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Greg/Diamond
12-18-2007, 06:16 PM
Just returned from the Mosconi Cup in Vegas last night. I've talked on the phone with the principles of the NACPBA Tour and have received the following email today:


Greg

This is to confirm our recent phone conversation.

We(NACPBA) will be sending Diamond Tables an order and payment for 36 Tables and 36 table carts not later then the end of next week.

Thanks

Terry

Fragged
12-18-2007, 06:41 PM
Just returned from the Mosconi Cup in Vegas last night. I've talked on the phone with the principles of the NACPBA Tour and have received the following email today:


Greg

This is to confirm our recent phone conversation.

We(NACPBA) will be sending Diamond Tables an order and payment for 36 Tables and 36 table carts not later then the end of next week.

Thanks

Terry




I hope that locks in the order for you but I wouldnt hold on to that check too long,

smashmouth
12-18-2007, 07:43 PM
they're starting with the bs already, lol

Drew
12-18-2007, 07:50 PM
they're starting with the bs already, lol

Naysaying already. Why can't we all just give them a chance? It's not like anyone has paid anything yet so let's just wait and see what happens.

av84fun
12-18-2007, 08:04 PM
Just returned from the Mosconi Cup in Vegas last night. I've talked on the phone with the principles of the NACPBA Tour and have received the following email today:


Greg

This is to confirm our recent phone conversation.

We(NACPBA) will be sending Diamond Tables an order and payment for 36 Tables and 36 table carts not later then the end of next week.

Thanks

Terry

Thanks for passing that on. At least we now have a "credibility date."

(-:

our_auctionguy
12-18-2007, 08:10 PM
My wife told me she wants a Really BIG Diamond our next anniversary. I was kind of thinking maybe a 4-1/2 by 9 might be big enough. Think that would make her happy???

Tim5000
12-18-2007, 08:38 PM
Gregg I wish you the best, and we all appreciate your sharing your personal business dealings with us, but I'll remain a skeptic. Your original post said you were 'picking up the check at the Mosconi Cup' now they have delayed it. Sounds a little suspicious (on their part, not yours of course) Good luck.

Dawgie
12-18-2007, 09:05 PM
Why do some of you guys start with the bashing as soon as you hear about the NACPBA recent news. Don't you think being positive and maybe commenting with encouraging words would be more helpful.

Some of you guys sound as though you would delight in this organization failing.

ScottW
12-18-2007, 09:27 PM
Greg,

How *long* does it take you guys to crank out 36 tables?

av84fun
12-18-2007, 09:43 PM
Greg,

How *long* does it take you guys to crank out 36 tables?

about 10 minutes after the DCC!

(-:

thebestpoolroom
12-18-2007, 10:27 PM
Y'all need to stop the bashing. I personally know Terry very well. He's a class act! If you are half the man that Terry is, you are a great person.

Good luck with the new tour Terry.

Your friend,

John Duong

jay helfert
12-18-2007, 10:32 PM
Y'all need to stop the bashing. I personally know Terry very well. He's a class act! If you are half the man that Terry is, you are a great person.

Good luck with the new tour Terry.

Your friend,

John Duong

I liked Terry as well. We had a nice talk at the Mosconi Cup. I hope everything works out for him on this ambitious project. I shared my reservations with him, and reminded him about the recent debacle of the IPT. He was unfazed and was confident that this new tour was going to proceed as planned.

RunoutalloverU
12-18-2007, 10:35 PM
Y'all need to stop the bashing. I personally know Terry very well. He's a class act! If you are half the man that Terry is, you are a great person.

Good luck with the new tour Terry.

Your friend,

John Duong

These kind of posts are encouraging, and I for one am expecting the worse, and hoping for the best! Lets make something happen!
And lmao at Earl in a straight jacket.

Mark Griffin
12-18-2007, 11:21 PM
Like some of the others that have already posted, I also met with the management team of the NACPBA project. They are asking a lot of questions and I think they are listening real well.

A project this big is not going to always happen as planned - there will be all kinds of adjustments made on the fly. But I am confident that the funds are available and that is a HUGE step. After a few adjustments, I think they are going to provide a lot of pool playing enjoyment for all of us.

They are looking at a lot of things that have been neglected over the years by all other promoters. Granted most don't have access to the money these guys do. But they are putting it into places that will suprise almost everyone - and the results will be really enjoyed by all.

I wish them the best - they have a daunting job ahead. But I think we might be all pleasantly suprised.

