For all those that have doubted my ideas to help improve this sport.

realkingcobra

Well-known member
Silver Member
The only thing that is going to straighten pool out in my opinion is to create a total separation between the top 256 Pro players in the world from the rest of the pack, and support those players in representing this sport, as a way of bringing organized tournaments, with recognizable repeat players that sponsors would like to advertise during their events, and not be embarrassed in doing so.

Golf Player Demographic Statistics
Golfer Statistics Data
Total number of golfers in the U.S. 29,000,000
Percent of the U.S. population who play golf 9.6 %
Percent of golfers who are male 77.5 %
Percent of golfers who are female 22.5 %
19 more rowsā€¢May 3, 2018

Pool could take a lesson from golf!!!

Only the top 125 players, as ranked by tournament winnings, get to keep their magic ā€œtour card,ā€ which allows them to enter any of the PGA Tour's official events. This is the preeminent men's golf tour in the U.S.ā€”and arguably the world.Feb 8, 2012
 

JoeyInCali

Maker of Joey Bautista Cues
Silver Member
John Schmidt was not even known outside of California when he won the US Open .
I remember Oscar playing in the Bike Open in 2003. He was not a ranked pro. He got on the money. It was his first major tournament cash-out . I know who sponsored him. He wanted to give the money back to his sponsor . The entree fee wasn't cheap.

Hohmann was a nobody when he won the world 9-ball. His odds in winning was some 200 to 1.
Let's even go back to Efren. Nobody knew him when he won his first tournament at Red's.

Preventing others to enter AND PAY ENTREE fees to pro-tournaments is counter-productive . Nobody goes to the US OPen and pay $500 to get in is getting a favor .
 

realkingcobra

Well-known member
Silver Member
John Schmidt was not even known outside of California when he won the US Open .
I remember Oscar playing in the Bike Open in 2003. He was not a ranked pro. He got on the money. It was his first major tournament cash-out . I know who sponsored him. He wanted to give the money back to his sponsor . The entree fee wasn't cheap.

Hohmann was a nobody when he won the world 9-ball. His odds in winning was some 200 to 1.
Let's even go back to Efren. Nobody knew him when he won his first tournament at Red's.

Preventing others to enter AND PAY ENTREE fees to pro-tournaments is counter-productive . Nobody goes to the US OPen and pay $500 to get in is getting a favor .

If that be the case, how come there's NO Pro Tour for professional pool players today then? Because there's NO sponsors? How come there's NO sponsors? Could it be because there's NO organized Professional Pool players to represent this sport, because they have to let ANYONE that pays an entry fee play right alongside the Pros?
 

realkingcobra

Well-known member
Silver Member
John Schmidt was not even known outside of California when he won the US Open .
I remember Oscar playing in the Bike Open in 2003. He was not a ranked pro. He got on the money. It was his first major tournament cash-out . I know who sponsored him. He wanted to give the money back to his sponsor . The entree fee wasn't cheap.

Hohmann was a nobody when he won the world 9-ball. His odds in winning was some 200 to 1.
Let's even go back to Efren. Nobody knew him when he won his first tournament at Red's.

Preventing others to enter AND PAY ENTREE fees to pro-tournaments is counter-productive . Nobody goes to the US OPen and pay $500 to get in is getting a favor .

29,000,000 play golf in this country alone, let alone all those golfers from the rest of the world....and yet, the golf world is represented by only 125 touring Pros....I wonder how it works for golf....how dare they NOT allow any golfer who wants to play with the pros....NOT be allowed to play!!!!
 

JoeyInCali

Maker of Joey Bautista Cues
Silver Member
If that be the case, how come there's NO Pro Tour for professional pool players today then? Because there's NO sponsors? How come there's NO sponsors? Could it be because there's NO organized Professional Pool players to represent this sport, because they have to let ANYONE that pays an entry fee play right alongside the Pros?

Because there is no pro-association.
PBT died because of Mackey.

What happened to Charlie Williams's pro-tour ?
Yup, not enough sponsors .
And you think the DONORS who enter tournaments and go 2 and out are the cause of the sponsors leaving ?
Why would they care if scrubs pay HUNDREDS of dollars to gain experience ?

