CTE Does NOT Work - It Did For One Pro

forabeer

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
you are a pro1 user?

No sir. But you mentioned "CB - OB - POCKET" and that is classic ghost ball.
I personally don't need "Pro1 Visuals" to get me there. But I do lurk here and am curious.
 

Attachments

  • table.jpg
    table.jpg
    172.2 KB · Views: 141

stan shuffett

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
No sir. But you mentioned "CB - OB - POCKET" and that is classic ghost ball.
I personally don't need "Pro1 Visuals" to get me there. But I do lurk here and am curious.

I appreciate your curiosity with PRO ONE. I was curious once many moons ago.

Very good diagram. An issue that I do see is...how are you going to account for CIT.

Additionally, while competing how do know your lines for the following extended shots?

Cross corner bank
Two rails cross corner
Three rails in the side
Three rails in the corner

A master PRO ONE player can immediately align for any of those banks with precision aim lines.

Thank you for your input.

Stan Shuffett
 
Last edited:

forabeer

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I appreciate your curiosity with PRO ONE. I was curious once many moons ago.

Very good diagram. An issue that I do see is...how are you going to account for CIT.

Additionally, while competing how do know your lines for the following extended shots?

Cross corner bank
Two rails cross corner
Three rails in the side
Three rails in the corner

A master PRO ONE player can immediately align for any of those banks with precision aim lines.

Thank you for your input.

Stan Shuffett

Assuming those are the last 2 balls on the table, a little top and a little speed will negate any cut induced throw. I could also use a touch of right English to achieve the same as long as I was cautious of the scratch in the side.

The cross bank and the three rails in the corner are more my shots. The 3 rails in the side and 2 rails cross corner, while I can get em close with an occasional make, are low percentage shots for me. Safety time.
 

stan shuffett

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Assuming those are the last 2 balls on the table, a little top and a little speed will negate any cut induced throw. I could also use a touch of right English to achieve the same as long as I was cautious of the scratch in the side.

The cross bank and the three rails in the corner are more my shots. The 3 rails in the side and 2 rails cross corner, while I can get em close with an occasional make, are low percentage shots for me. Safety time.

Very good answers for dealing with the cut.

Stan Shuffett
 

BC21

https://www.playpoolbetter.com
Gold Member
Silver Member
Assuming those are the last 2 balls on the table, a little top and a little speed will negate any cut induced throw. I could also use a touch of right English to achieve the same as long as I was cautious of the scratch in the side.

The cross bank and the three rails in the corner are more my shots. The 3 rails in the side and 2 rails cross corner, while I can get em close with an occasional make, are low percentage shots for me. Safety time.

They are low percentage for everyone. Even the best bankers in the world typically make 1 out 3.
 

BC21

https://www.playpoolbetter.com
Gold Member
Silver Member
Point being, ‘tis more desirable to have precision aim lines verses not having them.

Stan Shuffett

Knowing the shot like the back of your hand helps too. Regardless, even for you, a master Pro1 user and very experienced banker, the 3 rail bank in the side is low percentage, 1 out of 3 at best. Sure, we could put donuts out and shoot the exact shot enough times to start making it every other time. But to step right up in a game situation, where you have one attempt to make the shot.... it's low percentage despite aiming method.
 

stan shuffett

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Knowing the shot like the back of your hand helps too. Regardless, even for you, a master Pro1 user and very experienced banker, the 3 rail bank in the side is low percentage, 1 out of 3 at best. Sure, we could put donuts out and shoot the exact shot enough times to start making it every other time. But to step right up in a game situation, where you have one attempt to make the shot.... it's low percentage despite aiming method.

A master banker will make more than 1 out of 3, perhaps not two. Billy Thorpe would eat you alive at 3 to 1 on the money.
With a zillion possible shots on a table, there’s no way to know them all like the back of your hand.
PRO ONE essentially reduces all banks to one of three aim lines.

