Installed cue tips falling off

Kim Bye

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Thanks guys for the answers! Will help me alot!

But I need a little bit explanation about a few words and abbrevations. What do you mean with CA? Is this fluid glue like Loctite 401?



What do you mean with scores/score? Google translater can't help me with this verb/word :embarrassed2:

...and...

"rock"?! You mean sliding around?


And guys, only put a thin layer of super glue on the tip, not the ferrule, right?

CA is short for CyanoAcrylate, what we commonly call "superglue"
If you score the ferrule, you cut a few thin lines with a razorblade. I prefer two perfectly flat surfaces, in my experence, scoring the ferrule does not help, and you could potentially weaken the ferrule.
Sand the tip flat, put a few drops of CA on the tip, let it dry, sand it flat again, rinse the back of the tip and the ferrule with denatured alcohol. When it`s dry, you can glue the tip to the ferrule.
 
Last edited:

Dave38

theemperorhasnoclotheson
Silver Member
Here is a short video showing how rough vs smooth surfaces affects bonding of super glues. Pay attention at the 1:16 mark...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U7deOOmrxBM
Roughing a ferrule facing only weakens it, it may help with shear forces, but that's not what we need the most when gluing a tip on.
Everyone has their own way, but IMHO, smooth is the way to go.
Dave
 
Last edited:

Island Drive

Otto/Dads College Roommate/Cleveland Browns
Silver Member
Muffin Top

Here's my trick. Bottom line both glue surfaces must be faced, Willards tip tool always works, if you do it this way. Problem I see Nowadays, is layered tips have no Crown. This is where the problem lies, along with squishing glue with a tool made for this procedure.

Once both surfaces are faced equally, they must have the proper ''scratch coat''. Same thinking as a drywall or cement work. The grit of the sandpaper on the wheel is (PS22 in on the back of mine I just looked) is critical, it sets the depths of the glue. You don't want too fine or too coarse of a scratch coat. Like another said some tips/leather soak up more glue.

Ok, here's the trick....before you face up/glue the tip to the ferrule, attach with Very little glue, a tip with a crown to the top of your layered tip that has NO crown yet?
Next, on the layered tip apply an amount of glue that is a little too much. Touch tip/glue to ferrule facing, rotating tip/ferrule to make sure both surfaces are WET with glue.

CRITICAL....

Center tip as best you can by eye. Once it's centered....grab shaft, hold joint end at 12 o'clock and drop/bounce one time, lightly the tip off the counter, floor or any hard surface....ONCE....re-center the tip and let dry. There is a nice EQUAL layer of glue between tip/ferrule, not compromised by a vice type tool. If the tip is flat, your NOT ABLE to do the drop squish/muffin top, it won't work. You must have a tip with a crown.

You'll notice....Now, the tip has a muffin top of glue sticking out all the way around, perfect. What you actually have done is ''hydraulically'' by Dropping the tip to a hard surface, you have burped out any possible air bubbles and evenly spread the glue amount to each face.

Muffin Glue....:( no problem

What to do with the muffin top of glue? I use SG gel and in 20 minutes I'll take a piece of tin foil, wrap it around the shaft below the muffin top, then slid upward and turn the shaft removing all the muffin glue, thus not allowing it to get on the shaft or ferrule.

That's how I do it.
 

JC

Coos Cues
Here are my conclusions after reading this thread.

Super glue is amazing stuff and damned near anything you do with it will probably work.

Or might fail.

There can't be this big of a variety and opposing techniques of the right way to do it for an actual right way to exist. If it works for you keep doing it. Until it doesn't then try something else.

JC
 

James Sarenich

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
tall drop of glue

One of the first things I noticed, is you talk of spreading the CA. It should not be spread! By doing this you will loose holding power. Prime all non padded tips. I like to give each tip a nice deep breath of air onto them. CA likes this moisture. Then a good tall drop of CA. When you push the tip onto the ferrule, the glue will spread. Apply your pressure. Wipe off all your excess glue. If taped, take it off. I like to leave the tip over night before trimming. CA takes about 24 hours to completely cure.

Fresh CA, keep it in your refrigerator.
Sand FLAT, tips and ferrule.
Prime all non padded tips.
Do not spread your CA, a good tall drop, moisture in your breath and air help it cure.
Let the glue cure before trimming.
 

