are these cushions dead?

pt109

pt109

WO double hemlock
Silver Member
First check the rail bolts
...then the rubber, it should be pliable
...if rubber and rail bolts are okay, might be the glue holding the rubber
 
buckshotshoey

buckshotshoey

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
pt109 said:
First check the rail bolts
...then the rubber, it should be pliable
...if rubber and rail bolts are okay, might be the glue holding the rubber
Click to expand...

This^^^. And could also be the cushion nose height is too high. To low would make balls jump on a firm shot. What kind of cloth is on it? The cue ball slows down rather quickly.
 
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iusedtoberich

iusedtoberich

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Are we looking at the same thing? The rails look good to me. The ball seems to be bouncing normal to me.

It seems you are barely tossing it, and getting 3 sideways lengths. Use a cue stick, from the spot, go long ways, and you should get 4 lengths with a firm hit and minimal hop.

Edit: I had the sound off when I wrote this. With the sound on, it does sound not right, but the reaction still looks good, from the limited video anyway.
 
Nick B

Nick B

This is gonna hurt
Silver Member
Something is loose and you are not getting the correct energy transfer.
 
C

ChrisinNC

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
icemanfred said:
this table is only 3 months old.
its a connelly san carlos
I have e mailed this video to connelly also.

seems I have to hit pretty firm to get a three rail shot.
I had assumed the noise was from this table having pretty narrow rails. But I am beginning to learn otherwise.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=df7wW7wMaaI&feature=youtu.be
Click to expand...
Hard to tell from the video how hard you are rolling the ball. If you roll it as hard as you can, you should get 4 lengths (down and back, down and back), or 4 widths (across and back, across and back). It honestly doesn't look like you're rolling the ball nearly as hard as you could.

Another test is at break speed, as if you're hitting a break shot, hitting the CB solidly, nearly as hard as you can, dead center english or a little below center, you should get 4-5 lengths (down, back, down, back, part ways down again).
 
C

ChrisinNC

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
icemanfred said:
its simonis860 cloth
bolts are super tight
the cloth seems to play well. getting good speed and action when on the play feild and off other balls
its the cushions that is slowing things down

cushion height is 1.5" (cant attach a pic? needs a hosting site to link to?)

second test a little harder:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AgnW7qvV4Vk&feature=youtu.be
Click to expand...
If the cushion nose height is 1.5", it is borderline high. I believe it should be between 1-3/8" to 1-7/16".
 
buckshotshoey

buckshotshoey

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
BCA Table specifications....

The speed of the table cushions should be such that placement of a ball on the head spot, shooting through the foot spot, using center ball english, with a level cue and firm stroke, the ball must travel a minimum of 4 to 4 ½ lengths of the table without jumping.

Cushion nose height

Here is the rail cushion nose height specification, as dictated by the WPA:
"Rail height (nose-line to table-bed) should be 63 ½% (+1 %) or between 62 ½% and 64 ½ % of the diameter of the ball."

So as stated above, about 1 7/16. Your installer may have shimmed the rails too high?
 
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Nick B

Nick B

This is gonna hurt
Silver Member
A

AtLarge

AzB Gold Member
Gold Member
Silver Member
ChrisinNC said:
If the cushion nose height is 1.5", it is borderline high. I believe it should be between 1-3/8" to 1-7/16".
Click to expand...

The WPA spec is 63½% of the ball diameter plus or minus 1% of the ball diameter.

That translates to 1.42875" ± .0225".

[So 1 3/8" (1.375") is too low, but 1 7/16" (1.4375") is within the range.]

Edit -- The CSI (BCAPL and USAPL) spec is 1 29/64" + 1/64" or - 1/32"
 
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iusedtoberich

iusedtoberich

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
icemanfred said:
its simonis860 cloth
bolts are super tight
the cloth seems to play well. getting good speed and action when on the play feild and off other balls
its the cushions that is slowing things down

cushion height is 1.5" (cant attach a pic? needs a hosting site to link to?)

second test a little harder:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AgnW7qvV4Vk&feature=youtu.be
Click to expand...

Again, IMO, that looks normal. And the sound now is normal also. The phone picks up sound differently than real life depending on how close it is to the rails and probably a ton of other factors.

Stop using your hand. Put the CB on the spot. And hit the CB with your STICK, and shoot it long ways. You should get 4 table lengths easily, and 4.5 lengths if your rails are fast.

Also, what is your speed? Can you run a rack of 9 ball? I'm only asking this to ask you why you think the rails are wrong? Does the ball come off of them incorrectly when you are playing position? How does it compare to the local Gold Crown tables at your nearest pool hall?
 
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icemanfred

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
why would you want to shim the rails?
you really thing 1/16" can make that kind of difference,

I will check all the other bolts next.
 
buckshotshoey

buckshotshoey

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
icemanfred said:
why would you want to shim the rails?
you really thing 1/16" can make that kind of difference,

I will check all the other bolts next.
Click to expand...

I didn't see anyone say to shim the rails. I said maybe the installer shimmed them too high during the install. And yes 1/16 will make a difference. 1.5 inches would not be legal in a tournament for a reason.
 
I

icemanfred

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
what causes concern was the thud sound.
and noticing how much speed drops off after one or two rails. a three rail shot requires pretty hard hit.

I had thought the sound was from the smaller rails.. when I started getting frustrated with the lose of speed off the cushion I researched and found you tube videos describing that sound as one of the tell tail signs of dead rails.
I think angles re correct though.
yes , I can run a 9 ball rack..

but I ant figure out how a new table came with bad rails.if that is whats happening
 
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