How to Use the Masse' Shot to Curve Around Obstructing Balls

Mirza · Mar 3, 2015

CJ Wiley said:
I like that one, it's another level of difficulty, however, with a little "inside touch" it certainly can be made consistently. CLICK THIS LINK TO 2ND ADVANCED MASSE'

And yes, I may have, Mike, lost a few "customers" on that shot .

How do you aim a masse shot?

CJ Wiley · Mar 3, 2015

the emphasis on the upper body positioning will play an important factor.

Mirza said:
How do you aim a masse shot?

Just like any other shot, although the emphasis on the upper body positioning will play an important factor.....this may be difficult to explain in writing, it requires demonstration and explanation.

Mirza · Mar 3, 2015

CJ Wiley said:
Just like any other shot, although the emphasis on the upper body positioning will play an important factor.....this may be difficult to explain in writing, it requires demonstration and explanation.

In your video and in other videos by Dr Dave it doesn't seem like one is/ should be aiming like any other shot, for example, they aren't aiming towards the obstructing ball at all?

What did you exactly mean by that? You aim like you would aim the shot if the obstructing ball wasn't there?

CJ Wiley · Mar 3, 2015

Once you have a really, truly, solid pre shot routine you can learn quickly

Mirza said:
In your video and in other videos by Dr Dave it doesn't seem like one is/ should be aiming like any other shot, for example, they aren't aiming towards the obstructing ball at all?

What did you exactly mean by that? You aim like you would aim the shot if the obstructing ball wasn't there?

Yes.......of course - how else could we make them so consistently.

Efren's the one that showed me what was possible, I just did a "scooting report" and learned it too. Once you have a really, truly, solid pre shot routine you can learn at an accelerated rate.

This type of pre shot routing rehearses every aspect of the shot before getting down in the shooting position, then as if the shot had already been made.

Patrick Johnson · Mar 3, 2015

Mirza:
You aim like you would aim the shot if the obstructing ball wasn't there?

Click to expand...

CJ:
Yes.......of course - how else could we make them so consistently.

Uh...

pj
chgo

View attachment 94796

Mirza · Mar 3, 2015

Patrick Johnson said:
Uh...

pj
chgo

View attachment 94796

My thoughts exactly, thats why I wrote what I wrote in my first post..

Patrick Johnson · Mar 3, 2015

Mirza said:
My thoughts exactly, thats why I wrote what I wrote in my first post..

From my earlier post:

The "compass" direction you point the cue determines the CB's initial direction.

pj
chgo

MSchaffer · Mar 3, 2015

Patrick Johnson said:
Coriolis, the French mathematician, described this masse aiming technique. The essential principle is to elevate the cue until your tip points down through the CB at an imaginary line on the table drawn from the CB's base forward and parallel to the path you want the CB to take after curving. The "compass" direction you point the cue determines the CB's initial direction. How hard you hit the CB determines how far it goes in that initial direction before completing the curve onto the parallel path.

It's the best masse aiming technique I know, it's very accurate with some practice, and it works on all masse shots from small shallow curves to 180-degree "turnaround" curves.

pj
chgo

Bob Byrne described the masse just like this in one of his early videos, and is what I use. It is very accurate, and very simple to visualize. (Actual execution may be a problem, but the theory is dead solid)

Patrick Johnson · Mar 3, 2015

Coriolis, the French mathematician, described this masse aiming technique. The essential principle is to elevate the cue until your tip points down through the CB at an imaginary line on the table drawn from the CB's base forward and parallel to the path you want the CB to take after curving. The "compass" direction you point the cue determines the CB's initial direction. How hard you hit the CB determines how far it goes in that initial direction before completing the curve onto the parallel path.

It's the best masse aiming technique I know, it's very accurate with some practice, and it works on all masse shots from small shallow curves to 180-degree "turnaround" curves.

pj
chgo

Click to expand...

Neil:
It's what I use, and has served me very well over the years.

Click to expand...

MSchaffer:
Bob Byrne described the masse just like this in one of his early videos, and is what I use. It is very accurate, and very simple to visualize. (Actual execution may be a problem, but the theory is dead solid)

Click to expand...

It's very easy to visualize at the table - the picture below shows how. Once you know the technique, the only thing to calibrate by feel is the butt elevation and speed, which control when the ball curves.

pj
chgo

View attachment 3095

dr_dave · Mar 3, 2015

Patrick Johnson said:
It's very easy to visualize at the table - the picture below shows how. Once you know the technique, the only thing to calibrate by feel is the butt elevation and speed, which control when the ball curves.

pj
chgo

View attachment 3095

If people want to see a video demonstration of this, along with supporting instructional articles, they can be found here:

masse shot aiming resource page

Enjoy,
Dave

PS: PJ, good illustration. FYI, I've added it to the resource page (with credit to you, and a link to your post).

