ferrule replacement gone wrong

2strong4u

Banned
Installing a ferrule us somple. I've done 3 and they are all good as new. You just take small passes.....dude set the lathe to kill. He's a freaking butcher.

I'd tell him he bought it for 300...or he can give you 200 towards repairs. If they wanna stall you just file a small claims case. They'll end up paying off because it's inexcusable.
 

Tramp Steamer

One Pocket enthusiast.
Silver Member
How is this his fault?

I have a Schon/Predator 314-2 that cost me $240. Do you think that I would hand it over to someone for a tip replacement (much less a new ferrule), without knowing their level of expertise. That would be a HELL NO! :)
 

skins

Likes to draw
Silver Member
As far as due diligence, this shop has done the best work in town over the last number of years. This time a different person worked on the shaft. I figured if he worked there, he knew what he was doing.

The person that did this to my shaft is a person I have known for about 40 years. I thought we were friends, hahaha. First question I will ask him when we talk again is if something happened where he does not like me anymore, hahaha

I figure the answer is to cut down the shaved part of the shaft and put on a ferrule.
Then remove the ring work from the joint of the shaft and put in a spacer. I have seen nice cues with a different wood used on the first inch or two between the joint ring and the shaft wood. The cue has an ebony forearm so an ebony spacer would actually look very nice. Then we can only hope it plays as well as it did before.

What do you think about that idea?

Also, I am a business owner of a number of companies. I want a chance to make things right with an unhappy customer but some customers are a##holes.

So, I came to azbilliards for a second opinion. I did not want to be an a@@hole but your comments back up my first impression. So I don't think I will be out of line asking for him to make a major effort to make this right.

Don't remove the collar of the shaft. Just cut down enough to leave a tenon for the new 1" ferrule. Then have the shaft retapered. Sure it may be about an inch shorter but you probably won't notice it as much as you think...AFTER THAT tell the owner of the shop who destroyed it that he has to replace the shaft with an original from the secondary market...That's what I would do
 

stick130

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I have made a tenon joint on a broken shaft and bored out another shaft end and glued them together. I can't tell any difference in the hit. You will always have a line at the glue joint. Glue expands, there isn't anyway getting around it, I am open minded and if anyone can cosmetically make it look like a one piece shaft they should be making fine music instruments with that skill, not a cue shaft.
 

ScottK

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I have a Schon/Predator 314-2 that cost me $240. Do you think that I would hand it over to someone for a tip replacement (much less a new ferrule), without knowing their level of expertise. That would be a HELL NO! :)

I get that, but when he said
Story is, I took this shaft in to have the ferrule replace and it is at this point now.
I took it to mean "in to" a reputable shop. There is no way he could have expected this hack job.

OP, you should still out the guy who did this.
 

stick130

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I agre. There is no way any repairman will turn the tip smaller than the ferrule. The only way I can see it happening is,!. had the automatic feed on, 2 Got a phone call, 3 The tool rest had to come loose. Ive forgot to tighten my tailstock and the shaft got destroyed. That was building a new shaft. Only hurt my pocketbook. You dont have the whole shaft between centers doing tips.. The only person that doesnt make mistakes is the person that does nothing. The good ones, minimize their mistakes.
 

Tramp Steamer

One Pocket enthusiast.
Silver Member
I get that, but when he said I took it to mean "in to" a reputable shop. There is no way he could have expected this hack job.
OP, you should still out the guy who did this.

