and get me some of them tips! :rolleyes:

It never ceases to amaze me how many people think one tip "gets" more spin than another! LOL BALONEY! Tip hardness is merely a personal preference. It has nothing to do with whether or not (or how much) you can spin the CB. Stroke has EVERYTHING to do with whether or not (or how much) you can spin the CB! Someone with a good stroke can take any cue with any tip and make just about any shot! They may prefer one over another, but they can make any work!

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com




Scott,
So you are saying that a soft tip that grabs the cue ball longer doesn't apply more spin to the ball? I would say if you had a soft tip and a hard tip and shot the exact same english shot, the soft tip would apply more spin. Am I wrong?

Scott Lee
06-12-2007, 07:25 PM
Scott,
So you are saying that a soft tip that grabs the cue ball longer doesn't apply more spin to the ball? I would say if you had a soft tip and a hard tip and shot the exact same english shot, the soft tip would apply more spin. Am I wrong?

vinnie...IMO yes. The dwell time that the tip is in contact with the CB has been high-speed photographed (Jacksonville experiments) at about 1/1000th of a second...not long enough to make any significant difference in what happens with the tip, regardless of hardness. Maximum draw spin comes from an excellent stroke applied to the lowest possible place on the vertical axis of the CB (or the farthest outside edge, if using sidespin). I believe I can get the same amount of spin, regardless of tip, as long as it is properly chalked. jmo

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com

vinniebabarooch
06-12-2007, 07:29 PM
vinnie...IMO yes. The dwell time that the tip is in contact with the CB has been high-speed photographed (Jacksonville experiments) at about 1/1000th of a second...not long enough to make any significant difference in what happens with the tip, regardless of hardness. Maximum draw spin comes from an excellent stroke applied to the lowest possible place on the vertical axis of the CB (or the farthest outside edge, if using sidespin). I believe I can get the same amount of spin, regardless of tip, as long as it is properly chalked. jmo

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com

I can appreciate that answer. Thanks for the response.

Varney Cues
06-12-2007, 08:49 PM
I seen these Black Diamond med/hard tips on ebay. Has anyone tried these before?


http://cgi.ebay.com/6-Black-Diamond-11-layer-cue-tips-I-love-these-tips_W0QQitemZ110107753525QQihZ001QQcategoryZ75188 QQrdZ1QQssPageNameZWD1VQQcmdZViewItem

Save your money.;)