Open or Closed?

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walrus_3d

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
For a fun bridging update

Since this thread started, I've been 0 for 6 in APA matches. Last night, for the cue ball really close to the rail, I switched from an open bridge behind the rail to bridging on the rail itself with the index finger over the cue. I'm now 1 for 7. Damn you guys. Making me change stuff.

I guess that illustrates that it's not a question of open or closed, it's a question of what the shot requires and what you require to make that shot happen. Stability of the bridge is paramount, and everything else is window dressing.
 
sfleinen

sfleinen

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D

duckie

GregH
Silver Member
walrus_3d said:
Since this thread started, I've been 0 for 6 in APA matches. Last night, for the cue ball really close to the rail, I switched from an open bridge behind the rail to bridging on the rail itself with the index finger over the cue. I'm now 1 for 7. Damn you guys. Making me change stuff.

I guess that illustrates that it's not a question of open or closed, it's a question of what the shot requires and what you require to make that shot happen. Stability of the bridge is paramount, and everything else is window dressing.
Click to expand...

Ding,ding,ding..........we have a winner here. This concept of the shot dictates what and how you execute is so often overlooked.

This concept applies to stance, stroke, grip.
 
C.Milian

C.Milian

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
walrus_3d said:
Since this thread started, I've been 0 for 6 in APA matches. Last night, for the cue ball really close to the rail, I switched from an open bridge behind the rail to bridging on the rail itself with the index finger over the cue. I'm now 1 for 7. Damn you guys. Making me change stuff.

I guess that illustrates that it's not a question of open or closed, it's a question of what the shot requires and what you require to make that shot happen. Stability of the bridge is paramount, and everything else is window dressing.
Click to expand...

It's ok to thank us. Without Sean you may not have had your epiphany. Get him a card, its more meaningful.
 
sfleinen

sfleinen

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C.Milian said:
It's ok to thank us. Without Sean you may not have had your epiphany. Get him a card, its more meaningful.
Click to expand...

Dang it, another yellow card. One more of these, and I'll get a red card and ejected off the field. :p

Seriously though, matches [that count] are the WRONG TIME to be "experimenting." Practice time, yes. But "show time"? Definitely not.

-Sean
 
John Brumback

John Brumback

New member
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Imo

Only top top players have a good understanding of just how Important It Is
to use the right bridge for the shot.Not only that, It's very Important
to have the right angle on the cue as It goes through the cball at that time of the shot.But this Is just a matter of MHO.This was and Is a very well thought out thread you guys have.John B.
 
W

walrus_3d

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
sfleinen said:
Dang it, another yellow card. One more of these, and I'll get a red card and ejected off the field. :p

Seriously though, matches [that count] are the WRONG TIME to be "experimenting." Practice time, yes. But "show time"? Definitely not.

-Sean
Click to expand...

Well, see, that's the thing. For the six matches I lost, I wasn't changing anything. It wasn't until I changed something that I won a match. I even made a bank (on purpose!) for a shot that I usually cut. I tend to do better experimenting during a match, I think.
 
sfleinen

sfleinen

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JBKY said:
Only top top players have a good understanding of just how Important It Is
to use the right bridge for the shot.Not only that, It's very Important
to have the right angle on the cue as It goes through the cball at that time of the shot.But this Is just a matter of MHO.This was and Is a very well thought out thread you guys have.John B.
Click to expand...

John:

You say "IMO" -- but you need to know your opinion (whether it's humble or not) carries A LOT of weight around here! (Or anywhere, for that matter.) :eek:

I think it's universally agreed (it's been an occasional theme in this thread) that one should use not only the bridge he/she is comfortable with, but also for what the shot demands as well. I've been maintaining that the very last time you want to think about fundamentals like this, is during "show time" -- the shot itself. Like walrus_3d mentions, the bridge you need should just "pop out" without you thinking about it.

IMMHO,
-Sean <-- most humble
 
sfleinen

sfleinen

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walrus_3d said:
Well, see, that's the thing. For the six matches I lost, I wasn't changing anything. It wasn't until I changed something that I won a match. I even made a bank (on purpose!) for a shot that I usually cut. I tend to do better experimenting during a match, I think.
Click to expand...

Oh. I thought the historical score you mentioned were WINS, not losses, and you were giving us the "damn you guys, making me change stuff" thing because a change caused you your first loss. At least that's what I got out of it.

-Sean <-- dang it, that's a red card for sure! :eek:
 
John Brumback

John Brumback

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sfleinen said:
John:

You say "IMO" -- but you need to know your opinion (whether it's humble or not) carries A LOT of weight around here! (Or anywhere, for that matter.) :eek:

I think it's universally agreed (it's been an occasional theme in this thread) that one should use not only the bridge he/she is comfortable with, but also for what the shot demands as well. I've been maintaining that the very last time you want to think about fundamentals like this, is during "show time" -- the shot itself. Like walrus_3d mentions, the bridge you need should just "pop out" without you thinking about it.

IMMHO,
-Sean <-- most humble
Click to expand...

Oh ok,I agree with you 100% on everything you said,except the part about my opinion.It's just that, an opinion.haha John B.
 
W

walrus_3d

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
JBKY said:
Oh ok,I agree with you 100% on everything you said,except the part about my opinion.It's just that, an opinion.haha John B.
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Well, yeah, but when your opinion is based on experience, which most should be, yours is based on more betterer experience than most people. I think that's what he was getting at, anyway.

