Prepping for auto clear coat?

[JC]

I have a friend who has a body shop and he's agreed to spray some cues for me if I bring them over on a day he's clear coating. Hoping to use this finish without having to protect myself from it.

He said they don't need to spin just be upright so I built a lazy susan out of scraps of plywood that at least three cues can stand up in and he can rotate them by the base so he doesn't need to walk around them to spray. My plan is to screw them down tight and then back off just a little so they can't stick to the jig but the pin will be protected

I would like some tried and true advice on sealing and prepping for clear coat to give this the best chance for success. What condition should the cues be in when I bring them over? Obviously the grain has to be closed but I would love to hear from those who use auto clear how they prep the cue for smooth finish and adhesion.

Thank you!

Lazy Susan:

 

[SpiderWeb]

You have to spay in house. You will see in time.

 

[JC]

You have to spay in house. You will see in time.

Very helpful, thank you. Spaying is major surgery, but I can neuter.

Now all I need is Kim Walker to say "Automotive clear coat adds no value to the cue" and I'll be all set.

 

[Canadian cue]

How much sanding and polishing are you intending to do? If you are going to try and outsource the spraying make sure you have enough mill thickness to work with. As well you make some Delrin washers to go between the joint face and your lazy Susan that way you will be able to get the cue off the stand.

 

[Dave38]

My only input, as I haven't done auto clear, is I recommend using delrin for the threaded posts incase the cues do somehow end up down tight. The delrin will allow you to break it free without damaging the edge of the finish. Good luck with the project.

 

[Duane Remick]

Hi,
having sprayed well over 200 cues with the automotive clear....
I always sprayed directly to the wood- no sealers or west system or super glues, etc-
Just prepped with at least 400- 600 grit sand paper-
cues thoroughly blown off and then wiped clean with alcohol based wax and grease remover-finally-use a tac cloth then do the spraying-
Typically-
3 paint jobs per cue-But some more porous wood- lie cocobolo-more paint jobs
which means,
3-4 decent coats- allowing dry time- between those coats,
a day or 2 later- sanding down the cue nice and smooth and repeating the spraying/coating again, this time allows the paint solvents to escape-
too much clear coat at one time-paint can get hazy and bubble and a lot of issues-
then a day or 2 later - sanding and spraying again,
Until no holes or imperfections in the finish-
"YOU HAVE TO USE A FLAT SANDING BLOCK TOO- WHILE THE CUE IS SPINNING IN A LATHE-TO ASSURE IT FINISHES OUT NICE , SMOOTH AND FLAT-
LAST TIME i SAND BEFORE SPRAYING- SAND WITH 1000 GRIT WET OR DRY-"WET SAND-
SPRAY ONCE MORE-A FEW COATS, AGAIN
AFTER DRYING A FEW DAYS I WOULD SAND -WET SAND- Start with 1000 up to at lest 3000 grit sand paper-
I usually like the let the cue dry out and solvents escape for a few DAYS AGAIN,
prior to finally buffing and polishing-
"I did all of the cues WITHOUT ANY DRYING HELP THOUGH-
I know there are ultra violet lights , etc- but the shop I was working at didn't have anything like that-
SO my process- typically 4 weeks to properly auto clear coat cues-
Also-
the cues I was finishing all brand new construction.

 

[JC]

Hi,
having sprayed well over 200 cues with the automotive clear....
I always sprayed directly to the wood- no sealers or west system or super glues, etc-
Just prepped with at least 400- 600 grit sand paper-
cues thoroughly blown off and then wiped clean with alcohol based wax and grease remover-finally-use a tac cloth then do the spraying-
Typically-
3 paint jobs per cue-But some more porous wood- lie cocobolo-more paint jobs
which means,
3-4 decent coats- allowing dry time- between those coats,
a day or 2 later- sanding down the cue nice and smooth and repeating the spraying/coating again, this time allows the paint solvents to escape-
too much clear coat at one time-paint can get hazy and bubble and a lot of issues-
then a day or 2 later - sanding and spraying again,
Until no holes or imperfections in the finish-
"YOU HAVE TO USE A FLAT SANDING BLOCK TOO- WHILE THE CUE IS SPINNING IN A LATHE-TO ASSURE IT FINISHES OUT NICE , SMOOTH AND FLAT-
LAST TIME i SAND BEFORE SPRAYING- SAND WITH 1000 GRIT WET OR DRY-"WET SAND-
SPRAY ONCE MORE-A FEW COATS, AGAIN
AFTER DRYING A FEW DAYS I WOULD SAND -WET SAND- Start with 1000 up to at lest 3000 grit sand paper-
I usually like the let the cue dry out and solvents escape for a few DAYS AGAIN,
prior to finally buffing and polishing-
"I did all of the cues WITHOUT ANY DRYING HELP THOUGH-
I know there are ultra violet lights , etc- but the shop I was working at didn't have anything like that-
SO my process- typically 4 weeks to properly auto clear coat cues-
Also-
the cues I was finishing all brand new construction.

Good information Duane thank you.

I have sent some cues to Scot Sherbine and gotten them back in a week clear coated. I wonder what his work flow is?

 

[whammo57]

Very helpful, thank you. Spaying is major surgery, but I can neuter.

Now all I need is Kim Walker to say "Automotive clear coat adds no value to the cue" and I'll be all set.

I have never said that............. why do you choose to ridicule me for no reason????

Kim

 

[Kim Bye]

Do you use a epoxy base coat?