GoldCrown

AzB Gold Member
Gold Member
Silver Member
Hey!

So, I'm installing cue tips without a lathe since more than a year now and I had never a problem like this before

So what did you change if the problem just started.

What others said

Face, clean, proper amount of CA glue, get tip on quickly in proper position.
I will not contradict what techniques others use. But what I do. Gently sand the ferrule. Sand tip on a flat rigid surface using 80 grit. I apply some CA to tip...take tip and quickly but not wildly spread some of the glue onto the ferrule and apply. Before putting glue on tip...Wrap outside ferrule with blue tape to keep glue off of it. Remove tape as soon as you are satisfied with tip position. Can I suggest you watch a few YouTube videos ..there are plently of them.
 
Last edited:

qbilder

slower than snails
Silver Member
First thing is....don't score the ferrule, CA works best with 2 very flat and smooth surfaces.

That^. I cringe when I see people scuffing the ferrule. The problems people find with CA is usually not the CA. If you don't have a lathe and/or the knowledge & ability to install tips with CA, you really should be using something else. Epoxy and poly glues do well with ill-fitting surfaces. Contact cement is a classic tip glue.

Think about your rear view mirror. It's a piece of flat, shiny metal bonded to polished glass. It's done so with CA glue. If you cannot produce that level of smooth/flat surface on your tips & ferrule, then you shouldn't be using CA.
 

Tom1234

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
CA is short for CyanoAcrylate, what we commonly call "superglue"
If you score the ferrule, you cut a few thin lines with a razorblade. I prefer two perfectly flat surfaces, in my experence, scoring the ferrule does not help, and you could potentially weaken the ferrule.
Sand the tip flat, put a few drops of CA on the tip, let it dry, sand it flat again, rinse the back of the tip and the ferrule with denatured alcohol. When it`s dry, you can glue the tip to the ferrule.

Here's the reply from the Loctite company:

Response From Henkel Corporation - Ref # 000781373A


Dear Tom:

Thank you for e-mailing Henkel Corporation. We appreciate your interest in our products.

A roughened surface would be recommended for bonding and will created better adhesion.

For questions, comments or suggestions, please feel free to call us at (800) 624-7767, Monday through Friday, between the hours of 9:00 a.m. and 4:00 p.m. Eastern Time; or visit us on the Web at www.loctiteproducts.com or www.ositough.com.

Thank you for your inquiry. I hope you find this information helpful.

Sincerely,
Andrew I.
Consumer Relations Representative
Henkel Corporation
 

Kim Bye

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Here's the reply from the Loctite company:

Response From Henkel Corporation - Ref # 000781373A


Dear Tom:

Thank you for e-mailing Henkel Corporation. We appreciate your interest in our products.

A roughened surface would be recommended for bonding and will created better adhesion.

For questions, comments or suggestions, please feel free to call us at (800) 624-7767, Monday through Friday, between the hours of 9:00 a.m. and 4:00 p.m. Eastern Time; or visit us on the Web at www.loctiteproducts.com or www.ositough.com.

Thank you for your inquiry. I hope you find this information helpful.

Sincerely,
Andrew I.
Consumer Relations Representative
Henkel Corporation

Not sure why I was quoted? If I sand the back of the tip flat, I rough the surface up by the fact that I use 240 grit and 400 grit sandpaper. Scoring the ferrule is still not necessary. The ferrule itself is faced off with carbide insert tools and in many cases I dont really touch the ferrule itself, with a lathe you can do thin enough passes, as to just remove the old CA.
I`ve done thousands of tips this way on all types of ferrule materials, capped and uncapped, so it`s a method that simply works.
 

WilleeCue

The Barefoot Cuemaker
Silver Member
I think you should put glue on both the tip and the ferrule not just the ferrule.
Give it a few seconds to penetrate into the leather before joining it to the ferrule.
 

SSDiver2112

2b || !2b t^ ?
I quit using super glue for tips because it works great 95% of the time and the other 5% it doesn't due to a variety of variables mostly out of my control.

I use Gorilla poly glue and they don't fall off. Have used it on tough installs that kept having trouble for whatever reason and it works. I now use it every time.

