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-   -   8 ball break driving me nuts!! (https://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?t=141247)

trob 05-04-2009 04:27 PM

8 ball break driving me nuts!!
 
I'm not sure if it's lack of execution or lack of luck! lol I'm putting the cue ball at the corner of the break box. I aiming to hit the cue ball middle and the head ball as solid as possible. I turn my hips in at contact to gain power and drive the the cue through the ball. The damn rack is blowing up. Balls flying every where. But nothing is dropping! I would say in 5 breaks maybe 2 I drop a ball. The rack is wide open with nothing dropping...not a good way to start lol Any tips out there?

BVal 05-04-2009 04:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by trob (Post 1803088)
I'm not sure if it's lack of execution or lack of luck! lol I'm putting the cue ball at the corner of the break box. I aiming to hit the cue ball middle and the head ball as solid as possible. I turn my hips in at contact to gain power and drive the the cue through the ball. The damn rack is blowing up. Balls flying every where. But nothing is dropping! I would say in 5 breaks maybe 2 I drop a ball. The rack is wide open with nothing dropping...not a good way to start lol Any tips out there?

Maybe take a little power off of your break. Sometimes that works. It worked for my 9 ball break. When you hit the balls so hard more of them are moving and sometimes kicking balls out of pockets that would normally be going in.
BVal

~jj~ 05-04-2009 04:36 PM

If you break from the side, you aren't driving all the force through the center of the rack. The energy will get spread to one side more than the other.

When I see most pro's playing 8 ball it seems to be that they break from the center, or close to it. I don't know of any advantage of breaking from the side unless you are on the rail and really love a side-rail bridge.

Give it a shot from the center and put a good stroke on it too.

Good Luck

Roger Long 05-04-2009 04:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by trob (Post 1803088)
I'm not sure if it's lack of execution or lack of luck! lol I'm putting the cue ball at the corner of the break box. I aiming to hit the cue ball middle and the head ball as solid as possible. I turn my hips in at contact to gain power and drive the the cue through the ball. The damn rack is blowing up. Balls flying every where. But nothing is dropping! I would say in 5 breaks maybe 2 I drop a ball. The rack is wide open with nothing dropping...not a good way to start lol Any tips out there?

That's a common problem with a rack of 15 balls. You can't break them the same as in 9-ball. Try putting your cue ball on the head string and just an inch or two off the side rail. Then hit the second ball as full as possible with a very level cue and a little bit of low inside english. Or hit the third ball with a lot of low outside english. Practice those two for a bit, and see if you get better results.

Roger

CreeDo 05-04-2009 11:16 PM

I consider 50% a decent success rate (compared to my usual anyway) and you're making balls 40% of the time already. I'd say that's not so bad.

There are two ways of trying it... trying to make a specific ball (which is for suckers unless you're on a table that racks super consistently) and just using power.

Once you decide power is the way to go, the textbook says the highest power break is from dead center and hitting the head ball dead center too. This also makes parking the cue ball in the middle of the table more likely.

When you break from an angle, no matter what the angle is, your eyes will have a hard time seeing what a truly dead center square hit on the 1 ball is. I think the tendency is to hit a little bit on the side you're breaking from (so you will hit a bit to the left side of the 1 ball if you break from the left side of the box).

Instead, try to get the cue ball as close to dead center as possible. But, if you're like me, you don't always want to put the cue ball on the head spot, or there is no head spot, or you don't trust the head spot. I get a load more power with a rail bridge than I get shooting off the spot. So I set the cue ball about 1 diamond from the rail and I center it with a little trick. I split the table's nameplate or center diamond (hopefully yours has one) with my cue and then roll the cue ball a tiny bit left or right until it looks perfectly centered.

Then, when I aim, I am careful to line up as perfectly on the head ball as I can, I make sure my arm doesn't want to steer left or right during my practice swings... and... here's the big trick... I aim to hit at the BASE of the head ball, where I see the darkest bit of shadow below the ball. I read about this aiming at the base trick here on AZB and it's the nuts. Somehow I am getting much more perfectly square contact by doing this. I used to send the cue ball to the side rail almost every time when I break hard. Now I am parking the cue ball quite a lot, maybe 1 out of 3 breaks. I'm not scratching either.

That's it really. Get the cue ball as dead center as you can. Hit the head ball as dead center as you can. One of the first three balls will usually go in the side.

Drew 05-04-2009 11:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Roger Long (Post 1803107)
That's a common problem with a rack of 15 balls. You can't break them the same as in 9-ball. Try putting your cue ball on the head string and just an inch or two off the side rail. Then hit the second ball as full as possible with a very level cue and a little bit of low inside english. Or hit the third ball with a lot of low outside english. Practice those two for a bit, and see if you get better results.