For the naysayers-it is almost like you want a failure; so you can say "I told you so". My attitude is to do what you can to help get the job done. Lets encourage and promote this project. Or just "join the project or get the hell out of the way".

I wish everyone a Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year. See you at the Derby - and what a way to start off the new year!!!!

Mark Griffin
BCA Pool League

Fatboy
12-19-2007, 12:33 AM
I liked Terry as well. We had a nice talk at the Mosconi Cup. I hope everything works out for him on this ambitious project. I shared my reservations with him, and reminded him about the recent debacle of the IPT. He was unfazed and was confident that this new tour was going to proceed as planned.


if they dont have their business model dependant on one source on revinue like KT's gig did there is some hope, pool is cheap advertizing for alot of big business-who ever packages it the right way and sells it will make millions and the players will be able to earn a good living, its possible, just hasnt been done yet. I could do it for that matter problem is I have enough going on that I couldnt give full attention, if nothing happens by the time I retire from my current gig I'm gonna step up and I have the $$$ no bull shit to do it right. but right now is a bad time in my ife to go that direction.

JimS
12-19-2007, 04:58 AM
. but right now is a bad time in my ife to go that direction.

What would it take to be a good time? Not a smart-ass remark.... a serious question. Do you mean market conditions or conditions in your life/world? What conditions would make it a good time to go in that direction. Don't mean to put you on the spot but I guess I am putting you on the spot.

Johnnyt
12-19-2007, 05:09 AM
What would it take to be a good time? Not a smart-ass remark.... a serious question. Do you mean market conditions or conditions in your life/world? What conditions would make it a good time to go in that direction. Don't mean to put you on the spot but I guess I am putting you on the spot.

I believe he meant he has too many irons in the fire right now and couldn't give ir 100%. Johnnyt

COLLECTION GURU
12-19-2007, 06:54 AM
Naysaying already. Why can't we all just give them a chance? It's not like anyone has paid anything yet so let's just wait and see what happens.
DREW IS MY MIDDLE NAME AND I RECOGNIZE YOUR SENSE OF REASON.

M HOUSE
12-19-2007, 07:27 AM
By sheer chance, I ran into a gentleman from Ga. yesterday who knows the principles behind the new tour personally. He said this group has the desire and the money to get this done. What he said that I liked the most was that the "main" members of the group admit that they don't know as much as they need to know about the "game" itself. (I think we already knew that from reading their website) The fact that they acknowledge that this is a area of weakness for them would indicate that there may be a willingness on their part to accept input from people who have knowledge and experience in this field.

I hope that if they do seek advice in this area, they form some kind of "committee" and not depend on one person (ie, a player) for advice. We know what happened when "the greatest thing that ever happened to pool" relied on one person for advice. His personal prefences became the rule of law (slow, napped cloth, no jump cues, etc.).

If they are accepting recommendations for members of such a committee, I would put Greg of Diamond at the top of the list. He has been involved in our sport on many levels and knows what works and more importantly, what doesn't work. If this tour is going to "get off the ground", it would be nice to see it started with as few "bugs to be worked out later" as possible.

Happy Holidays, see you at DCC

Blackjack
12-19-2007, 08:00 AM
By sheer chance, I ran into a gentleman from Ga. yesterday who knows the principles behind the new tour personally. He said this group has the desire and the money to get this done. What he said that I liked the most was that the "main" members of the group admit that they don't know as much as they need to know about the "game" itself. (I think we already knew that from reading their website) The fact that they acknowledge that this is a area of weakness for them would indicate that there may be a willingness on their part to accept input from people who have knowledge and experience in this field.

I hope that if they do seek advice in this area, they form some kind of "committee" and not depend on one person (ie, a player) for advice. We know what happened when "the greatest thing that ever happened to pool" relied on one person for advice. His personal prefences became the rule of law (slow, napped cloth, no jump cues, etc.).

If they are accepting recommendations for members of such a committee, I would put Greg of Diamond at the top of the list. He has been involved in our sport on many levels and knows what works and more importantly, what doesn't work. If this tour is going to "get off the ground", it would be nice to see it started with as few "bugs to be worked out later" as possible.

Happy Holidays, see you at DCC

I agree with you entirely. Instead of a "committee" - perhaps this group could put together a roundtable of people that have experience with what works and what doesn't - and to alert them on what has contributed to the failure of their predecessors - and guide them in the opposite direction. Without that guidance from those that have experience - they will have a tough hill to climb.