Stan Shuffett
 

BC21

https://www.playpoolbetter.com
Gold Member
Silver Member
A master banker will make more than 1 out of 3, perhaps not two. Billy Thorpe would eat you alive at 3 to 1 on the money.
With a zillion possible shots on a table, there’s no way to know them all like the back of your hand.
PRO ONE essentially reduces all banks to one of three aim lines.

Stan Shuffett

That's awesome. But seriously, there aren't a zillion shots. I believe I read somewhere years ago that a mathematician estimates that there are around 30,000. Lol. Still, too many to memorize. And even with Pro1 the player needs speed and spin. A player like Billy Thorpe just sees the angles to make shots happen, like most players.
 
Last edited:

stan shuffett

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
That's awesome. But seriously, there are are a zillion shots. I believe I read somewhere years ago that a mathematician estimates that there are around 30,000. Lol. Still, too many to memorize. And even with Pro1 the player needs speed and spin. A player like Billy Thorpe just sees the angles to make shots happen, like most players.

Place the CB anywhere. Then move an OB one tick at a time to cover every thread of cloth on the table. The move the CB by one tick and start all over again. It’d be about like counting all of the stars. Ain’t gonna happen. 30,000 wont scratch of the surface of possible CB OB relationships that can be identified on a table.

Stan Shuffett
 

BC21

https://www.playpoolbetter.com
Gold Member
Silver Member
Place the CB anywhere. Then move an OB one tick at a time to cover every thread of cloth on the table. The move the CB by one tick and start all over again. It’d be about like counting all of the stars. Ain’t gonna happen. 30,000 wont scratch of the surface of possible CB OB relationships that can be identified on a table.

Stan Shuffett

That's a bit extreme and unnecessary. The same aim reference can be used to pocket balls with slight variations in ball placement. Once you've moved the balls far enough out line then another aim reference can be used.

Anyhow, I didn't come up the 30,000 figure. A mathematician did. It wasn't made up by a non-math person, so I'd consider it more accurate than a "zillion".
 

Scarlett0Hara

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
That's awesome. But seriously, there aren't a zillion shots. I believe I read somewhere years ago that a mathematician estimates that there are around 30,000. Lol. Still, too many to memorize. And even with Pro1 the player needs speed and spin. A player like Billy Thorpe just sees the angles to make shots happen, like most players.


Einstein say there were over 6 Million possible shots on a pool table, i remember reading that on this board years ago...i dunno if he really said it?
 

stan shuffett

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
That's a bit extreme and unnecessary. The same aim reference can be used to pocket balls with slight variations in ball placement. Once you've moved the balls far enough out line then another aim reference can be used.

Anyhow, I didn't come up the 30,000 figure. A mathematician did. It wasn't made up by a non-math person, so I'd consider it more accurate than a "zillion".

Every tick means something in CTE whether it’s 1 of 360 ticks on an OB or 1 of 360 ticks on a cue ball......and every refined possible placement of a CB OB on a 5,000 sq. inch surface matters as well.

Stan Shuffett
 
Last edited:

BC21

https://www.playpoolbetter.com
Gold Member
Silver Member
Einstein say there were over 6 Million possible shots on a pool table, i remember reading that on this board years ago...i dunno if he really said it?

Einstein was wrong about a lot of stuff. Great minds produce so much thinking, so many theories, and most are duds. Just like most of Shakespeare's plays were not best sellers and most of Beethoven's musical pieces were not masterpieces.

Still, 6 million is a fraction of a "zillion".
 

BC21

https://www.playpoolbetter.com
Gold Member
Silver Member
Every tick means something in CTE whether it’s 1 of 360 ticks on an OB or 1 of 360 ticks on a cue ball......and every refined possible placement of a CB OB on a 5,000 sq. inch surface matters as well.

Stan Shuffett

But you can only see and use the visible 178 or so degree portion of the cb and ob, not 360°.

But I do find it interesting that you can visualize a "tick" from A or B or whatever, but you say a fractional user can't accurately visualize a fractional aim point to the nearest 1/16 or 1/32 of a ball. A "tick" is 0.5mm across the surace of the ball, while a 1/32 fractional aim is about 2mm wide (1.8). So you can accurately see a 0.5mm difference in an aiming reference but doubt that any fractional user can see a 2mm aiming difference on the ball?