I tried it by accident about 6 years ago I was on the road at my parents house playing in a tournament and the tip fell off of my player. It had a tiger Onyx that was installed by a professional and all my dad had was some gorilla glue so I centered it and glued it back on. It stayed. Gave that cue to a broke buddy and he plays with it daily and it's still on there today. This is how I got the idea that it might work on problem installs and it does.

The dry time is overnight which is the down side but having tips fall off is embarrassing and expensive to your reputation and wallet.

JC

JC,
Had my first tip pop off and I do not like that feeling. I was using locktite control gel with all the normal recommended procedures.

Are you still getting the same results with Gorilla poly glue? Also does the clear version offer the same results or just stick with the brown?
 

GoldCrown

AzB Gold Member
Gold Member
Silver Member
I’m using Starbond medium …. Never had a problem with that or Bob Smith CA. I clean the ferrule with an alcohol pad a few minutes prior to gluing
 

TheBasics

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Howdy All;

I learned about sticking things together when I was an aviation structural mech. THE
Main thing was to ensure that the surfaces to be joined were CLEAN.
When I replace a tip I use one of the Willard rotary sanders. First the course grit to clean-up
the ferrule then the fine grit to smooth the surfaces. Yup, I use it on both. Then, as cleanliness
is next to ... well, then I use an alcohol wipe 1 for the tip and 1 for the furruel then I prime BOTH
surfaces with CA glue and allow it to tack dry (maybe 5 minutes). I place a drop on the tip then
smear it around with a wooden toothpick then do the same with the ferrule. Finally I apply a generous
drop to the ferrule and slide the tip around to be sure it (glue), is spread evenly and completely
between both surfaces. With tip centered I clamp it in place and leave it alone for a day.

hank
 

chefjeff

If not now...
Silver Member
JC,
Had my first tip pop off and I do not like that feeling. I was using locktite control gel with all the normal recommended procedures.

Are you still getting the same results with Gorilla poly glue? Also does the clear version offer the same results or just stick with the brown?

I've had a hard time finding good glue since the covidscam.

I finally found some mini gels Loctites at the local Ace hardware. So far, it's seems to be ok.

I think there's a whole lot of too much old glue out dar.


Jeff Livingston
 

boogieman

It don't mean a thing if it ain't got that ping.
I had a particularly thirsty tip that soaked up the glue. I should have let it dry, lap it smooth then go again. I didn't. Two weeks later while playing I hit a shot perfectly but I heard a metallic sounding almost glass breaking sound. The glue had let go, but the tip was still on.

I took it home, carefully took the tip off, re-did the process now that the "thirsty" tip was primed. It has held perfectly.

The real trick, the tip was perfect as far as fit the first time. I took 3 wooden toothpicks and taped them on the ferrule to make a guide. Glued the ferrule and tip and pressed it down. The toothpicks kept it centered and it came out almost perfect. It came out well enough you wouldn't look twice if your cue guy put it on, but I notice small things. Either way it's a great way to save the tip if you have one let loose on you. I think @chefjeff is correct, there's a lot of old glue sitting out there right now. Look for the newest package however you can.
 

DeeDeeCues

Well-known member
First thing is....don't score the ferrule, CA works best with 2 very flat and smooth surfaces. Second is to, as mentioned above, prime the tip with thin CA. ALSO, make sure the tip doesn't 'rock' to and fro when you dry fit the tip to the ferrule, before you glue. If it rocks even slightly, it makes it more likely to come off at a later time, as the extra space will be filled with glue and will let go under pressure of use. I use the cheap thin CA to apply to the bottom layer, and then very quickly, wipe the excess and hit it with a spray accelerator, then apply and wipe another quick coat. Let dry a minute, then sand flat again, and then glue it on. Most layered tips soak up the glue almost as fast as you can apply it, and therefore will cause a glue-staved joint if you don't seal it first. As for the Kamui Clears, they recommend using the 401 Loctite, as it glues the polycarb pad better. I have used the gel on them at first and had them let go while trimming
Dave

Nice post
 

JoeyInCali

Maker of Joey Bautista Cues
Silver Member
Kamui Clear or poly carb break tips on cheap plastic ferrules now get a paper phenolic backer from me .
The backer sticks better to both surfaces .
 
Top