ENGLISH! · Mar 3, 2015

I'm not sure if CJ was referring to this specific shot or not but I have very often aligned 'through' a portion of a blocking ball & gone right around it but usually with less masse than this shot.

I think it depends whether one hits high on the ball or more on the low side.

I think with the lower hit the ball squirts a bit early on.

But... like Dennis Miller so often says about himself, I could be wrong. :wink:

Best 2 All,
Rick

dr_dave · Mar 3, 2015

dr_dave said:
If people want to see a video demonstration of this, along with supporting instructional articles, they can be found here:

masse shot aiming resource page

FYI, for those interested, the video and articles also contain some useful technique advice for those who have trouble executing masse shots. It's one thing to know how to aim masse shots, and it is an entirely different thing to have the technique necessary to execute them with confidence.

Enjoy,
Dave

CJ Wiley · Mar 3, 2015

upper body angles will change relative to where you have to hold the cue

ENGLISH! said:
I'm not sure if CJ was referring to this specific shot or not but I have very often aligned 'through' a portion of a blocking ball & gone right around it but usually with less masse than this shot.

I think it depends whether one hits high on the ball or more on the low side.

I think with the lower hit the ball squirts a bit early on.

But... like Dennis Miller so often says about himself, I could be wrong. :wink:

Best 2 All,
Rick

Yes, to create the technique's ideal scenario the head must not move, after you're aligned and ready to approach the shot.

The upper body angles will change relative to where you have to hold the cue (at the front of the wrap, or even behind, near the balance point).

JE54 · Mar 3, 2015

Is it harder to do using a low deflection shaft ?

Patrick Johnson · Mar 3, 2015

JE54 said:
Is it harder to do using a low deflection shaft ?

No - some think it's easier to squirt the ball around the obstacle with a higher-squirt cue, but that's not necessary - just aim it where the squirt would take it (if any).

pj
chgo

CJ Wiley · Mar 5, 2015

there's a system that allows you to do this no matter how much masse' is needed

ENGLISH! said:
I'm not sure if CJ was referring to this specific shot or not but I have very often aligned 'through' a portion of a blocking ball & gone right around it but usually with less masse than this shot.

I think it depends whether one hits high on the ball or more on the low side.

I think with the lower hit the ball squirts a bit early on.

But... like Dennis Miller so often says about himself, I could be wrong. :wink:

Best 2 All,
Rick

Yes, there's a system that allows you to do this no matter how much masse' is needed. It's pretty cool, however, it takes a good understanding of the upper body mechanics, and how they conform to the cue's tip......'The Game is the Teacher'

Patrick Johnson · Mar 5, 2015

ENGLISH!:
...I have very often aligned 'through' a portion of a blocking ball & gone right around it but usually with less masse than this shot.

Click to expand...

CJ:
Yes, there's a system that allows you to do this no matter how much masse' is needed.

I seriously doubt it - it's impossible to aim through the blocking ball for any but the tiniest amount of masse. For instance, your "instructional" video clearly shows you aiming far to the side - how about a video of you making that shot while really aiming through the blocking balls?

pj
chgo

CJ Wiley · Mar 5, 2015

"Aligning" correctly is the key to shot-making.

Patrick Johnson said:
I seriously doubt it - it's impossible to aim through the blocking ball for any but the tiniest amount of masse. For instance, your "instructional" video clearly shows you aiming far to the side - how about a video of you making that shot while really aiming through the blocking balls?

pj
chgo

Yes, to create the technique's ideal scenario the head must not move, after you're aligned and ready to approach the shot.

Click to expand...

The upper body angles will change relative to where you have to hold the cue (at the front of the wrap, or even behind, near the balance point).

Where did I say anything about aiming? "Aligning" correctly is the key to shot-making.

Patrick Johnson · Mar 5, 2015

CJ Wiley said:
Where did I say anything about aiming?

Right here, in the post I quoted above:

Mirza:
You aim like you would aim the shot if the obstructing ball wasn't there?

Click to expand...

CJ:
Yes.......of course - how else could we make them so consistently.

But anyway, OK, you meant aligned. And how you're aligned for the masse shot in the video is the same way you'd be aligned for a straight shot?

If you say so...

pj
chgo

CJ Wiley · Mar 5, 2015

Patrick Johnson said:
Right here, in the post I quoted above:

But anyway, OK, you meant aligned. And how you're aligned for the masse shot in the video is the same way you'd be aligned for a straight shot?

If you say so...

pj
chgo

It's common to confuse "aiming" with aligning, although I try to be specific when possible.

And you can align the same, although only when you understand the fundamentals correctly......

How to Use the Masse' Shot to Curve Around Obstructing Balls

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