Well, then, somethings rotten in Denmark, because there should have been some tell-tale signs somewhere. A reputable owner of any shop wouldn't have allowed something like this to go out the door.
Let's say the shop owner, who has been in business for awhile hires his nephew to work through the summer because his Sister is all up into his shit about how her son needs some influence from another male seeing as how her old man ran off with the babysitter, and left her and the kids to fend for themselves. And, just for the record, Sis has been colder than a week-old bucket of piss, so who can blame him.
Anyhow, the kid goes to work and low and behold his first job is to replace the ferrule on Cesar's shaft. He (the kid) figures what the hell, I've seen Unk do this before and off to work he goes.
Now remember, Junior here, only has the use of one hand. His other hand has a smart phone in it and between playing Call of Duty II, and texting his girlfriend Jennifer, he's damn near disabled.
So, he gets done with Morales shaft, shows it to his Uncle, and says: "What do you think? Not too shabby, huh?"
After shitting all over his Gorton Pantograph Model 3, he looks a the kid, smiles, and says good job son. Why don't you go get some lunch. The kid walks off, grinning from ear to ear.
Now here's where things go from bad, to worse. Our friend Cesar walks in the shop at just that very moment and sees the guy holding his shaft (cue shaft). Cesar says, "Hey, dude, you got it done. Great."
The guy hands him the shaft with the screwed to hell ferrule, and says: "No charge."
Morales says: "This is my lucky day.", and walks out of the shop.
That's why I say they're both at fault. :smile:
 

Cardigan Kid

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Well, then, somethings rotten in Denmark, because there should have been some tell-tale signs somewhere. A reputable owner of any shop wouldn't have allowed something like this to go out the door.
Let's say the shop owner, who has been in business for awhile hires his nephew to work through the summer because his Sister is all up into his shit about how her son needs some influence from another male seeing as how her old man ran off with the babysitter, and left her and the kids to fend for themselves. And, just for the record, Sis has been colder than a week-old bucket of piss, so who can blame him.
Anyhow, the kid goes to work and low and behold his first job is to replace the ferrule on Cesar's shaft. He (the kid) figures what the hell, I've seen Unk do this before and off to work he goes.
Now remember, Junior here, only has the use of one hand. His other hand has a smart phone in it and between playing Call of Duty II, and texting his girlfriend Jennifer, he's damn near disabled.
So, he gets done with Morales shaft, shows it to his Uncle, and says: "What do you think? Not too shabby, huh?"
After shitting all over his Gorton Pantograph Model 3, he looks a the kid, smiles, and says good job son. Why don't you go get some lunch. The kid walks off, grinning from ear to ear.
Now here's where things go from bad, to worse. Our friend Cesar walks in the shop at just that very moment and sees the guy holding his shaft (cue shaft). Cesar says, "Hey, dude, you got it done. Great."
The guy hands him the shaft with the screwed to hell ferrule, and says: "No charge."
Morales says: "This is my lucky day.", and walks out of the shop.
That's why I say they're both at fault. :smile:

this was absolutely genius - too funny for words. I'm still laughing and can't type.
:rotflmao1::lol::rotflmao::killingme:

i would green rep but gotta spread it around first.
 

victorl

Where'd my stroke go?
Silver Member
Maybe he was trying to make it LD??
Could be a new way to reduce the front end mass without changing to a lighter ferrule and thinner taper. Or not.
 

JC

Coos Cues
I posted this issue in the ask the cue maker section and pretty much got the opinion that this was not the way to replace a ferrule. So, as players, what do you think is a fair way to deal with this issue.

The shaft can not be replaced because it goes to a custom cue from a famous cue maker who is dead. I don't play with shafts that are smaller than 13mm.

Story is, I took this shaft in to have the ferrule replace and it is at this point now.

You don't take shafts from cues with famous makers who are now dead to someone who doesn't have solid credentials to do a simple ferrule replacement.

This is what you did (or so you say) and now you're screwed. Who is really to blame?

No sympathy here.

JC
 
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Dan_B

AzB Gold Member
Gold Member
Silver Member
If you haven’t done anything yet, I can do an extended acrylic ferrule and get that 1” back.
Send it in, I’ll fix it. Send it back, if you like, send me $50.
extended ferrule
 

Icon of Sin

I can't fold, I need gold. I re-up and reload...
Silver Member
I don't play with shafts that are smaller than 13mm.
You do now.

Only way to fix this is have a good repair guy take down the rest of the shaft to match it. You can take it off but you cant put it on.