Like I've said before - the tours continue to fail because they keep repeating the same mistakes over and over and expecting different results. Anyone that is involved in the management aspect of the tour does not need to be competing. That is a conflict of interest at every level. Hopefully they have avoided that pitfall altogether.

Tossing money at ANY tour won't solve anything until and unless the players are willing to do the work necessary to bring prominence to themselves, the game, and the tour itself. The IPT is a perfect example of what happens when there is a lot of money involved TOO SOON. Not many players were out there promoting the IPT every day in media markets - locally, nationally, or on the web - after a while, it was all about getting those big checks - playing with the numbers - a saver here, a saver there - lets gets as much as we can, split it up - everyone goes home a winner - isn't it great to have a big money machine? That is why support from the industry goes out the window. In fact, many run in the other direction to distance themselves from professional pool.

70% of the people "in the billiards industry" don't care about professional pool, have no knowledge of the players, and have no knowledge of the history of professional pool. A large majority look at the players in a poor light due to a history of all take and no give. This is unfair to the players of today who are trapped paying for the sins of those that came before them.

Until there is a united effort between the industry, the tour, and the players to map out a clear direction for the sport - we will continue to run in circles. With everybody playing a different tune, its no wonder that no matter what tour is out there, the public can't seem to understand what we are trying to sell to them.

I hope this tour, the people behind it, and the money that is supporting it have the insight to contact the right people, do their homework diligently, and place the right people in the proper positions to make this a success. IMO, it's about time something succeeded.

ShootingArts
12-19-2007, 08:17 AM
My wife told me she wants a Really BIG Diamond our next anniversary. I was kind of thinking maybe a 4-1/2 by 9 might be big enough. Think that would make her happy???

Not for an anniversary or special occasion, just out of the blue I bought my wife a new washer and dryer because ours were a little old. You would think she would be happy but noooo, she said something nasty! I ran across a washboard purely by accident so after scoring it I passed by the hardware and bought a piece of clothesline cord.

I think any woman should be thrilled with a new diamond table. Probably just a coincidence that I have been divorced for twenty years.

Hu

Fatboy
12-19-2007, 08:27 AM
What would it take to be a good time? Not a smart-ass remark.... a serious question. Do you mean market conditions or conditions in your life/world? What conditions would make it a good time to go in that direction. Don't mean to put you on the spot but I guess I am putting you on the spot.

i like being on the spot, or straight in either one is fine by me. ;)


seriously right now I have more balls in the air with my current business than I can stand, however i'm sick of it. but, it pays real good so I need to run it a couple more years. once thats out of the way I will have time to do something else-I'm not gonna do it for free, I have to make several million a year-i'm not gonna bulshit about that, I have to cover my time. However if things fall into place and i'm widely reconigezed in the billiard world over time then I can make a move because i'll need a support structure of smarter people. Done properly I'll get my end and the player will get theirs, i'm not gonna wast any ones time with a 2nd place finish for $7500 nobody can live on that and there is only one guy in the whole tournment who is make more? thats aweful. Look at UFC and how they got it booming-if I do something it will be like that. I'm not gonna waste the players time or $$$ nor mine, right now I cant deliver. First things first I need to work on my public image in pool and reputation then we'll see.

ShootingArts
12-19-2007, 08:50 AM
i'm not gonna wast any ones time with a 2nd place finish for $7500 nobody can live on that and there is only one guy in the whole tournment who is make more? thats aweful. Look at UFC and how they got it booming-if I do something it will be like that. I'm not gonna waste the players time or $$$ nor mine, right now I cant deliver. First things first I need to work on my public image in pool and reputation then we'll see.


Everybody chases the Dolly Parton purses but the simple fact is that there can be only one winner in any event. If chasing purses is your livelihood you have to not only look at what winning pays but at what the costs and payout is for where you are likely to be if things don't go perfectly. Sometimes you need a little good luck, sometimes just no bad luck, however both happen sometimes. I have not let the other person have a single shot and it has been done to me. When that happens, ability doesn't mean a thing.

Hu

CrownCityCorey
12-19-2007, 10:15 AM
i like being on the spot, or straight in either one is fine by me. ;)


seriously right now I have more balls in the air with my current business than I can stand, however i'm sick of it. but, it pays real good so I need to run it a couple more years. once thats out of the way I will have time to do something else-I'm not gonna do it for free, I have to make several million a year-i'm not gonna bulshit about that, I have to cover my time. However if things fall into place and i'm widely reconigezed in the billiard world over time then I can make a move because i'll need a support structure of smarter people. Done properly I'll get my end and the player will get theirs, i'm not gonna wast any ones time with a 2nd place finish for $7500 nobody can live on that and there is only one guy in the whole tournment who is make more? thats aweful. Look at UFC and how they got it booming-if I do something it will be like that. I'm not gonna waste the players time or $$$ nor mine, right now I cant deliver. First things first I need to work on my public image in pool and reputation then we'll see.