There are no sponsors because the sponsors don't see pool players as a big market outside of pool products .

Watch a golf tournament on tv . What tv commercials do you see more often ?
NOT golf products . Mostly automobiles . That shows the great demographics of golf players AND scrubs . They can afford expensive cars .
The demographics of pool players ( sad to say ) ain't that great .
In the mid 90's I was at the Riviera watching Efren and company in the PBT World 8-Ball. My late friend and great cue maker, Judd Fuller , made a joke about the people in the first floor playing in smoke-filled rooms full of Valley bar boxes, " That's a lot of goat ropers". I just about died laughing.

Let's not even discuss there is no betting line at the casinos for pool tournaments these days . Some really smart pro players killed that eons ago.

No sports betting ? Your sports ain't much of a sport .
No corporate sponsorship ? You're on your own.

All that have nothing to do with scrubs donating entree money.
 

JoeyInCali

Maker of Joey Bautista Cues
Silver Member
29,000,000 play golf in this country alone, let alone all those golfers from the rest of the world....and yet, the golf world is represented by only 125 touring Pros....I wonder how it works for golf....how dare they NOT allow any golfer who wants to play with the pros....NOT be allowed to play!!!!

And how many hundreds of qualifying tournaments do they have ?

Pool ? None. The ladies don't even have the regionals anymore .
Their tour is dead . Died when ESPN pulled the plug .

29,000,000 PLAYERS??? There's your answer. There are 29 freaking million golf players . 29 million freaking players playing an expensive OUTDOOR sport .
 

realkingcobra

Well-known member
Silver Member
Because there is no pro-association.
PBT died because of Mackey.

What happened to Charlie Williams's pro-tour ?
Yup, not enough sponsors .
And you think the DONORS who enter tournaments and go 2 and out are the cause of the sponsors leaving ?
Why would they care if scrubs pay HUNDREDS of dollars to gain experience ?

There are no sponsors because the sponsors don't see pool players as a big market outside of pool products .

Watch a golf tournament on tv . What tv commercials do you see more often ?
NOT golf products . Mostly automobiles . That shows the great demographics of golf players AND scrubs . They can afford expensive cars .
The demographics of pool players ( sad to say ) ain't that great .
In the mid 90's I was at the Riviera watching Efren and company in the PBT World 8-Ball. My late friend and great cue maker, Judd Fuller , made a joke about the people in the first floor playing in smoke-filled rooms full of Valley bar boxes, " That's a lot of goat ropers". I just about died laughing.

Let's not even discuss there is no betting line at the casinos for pool tournaments these days . Some really smart pro players killed that eons ago.

No sports betting ? Your sports ain't much of a sport .
No corporate sponsorship ? You're on your own.

All that have nothing to do with scrubs donating entree money.

All a bullshit excuse for why 125 Pro Golfers represent the whole world of golf, there's NEVER been Pro player only tournaments that decided who the players were by ANY standard, so keep defending a broken system I stead of taking a stand and put the best in front of this sport to represent it.
 

Poolmanis

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Yeah, I know, i haven't been doing anything for pool for the last 35 years!

I did not mean to bash your work. I like your work ethic and attitude when we talk about table maintenance.
I just wanted to correct your mistake because those guys witch i mentioned have been much for pool and need to be recognized.
 

jay helfert

Shoot Pool, not people
Gold Member
Silver Member
I remember when that started out as the Fatboy challenge, is the event still going?

You've been sniffing too much of that glue! :smile:
Roberto Gomez won this year over Fedor Gorst. It paid $16,000 for first, $8,000 for second and $4,000 each for third/fourth.
 

garczar

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
29,000,000 play golf in this country alone, let alone all those golfers from the rest of the world....and yet, the golf world is represented by only 125 touring Pros....I wonder how it works for golf....how dare they NOT allow any golfer who wants to play with the pros....NOT be allowed to play!!!!
That's just the US PGA Tour. There are various pro tours worldwide. They all have their own qualification process. Do you know how many joe-blow off-the-street golfers could compete with a top125 player? NONE. Not even close. I love it when a scratch player thinks he could play on level terms with a touring pro. He's got ZERO chance. That's why they have qualification events and development tours. To keep delusional dreamer moron golfers at bay. BTW the US Open DOES allow anyone with a 2 or better handicap to try and qualify. A few make the cut occasionally but never even sniff the top 20 places. IF pro pool was to EVER have a chance they'd have to have some sort of qualification process to weed out all the DDM(delusional dreamer moron) pool players that think they have a shot beating SVB.
 