That or he wants to date you. :rolleyes:

BTW, Sean, I wasn't saying anything about the right bridge popping out, I was consciously and deliberately changing my bridge to more correctly match the requirements of the shot. Contrary to what seem to be everybody else's beliefs, I actually do better when I'm concentrating on fundamentals than I do when I'm trusting them to just happen. If I count through them like a checklist, I put myself in the right place for each shot. Granted, it takes longer that way, but I figure the more times you run through the same checklist the right way, the faster you get, and the less conscious it needs to be.
 
The Chinchilla

The Chinchilla

AzB Silver Member
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JBKY said:
Only top top players have a good understanding of just how Important It Is
to use the right bridge for the shot.Not only that, It's very Important
to have the right angle on the cue as It goes through the cball at that time of the shot.But this Is just a matter of MHO.This was and Is a very well thought out thread you guys have.John B.
Click to expand...

I posted my thoughts earlier, but I forgot to mention that I personally tend to use an open bridge when i'm shooting a bank at a kinda rolling speed. I feel it helps me see or feel the entire shot better. Any comments :)

PS, as always, thanks for stopping by!!
 
Last edited:
John Brumback

John Brumback

New member
Silver Member
The Chinchilla said:
I posted my thoughts earlier, but I forgot to mention that I personally tend to use an open bridge when i'm shooting a bank at a kinda rolling speed. I feel it helps me see or feel the entire shot better. Any comments :)

PS, as always, thanks for stopping by!!
Click to expand...

That's how I shoot them too.And I think It allows you to see the entire line
better.Why would you need a closed bridge for an easy shot? Thanks,John B.
 
W

walrus_3d

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
JBKY said:
That's how I shoot them too.And I think It allows you to see the entire line
better.Why would you need a closed bridge for an easy shot? Thanks,John B.
Click to expand...

That's funny. I only use a closed bridge on easy shots. If it's remotely long, complicated, thin, or weird, I use an open bridge. :) I only use the closed bridge to freak out my team mates. Same reason I sometimes bank.

This is a fun thread.
 
C.Milian

C.Milian

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
walrus_3d said:
Well, yeah, but when your opinion is based on experience, which most should be, yours is based on more betterer experience than most people. I think that's what he was getting at, anyway.

That or he wants to date you. :rolleyes:

BTW, Sean, I wasn't saying anything about the right bridge popping out, I was consciously and deliberately changing my bridge to more correctly match the requirements of the shot. Contrary to what seem to be everybody else's beliefs, I actually do better when I'm concentrating on fundamentals than I do when I'm trusting them to just happen. If I count through them like a checklist, I put myself in the right place for each shot. Granted, it takes longer that way, but I figure the more times you run through the same checklist the right way, the faster you get, and the less conscious it needs to be.
Click to expand...


:lovies: So I heard you got bank

:wub: Yeah. You like watching the sunset while contemplating bridges?

:lovies: Yeah. Let's get some fried chicken.
 
Donny Lutz

Donny Lutz

Ferrule Cat
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Looking at the ferrule is basically the same as looking at the tip. The ferrule is easier to see, - perhaps why ferrules have almost always been white or black, - easier to see! If you don't look at some part of the cue when lining up, how can you know if your cue is in line? Once you're in line, THEN you look back and forth between the cb and ob. When I taught bowling back in the '60s, I taught students to look at a board rather than a spot. That way you get direction as well as target. Same is sort of true with the cue tip. You can have your cue TIP in the proper place, but if the cue isn't in line with the desired path, the position of the tip is meaningless. Looking at the ferrule (like looking at the shaft) gives direction as well as target. Remember, the cue tip doesn't just travel to the point of contact, it must go THROUGH that point in line with the projected path to the cb. One reason that the old Meuccis were popular was that the longer ferrule made sighting easier!
 
C.Milian

C.Milian

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Donny Lutz said:
Looking at the ferrule is basically the same as looking at the tip. The ferrule is easier to see, - perhaps why ferrules have almost always been white or black, - easier to see! If you don't look at some part of the cue when lining up, how can you know if your cue is in line? Once you're in line, THEN you look back and forth between the cb and ob. When I taught bowling back in the '60s, I taught students to look at a board rather than a spot. That way you get direction as well as target. Same is sort of true with the cue tip. You can have your cue TIP in the proper place, but if the cue isn't in line with the desired path, the position of the tip is meaningless. Looking at the ferrule (like looking at the shaft) gives direction as well as target. Remember, the cue tip doesn't just travel to the point of contact, it must go THROUGH that point in line with the projected path to the cb. One reason that the old Meuccis were popular was that the longer ferrule made sighting easier!
Click to expand...

Guess what? People play with smaller shorter ferules now, we are superhuman.
 
sfleinen

sfleinen

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walrus_3d said:
[...]
That or he wants to date you. :rolleyes:
[...]
Click to expand...

C.Milian said:
:lovies: So I heard you got bank

:wub: Yeah. You like watching the sunset while contemplating bridges?

:lovies: Yeah. Let's get some fried chicken.
Click to expand...

Ssshhhh!! You guys better make no mention of this to my Lisa. She'd be EXTREMELY disappointed that I'd be "coming out of the closet" after all these years and that she'd wasted her time with me. :p

All funnin' aside, walrus_3d's observation that "opinions backed by experience" is a very sound one. I'm a firm believer in that. And to walrus_3d, I apologize for confusing your win/loss record. For some strange reason, I got the opposite impression of what you were trying to say. That's why I pinged myself with the expectation of receiving a "red card" for being thick or dumb. I still do stand by the notion that one shouldn't be experimenting during "show time" (i.e. a match), but that's not a "one size, fits all" thing, either. If you personally find out you do better by "shaking things up" with changes/experiments, then that obviously works for you.

Hope that helps clarify,
-Sean
 
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