Ya gotta work on your "on the rail straight-in cue ball floaters" for shape ;)

Scott Lee
12-19-2007, 10:24 AM
tap, tap, tap, Mark! Great post! I certainly wish these new folks the best, and take the attitude that most posters here have...wait and see, and help in any way I can, to make the tour successful!

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com

Like some of the others that have already posted, I also met with the management team of the NACPBA project. They are asking a lot of questions and I think they are listening real well.

A project this big is not going to always happen as planned - there will be all kinds of adjustments made on the fly. But I am confident that the funds are available and that is a HUGE step. After a few adjustments, I think they are going to provide a lot of pool playing enjoyment for all of us.

They are looking at a lot of things that have been neglected over the years by all other promoters. Granted most don't have access to the money these guys do. But they are putting it into places that will suprise almost everyone - and the results will be really enjoyed by all.

I wish them the best - they have a daunting job ahead. But I think we might be all pleasantly suprised.

For the naysayers-it is almost like you want a failure; so you can say "I told you so". My attitude is to do what you can to help get the job done. Lets encourage and promote this project. Or just "join the project or get the hell out of the way".

I wish everyone a Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year. See you at the Derby - and what a way to start off the new year!!!!

Mark Griffin
BCA Pool League

Scott Lee
12-19-2007, 10:28 AM
Dave...I agree with your entire post. Well said. At the same time, there are still plenty of "sinners" out there, who continue to act and behave in ways that do nothing to dispel the negative image professional pool has with mainstream America. I'm not telling you anything you don't already know. Kudos to the guys who are stand up...but eventually they ALL have to become standups for this thing to succeed in it's entirety! jmo

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com

A large majority look at the players in a poor light due to a history of all take and no give. This is unfair to the players of today who are trapped paying for the sins of those that came before them.

1pRoscoe
12-19-2007, 10:35 AM
But again, Fatboy really doesn't like to brag.....

Fatboy
12-19-2007, 02:33 PM
But again, Fatboy really doesn't like to brag.....


i dont, i tell the truth, i cant do anything right now. I support the new guys and wish them the best. I truly hope it is the biggest most successful thing to ever happen to pool. If it can happen for bowling it can for pool.

corvette1340
12-19-2007, 02:46 PM
i like being on the spot, or straight in either one is fine by me. ;)


seriously right now I have more balls in the air with my current business than I can stand, however i'm sick of it. but, it pays real good so I need to run it a couple more years. once thats out of the way I will have time to do something else-I'm not gonna do it for free, I have to make several million a year-i'm not gonna bulshit about that, I have to cover my time. However if things fall into place and i'm widely reconigezed in the billiard world over time then I can make a move because i'll need a support structure of smarter people. Done properly I'll get my end and the player will get theirs, i'm not gonna wast any ones time with a 2nd place finish for $7500 nobody can live on that and there is only one guy in the whole tournment who is make more? thats aweful. Look at UFC and how they got it booming-if I do something it will be like that. I'm not gonna waste the players time or $$$ nor mine, right now I cant deliver. First things first I need to work on my public image in pool and reputation then we'll see.


lol, what pool player can't live off of a 2nd place check for $7500? Most of them live off of $7500 for half the year.

Johnson
12-19-2007, 04:19 PM
Look at UFC and how they got it booming-if I do something it will be like that.


the ufc will pay out like +/- $500,000 in salary for an entire card but usually 80% of that goes to 1 fighter and the rest of them are given from like $3000 - $30,000 each or so, this is b4 bonuses and sponsors of course, 3k is nothing when u train non stop for 2-3 months b4 a fight, they also have a scandal going on with their in house sponsor xience some have dubbed it the enron of mma, the ufc has a lot of hype behind it and i dont think it's a very good model for pool
________
Paulete cam (http://camslivesexy.com/cam/Paulete)

smashmouth
12-19-2007, 08:18 PM
so this group contacts Diamond before the Mosonic Cup to place an "order"

says cheque will be waiting at the tourney

tourney comes and goes, no cheque

subsequent phone discussion regarding the "order"

subsequent email confirming aforementioned phone discussion,

evidently cheque is soon to come....

sounds great

juegabillar
12-19-2007, 09:20 PM
I agree with you entirely. Instead of a "committee" - perhaps this group could put together a roundtable of people that have experience with what works and what doesn't - and to alert them on what has contributed to the failure of their predecessors - and guide them in the opposite direction. Without that guidance from those that have experience - they will have a tough hill to climb.