 

[JC]

I have never said that............. why do you choose to ridicule me for no reason????

Kim

I'm not ridiculing you Kim come on just kidding around about your bluntness. You know I respect your opinions.

 

[JC]

Do you use a epoxy base coat?

Not generally is that a good idea for sealing? I have some max 1618 that seems never to yellow.

 

[Duane Remick]

Good information Duane thank you.

I have sent some cues to Scot Sherbine and gotten them back in a week clear coated. I wonder what his work flow is?

"I'm thinking Scot has a curing system of some kind-
"I know His work is always TOP- SHELF QUALITY ,
and seems to always deliver on time too"

 

[JoeyInCali]

I lay mine horizontal and index 4 spots . Used to do it in 5 but having a 3-inch mist does the job indexing every 90 degrees.
Epoxy base coat at least two layers . First coat gets sanded down 320 grit. Second coat 800 plus gray scotch brite . Third coat gets same sanding with 800 grit and gray scotch brite.
Prep All spray can and bondo tack cloth before spraying .
First coat goes in about 7 mil and you sand that down to 2 to 3 mil with 800 grit and gray scotch brite .
Blow clean. Prep All and tack cloth.
Final coat some 5 mil.

People do it differently . Some sand the epoxy coat and just it as filler .
If the cue is cored, you can heat dry. But, don't get crazy with the heat .
I don't heat dry. PPG I use dries the next day . Polish in 4 days is better .

 

[JC]

I lay mine horizontal and index 4 spots . Used to do it in 5 but having a 3-inch mist does the job indexing every 90 degrees.
Epoxy base coat at least two layers . First coat gets sanded down 320 grit. Second coat 800 plus gray scotch brite . Third coat gets same sanding with 800 grit and gray scotch brite.
Prep All spray can and bondo tack cloth before spraying .
First coat goes in about 7 mil and you sand that down to 2 to 3 mil with 800 grit and gray scotch brite .
Blow clean. Prep All and tack cloth.
Final coat some 5 mil.

People do it differently . Some sand the epoxy coat and just it as filler .
If the cue is cored, you can heat dry. But, don't get crazy with the heat .
I don't heat dry. PPG I use dries the next day . Polish in 4 days is better .

What epoxy do you use?

 

[JoeyInCali]

What epoxy do you use?

West 105/207. But, your max will do too.

And, btw, I suggest not using snap cure type auto clear . Collision places like using those because they dry fast .

 

[Kim Bye]

I do 2-3 layers of epoxy, BSI finish cure or West 207 special clear. Sand between each layer until I have a smooth matte surface a few thou under the final dimension. Clean the surface, then spray, first a tack coat, let that sit about 10 minutes, then spray several wet coats.
I try to leave as much time as possible before I wet sand and buff.

 

[Canadian cue]

When I started finishing I didn't use a base coat and what I found was that as the finish cured over months it shrank back some. So depending on the base material, be it wood, plastic, fiber, bone or metal it would settle in different. So for me the base coat is more about creating a flat consistent surface for the clear. So even if it shrinks back some over time it will still be nice and even. The problem with base coat of epoxy that I have found is that it isn't as clear as the auto clear so if you leave it on too thick it creates a haze over certain materials, specifically metal work. For me it was all about learning the nuances. You have to create a system that works for you and your situation, be critical of your results and keep modifying your process until you get the level of perfection your happy with. When ever I get other makers cues in my shop I always look the finish over. The level of perfection is all over the map.

 

[JoeyInCali]

I do 2-3 layers of epoxy, BSI finish cure or West 207 special clear. Sand between each layer until I have a smooth matte surface a few thou under the final dimension. Clean the surface, then spray, first a tack coat, let that sit about 10 minutes, then spray several wet coats.
I try to leave as much time as possible before I wet sand and buff.

I have found some finishes have different instructions . Some do not dry coat . Some tell you to spray a wet coat right away . When that flashes, spray final coat .
I've come across one that tells you to not even wait for flash. Just lay it out .
It actually got really hard but did not shine as well as the euro PPG I use now.
Btw, JC, I suggest stocking up on 000 and 0 steel wool . Learn their uses .
Cleaners for bare wood and wood with epoxy coat on top are different too.
Acetone is tough on epoxy coat . But, perfect for wood and metals.

 

[Kim Bye]

I have found some finishes have different instructions . Some do not dry coat . Some tell you to spray a wet coat right away . When that flashes, spray final coat .
I've come across one that tells you to not even wait for flash. Just lay it out .
It actually got really hard but did not shine as well as the euro PPG I use now.
Btw, JC, I suggest stocking up on 000 and 0 steel wool . Learn their uses .
Cleaners for bare wood and wood with epoxy coat on top are different too.
Acetone is tough on epoxy coat . But, perfect for wood and metals.

Clear is definitely a product that can be fickle in terms of temperature, humidity, way of aplication, air pressure, equipment etc.
For me it took quite a bit of experimenting before dialing in all the different elements that effects the way the clear behaves.
Having clean air is super important. I have a Prevost solid pipe system, with a 3 stage air purifying system from Devilbiss.
That helped a lot in terms of consistency.

 

[whammo57]

I'm not ridiculing you Kim come on just kidding around about your bluntness. You know I respect your opinions.

yes I am blunt............ having said that.... I see people trying to add operations, methods and materials to building pool cues that are simply the builders idea ................ and some of them add no value to the cue............... auto clear coat is very nice but dangerous to the user with out proper PPE...............

Kim