APA Unmarked Pocket Cost my Rackess, then the Match

JessEm · Feb 18, 2019

Didn't mark my pocket for the 8 tonight during my match game for a rackless. Opponent still had 6 or 7 balls on table...

For those unfamiliar with APA, it goes down as a scratch on the 8 because it wasn't marked. … There's zero question about where I was intending to put it, but thems the rules.

Opponent only needed two games to win the match. Ahead again in the next game, I proceeded to get fancy and knocked in the 8 early (E8). Game over. From rackless to losing the match because I didn't mark my pocket.

Yes a dumbass move. Let the criticism rain down. I'm still new to this.

Dead Money · Feb 19, 2019

JessEm said:
Didn't mark my pocket for the 8 tonight during my match game for a rackless. Opponent still had 6 or 7 balls on table...

For those unfamiliar with APA, it goes down as a scratch on the 8 because it wasn't marked. … There's zero question about where I was intending to put it, but thems the rules.

Opponent only needed two games to win the match. Ahead again in the next game, I proceeded to get fancy and knocked in the 8 early (E8). Game over. From rackless to losing the match because I didn't mark my pocket.

Yes a dumbass move. Let the criticism rain down. I'm still new to this.

Yup, you dogged it. I have a feeling you won't do that again

Kind of lame your opponent took that win the way they did.

Johnny Rosato · Feb 19, 2019

I got a ticket once for driving 110 in a 70 mph zone. What's this world coming to nowadays. with all kinds of rules everywhere we turn. SMH

slide13 · Feb 19, 2019

Tough loss. That’s a pretty stupid rule in my opinion, I play in a league where it’s just normal call your pocket and even that isn’t required if it’s completely obvious (though most do for clarity). We never have issues around that, literally can’t remeber one time. But it’s a small league where everybody knows each other.

trob · Feb 19, 2019

JessEm said:
Didn't mark my pocket for the 8 tonight during my match game for a rackless. Opponent still had 6 or 7 balls on table...

For those unfamiliar with APA, it goes down as a scratch on the 8 because it wasn't marked. … There's zero question about where I was intending to put it, but thems the rules.

Opponent only needed two games to win the match. Ahead again in the next game, I proceeded to get fancy and knocked in the 8 early (E8). Game over. From rackless to losing the match because I didn't mark my pocket.

Yes a dumbass move. Let the criticism rain down. I'm still new to this.

Man... no one your team must have been paying attention since anyone can temind you to do it in a match. That sucks. The nice thing around here is most times people will say before the match just call the pocket dont worry about marking the pocket lol

jviss · Feb 19, 2019

Please excuse my ignorance, I don't know what "mark the pocket" means; I though he meant call the pocket, but then someone alluded to a distinction.

Thanks,

jv

HQueen · Feb 19, 2019

In APA league the rule is you have to place a physical object (marker) on the rail by the pocket you are going to make the 8 ball in.

jviss · Feb 19, 2019

HQueen said:
In APA league the rule is you have to place a physical object (marker) on the rail by the pocket you are going to make the 8 ball in.

Thank you. I had never heard of that.

RichSchultz · Feb 19, 2019

If your opponent only needed two racks, they are a low skilled plyr. I am guessing their captain made the foul call to get at least 1 point for being on the hill. That’s pretty crappy; even moreso in regular, midsession play. I would understand if it were playoffs, but that’s crappy. Of course, your team should have shouted, “mark your pocket’”

ctyhntr · Feb 19, 2019

The American Poolplayers Association is the largest amateur league in the United States. Their rules have to be explicitly clear to make it easy for members to follow and avoid needless disputes.

jviss said:
Thank you. I had never heard of that.

decent dennis · Feb 19, 2019

What is a rackless?

RichSchultz · Feb 19, 2019

decent dennis said:
What is a rackless?

you won every rack in the match; opponent never broke.

Maniac · Feb 19, 2019

slide13 said:
Tough loss. That’s a pretty stupid rule in my opinion, I play in a league where it’s just normal call your pocket and even that isn’t required if it’s completely obvious (though most do for clarity). We never have issues around that, literally can’t remeber one time. But it’s a small league where everybody knows each other.