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poolhustler

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
ā€¦ā€¦ā€¦ā€¦ā€¦ā€¦ā€¦ā€¦ā€¦ā€¦ā€¦..if u can't say nothing nice...ā€¦ā€¦ā€¦ā€¦..lol
 
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realkingcobra

Well-known member
Silver Member
That's just the US PGA Tour. There are various pro tours worldwide. They all have their own qualification process. Do you know how many joe-blow off-the-street golfers could compete with a top125 player? NONE. Not even close. I love it when a scratch player thinks he could play on level terms with a touring pro. He's got ZERO chance. That's why they have qualification events and development tours. To keep delusional dreamer moron golfers at bay. BTW the US Open DOES allow anyone with a 2 or better handicap to try and qualify. A few make the cut occasionally but never even sniff the top 20 places. IF pro pool was to EVER have a chance they'd have to have some sort of qualification process to weed out all the DDM(delusional dreamer moron) pool players that think they have a shot beating SVB.

My point exactly, so everyone needs to stop knocking me because I'm trying to do something about this broken system, if I fail in doing so, oh well, then I'll join the ranks of the failed systems, but at least I have a plan I'm working on for the Pro level, and excluding the rest.
 

garczar

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
My point exactly, so everyone needs to stop knocking me because I'm trying to do something about this broken system, if I fail in doing so, oh well, then I'll join the ranks of the failed systems, but at least I have a plan I'm working on for the Pro level, and excluding the rest.
I think Barry Hearn and Matchroom might be the last shot at real pro pool in the states. He has the sponsors and the track record with him.
 

realkingcobra

Well-known member
Silver Member
I think Barry Hearn and Matchroom might be the last shot at real pro pool in the states. He has the sponsors and the track record with him.

Pool is still missing the most important thing of all, a dedicated event center with at least 64 9ft pool tables set up at all times, not tables rolled in and rolled out. An event center needs to be set up for live streaming at all times, and not open to the public like a pool room is. The only time the lights get turned on and the doors are opened....is when a Pro Tournament is scheduled to be live streamed to the viewers world wide. Viewers pay per event, or by monthly subscription. Those revenues are then collected and cycled back into the Pro Players event funds after expenditures are deducted, then there's a revolving sponsorship fund supported by the public...THEN you have your Pro Players events on a regular basis.
 

realkingcobra

Well-known member
Silver Member
Because there is no pro-association.
PBT died because of Mackey.

What happened to Charlie Williams's pro-tour ?
Yup, not enough sponsors .
And you think the DONORS who enter tournaments and go 2 and out are the cause of the sponsors leaving ?
Why would they care if scrubs pay HUNDREDS of dollars to gain experience ?

There are no sponsors because the sponsors don't see pool players as a big market outside of pool products .

Watch a golf tournament on tv . What tv commercials do you see more often ?
NOT golf products . Mostly automobiles . That shows the great demographics of golf players AND scrubs . They can afford expensive cars .
The demographics of pool players ( sad to say ) ain't that great .
In the mid 90's I was at the Riviera watching Efren and company in the PBT World 8-Ball. My late friend and great cue maker, Judd Fuller , made a joke about the people in the first floor playing in smoke-filled rooms full of Valley bar boxes, " That's a lot of goat ropers". I just about died laughing.

Let's not even discuss there is no betting line at the casinos for pool tournaments these days . Some really smart pro players killed that eons ago.

No sports betting ? Your sports ain't much of a sport .
No corporate sponsorship ? You're on your own.

All that have nothing to do with scrubs donating entree money.

