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sjm
06-24-2007, 06:14 PM
Took a new approach on a shot I've been playing a certain way for decades and got a good result. Did I play this the right way?

3andstop
06-24-2007, 06:20 PM
I'll admit not being any consistant 100 ball runner, and I'll also admit that I like inside english a lot to help control speed, but in this case using low outside IMO will keep the cue ball on a "good break" line much longer than using high inside.

If you drew an imaginary line from the 7 to the 10, anything south of that line would be a break shot, using the follow inside takes you outside that area for most of the shot. IMO anyway. :)

selftaut
06-24-2007, 06:48 PM
I most likely would choose the right english shot , unless the ball was froze to the rail or I got to thin on it , then I would go 3 rails.

Williebetmore
06-25-2007, 07:57 AM
sjm,
Not sure about the shot, I see 2 possibilities with inside English (greatly depending on the distance of the object ball from the rail).

Which one (if either) are you describing?

There are 2 pages in the diagram.

http://CueTable.com/P/?@4GNyU2JKKa1PNwq2eKKa2ecpl1kNwq2kHYX2kHxl2kbJF4kM hi3qTnKAre_you_describing_this_shot,_or_the_one_on _the_next_page?&ZZ3uBGR@4GNyU2JKKa1PNwq2eKKa2ecxl2ecxm1kNwq2kHYa2k IWk2kbGL3kLIk1kMhD3qTnK&ZZ3uBWG@

Steve Lipsky
06-25-2007, 08:10 AM
sjm,
Not sure about the shot, I see 2 possibilities with inside English (greatly depending on the distance of the object ball from the rail).

Which one (if either) are you describing.



From that angle, Willie, I think he's definitely playing your 2nd shot. However, depending on your equipment, I think you have to hit the 2nd rail between the side pocket and the upper left corner.

Another interesting variation of this shot would be to go four rails with inside, hitting the 2nd rail just a bit shorter than where you have diagrammed. In this shot, you'll be going around the break ball.

Williebetmore
06-25-2007, 10:05 AM
From that angle, Willie, I think he's definitely playing your 2nd shot. .

SL,
That's what I thought as well. I have been working with one of my instructors on extending the standard 1 and 2 rail routes - just hit the shot a lot harder, and/or with more English; and it can take you a lot of places on the table that a novice might not expect (I was unaware of these routes a few months ago).

One of the advantages of the "four-railer" you are describing is that most of the cue balls speed will be gone after hitting the fourth rail; and as long as you hit it nice and firm, you will probably get nice break position (if you don't hit the break ball or scratch).

P.S. - I've been working on some of the suggestions you gave me; I'll PM. Thanks.

3andstop
06-25-2007, 10:45 AM
Hi. As I said, I'll admit I've got quite a ways to go playing this game. I get through 30 or 40 balls and even once to 78 so I'm no world beater by any means.

I look at the placement of that 10 ball and the diagram of hitting the long rail at the first diamond and I say to myself, wow I just don't see that happening. Hitting slightly before the second diamond would IMO be a hell of a stroke from that angle. Now put that together with that inside english that will be opening the angle off the long rail and I envision this shot coming off the long rail much more along the line of the 7 to the second diamond at best, with little or no angle to the break.

I've got to take this position to my table and play with it. Maybe I'm way off the way I see it on the diagram, but gee, I don't think so. :(

Neil
06-25-2007, 01:05 PM
............

Steve Lipsky
06-25-2007, 01:10 PM
The tables we have here are so fast that the one rail position is almost impossible.We naturally take the 3 rail route.

You should see sjm slowroll a ball, Neil. It's uncanny ;).

Of course, there is a limit to what he can do - so on those tables where this shot would not be possible, it's definitely good to be comfortable with the 3-railer.

- Steve

Williebetmore
06-25-2007, 05:28 PM
I've got to take this position to my table and play with it. Maybe I'm way off the way I see it on the diagram, but gee, I don't think so. :(

Stop-man,
Realize that the cuetable program is a great tool, but it is small compared to a real table. On the real table, a difference of an inch or so on placement of the object ball OR the cue ball is of vital importance in determining what can or can't be done with the ball (and such a difference just does NOT show up on the cuetable diagram). You will find that many people try to post responses of what is or isn't possible based on the cuetable diagram. It is better to ask the original poster what is or isn't possible - he was there. I was merely asking sjm to clarify his route, THEN I can set it up and see the possibilities and limitations of the shot. There are definite limitations to these diagrams.

Also I suspect that if sjm says it is possible to slow roll into position from where he was, then it is so. I also realize that he might be able to do it with the object ball closer to the head rail or closer to the upper right corner pocket than we mere mortals. I hope this helps.

sjm
06-25-2007, 06:25 PM
sjm,
Not sure about the shot, I see 2 possibilities with inside English (greatly depending on the distance of the object ball from the rail).

Which one (if either) are you describing?

There are 2 pages in the diagram.

http://CueTable.com/P/?@4GNyU2JKKa1PNwq2eKKa2ecpl1kNwq2kHYX2kHxl2kbJF4kM hi3qTnKAre_you_describing_this_shot,_or_the_one_on _the_next_page?&ZZ3uBGR@4GNyU2JKKa1PNwq2eKKa2ecxl2ecxm1kNwq2kHYa2k IWk2kbGL3kLIk1kMhD3qTnK&ZZ3uBWG@

Your second shot is the one I played. Short long short.

TATE
07-02-2007, 09:00 PM
Hi SJM,

True, the inside will get you there, and I love inside, however, when you have to put a lot of spin on it like that, I find it makes pocketing the ball more difficult.

These days I'm a little spooked with slow rolling too. The shot I like in this scenario is to use low right, hit into the 10 a little thick so the spin throws it in, and use 2 rails coming back, softly bouncing off the 2nd rail.

Chris

rikdee
07-03-2007, 08:51 AM
Took a new approach on a shot I've been playing a certain way for decades and got a good result. Did I play this the right way?

SJM, the short answer is play to your strength. When in must situations, we all tend to execute the stroke that offers the best chance of success. With that in mind, slow rolling (your strength) is probably most offen the play.
Yet, both cueball paths can result in a desirable position. To some degee the choice here is influenced by the speed of the table. I've played on some equipment where a slow roll from the illustrated position would not hold the position, too slick. The inside spin solution is best on fast equipment as it uses up cueball speed and allows for a softer stroke. Any amount of speed on the inside stroke is going to introduce some measure of cueball path distortion, thus reducing the percentage of successful pocketing.

_Rick