Like I've said before - the tours continue to fail because they keep repeating the same mistakes over and over and expecting different results. Anyone that is involved in the management aspect of the tour does not need to be competing. That is a conflict of interest at every level. Hopefully they have avoided that pitfall altogether.

Tossing money at ANY tour won't solve anything until and unless the players are willing to do the work necessary to bring prominence to themselves, the game, and the tour itself. The IPT is a perfect example of what happens when there is a lot of money involved TOO SOON. Not many players were out there promoting the IPT every day in media markets - locally, nationally, or on the web - after a while, it was all about getting those big checks - playing with the numbers - a saver here, a saver there - lets gets as much as we can, split it up - everyone goes home a winner - isn't it great to have a big money machine? That is why support from the industry goes out the window. In fact, many run in the other direction to distance themselves from professional pool.

70% of the people "in the billiards industry" don't care about professional pool, have no knowledge of the players, and have no knowledge of the history of professional pool. A large majority look at the players in a poor light due to a history of all take and no give. This is unfair to the players of today who are trapped paying for the sins of those that came before them.

Until there is a united effort between the industry, the tour, and the players to map out a clear direction for the sport - we will continue to run in circles. With everybody playing a different tune, its no wonder that no matter what tour is out there, the public can't seem to understand what we are trying to sell to them.

I hope this tour, the people behind it, and the money that is supporting it have the insight to contact the right people, do their homework diligently, and place the right people in the proper positions to make this a success. IMO, it's about time something succeeded.

I think the odds are against this group of investors. Any group of investors should know what they are getting into, and its has been said in this forum that they don't. This is the first problem.

Another problem is that if they find out about previous problems and failures, they could and most probably would back-off the project; therefore, if the "committee" is honest with the investors; the committee must let them know of the risks involved in this venture.

One thing that "might" work out is the signing of exclusive contracts by the players with the new organization but then what will happen with all the other established tours and tournaments around the World? Players of the new organization would have to be granted "waivers" to participate in other events; therefore, trying to obtain "exclusivity" could pose another huge problem to players, promotors, tours, pool organizations, etc.

Twenty-two million dollars is a lot of money to be "tossing" around without knowing the "background" of billiards. Any "saavy" investor should want to know what has failed in the past, and right now I don't see how these "problems" could be corrected. The odds are really against this group although they may have the best intentions.

Just my honest opinion....

av84fun
12-19-2007, 10:17 PM
I think the odds are against this group of investors. Any group of investors should know what they are getting into, and its has been said in this forum that they don't. This is the first problem.

Another problem is that if they find out about previous problems and failures, they could and most probably would back-off the project; therefore, if the "committee" is honest with the investors; the committee must let them know of the risks involved in this venture.

One thing that "might" work out is the signing of exclusive contracts by the players with the new organization but then what will happen with all the other established tours and tournaments around the World? Players of the new organization would have to be granted "waivers" to participate in other events; therefore, trying to obtain "exclusivity" could pose another huge problem to players, promotors, tours, pool organizations, etc.

Twenty-two million dollars is a lot of money to be "tossing" around without knowing the "background" of billiards. Any "saavy" investor should want to know what has failed in the past, and right now I don't see how these "problems" could be corrected. The odds are really against this group although they may have the best intentions.

Just my honest opinion....

Both honest and excellent. For MANY years, nearly all of the existing known top players have been competing against each other in televised events.

Those events have achieved and x% share of the viewing audience in their orignal runs and re-runs. Those programs have generated y% of advertising revenue.

The NUMEROUS TV broadcasts have accumulated into a "baseline" that would reasonably predict the financial outcome of similar events in the future.

Based on those rational expectations, the prize money posted for those events would approximate....I would GUESS...around $100k for all those who finish in the money. (that assumes $25k, 15k, 10k etc. which are typical payouts...and that assumes events other than "opens" where player entry fees provides a significant percentage of prize money).

So, my question is...if the events in question are going to include the players who have been competing against each other for years, what factors are the promoters relying on to presume they can payout substantially more prize money and still make a profit?

The IPT "experiment" (to put it charitably) stands for the proposition that these new promoters may have a tough and expensive lesson to learn.

Regards,
Jim