That shit is absurd.
 

Icon of Sin

I can't fold, I need gold. I re-up and reload...
Silver Member
If you haven’t done anything yet, I can do an extended acrylic ferrule and get that 1” back.
Send it in, I’ll fix it. Send it back, if you like, send me $50.
extended ferrule

Wait... this is a thing?

That looks ridiculous.

Edit to add: But I guess it's better then the original posters shaft now...
 
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Celophanewrap

Call me Grace
Silver Member
If you haven’t done anything yet, I can do an extended acrylic ferrule and get that 1” back.
Send it in, I’ll fix it. Send it back, if you like, send me $50.
extended ferrule

Just curious, why the "hour glass" shape? What happens if you take the taper all the way out?

If you had an extended acrylic ferrule, couldn't you extend the tenon and put on a maple sleeve and a short ferrule?
 
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Dan_B

AzB Gold Member
Gold Member
Silver Member
Just curious, why the "hour glass" shape? What happens if you take the taper all the way out?

If you had an extended acrylic ferrule, couldn't you extend the tenon and put on a maple sleeve and a short ferrule?

These particular ferrules are an attempt to get the sight somewhat on a perpendicular plane to the shooters line of sight, is, what creates the form. The acrylic is solid chunks of material, so there isn’t any limitation on how or what shape it is turned too. However, when working with this material, when turning, caution needs to be used, side stencil strength has its limits.

...on the second ? Doing the joint work is not an issue, getting the similar wood grain and natural color is a hill, then getting sheen/finish match starts another issue.
 
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Bob Jewett

AZB Osmium Member
Staff member
Gold Member
Silver Member
As far as due diligence, this shop has done the best work in town over the last number of years. This time a different person worked on the shaft. I figured if he worked there, he knew what he was doing.

The person that did this to my shaft is a person I have known for about 40 years. I thought we were friends, hahaha. First question I will ask him when we talk again is if something happened where he does not like me anymore, hahaha

I figure the answer is to cut down the shaved part of the shaft and put on a ferrule.
Then remove the ring work from the joint of the shaft and put in a spacer. I have seen nice cues with a different wood used on the first inch or two between the joint ring and the shaft wood. The cue has an ebony forearm so an ebony spacer would actually look very nice. Then we can only hope it plays as well as it did before.

What do you think about that idea?

Also, I am a business owner of a number of companies. I want a chance to make things right with an unhappy customer but some customers are a##holes.

So, I came to azbilliards for a second opinion. I did not want to be an a@@hole but your comments back up my first impression. So I don't think I will be out of line asking for him to make a major effort to make this right.
One option is to just walk away and find somewhere else to get cue work done.

A second is to sit down with the owner of the shop and the guy who did the "work" and figure out what should be done. Most of that is up to the owner of the shop. I'd let him decide and depending on what that was I might go back to option 1.

You might want to keep the shaft to show to people. Or take it down in length and learn how to play 3-cushion.

I had a similar thing happen to me. I took a bunch of shafts in to be retipped. Maybe 7-8. When I picked them up, the guy who did the work was all proud because he had installed a ferrule on the shaft that had no ferrule and wasn't going to charge me for it. The owner was standing right there and probably saw the look on my face because there was no charge for any of the work. The shaft was a Balabushka and it had no ferrule for a reason.
 
These particular ferrules are an attempt to get the sight somewhat on a perpendicular plane to the shooters line of sight, is, what creates the form. The acrylic is solid chunks of material, so there isn’t any limitation on how or what shape it is turned too. However, when working with this material, when turning, caution needs to be used, side stencil strength has its limits.

...on the second ? Doing the joint work is not an issue, getting the similar wood grain and natural color is a hill, then getting sheen/finish match starts another issue.

Your use of the term 'stencil strength' shows you have no idea about any of the gibberish that you type.

It is called, 'Tensile' strength. It is the ability of the material to react forces in tension.
 
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