basic rules/score keeping

Tommy Tube Sock

Tommy Tube Sock

the last place you look
Silver Member
I am very new to straight pool. It’s very funny when I try to get my 8 and 9 ball friends to play. Most of the guys my age (40 something) say it’s too boring. That is until they get on a run and miss position and start swearing – then I say, “I’m sorry, are you still bored.”

Even more funny are the guys from the generations behind me who purport to have “grown up playing this game.” They seem to have some strange interpretations of the rules. One guy swore that the opening break could be a regular safe shot; 1 ball to the rail. I had to show him the BCA rules that 2 object balls plus the cue ball had to hit a rail.

Invariably, the “old timers” want to spot balls on a scratch when nothing but the cue goes in. They argue that each rack has to add up to 14, so if you scratch and deduct a point from your score, you should pull a ball up and spot it. If you have yet to make a ball, you “owe one” and at the end of your inning when you do pocket one or more balls. If you scratch and make a ball, the ball comes up and your score the balls you made before the scratch. So if you scratch on your first shot and make a ball, you don't loose a point.

Am I crazy or are they completely wrong? If you scratch and make a ball, the ball is spotted and you loose a point. If you scratch (or foul) and don’t make a ball, you loose a point, but all balls stay down. Not all racks will add to 14 and the running total doesn’t divide by 14 if there are fouls.

Is this like 8 ball where there are real rules and bar rules?
 
sjb

sjb

evolving player
Silver Member
you're not crazy

Sounds like you've got the rules right.

I'm still of the opinion that racks always total 14 (or 15 if you count the one on the table). Probably because I played the game on Brunswicks with the scoring wheels. Two for each player -- one for the rack score and one for the running total. We always took fouls off of the running total score only. That way, you could at any time add up the rack score number of each player and the balls remaining on the table, subtract it from 15, and know how many balls you just made (after you missed or finished the rack).
 
M

mnShooter

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
All racks will add up to 14 everytime. You take the point off of the running total on a scratch. If you make a ball it spots.
 
3andstop

3andstop

Focus
Silver Member
Its done the same way with beads. You keep the running total seperate on the beads from the current rack. If there is a scratch you take it from the running score. For example if you have a total of 45 points and 8 in the current rack when you scratch, you take one from the 45 leaving 44, slide it to the current rack giving you 9, and of course then sliding that off the current rack making it 8 again. This way each rack can stay seperate for accuracy while keeping score.
 
Tommy Tube Sock

Tommy Tube Sock

the last place you look
Silver Member
What about on the first rack where there is no running score. If there is a foul on the first rack, the rack will end with 13 points, right? Same thing in subsequent racks when one player has zero or negative points as a running score. In these cases I imagine you just have to remember the foul.
 
3andstop

3andstop

Focus
Silver Member
On the first rack where there is no running score when you use beads, you would keep the initial rack score in tact and .... from the number 50 marker at the other end, you slightly seperate it from the mass on that far end.

After the initial rack is finished, you can identify the scratches up at the 50 point end and at that time reduce the initial score beads, then proceeding as I mentioned above. :)
 
Bob Jewett

Bob Jewett

AZB Osmium Member
Staff member
Gold Member
Silver Member
Tommy Tube Sock said:
What about on the first rack where there is no running score. If there is a foul on the first rack, the rack will end with 13 points, right? Same thing in subsequent racks when one player has zero or negative points as a running score. In these cases I imagine you just have to remember the foul.
Click to expand...
If there is a foul on the first rack, I will usually adjust the score so that it looks the same as if it were 99 (or 49 with a string of 50 beads). Other people do this differently, and will mark scratches with the 50 and 49 beads and put up the score as if there were no fouls in the rack. Then at the end, they will reconcile the minus points.

With score wheels, the "total score" wheel becomes 99 if you scratch in the first rack, and the "this rack" wheels will add to 14 at the end of the rack.

There are racks where 15 balls are scored if two balls are sunk on the last shot of the rack.
 
jhendri2

jhendri2

Rack'em Sausage
Silver Member
No, you need to learn WHEN to foul :) . It's all part of straight pool strategy.

Jim
 
Tommy Tube Sock

Tommy Tube Sock

the last place you look
Silver Member
jhendri2 said:
No, you need to learn WHEN to foul :) . It's all part of straight pool strategy.

Jim
Click to expand...

Yes, good point. I should re-state my earlier post to say I should learn to stop fouling on accident.

I'm still curious about the origin of the idea of spotting balls after a foul. Several "old timers" around here play that way. Is it a New England thing? Is it a bar rules thing?
 
acedotcom

acedotcom

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Tommy Tube Sock said:
Yes, good point. I should re-state my earlier post to say I should learn to stop fouling on accident.

I'm still curious about the origin of the idea of spotting balls after a foul. Several "old timers" around here play that way. Is it a New England thing? Is it a bar rules thing?
Click to expand...

The "old timers" are obviously confused. That's what happens when you get old. :) There was a time when balls in 8-ball and 9-ball came back up. They probably are thinking of that.
 
jhendri2

jhendri2

Rack'em Sausage
Silver Member
Tommy Tube Sock said:
Yes, good point. I should re-state my earlier post to say I should learn to stop fouling on accident.

I'm still curious about the origin of the idea of spotting balls after a foul. Several "old timers" around here play that way. Is it a New England thing? Is it a bar rules thing?
Click to expand...

I can't imagine spotting balls in a bar, since the tables are normally coin-op. The only games I can think of that you spot a ball on a foul are banks and 1hole. Maybe they're just very confused, but in 14.1 you only spot on a foul is if a ball was made during the foul. Then you spot the made ball and -1 from your score.

Jim
 
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