spliced shafts versus conventional
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A spliced shaft does have advantages, over a conventional maple shaft... There is abosolutely no hype about that, it is fact... Deflection, no there is where the Hype useualy comes in..
SPINDOKTOR
SPINDOKTOR
What advantages do flat-laminated shafts have over conventional ones?SPINDOKTOR said:
marketing
This has to have been the best marketing job of all time. They have told you that plywood for shafts is the greatest think since the invention of the wheel. I don't know how we ever made a ball with a straight piece of maple. My hat goes off to these master minds. Deflection has been the buzz word for the billiards industry. I always thought that the player made the cue and not the shaft. If these shafts are so great, why doesn't everyone go and buy a Kmart cue and play.
This has to have been the best marketing job of all time. They have told you that plywood for shafts is the greatest think since the invention of the wheel. I don't know how we ever made a ball with a straight piece of maple. My hat goes off to these master minds. Deflection has been the buzz word for the billiards industry. I always thought that the player made the cue and not the shaft. If these shafts are so great, why doesn't everyone go and buy a Kmart cue and play.
The warrior chooses his weapon wisely.
Would you go into battle with a rock when you could have had a gun? If you don't believe in the low deflection shafts that are out there today, then that is your choice. In my experience I have played with many different cues before trying the predator and OB1. Since then it's been nothing but predator for me. It just plain outperforms and that's where the buck stops with me.
Would you go into battle with a rock when you could have had a gun? If you don't believe in the low deflection shafts that are out there today, then that is your choice. In my experience I have played with many different cues before trying the predator and OB1. Since then it's been nothing but predator for me. It just plain outperforms and that's where the buck stops with me.
Low deflection doesn't mean it has to be laminated.Big C said:
You can easily have conventional shaft with a bored hole.
JoeyInCali said:
Not without infringing on a copyright or 2
BPG24
Banned
JoeyInCali said:
Well, how much do you want for a primo maple shaft matched to my current player?
Must be low deflection
i want the performance of a "z" shaft with the best quality in the world
http://i188.photobucket.com/albums/z316/bpg24/100_1136.jpg
here is the pic... 5/16-18 piloted coco and silver in black phenolic
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Predator has a patent on that hole.BPG24 said:
JoeyInCali said:
JoeyInCali said:
I agree low deflection doesnt mean laminated, I played with a house cue tonight, and I was amazed at how much side I could use and still pocket the ball, definately low deflection... that is part of the problem, laminated shafts are much more consistant from shaft to shaft V/s solid maple shafts...As I picked up another one identical to it, and it was horrible..
How can splices of different boards made in China be more consistent?SPINDOKTOR said:
Now if all makers made shafts with 15-inch barrel, short plastic ferrule and hollowed front, they'd really be close to being alike.
JoeyInCali said:
Exactly, the majority of laminated shafts like the 314-2 Z-2 X shaft, OB-1 etc,, are pretty consistant in shaft to shaft, as the majority of these shafts I have tried all play very simular, Some maple shafts (solid) play differnt if you turn them a certain way, ala sweet spot.. whereas a laminated shaft if properly built has a 360* sweetspot...
If you have a low deflection solid maple shaft, I see no advantage, untill you need a new shaft, you cant gurantee you will get a shaft that plays close enough you dont need to readjust, now with the popular laminated shafts I could venture to say you could.. at least after the tip has seated in... because they are consistant..
This is my observations, that I know to be true... If your have had an experiance otherwise Id like to hear it.
If you have a low deflection solid maple shaft, I see no advantage, untill you need a new shaft, you cant gurantee you will get a shaft that plays close enough you dont need to readjust, now with the popular laminated shafts I could venture to say you could.. at least after the tip has seated in... because they are consistant..
IF it has a bored hole, same ferrule and taper, why wouldn't it be?
You think multiple pieces from different boards with differing density, age, tone and weight is more consistent?
The consistency in them is they are all made the same exact way.
If all makers bored their shafts 1/4 by 5 inches deep and used the same exact taper and ferrule, it'd ruin the laminated shaft market imo.
IF it has a bored hole, same ferrule and taper, why wouldn't it be?
You think multiple pieces from different boards with differing density, age, tone and weight is more consistent?
The consistency in them is they are all made the same exact way.
If all makers bored their shafts 1/4 by 5 inches deep and used the same exact taper and ferrule, it'd ruin the laminated shaft market imo.
JoeyInCali said:
Joey, I agree with you for the most part and I understand what your saying, but you cant deny the aftermarket low deflection shafts if anything are consistant in playability.. I think this was the main reason people started going with laminated shafts, so when you get a new cue, you would have as near identical shafts as possible..