Nevermind. I don't have the patience to go back and forth over this stuff. If you think there are a zillion shots on the table, and Einstein thought there were 6 million, and some mathematician calculated a number near 30,000, it makes no difference. Believe what you want.
 

Scarlett0Hara

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
But you can only see and use the visible 178 or so degree portion of the cb and ob, not 360°.

But I do find it interesting that you can visualize a "tick" from A or B or whatever, but you say a fractional user can't accurately visualize a fractional aim point to the nearest 1/16 or 1/32 of a ball. A "tick" is 0.5mm across the surace of the ball, while a 1/32 fractional aim is about 2mm wide (1.8). So you can accurately see a 0.5mm difference in an aiming reference but doubt that any fractional user can see a 2mm aiming difference on the ball?

Nevermind. I don't have the patience to go back and forth over this stuff. If you think there are a zillion shots on the table, and Einstein thought there were 6 million, and some mathematician calculated a number near 30,000, it makes no difference. Believe what you want.

lol ... smh
 
Last edited:

Patrick Johnson

Fish of the Day
Silver Member
The same aim reference can be used to pocket balls with slight variations in ball placement. Once you've moved the balls far enough out line then another aim reference can be used.
The CB/OB can be located at thousands of places on the table, but that doesn’t mean that many different CB/OB alignments are needed.

With pocket slop it takes only 20-25 CB/OB alignments to make a spot shot from every possible angle - fewer for closer shots, more for longer ones. The longest possible shot into the smallest pocket needs less than 100 alignments to be made from any CB location.

Even so, no system defines that many CB/OB alignments “objectively”. Except for the closest shots, there are always needed alignments that fall between the relatively few system-defined alignments and need player judgment.

pj
chgo
 
Last edited:

stan shuffett

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
But you can only see and use the visible 178 or so degree portion of the cb and ob, not 360°.

But I do find it interesting that you can visualize a "tick" from A or B or whatever, but you say a fractional user can't accurately visualize a fractional aim point to the nearest 1/16 or 1/32 of a ball. A "tick" is 0.5mm across the surace of the ball, while a 1/32 fractional aim is about 2mm wide (1.8). So you can accurately see a 0.5mm difference in an aiming reference but doubt that any fractional user can see a 2mm aiming difference on the ball?

Nevermind. I don't have the patience to go back and forth over this stuff. If you think there are a zillion shots on the table, and Einstein thought there were 6 million, and some mathematician calculated a number near 30,000, it makes no difference. Believe what you want.

The beauty of CTE is that it does resolve shots down to a single CCB tick. It’s not that I believe it. I know it.

Stan Shuffett
 
Last edited:

stan shuffett

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
The CB/OB can be located at thousands of places on the table, but that doesn’t mean that many different CB/OB alignments are needed.

With pocket slop it takes only 20-25 CB/OB alignments to make a spot shot from every possible angle - fewer for closer shots, more for longer ones. The longest possible shot into the smallest pocket needs less than 100 alignments to be made from any CB location.

Even so, no system defines that many CB/OB alignments “objectively”. Except for the closest shots, there are always needed alignments that fall between the relatively few system-defined alignments and need player judgment.

pj
chgo


Since you’re qualifying “no system” then please explain BASIC CTE and PRO ONE.

You won’t because you can not do so. You really don’t know what you don’t know.

100 alignments. You gotta be kidding me! I seriously doubt that any pro during their course of shooting a few million shots has ever exactly duplicated more than a handful of shots.

You’re thinking is in line of what I would teach to a non serious student such as what I used to encounter in my college classes. That’s the type of student that needs a limited number of alignments approach. Limit a pro to a few alignments and you’re pulling his teeth.

When I work with players I don’t pull their teeth nor do I pull their their leg with stifling information that leads to limitation.

Stan Shuffett
 
Last edited:
Top