In the two APA divisions around here that I play in, I usually ask my opponent before we lag if it is okay if we just call the pocket for the 8-ball. Almost every opponent I ask agrees to do it.

It is a sh*t move to claim a game that way if what the OP says about the 8-ball's pocket being obvious...and I have zero doubt that he's telling the truth.

Maniac

billiardthought · Feb 19, 2019

RichSchultz said:
you won every rack in the match; opponent never broke.

It also entails that you won the lag for those unfamiliar.

jviss · Feb 19, 2019

Maniac said:
In the two APA divisions around here that I play in, I usually ask my opponent before we lag if it is okay if we just call the pocket for the 8-ball. Almost every opponent I ask agrees to do it.

It is a sh*t move to claim a game that way if what the OP says about the 8-ball's pocket being obvious...and I have zero doubt that he's not telling the truth.

Maniac

I think you meant "and I have zero doubt that he's telling the truth?" Meaning, you don't doubt that he's telling the truth, the OP being "he?"

Rules are rules, in my opinion. Why have them if they are not used, observed, exploited. I don't begrudge the opponent claiming the game for this, at all.

It would be interesting to know, though, exactly how obvious the shot was.

Celophanewrap · Feb 19, 2019

Kind of a cheap way to win a game/match if you ask me, especially if there was no question about where you
intended to put the 8, but still within the rules if your opponent wanted to call it that way.

Don't let it get to you, it's happened to pretty much everyone at least once.

In weekly play no big deal, you lose a point. When you get to playoffs and Tri-Cup or regional s or Cities, or whatever
your LO calls it try to make it a practice to adhere to the written rules and if you advance to Las Vegas make sure you
follow the written rules so there is nothing to question.

In regular weekly play there's no reason to be a pr1ck, unless you want to be remembered for next time.

Bad Karma, it can kill

justadub · Feb 19, 2019

HQueen said:
In APA league the rule is you have to place a physical object (marker) on the rail by the pocket you are going to make the 8 ball in.

You also are supposed to mark your pocket in TAP, as well...

I agree that it's a cheap move, but it is the rule. And it's not a secret. If you ever get to go to Vegas, you had better be ready to do it, as well as most higher level tournaments.

ShootingArts · Feb 19, 2019

One or two things to take away

Play by the written rules. More common than this guy is the one that will go along with neither player marking their pocket until a critical game and match, then nail you with that "didn't mark your pocket" crapola. Good to stay in practice playing by the rules so you might explain you need the practice to your opponents and ask to please play by the written rules including marking pockets.

The second thing goes almost unnoticed, the early eight. Was that completely an accident or had you not put the incident with the unmarked pocket behind you? Another lesson, get back in the moment shooting.

All of us haven't lost by not marking a pocket since we haven't all played APA but all of us have had the "didn't call your pocket" move pulled on us. No guarantee that an opponent sees a quick motion with a stick, tell them and make sure they acknowledge when it is important. The best way to play is that it is important all the time.

Hu

jviss · Feb 19, 2019

The problem with expecting folks to waive a rule in their favor is that since this protocol is not written, and not universal in implementation, there will be disappointment, anger, and controversy when expectations don't match up.

I'd say that it's entirely appropriate to apply the rules strictly if one is serious about the competition. This match may have meant more to the eventual winner than the person who forgot to mark (and also call, I assume) the pocket. He may have felt an obligation or duty to his team to win, too.

This comes up in golf. You should never expect your opponent to concede a putt in match play. In fact, the entire aspect of concession becomes part of match strategy at times.

I think the OP handled this graciously, and does not begrudge his opponent the win.

shasta777 · Feb 19, 2019

I am also in APA... I always ask my opponent if it is OK to just call the pocket BUT... I also do it in front or loud enough for others on both teams or so both my Capt... & theirs also hear it... This way there is NO question at all... (just in case opponent says I did NOT call the pocket)…. for those who do NOT want to take any chance at all JUST mark the darn pocket.... lol

APA Unmarked Pocket Cost my Rackess, then the Match

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