If I were to look at it from a cue makers standpoint, where I can only speculate, I would drill all my shafts 1/4 by 5 inches Deep and use the same taper.. that way all my cues would play very simular.....If this also lessens deflection, that would be a bonous right? what I mean is, as long as you can get a shaft to play really close to your former shaft, to me it wouldnt need to be low deflection, just consistant..
I think your on to something, why not go with it? I think if modifying a solid maple shaft, if you can get results, by all means do it.. I'll be your best customer.
SPINDOKTOR
If I were to look at it from a cue makers standpoint, where I can only speculate, I would drill all my shafts 1/4 by 5 inches Deep and use the same taper.. that way all my cues would play very simular.....If this also lessens deflection, that would be a bonous right? what I mean is, as long as you can get a shaft to play really close to your former shaft, to me it wouldnt need to be low deflection, just consistant..
It would make them very close to similar b/c by drilling that hole and using a soft ferrule, you would be killing tone out of the equation.
Hollowed shafts have almost no feel.
It would make them very close to similar b/c by drilling that hole and using a soft ferrule, you would be killing tone out of the equation.
Hollowed shafts have almost no feel.
hmm, would using a harder ferrule material help? See this is why I mentioned Carbonfiber awhile back.., for ferrule material, you lessen weight off the tip but Id imagine the hit would be hard?
I really am just making questimates, because really I dont know.. I do think if you can work out the perticulars, you would have some very consistant playing cues.. I dont know how to solve the hit problem, or what harder ferrules cause when used.. other than possibly a harder hit.
these are uncharted waters, someone is bound to set sail eventualy, If I had the cue making equipment and know how Id be all over it......
I quess Im sort of silly in a sense, because I feel that way, but truely it is my nature..
SPINDOKTOR
I really am just making questimates, because really I dont know.. I do think if you can work out the perticulars, you would have some very consistant playing cues.. I dont know how to solve the hit problem, or what harder ferrules cause when used.. other than possibly a harder hit.
these are uncharted waters, someone is bound to set sail eventualy, If I had the cue making equipment and know how Id be all over it......
I quess Im sort of silly in a sense, because I feel that way, but truely it is my nature..
SPINDOKTOR
JoeyInCali said:
hmm, would using a harder ferrule material help? See this is why I mentioned Carbonfiber awhile back.., for ferrule material, you lessen weight off the tip but Id imagine the hit would be hard?
I imagine a carbon fiber tube will work.
Maybe 5/16 in diam with a 1/4 hole . Then sleeve a lightwt. ferrule.
http://www.carbonfibertubeshop.com//index2.html
Predator won't have any grounds to sue I think.
I imagine a carbon fiber tube will work.
Maybe 5/16 in diam with a 1/4 hole . Then sleeve a lightwt. ferrule.
http://www.carbonfibertubeshop.com//index2.html
Predator won't have any grounds to sue I think.
laminated shaft consistency
As a general statement laminated shaft consistency comes from two things. The first is the identical profile of all shafts as Joey mentioned. The other thing is the primary characteristics of the way the shaft plays doesn't come from the wood itself but from the adhesive holding it together and the adhesive soaked wood. In effect when playing with the laminated shafts you are playing with a synthetic shaft. For the greatest consistency of all, go to spun aluminum. Dang did those things bong and vibrate! Nearly nobody wants a plastic or metal shaft, but considering the huge market share that all of the laminated shafts combined have and then add in the sheathed shafts and that is where we are headed.
Someone tested high grade maple shafts many years ago and came up with a number of 3% difference in deflection depending on how the grain was oriented. Of course that rarely makes a difference but it is possible to index your cue for each shot to take advantage of this if you choose. In the days of playing with house cues, I always indexed my cue, mainly because I was often playing with a badly warped cue and I preferred the belly to be down on these cues.
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Hu
As a general statement laminated shaft consistency comes from two things. The first is the identical profile of all shafts as Joey mentioned. The other thing is the primary characteristics of the way the shaft plays doesn't come from the wood itself but from the adhesive holding it together and the adhesive soaked wood. In effect when playing with the laminated shafts you are playing with a synthetic shaft. For the greatest consistency of all, go to spun aluminum. Dang did those things bong and vibrate! Nearly nobody wants a plastic or metal shaft, but considering the huge market share that all of the laminated shafts combined have and then add in the sheathed shafts and that is where we are headed.
Someone tested high grade maple shafts many years ago and came up with a number of 3% difference in deflection depending on how the grain was oriented. Of course that rarely makes a difference but it is possible to index your cue for each shot to take advantage of this if you choose. In the days of playing with house cues, I always indexed my cue, mainly because I was often playing with a badly warped cue and I preferred the belly to be down on these cues.
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Hu
SPINDOKTOR said:
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