Roger

Oh yeah baby!! The APA break!! Guaranteed clusters

softshot 05-04-2009 11:56 PM

I am a big fan of the dead center 8 ball break.. at a notch below full power (possibly two notches depending on the table)

easy to control the CB .. 50+% ball making.. nice spreads

some one mentioned that it is hard to hit dead center on the ball from an angle..

you hit dead center on the ball same as always... point your cue on the line from where the CB touches to felt to where the OB touches the felt... if you have room to make a full hit (and on the break you ALWAYS have room)

I find it hard to control the CB off of a full rack when shooting from the side.. it doesn't react the same way it does off of a 9 ball rack... at least that's the way it appears to me..

poolplayer2093 05-05-2009 12:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by trob (Post 1803088)
I'm not sure if it's lack of execution or lack of luck! lol I'm putting the cue ball at the corner of the break box. I aiming to hit the cue ball middle and the head ball as solid as possible. I turn my hips in at contact to gain power and drive the the cue through the ball. The damn rack is blowing up. Balls flying every where. But nothing is dropping! I would say in 5 breaks maybe 2 I drop a ball. The rack is wide open with nothing dropping...not a good way to start lol Any tips out there?

i've heard that breaking form the center of the table instead of near the rail gets better results with an 8 ball rack

have you tried the second ball break?

Drew 05-05-2009 12:10 AM

I just noticed that the table size has not been specified. I usually think bar tables when I think 8-ball. If you're making balls 40% of the time on a big table then you're doing alright; if it's on the bar table, you might want to think about adjusting. Try hitting harder, softer, moving the cue ball around. Power breaks aren't exactly a science. Every table and every rack breaks differently so switch it up until you find the technique.

trob 05-05-2009 01:43 AM

It's a 7 foot table. I'll work on the spot tonight. I haven't broken from the spot in years so I'll see how that works out. It's the only part of my game thats not consistent right now and it's driving me crazy.

BVal 05-05-2009 01:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by trob (Post 1803659)
It's a 7 foot table. I'll work on the spot tonight. I haven't broken from the spot in years so I'll see how that works out. It's the only part of my game thats not consistent right now and it's driving me crazy.

not so much the spot but a little left or right of it. If I break from the center I usually break from inbetween the 1st and middle diamond. Very rarely do I ever break from dead center. Either way there has been loads of good advice in here and I am sure you will figure something out for yourself.

BVal

predator 05-05-2009 02:19 AM

This past weekend there was a pro tournament at my home club in 8ball discipline. There were some high profile european pro's here. Let me just tell you that they all suffered with the break. They made the balls alright, but the break let them down in critical moments too. Most of them are excellent ball breakers and runout machines, but not one of them could guarantee a ball made on the break. 50-60% rate of success at best.
All pros were using the break from or near the center...no side rail break or second ball break. That tells you something...

billbOK 05-05-2009 03:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by predator (Post 1803665)
This past weekend there was a pro tournament at my home club in 8ball discipline. There were some high profile european pro's here. Let me just tell you that they all suffered with the break. They made the balls alright, but the break let them down in critical moments too. Most of them are excellent ball breakers and runout machines, but not one of them could guarantee a ball made on the break. 50-60% rate of success at best.
All pros were using the break from or near the center...no side rail break or second ball break. That tells you something...

Hi pred !

Can you give us more details ? Who was in the last 8 ?

Thanks !

predator 05-05-2009 04:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by billbOK (Post 1803681)
Hi pred !

Can you give us more details ? Who was in the last 8 ?

Thanks !

Hi Bill!

The tournament was at Ground Zero club in Zagreb, Croatia.

Final 8 participants were:
Dalmatin, Putnik, Mladenovic, Klasovic, Foldes, Susnjara, Tot, Erculj

Semis:
Vilmos Foldes - Sandor Tot 10-9
Karlo Dalmatin - Goran Mladenovic 10-5

In the final Vilmos Foldes beat current Croatian #1 player Karlo Dalmatin by a 10-8 scoreline. He picked up 5500€ first prize and a trophy.

In the semifinal between Sandor Tot and Vilmos Foldes, Sandor was breaking at hill-hill and no balls went down. Vilmos cleared, so 2000€ lost in one shot for Sandor.

Interesting that Sandor Tot was partying all Saturday night. He stayed in the club until 6 a.m., but had little trouble getting up Sunday morning for last 16 match. He played lights out for most of the Sunday despite having so little sleep. The amount of energy this man has for playing pool is just amazing. His fellow players have seen it time and time again, but still can't quite believe it.

Some other international stars were supposed to appear, but didn't. It seems that a lot of top European pro's ask for appearence fee. Can't say I blame them, but this tournament was up for grabs...plenty of amateurs in it also. Our club owner has a firm stance on appearence fees, he won't pay any. But, unlike in some high profile international events however, the players got payed immediately, just like last year.

TXsouthpaw 05-05-2009 07:21 AM

During a lesson with johnny archer he said he usually breaks 8 ball from the middle of the table maybe a few inches to either side. He said it give the best spread and the best chance of a ball dropping.

That being said Joe tucker also has some good advice on the subject.
If your playing a weaker player whos not likely to run out go for the 2nd ball break and try and make the 8. If your playing a player thats likely to run out if you miss then break from the middle and try and get out.


Hope that helps.


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