Joey...29,000,000 golfers in the US

The Billiards Congress of America says there are about 46 million people playing pool in about 9,000 facilities throughout North America. Ninety-five percent of those people play pool. Only three percent and two percent play carom and snooker respectively. About one-third of all players are women
 

garczar

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Pool is still missing the most important thing of all, a dedicated event center with at least 64 9ft pool tables set up at all times, not tables rolled in and rolled out. An event center needs to be set up for live streaming at all times, and not open to the public like a pool room is. The only time the lights get turned on and the doors are opened....is when a Pro Tournament is scheduled to be live streamed to the viewers world wide. Viewers pay per event, or by monthly subscription. Those revenues are then collected and cycled back into the Pro Players event funds after expenditures are deducted, then there's a revolving sponsorship fund supported by the public...THEN you have your Pro Players events on a regular basis.
Will never happen. Sorry, but that's just my take.
 

alstl

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
One great way for you to improve the sport would be to install a 9 foot diamond in my basement and remove the A E Schmidt I currently have. I'll provide free bottled water and I'll even buy you lunch.
 

jay helfert

Shoot Pool, not people
Gold Member
Silver Member
Here's something for you to think about, seeing how you don't quite understand, which is why you posted your snide remark;)

Maybe I'm just stupid enough to sponsor some $20,000 added Pros only 16 player Pro Tour stops, promoting single elimination, race to 21, with match time limits of 3 hrs, and pay ALL the players, 9-16 $500 ea, 5-8th $1,000 ea, 3-4th $2,000 ea 2nd $4,000 1st $8,000 on a Saturday.....as a way of promoting my new adhesive....I could be that stupid I guess;) what would be even more stupid is if there was no entry fee;)

This is actually a pretty good idea here and very doable. If you did in fact put up $24,000 with no entry fee and invited sixteen top players to participate, most of them would probably do so. And such a tour, even on a limited basis (say six to eight events) could be workable.

Let's say you have a large trailer with a couple of tables, and collapsible bleacher seating and carried it from city to city, setting it up in a suitable sized space, attracted an audience and streamed each event. Then you might have something to brag about. Until then, it remains just that, a nice idea.
 

realkingcobra

Well-known member
Silver Member
This is actually a pretty good idea here and very doable. If you did in fact put up $24,000 with no entry fee and invited sixteen top players to participate, most of them would probably do so. And such a tour, even on a limited basis (say six to eight events) could be workable.

Let's say you have a large trailer with a couple of tables, and collapsible bleacher seating and carried it from city to city, setting it up in a suitable sized space, attracted an audience and streamed each event. Then you might have something to brag about. Until then, it remains just that, a nice idea.

Jay, any pool room with a minimum of 8 Diamond 9ft ProAms would serve as a ProTour stop, and the first match played would be the 16 Pros against the top 16 locals, then the final 16 players are in the money. This rotating system supports pool rooms, and still allows some amateurs to compete, but under the exact same rules the Pros play by, single elimination, race to 21, match time limits of 3 hours, no magic rack, no pattern racking, balls must be racked the same as determined by the set rules, and rack your own, no alternating breaks. People can laugh at my glue, they can joke about it all they want, but when I have world wide distribution by this coming summer, I'll be the one laughing when I'm depositing 500k a monthšŸ¤£
 

FeelDaShot

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Jay, any pool room with a minimum of 8 Diamond 9ft ProAms would serve as a ProTour stop, and the first match played would be the 16 Pros against the top 16 locals, then the final 16 players are in the money. This rotating system supports pool rooms, and still allows some amateurs to compete, but under the exact same rules the Pros play by, single elimination, race to 21, match time limits of 3 hours, no magic rack, no pattern racking, balls must be racked the same as determined by the set rules, and rack your own, no alternating breaks. People can laugh at my glue, they can joke about it all they want, but when I have world wide distribution by this coming summer, I'll be the one laughing when I'm depositing 500k a monthšŸ¤£

Thanks RKC, I'm grateful and proud of you bud! I'm sure there were a lot of hurdles involved with your start up which most people would have never surpassed. Keep pushing the limits and good things will come.

I see where to buy the glue but where can the glue installation video be found?
 
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